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Wishing upon a star that one day Apple opens up the AppStore in Canada like it was forced to in the EU. While I like the build quality of Apple hardware and the software has its ebbs and flow it still feels very restrictive that I am unable to install some apps that are offered free on the PlayStore.

While counter-arguments can claim I can just go to the AndroidOS camp does that mean Apple will provide me a full refund or even prorated to purchase an Android device. Once again a simple change to the policy and the software can run without hassling the customer and this stance by Apple seems passive aggressive and outright opposite of its green initiative.

Were you a tech user when Microsoft was going through their own monopoly saga?

Do you remember when "another Windows virus" was a near-daily headline?

Apple designed and built iOS to intentionally avoid the nightmares that Windows users experienced. They would ensure that iPhone users only receive quality, vetted apps on their devices — because users can't be trusted.

In your comment, it almost sounded like you expect that "free Android apps" should be installable on your iPhone. Did I misread that?

The developers of those free apps on Android are entirely capable of building an equivalent free app for iOS. The free option has always existed on iOS.

So what are you hoping to be different? Apple is not a charity, and iOS is secure because of their approach.
 
Exactly. I’m a developer and I know it costs an absolute **** ton of money to run an App Store. The fees Apple charges isn’t much at all especially concerning what it used to cost to host an app before app stores showed up.

Google, Steam, Nintendo, Sony, etc all charge 30%. Apple is 30% if you make over a million, otherwise it’s only 15%.
Yet third parties in EU are capable of running an AppStore on a sliver of an operating budget. So either Apple has no clue on AppStore optimization or it’s an outright lie.
 
Perhaps with the blatant lie that Sony would charge a 100% fee?
For those who apparently can't do math: that would mean that the game developers wouldn't get a single cent from the sales.
And especially for you: Sony doesn't charge any fees at all for developers to offer games for the PS5.
I didn’t say Sony charges a 100% fee. I said they make close to 100% of their software sales revenue from games. (By contrast, about 70% of Apple’s App Store revenue comes from games.)

And Sony doesn't charge any fees at all for developers who offer games on the PS5? Excuse me? You do realize they charge 30% on ALL PS5 games sold, right? Even those sold in stores? And no one has any issue with that whatsoever. I am sure Apple will begrudgingly accept the deal where they have to allow third party stores, but still get to charge 30% (I actually think they would still push back because third party stores are bad for users, but I'm sure they'd live).

Besides, what's with this misuse of the word "gatekeeper"?
So far, Sony has not been known to block games or apps because they contradict the company's moral values. Only Apple has done that so far.
Gatekeeper is a word madeup by the EU to justify regulation of companies that weren't monopolies like they were monopolies. So I'm applying the made up term to Sony.

And how many developers do you know who have to develop games for the PS5 because there is practically no alternative?
That's right, none. That's because there is fierce competition from Xbox, computers, smartphones, the internet, and Nintendo.
But hey, who cares about facts, right?
So it's competition when Xbox competes with Playstation, but not when Android competes with iOS? How does that work?

No one is forcing developers to develop for iOS! Developers are free to develop for Windows, Android, Playstation, Xbox, Web Apps, etc.

But hey, who cares about facts, right?
 
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Great, do supermarkets next!
More investment in a brick and mortar operation compared to a digital service provider where the brick and mortar data centre is located in a place with the most amount of government tax breaks while serving a global community, not comparable and try again.
 
one can do both at the same time.
If you remove the accessories even reduce the product price accordingly that’s the logic of how something works. While there are inflationary factors it pales in comparison to the profit margin percentage.
 
The market reach is not because they have the App Store locked down as the only option to source Apps.
No, that’s because Apple turned the iPad and iPhone into huge global bestsellers and continuous to invest in what they believe their customers like most. That doesn’t give anyone the right to a free ride.
I think there is a lot of confusion here. As an analogy it’s like someone listing a product on Amazon and is charged a certain percentage and another percentage on using ONLY Amazon pay service so in total 30% (as in Apple’s AppStore case).

So to list or host the product and the seller can ONLY USE Amazon’s pay system for a total of 30% fees to Amazon. Now if the seller says I don’t mind paying a listing fee but I can find a better rate for transactions and Amazon says nope it’s either our way or the highway. Now the seller has to offer up its product for a higher price to make up for Amazon’s cut or go elsewhere. Considering Amazon has a large footprint globally the seller has little recourse to just swallow the terms which is anticompetitive.
You are correct, there is a lot of confusion. As a dev, I'm not just selling my product. I'm selling a product designed for iPhone. No-one would design their product on top of Amazon. Amazon is just a marketplace.

The iPhone is a product that by design allows for expanding its standard features by whatever you can come up with. The result is an experience that is the combination of your innovation and work, on top the work Apple has done to allow you to design, build and deliver your product.

The AppStore could be seen a just a marketplace but the complete eco-system behind it is so much more than just a market place. Separating the platform from the store might sound like a great anti-competitive idea but it completely ignores that the product below the store is what gives the store its value. Without the product, there wouldn't be a store.

Amazon doesn't have that dilemma. The store is the product. That's all it is.
 
Let me know when you spot people carrying around a PS4 to run Google Maps, receive 2FA for banking, or be notified of AMBER Alerts.
I said PS Vita.

But anyways: there's no Google Maps app for Mac. I receive 2FA/Amber alerts on my iPhone. Does this mean Apple can close up macOS on iMac since people aren't carrying it around? Try again?

It's wild different people on the other side can't keep a consistent counter point.
 
