Apple Hit With Second Class Action Lawsuit Over 'Defective' Keyboards in Recent MacBook, MacBook Pro Models

[smirking]

Wish they would just update the old retina MacBook Pro chassis with the latest hardware. Get my SD card slot, ports, MagSafe and a proper keyboard back. Not going to miss the touchbar at all.

I'd be happy with just better butterfly keys. USB-A and SD Card slots would be going backwards and I say this as someone who shoots a lot of photos onto an SD Card slot and owns a lot of USB-A peripherals. My next camera is likely going to be using a much faster storage standard and that SD Card slot will become useless to me.

The lack of USB-A is very easy to address. A few $5 adapters are all you need. I have several and always carry one around with me just in case.

 

[FasterQuieter]

This generation of MacBooks has been a bummer all round. I was immediately repelled by the $300 price hike for the magic toolbar I have no interest in. Then we found out about the defective keyboards. I just hope this negative experience doesn't lessen Apple's Mac enthusiasm even further. I currently have a 2012 Mac Mini and a 2013 Macbook Air. I used to enthusiastically upgrade my Macs every couple of years. It's such a shame.

 

[Mousse]

So true!! Couldn’t have said it better.

Hardware under Tim Cook has gone downhill. He keeps trying to cut costs to maximize profits.

Nah. It ain't cost cutting. Designing those butterfly mechanism keyboard and manufacturing them cost money. Using the old scissors mechanism keyboard would have saved in manufacturing and R&D cost.
It's the obsession with thin, thinner, thinnest. That's why they removed ports, to make it thinner. That's why they used the new keyboards, to make it thinner. That's why they replaced MagSafe power connection with USB-C, to make it thinner. Thinner, thinner, thinner.

 

[ChrisChaval]

Nah. It ain't cost cutting. Designing those butterfly mechanism keyboard and manufacturing them cost money. Using the old scissors mechanism keyboard would have saved in manufacturing and R&D cost.
It's the obsession with thin, thinner, thinnest. That's why they removed ports, to make it thinner. That's why they used the new keyboards, to make it thinner. That's why they replaced MagSafe power connection with USB-C, to make it thinner. Thinner, thinner, thinner.

well, eventually everything will be wireless, data accessed almost exclusively via cloud

it is just that they tried way too hard to be ahead of time

their userbase is not there yet, also because the infrastructure is not there yet

so, yes, we still do need some ports for some time

 

[Glideslope]

Margins up, QC down. So what's new here? It's Tim's Legacy. Arthur, are you in here?

 

[corebeliefs]

Mine has been on both of my new MBPs. In fact, they've been just fine for the majority of users. If it was as huge of a problem as some here seem to believe, you'd have seen mass recalls and it publicized all over national news.

The reality is that only a very small number of users have been impacted by this.

Saying that it's a very small number of users, you have no facts to support that. That's just something that you're coming up with. There are in fact news stories being written about this, in fact this very post was about a second class action lawsuit and a petition has thousands of signers.

Another poster here said that in his large company there was a 14% failure rate according to IT. Statistically, that is not small. Again that is not an official number but it's better than what you've got.

 

[Glideslope]

Nah. It ain't cost cutting. Designing those butterfly mechanism keyboard and manufacturing them cost money. Using the old scissors mechanism keyboard would have saved in manufacturing and R&D cost.
It's the obsession with thin, thinner, thinnest. That's why they removed ports, to make it thinner. That's why they used the new keyboards, to make it thinner. That's why they replaced MagSafe power connection with USB-C, to make it thinner. Thinner, thinner, thinner.

Butterfly Switches can be manufactured from quality materials, or, in this case, s***.

 

[hajime]

your slipping Timmy Cook you are taking quantity over quality

Apple should compensate and TC should step down.

 

[mixel]

This really is a case of "if it aint broke.."

