Apple Ordered to Stop Selling iPhones Without Charger in Brazil [Updated]

[Benlurks1010]

As far as powering electronics, not including a charger is similar in that sense to "batteries not included" which has been common with electronics for ages.

This is true. But while that has always been common, phones are different because they always have included the charger. It’s a standard, an expectation that Apple is trying to change here, which makes it necessary for them to be as open about it as possible. IMO

They also give you the option to easily add a charger during the checkout process.

This is a good start. If you’re prompted to add a charger before checking out, and also reminded right there that it won’t include one if you don’t, that satisfies my definition of openness.

 

[sunking101]

None of it goes to landfill, it all gets sold on or handed down.

However you could use less as an individual. You could consume less on a personal level. I don't buy smartwatches because they're unnecessary. Likewise tablets. Likewise having a desktop and a laptop. Most people don't need all this kit. Some do I accept but most don't.

Offering a charger for free if a customer wants one wouldn't necessarily be a good environmental solution as many, if not most, consumers would still likely choose to get it anyway and therefore would still create unnecessary waste.

Getting a new iPhone every year creates unnecessary waste. It would be better to vet potential customers before nabbing their charger. If they have an iPhone, a MacBook and an iPad then they are bad for the environment. No new tech products for them unless on a 3-yearly upgrade plan.

iWatch as well? They clearly can't be trusted and are massive anti-environmentalists who waste money on numerous pieces of equipment which all do similar things. If you have an iPhone and a MacBook then no iPad or iWatch for you. Regardless, tech has reached a plateau now so a three yearly upgrade path for everyone.

Would you like to be dictated to like that? Give me the damned charger.

 

[sunking101]

Apple cares about their impact on the environment and climate since it's good business to care about it when a lot of your customers, employees and shareholders care.

No they don't.

Apple wins.

Every time. $$$$$$

 

[Branaghan]

Amazon is selling kindle without power brick

Anyways the removal of power brick in the iPhone package was mainly business, logistic wise Apple can ship probably 3x more iPhones in one go due to decrease in package dimensions compared before with Power brick inside.

…still there is balance, less CO2 and waste

Most purchases from the Kindle Paperwhite are from Amazon's website, and on the right side of the product page you can clearly see an option to add the charger for another US$ 19.

Remember this bit for a later argument: you * CAN * add the charger from right there. The product page. Other accessories, too, like the COVER.

For Apple, this is what we see when we try to get an iPhone... First you can choose 128-256 GB, etc, then the color, and finally...

They tell you this:

As part of our efforts to reach carbon neutrality by 2030, iPhone 13 and iPhone 13 mini do not include a power adapter or EarPods. Included in the box is a USB‑C to Lightning Cable that supports fast charging and is compatible with USB‑C power adapters and computer ports.

We encourage you to re‑use your current USB‑A to Lightning cables, power adapters, and headphones, which are compatible with these iPhone models. But if you need any new Apple power adapters or headphones, they are available for purchase.

There are two problems here:

1) The charger is located elsewhere (accessories hyperlink), not in the main product page, where you select what you want before BUYING. This is a stupid mistake, and I'll prove it to you with a totally different product:

Aeron Chair from Herman Miller - link here

It follows the same logic: offer ALL accessories which are essential for the product right there, on the main page. Apple makes us think that selecting the phone's disk space and color are crucial, while deciding if we want the charger isn't a big deal.

And believe me, many people are idiotic to not bother going in "ACCESSORIES" and assuming the charger will be there, without even reading this warning about their eco-policies.

2) The charger is too expensive, so any customer would feel cheated if buying from a local store or eBay-like website and end up not getting one with the iPhone box. The Amazon Kindle charger is sold for US$ 19, while for Apple is priced at US$ 42 (USB-C, 20W).

