A nice fantasy but unfortunately Apple is entitled to the same terms Research in Motion and Motorola are given. Nokia can't put them out of business. At best they could collect a few dollars. But apparently so can Apple. The question is whose infringement is the greater one? Who will end up paying more, and will it cover all the legal fees.
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Apple Files Countersuit Against Nokia
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A nice fantasy but unfortunately Apple is entitled to the same terms Research in Motion and Motorola are given. Nokia can't put them out of business. At best they could collect a few dollars. But apparently so can Apple. The question is whose infringement is the greater one? Who will end up paying more, and will it cover all the legal fees.
Interesting story but not true as Apple's countersuit shows. There's 13 patents mentioned and only ONE is an iPhone 'innovation'....
No. 7,469,381, B2: List scrolling and document translation, scaling, and rotation on a touch-screen display
...which relates to flicking pages and scaling images. All the others having nothing to do with the iPhone and predate it in many cases.
If Nokia really had copied the iPhone, you'd think Apple would be suing them for the patents it holds on the iPhone. The problem is, Apple holds very few patents on the iPhone itself, despite what Steve Jobs said when he launched it. Many of the software patents here are from Taligent - Apple and IBMs failed object-oriented OS experiment from the 90s.
What next? Nokia claiming patents it had from Psion back in the 80s are infringed by Apple?
If you really want to go back a bit further, Symbian has a lineage going back to Psion's EPOC which predates the Newton.
But as I said, this isn't about touch screen interfaces. All but 1 of Apple's claims are nothing to do with the iPhone.
Offtopic:
I was reading NOKIA's Wikipidea page and found out that NOKIA was founded 1865it took apple less then 2 years to beat them in smartphone market..
you must be american. in europe and asia nokia is the clear number 1 manufacturer.
just because the iphone gets a lot of media attention doesn't mean that apple is a massive player in the mobile phone market.
apple produces one phone with 3 derivatives. that's a pretty limited handset lineup and quite frankly the contract lifetime costs of an iphone are sickening, which places them in the top tier of the mobile phone market pricewise.
nokia makes most of its money from non smartphones which is the vast majority of the market.
with regards to patent infringements. nokia has indeed created a lot of very important patents regarding GSM technology, which apple needs to licence, but don't see fit to pay for (everybody else does).
and before i get thread-raped, i buy whatever tech fits my needs regardless of the manufacturer.
Some objectivity wouldn't hurt... Yep, I like my iPhone and I wouldn't change it to Nokia but the fact remains; Nokia came up with touch screen smart phones way before Apple did. Nokia has had MP3 playing music phones even before era of smart phones. It is highly unlikely Apple wants to test their patents against Nokia in the court. This looks more like a typical counter law suit which Apple hopes is going to give them better positions for negotiations. The fact is Nokia's patents are key IP in creating GSM smart phones. Experts say one can't be created without using them. On the other hand Apple's patents aren't key IP and therefore their financial impact isn't as significant as Nokia's.
Well said. I went through the Apple document (79 pages) pretty quickly, but the gist was that Apple wanted F/RAND and that was all, but that if necessary, they would attempt to invalidate many of Nokia's claims. It also appeared that Nokia was attempting to leverage the F/RAND to obtain Apple UI tech, which they are specifically proscribed from as part of the Standards Setting Organization.
I know this turnout is "highly unlikely" from your conclusion but why would Nokia be unable to sell touchscreen devices? They've been selling them since 2004 (Nokia 7710).
If I recall correctly it was Nokia that lost the majority of patent disputes with Qualcomm in the USA and also in Europe. This kept Nokia from using ANY of Qualcomm's chipsets (along with Broadcom, and a few others) and forced Nokia to use cheap Freescale chipsets. This was all over the news for the past 3-5yrs.
Here is just one specific OOPS about the patents....
http://www.nokia.com/press/press-releases/archive/archiveshowpressrelease?newsid=1018639
http://www.nokia.com/press/press-releases/showpressrelease?newsid=1260299
also ...
http://www.nokia.com/press/press-releases/showpressrelease?newsid=1305539
THANK YOU. Some people on here that ACTUALLY understand what they're talking about. Seems most of the trash talkers on this site don't seem to understand that bit right there. What you said is exactly right, and Apple absolutely must go on a counter-attack.
Nokia simply sees something that they like, which is the iPhone and Apples other products and their design, and is taking advantage of their standards to try and bully Apple into giving up its IP, which is not allowed and should not be tolerated. You just can't do that, and Apple has no choice but to go after Nokia for not only violating their IP, but for also violating the F/RAND terms. They cannot just single out Apple to settle to any different terms to license GSM technology, just because they see something better from Apple that they are envious of.
End of story. Anyone saying that Apple is the bully in this situation simply has no idea what they're talking about. Nokia is being the bully and taking advantage of something they're not allowed to.
Sorry but that's nonsense. There is no 'bully' or 'victim' here. Once again, this is about negotiation.
Nokia wanted to pay Apple 5% of revenue. That's exactly the same all other companies pay to Nokia under the FRAND rules. Just Apple wanted to pay less.
"Sssshh..." I haven't told them to put their fingers in their ears and go "lalalalala" yet.
Wouldn't Judge Marilyn Milan call this a "just because" counter-suit? I'm-offended-you-dare-sue-me-so-I'll-counter-sue-you-back. Often the defendant calls it "time for loss wages" (for showing up in court) or "emotional distress".
Doesn't work in a People's Court eppy.
peacethe irony being that the idea behind the statement was, hmmmm, borrowed from s. jobs:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CW0DUg63lqU
looks like this lawsuit is going to be entertaining one for a lawsuit!
I'd say paying less would indeed just be fair.
After all the share of the questionable technology gets smaller with the growing complexity of the final system.
I guess that is why there is still no GSM module in every notebook, cause the 5% would be to expensive to pay for the whole product. much more reasonable to include a 30$ USB dongle where the patent fees are only a fraction.
why don't they make it flat priced per unit? like 5$ per device.
imagine Microsoft would ask the vendors to pay them for Windows in % of the Hardware Costs, OEM versions for high end computers would get rather expensive
i know people (like me) who never ever use the optical drives. And be honest, would you prefer to have a second HDD, or battery inside a notebook, or that bulky thing that takes up such a big amount of space.
i hope Apple is taking the same steps as it did with the MacMinis and offer more Macs without optical drive. Sad the MBAir is trimmed to much for being fancy, a normal fast MacBookPro (13'') with usual BTO options but without the stupid optical drive would be my notebook of choice. especially when i get 10h battery life (bigger battery), and 2 HDDs )))
Well that totally depends on my needs. I for one DO need at least one computer with a BluRay Drive.
I'd rather have it in the AppleTV, the MacMini, or the iMac, PowerMacs but i can't imagine why they still but this drives into notebooks.
Recently we were hanging together with a friend and then he told like "i think Something happened with my Mac, it was never getting so noisy before."
We then realized that it was the drive in the Mac still burning a disc with some photos. And also that no one of us even remembered when we last used the drive before that. Flash got too convenient the last years...
I laughed at the part where Apple claims "unreasonable licensing agreements" as the reason they just went ahead and violated Nokia's patents and are now clearly hoping to get them to back off by suing them as well. Unreasonable licensing agreements? Apple? The same people who REFUSE TO LICENSE their operating system to ANYONE for ANY REASON? And that's not unreasonable? And then they're surprised when someone went ahead (like them it seems) and did it anyhow? Can you say HYPOCRITES? Yes, I knew you could.