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No, that’s because Apple turned the iPad and iPhone into huge global bestsellers and continuous to invest in what they believe their customers like most. That doesn’t give anyone the right to a free ride.

You are correct, there is a lot of confusion. As a dev, I'm not just selling my product. I'm selling a product designed for iPhone. No-one would design their product on top of Amazon. Amazon is just a marketplace.

The iPhone is a product that by design allows for expanding its standard features by whatever you can come up with. The result is an experience that is the combination of your innovation and work, on top the work Apple has done to allow you to design, build and deliver your product.

The AppStore could be seen a just a marketplace but the complete eco-system behind it is so much more than just a market place. Separating the platform from the store might sound like a great anti-competitive idea but it completely ignores that the product below the store is what gives the store its value. Without the product, there wouldn't be a store.

Amazon doesn't have that dilemma. The store is the product. That's all it is.
When was the last time the AppStore deliver physical items to your doorstep and all the other logistics? You feel that Amazon is just a store clearly demonstrates your understanding of the matter. Amazon also has e-services and products like Apple and more such as AWS, Prime, etc. But please continue to justify Apple’s position.
 
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If you remove the accessories even reduce the product price accordingly that’s the logic of how something works. While there are inflationary factors it pales in comparison to the profit margin percentage.

I'm sure development of a new phone is 100% the same cost of designing/producing every year where removing accessories and making the box smaller results in 100% pure extra profit, right?

I'm sure 5G chip costs the same as the LTE-only chips the year before, right?

Or maybe, things that Apple did to save money in one part of the product allowed them to spend money in other areas to build the product.
 
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No, that’s because Apple turned the iPad and iPhone into huge global bestsellers and continuous to invest in what they believe their customers like most. That doesn’t give anyone the right to a free ride.

Nobody’s asking for a free ride.

Apple charges developers and an annual fee to be on the platform.

Nothing about the situation entitles Apple to a cut of everything going on directly between customers and a business.

Are you advocating that Apple get a cut of all Amazon sales through the app?

What about a piece of monthly sub revenue from all Netflix iOS app users?
 
Apple Pay is a thing.
And App Store has strong competition against Google Play Store.
ApplePay needs an external financial institute to be linked or use its own, not sure how this is any different from AmazonPay or SamsungPay or GooglePay, strong competition changes. I don’t use any of those “Pay” systems I use my credit card directly and one could say those are “Pay” systems predating these “TechCompanyNamePay” systems. Makes it as convoluted as those gift cards, more waste and redundancy than anything.
 
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Wake me up when you can make phone calls, surf the web, etc on a Nintendo Switch/2 or others like a computer.
The apps in the app store are not required to make phone calls or surf the web. The apps in the app store are not necessary at all, so that argument is not valid.
 
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Apple engaged in anticompetitive behavior by charging App Store developers "excessive and unfair prices" for app distribution services, the UK's Competition Appeal Tribunal (CAT) ruled today [PDF] (via Reuters).

app-store-blue-banner-uk.jpg

The Tribunal found that Apple abused its market power by overcharging developers from October 2015 through the end of 2020. Developers were forced into using Apple's in-app purchase system and had no alternative to paying up to a 30 percent commission during that time period. The excessive fees ultimately led to higher prices for consumers.

According to the CAT, Apple had a monopoly over iOS app distribution and in-app payments. Apple's argument that Android and other platforms were viable alternatives for consumers and developers was rejected. The Tribunal also did not accept Apple's argument that its rules and fees were required for user security and privacy.

The end of 2020 in the UK's timeline corresponds with the launch of the App Store Small Business Program that saw Apple reduce App Store fees for independent developers and small business owners. The program reduced the commission that Apple collected from developers earning under $1 million per year to 15 percent, down from 30 percent. It's also when Apple began implementing other App Store changes in response to cases like Epic Games v. Apple.

The class action lawsuit was first filed in 2021 by Kings College London academic Dr. Rachael Kent, and the claim seeks up to £1.5 billion in damages. The period between 2015 and 2020 was selected in order to determine how much Apple will need to pay to UK consumers.

A damages trial is scheduled for November. Apple said it will appeal the ruling.

Note: Due to the political or social nature of the discussion regarding this topic, the discussion thread is located in our Political News forum. All forum members and site visitors are welcome to read and follow the thread, but posting is limited to forum members with at least 100 posts.

Article Link: Apple Loses UK Antitrust Lawsuit Over App Store Fees, Faces £1.5 Billion in Damages
This is getting absolutely ridiculous. Prior to the App Store, retail margins on software were 50%, and wholesalers got another 10% or so, leaving 40% or less for the developer, who also had to package the software, bringing their profit down even farther.

Now, software in the App Store costs less, developers get access to tools, support and hosting, as well as the benefits of being in a mall - common advertising, lead generation etc., and they receive somewhere around double the revenue share, and consumers benefit from the security, privacy and quality assurances from the App Store.

Government interference like this harms consumers and promotes the interests of shady companies who find the privacy and security barriers in the way of things they’d like to do at consumers’ expense.
 
That 30% cut isn’t unique to Apple, it’s pretty much the standard across the whole industry. PlayStation, Google Play, Steam, Nintendo, they all take around the same amount. It’s been that way for years and just kind of became “normal,” even though a lot of developers have complained about it.

Sure, some newer stores like Epic have dropped their cut to around 12–15%, but the big ones still stick with 30%. So why single out Apple? if they dont like Apples fee, go after that 30% norm as a whole. Seems a bit unfair otherwise.
 
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