 

[webkit]

This probably sums it up best

So, are you saying that excluding chargers doesn't help the environment in any meaningful way? How do we know Apple is doing this just for profit/money reasons? Many factors go into the pricing of the phone. Maybe the U.S. iPhone 14 prices instead of being $829, $929 and $1,129 actually would've been $849, $949 and $1,149 had a charger been included.

 

[webkit]

This is true. But while that has always been common, phones are different because they always have included the charger. It’s a standard, an expectation that Apple is trying to change here, which makes it necessary for them to be as open about it as possible. IMO

This is a shift from how things used to be but there have been a variety of changes in technology and elsewhere over the years, for better or worse. In the Apple world, things like Mac OS upgrades, apps Keynote, Numbers, Pages, etc. used to cost money but are now included (at least for a period of time) and iPhone chargers which used to be included now aren't.

Some changes being seen today are due to green/environmental/carbon neutral goals that didn't exist (quite as much) years ago.

No matter what Apple does, it seems they will be accused of doing it for just profit reasons.

 

[webkit]

Getting a new iPhone every year creates unnecessary waste. It would be better to vet potential customers before nabbing their charger. If they have an iPhone, a MacBook and an iPad then they are bad for the environment. No new tech products for them unless on a 3-yearly upgrade plan.

iWatch as well? They clearly can't be trusted and are massive anti-environmentalists who waste money on numerous pieces of equipment which all do similar things. If you have an iPhone and a MacBook then no iPad or iWatch for you. Regardless, tech has reached a plateau now so a three yearly upgrade path for everyone.

Would you like to be dictated to like that? Give me the damned charger.

Not everyone is on the same phone purchase cycle. Sometimes phones get damaged, lost, stolen, etc. It would be unrealistic to expect Apple not to continue to make new phones every year.

However, Apple is not forcing people to get a new phone every year. If Apple really wanted to try to do that, they could do things like make phones with only one year of OS and security updates instead of the up to 7 years (about twice the average Android phone) they provide now.

 

[webkit]

The charger is located elsewhere (accessories hyperlink), not in the main product page, where you select what you want before BUYING. This is a stupid mistake, and I'll prove it to you with a totally different product:

You don't need to go to the accessories link to add a charger for the iPhone. After you select your desired phone model, color, storage, etc. and click "Add to Bag", you are next brought to a page that provides other optional items you can easily add including chargers.

 

[ericwn]

Says the Apple fan who no doubt has a ton of Apple kit readying itself for landfill. iMac? MacBook? iPad? iPhone? iWatch? Not to mention all the chargers and accessories that come with that lot. If you made do with one device and one charger I might respect your climate change stance a little more...

Hilarious. Runs out of arguments, starts assuming. Classy.

 

[sunking101]

Hilarious. Runs out of arguments, starts assuming. Classy.

Am I wrong though?? Most Apple fanbois own a ton of Apple kit, much of it superfluous. Nobody needs an iPad if they have an iPhone and MacBook. Nobody needs an iWatch period. Yet millions of people own all three and regularly upgrade them unecessarily because they want the latest & greatest. These people cannot preach to me about the environment.

I want a new charger with my new device and until they show me that they're environmentally right-on in every way they cannot question my motives. As for defending Apple selling chargers, these should be priced at cost value otherwise they're scamming us..

 

[ericwn]

E-SIM, no chargers, no headphones, what's next? No charger? Apparently Apple has different standards for each country. USA lost another feature. Switching back to Android physical SIM has me without 5G still. The unsuspecting are going to drown these mobile carriers in calls.

I believe this has been the case for two or so years already and it hasn’t stopped the iPhone’s popularity. The world has adjusted mostly.

 

[ericwn]

Am I wrong though?? Most Apple fanbois own a ton of Apple kit, much of it superfluous. Nobody needs an iPad if they have an iPhone and MacBook. Nobody needs an iWatch period. Yet millions of people own all three and regularly upgrade them unecessarily because they want the latest & greatest. These people cannot preach to me about the environment.