There's so much leeway to make different low profile keyboards with a decent amount of travel and a distinct feel. Keyboards have been holding up well for a long time and didn't need "fixing". This is G4 cube, "iMac that sucks dust inside the display enclosure", "iMacs with a spring to hold the display up that can't hold the weight of the display." levels of stupid design choice. I love Apple but they're sometimes frustratingly dumb in the pursuit of slimness.

They should genuinely replace the keyboards with ones that actually hold up to the passage of time. I have a friend who almost maxed out his MBP at huge expense, I'd be scared of dust getting in the damn keyboard if I was him, that's crazy. Doesnt matter if it happens now or later. And hoo boy, I've got numerous EU style free out of warranty Apple repairs, but those won't be a definite anymore now we're leaving the EU. Wonderful.

 

[spazzcat]

Personal anecdotes are just that... personal, and not indicative of the general nature of the issue. Even 6 trouble-free units is statistically insignificant.

I was asking the question, not sure how that is being dismissive, and 99% of the time these things are exaggerations.

 

[smirking]

Butterfly Switches can be manufactured from quality materials

I see. So what should they have used to make the switches?

You can say a lot of things about Apple, but I don’t think skimping on materials can be one of them.

They probably should have sent the butterfly switch back to the lab instead of rolling the dice with deploying that design.

 

[TheHotdog]

Good, it's better to keep a fire under their butts on this stuff.

Even better knowing it will be fixed by the time I get my first touchbar-enabled macbook.

 

[gwaizai]

We have three of them in the office. Two have been in for repairs a total of 5 times. Third one not affected (yet).

Why are some okay and others not? If it's design, wouldn't all pretty be much affected?

Sounds like sloppy, inept manufacturing.

When will Mr Social Justice Warrior Cook realize you can't work people 18 hours a day in near slave
conditions to the point of suicide and expect quality assembly?

I guess some people's moral principles boil down to only one thing: Cash.

 

[spazzcat]

We have three of them in the office. Two have been in for repairs a total of 5 times. Third one not affected (yet).

I was wondering if it hard typers, but we have a couple of them here and they haven't broken theirs yet.

 

[OldSchoolMacGuy]

Saying that it's a very small number of users, you have no facts to support that. That's just something that you're coming up with. There are in fact news stories being written about this, in fact this very post was about a second class action lawsuit and a petition has thousands of signers.

Another poster here said that in his large company there was a 14% failure rate according to IT. Statistically, that is not small. Again that is not an official number but it's better than what you've got.

This happens every single time there's an issue. You assume the problem is far larger than it is because of a couple vocal members. What you don't take into account is the countless other members without issue, because they don't bother to complain.

We saw this with Bendgate (less than a dozen occurrences were actually reported), the 2012 Mac mini video issue, and numerous other problems with Apple devices. The reality in every single case was that the issue wasn't widespread.

As someone else here has said, according to Apple Store employees, they're actually seeing LESS issues with the new keyboard design than the old. I reached out and confirmed this with Apple internally.

A class action suit isn't an indication of any type of widespread issue. You can always find a lawyer to take on these suits, even if just 1 person out of millions was impacted. Again, you're letting this information influence you when in fact it too isn't an indication of a widespread issue.

You cite an online petition but anyone can sign that. How many of those that did actually own a new MBP? How many of those signatures are duplicates? Even then, a couple thousand signatures means little from a product that has sold as many as the current laptop line. You're talking about single digit percentage or less.

 

[rockarollr]

Man... Apple has been ****ing up left and right lately. Software (iOS 11, macOS High Sierra)... hardware (Mac Pro, defective keyboards, general Mac neglect) ... management decisions (non-disclosure of iPhone throttling)...

I sometimes genuinely wonder what Steve would think of it all and what he would do as a result. I'd be willing to bet there would be a few "personnel changes" at a minimum.