I want a new charger with my new device and until they show me that they're environmentally right-on in every way they cannot question my motives. As for defending Apple selling chargers, these should be priced at cost value otherwise they're scamming us..

Complete nonsense and nothing but guesswork.
Visit the iPad forum to check for how many it has become their primary computer platform.
There is no iWatch.
People buy what they like and see value in and not just because it has an apple logo on the front, teenagers maybe excluded.

You have your solution though now, all it takes is a move to Brazil.

 

[Bento.Box]

I find it good that the Brazil government intervened.

It's funny that apple doesn't include chargers for "environmental reasons", yet they stick witch features like a non-user-serviceable battery. I'm ok with using my own charger, but then of course I had to order a lightning cable because they didn't include one (USB-A to lightning).

In the end, it's not even about price, because you can get USB chargers, lightning cables etc. for cheap on aliexpress. Just order it one or two months before you need it.

But if I order a phone for roughly 1000 USD, then it would be good customer service to supply a charger for it. It's like when you buy a car and the dealer charges you extra for the floor matts because it's not included.

 

[strongy]

I find it good that the Brazil government intervened.

It's funny that apple doesn't include chargers for "environmental reasons", yet they stick witch features like a non-user-serviceable battery. I'm ok with using my own charger, but then of course I had to order a lightning cable because they didn't include one (USB-A to lightning).

In the end, it's not even about price, because you can get USB chargers, lightning cables etc. for cheap on aliexpress. Just order it one or two months before you need it.

But if I order a phone for roughly 1000 USD, then it would be good customer service to supply a charger for it. It's like when you buy a car and the dealer charges you extra for the floor matts because it's not included.

the EU is going to intervene and ban chargers from being included eventually get used to it, this was their idea.

 

[Bento.Box]

the EU is going to intervene and ban chargers from being included eventually get used to it, this was their idea.

Fortunately, I don't live in the EU

 

[strongy]

Fortunately, I don't live in the EU

you that will matter lol, they will fine companies including what they define as 'ewaste', the EU has more pull than brazil.

 

[Unregistered 4U]

Under this new EU law it will be illegal to not offer phones and other small electronics without a charger.

the EU is going to intervene and ban chargers from being included eventually get used to it, this was their idea.

Which one is it?

 

[Bento.Box]

you that will matter lol, they will fine companies including what they define as 'ewaste', the EU has more pull than brazil.

until the people get upset and more countries leave .
(and in the meantime, I would just continue to order directly from China via aliexpress)

 

[strongy]

Which one is it?

Common charger: MEPs agree on proposal to reduce electronic waste​

The new rules would make sure consumers no longer need a new charger and cable every time they purchase a new device

Unbundling the sale of a charger from the sale of the electronic device: the Commission says that EU consumers already have an average of three chargers and will only use two.

 

[Unregistered 4U]

Common charger: MEPs agree on proposal to reduce electronic waste​

The new rules would make sure consumers no longer need a new charger and cable every time they purchase a new device

Thanks, I thought I read two opposing things on that.

 

[Branaghan]

I find it good that the Brazil government intervened.

It's funny that apple doesn't include chargers for "environmental reasons", yet they stick witch features like a non-user-serviceable battery. I'm ok with using my own charger, but then of course I had to order a lightning cable because they didn't include one (USB-A to lightning).

In the end, it's not even about price, because you can get USB chargers, lightning cables etc. for cheap on aliexpress. Just order it one or two months before you need it.

But if I order a phone for roughly 1000 USD, then it would be good customer service to supply a charger for it. It's like when you buy a car and the dealer charges you extra for the floor matts because it's not included.

Fact: if you live in Brazil you can't easily replace an iPAD battery (I don't even think this is possible...), while it's the other way around with iPhones (at least some older models), and probably a lot cheaper...

Apple says it can do this for tablets asking 2x more $ than they do for iPhones, but when I contacted them directly, they denied this was possible, and local Apple companies claimed the same. They pushed me into paying for a new iPAD to replace it, or perhaps switching for a refurbished one, if available, of course.

The problem is, if you live here, you simply cannot keep buying anything new from Apple anymore... prices are now out of hand, and used/old phones are being sold more than ever in history. I used to replace mine every 2-3 years, now it's been 5 and soon 6 that I stopped doing it.

Within 3 years, no matter how careful you are, these batteries are much worse. If a single charge lasted, say, 8, 9 hours even with watching videos, it's probably down to 4-5 if you are lucky after a few years.

Instead of virtue signaling, how about Apple improves this old technology (from these batteries), which has always been garbage?

 

[Scoob Redux]

You buy a car and the dealer gives you a tank of gas. You get your refills yourself because it’s readily available, same for readily available chargers in your car, or drawer at home, or a new one online/in-store. Teslas now don’t come with mobile chargers either (although Tesla does give you a credit towards one or Wall Connector). Plus, many new cars cone with wireless charging pads so that’s yet another option to charge your new iPhone without a charger in the box. Why include charging accessories that are already ubiquitous?

Frankly I prefer no charger and could even do without the too-short cable. I also don’t need the booklets nor Apple stickers in the box.

First, just because Tesla also "de-contented" their cars does not justify anti-consumer behavior (btw, my Model S DID come with a charging cable).
Second, I need Apple to give me the charger necessary for adding power to my iPhone just like I need my car dealer gives me a car with a fuel filler orifice which is necessary for adding fuel to my car.

 

[Unregistered 4U]

Second, I need Apple to give me the charger necessary for adding power to my iPhone just like I need my car dealer gives me a car with a fuel filler orifice which is necessary for adding fuel to my car.

But, isn’t there a big difference in that analogy where if they don’t give you a cable you can still BUY a cable? I don’t think one can buy a car without a fuel filter orifice. And, if they did, there would likely be a thriving third party market that supplies those fuel filler orifices?

 

[NeonNights]

First, just because Tesla also "de-contented" their cars does not justify anti-consumer behavior (btw, my Model S DID come with a charging cable).
Second, I need Apple to give me the charger necessary for adding power to my iPhone just like I need my car dealer gives me a car with a fuel filler orifice which is necessary for adding fuel to my car.

Yes, we received the UMC with our Raven S and Model Y too. I’m just saying the policy changed recently with Tesla. As for orifices, the iPhone still comes with the lightning orifice. With so many Apple devotees upgrading every year, how many truly don’t already have a compatible charger? How many do you need to hoard?

With Teslas and other automakers adopting USB-C ports you can still charge in the car with the charging cable that comes with an iPhone, or possibly wirelessly charge. It is a small minority of new iPhone users that absolutely cannot plug the provided charging cable into either their car, laptop/desktop, or some existing USB hub/charger/battery pack to charge. Charging options are not quite as limited as they were years ago.

 

[Bento.Box]

With so many Apple devotees upgrading every year, how many truly don’t already have a compatible charger? How many do you need to hoard?

I upgrade the phone around every 3 years. I burn through chargers often faster than through phones (sometimes literally, had some that went up in smoke - especially original chargers). Then the charging standards change all the time and the new phones aren't compatible with the old chargers, so even with an adapter, they charge really slow with 2.5W (or not at all).

At the moment, we transitioned from USB-A and QC 3 to USB-C and PD on the charging side. And we already have different rated USB-C cables. What will it be when I buy the next iphone?

Sure, I can put in the effort and research what charger with which protocol will work for the next phone. But when I pay premium, I sort of expect to come with a compatible charger. It's included in the cheaper phones.
It's not included in other appliances, but then again, they are usually low power and come with standard USB-A. So if your nightlight chargers only with 2.5W, it doesn't matter much.

It would also be nice to have at least a standard cable included (or an adapter), since you can't connect your iphone via USB-C to a standard computer to synchronize with itunes (music, backup).