 

[x-evil-x]

So what happens to gen 1 2016 users when their AppleCare runs out next year? I haven’t had any problems with the keyboard at all. Will Apple replace it after warranty is up because of this lawsuit?
Back in the plastic MacBook days. Apple continued to replace my top case because of the known issue of cracking. Eventually they replaced the computer. Well outside the warranty I had and I didn’t have AppleCare in it. But it was a known issue.

 

[macfacts]

Class action lawsuits are about making money for lawyers. If they win they make millions, the people “wronged” get dollars.

If you want more, you can individually sue in small claims court by yourself.

 

[corebeliefs]

This happens every single time there's an issue. You assume the problem is far larger than it is because of a couple vocal members. What you don't take into account is the countless other members without issue, because they don't bother to complain.

We saw this with Bendgate (less than a dozen occurrences were actually reported), the 2012 Mac mini video issue, and numerous other problems with Apple devices. The reality in every single case was that the issue wasn't widespread.

As someone else here has said, according to Apple Store employees, they're actually seeing LESS issues with the new keyboard design than the old. I reached out and confirmed this with Apple internally.

A class action suit isn't an indication of any type of widespread issue. You can always find a lawyer to take on these suits, even if just 1 person out of millions was impacted. Again, you're letting this information influence you when in fact it too isn't an indication of a widespread issue.

You cite an online petition but anyone can sign that. How many of those that did actually own a new MBP? How many of those signatures are duplicates? Even then, a couple thousand signatures means little from a product that has sold as many as the current laptop line. You're talking about single digit percentage or less.

It doesn't have to be 100% of users or 1% of users. I tend to think knowing how the Mac works and the Apple ecosystem, if enough people are talking about this it is an issue for them. If it's a 14% or 10% failure rate, that's very high. It's not the 100% rate that you seem to want it to be in order for it to be considered a serious problem, but it is high.

 

[spazzcat]

Saying that it's a very small number of users, you have no facts to support that. That's just something that you're coming up with. There are in fact news stories being written about this, in fact this very post was about a second class action lawsuit and a petition has thousands of signers.

Another poster here said that in his large company there was a 14% failure rate according to IT. Statistically, that is not small. Again that is not an official number but it's better than what you've got.

If it was that high, there would be a recall. But even 1% would be enough to cause a buzz on the internet.

 

[itguy06]

4 people claim compressed air isn't fixing that and are inflating the numbers to make it seem like a bigger problem than it is.

The other week on The Mac Power Users' Podcast, Dave was saying he's on keyboard #3 on his Macbook Pro.... And him and Katie tend to never discuss issues. She's been through a couple MBP's too.

 

[spazzcat]

If you want more, you can individually sue in small claims court by yourself.

Only if Apple doesn't fix the issue under warranty.

 

[simonmet]

Good. Hopefully these lawsuits point to a keyboard redesign in the next MBP. I actually think Apple (they're not stupid) was expecting them to come eventually, so I wouldn't expect it to hold up the release of the new MBP.

I actually think they are kind of stupid to have released this keyboard in the first place. At best, early reviews and opinions were mixed, at worst it was commonly derided. That was before complaints about reliability even began to emerge. I don’t remember complaints about pre-2016 MacBook Pro/pre-2015 MacBook keyboards; at least nothing remotely close to those for the Butterfly keyboards. It’s been a major step backwards, and one they should’ve easily foreseen. The sound alone was not deserving of release: loud, cheap, obnoxious!

And if Apple thinks they can replace the keyboard entirely with a completely flat touch-screen, either they’ve got some insanely weird alien technology or they’ve got rocks for brains.

 

[tubular]

The 2015 model is still on sale. That's the last good one. All regular ports and regular keyboard.

That’s what I bought exactly to avoid the new keyboard.

 

[HobeSoundDarryl]

So what happens to gen 1 2016 users when their AppleCare runs out next year?

Throw it awa_ and bu_ a new one sill_. Apple needs the mone_. _earl_ record revenues beg for faster & faster replacement purchases. Take one for the team. Then do it again. And again. Trillion dollar profitabilit_ requires _our cooperation. Resistance is futile.