iPod Apple really blew it with my warranty service

[aussieinjapan]

Is the thread starter trying to piss people off ??? So you've had problems with Apple - just buy what you want.

I loved my Sony bravia 32" until the screen went all purple. Sony came and replaced the screen in my house (yes, this is Japan). Now, when it starts up, the screen is flickering...

So Im not going to get a Sony next time. Maybe a Toshiba or even an LG (they just started selling them here in Japan again).

Problem solved

 

[Keebler]

Hi MacOsx,

I think you just have had crap luck unfortunately.

You said your post was to inform people what Apple's warranty is really like and unfortunately for you, I can see how you'd be frustrated, but I don't believe your case is the baseline for how their warranty and service performs.

For me, our house has 6 Macs, 1 iPad, 1 iPhone, 2 ipod shuffles and an old 3rd gen iPod (the ol' white brick).

I've had my share of issues - 4 in total and each time, Apple has completely honoured Applecare and/or their warranty to my satisfaction.

I know there will be other people like you and other people like me, sharing similar experiences.

It's too bad you've had those issues, but I just wanted to share a glimmer of hope from my positive ones.

Good luck,
Keebler

 

[blackburn]

I can only say that apple service is excellent. Tomorrow I'm going to pick up my macbook with a new bottom plate because the old one warped (and I had the option of keeping the macbook with me while the bottom plate arrives to the store).
mosx is just bashing apple.
Some times we get bad luck with an brand, but that doesn't mean we have to go and bash it.
Some days we get lucky other days we don't. If you think apple service sucks. You should have seen sony with my mp3 player (5 months and they decided they couldn't fixed it and gave my money back).

You can always buy another brand of whatever you want.

 

[czeluff]

yeah, sorry you've had bad luck dude. I've had 3 MBP's, a Blackbook, a Macbook Air, every iPhone, an iPad, and a 24" iMac, and I've had a problem or two, but each one was met with a sincere Genius who apologized for my troubles and took excellent care of me.

Maybe you're just better off in the hands of Dell or HP.

 

[mosx]

Easily warped current generation MBPs? I want some of what you're smoking. Even if you don't like the components or OS, the build is more solid than any other machine out there.

Built more solid than what? Theres nothing "more solid" about my unibody aluminum MacBook than my plastic HP. Except maybe the fact that if I bump the MacBook into something it will dent while nothing will happen to the HP.

Mr. OP, why don't you rid yourself of all your Apple products? They hold excellent resale value, and as you say, you could pick up much more computing power for your dollar. What's holding you back? The attention you are getting at these forums?

Tried selling them before. My post on the marketplace might still be there. Everyone here wants to use PayPal and I don't use them for my own protection and out of principle. That leaves local sales only, and people around here are too smart to buy Apple products at used prices. So these days I keep the Apple logo on my MacBook covered and mostly run Windows 7 on it.

I get the impression that you are quite a confrontational person.

Only after someone tries to screw me over.

Some people get swollen batteries replaced without problems, others don't. You should look in the mirror and ask yourself why you were in the "others" category.

Maybe you should learn to not post without knowing all of the facts.

When I contacted Apple about my battery I was very polite, very easy going, and not "confrontational" at all until after they had told me multiple times there was nothing they could do about it.

Just have a look at the responses in this thread. The same situation, described in different words, would have got you sympathy, support, perhaps help. Instead you got attacked

Because people around here don't like hearing the truth about Apple.

My hp idled at 70ºC, so my macbook at 37ºC certainly is way cooler than the hp crapbook that I owned before. I've got my warranty voided when I swap the lcd panel that the hp support scratched.

Idled at 70c? I don't think so. You're not being honest there or your fan was dying. I've never had a non-Apple computer reach a temperature that high idling or under load.

As far as your LCD is concerned, blame your countries laws. Here in the US, no company could legally void your warranty because of that.

For instance, if I swapped the LCD on a new 13" MacBook Pro for one of those TechRestore matte displays, Apple would still legally have to honor the warranty on the rest of the system under the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act. They wouldn't have to honor display issues, but they would absolutely have to honor the warranty on the rest of the system.

Try reinstalling windows a few times. Or office. And not user error. I've had it with pc's. In programming courses they always gave trouble to anyone who tried to use them. And it's not a user error. Go google. Many people share the same people.

I've been running Windows for the better portion of 2 decades now. And OS X for 4 years. I've seen OS X go berserk more in the last 4 years than I ever had problems with Windows. Tiger, 10.4.8, was the first time I had seen a computer fully lock up and become unresponsive since the 90s.

At least in mac os x I can install an combo update and I don't have to loose that much time.

A combo update for OS X is bigger than all current Windows 7 patches combined.

Go call others stupid. But I've been servicing windows machines for years. I get paid to repair the crap that ms does. So don't tell me that's user error.

I get paid to repair computers as well. With the exception of hardware failure, every single software issue I've ever seen in Windows is the result of user error. However, with OS X, all I ever encounter are issues caused by the OS itself. I mean, how stupid is it that your wireless networking can just disappear? That happened to me once and I've seen it happen to others. In OS X my wireless adapter just completely disappeared. It worked in Windows on the same machine. Thats how I was able to get online and find the solution. But in OS X it was gone.

Windows 7 clean install with nvidia drivers turns off my lcd every-time that I insert an usb pen drive. So what? To bad that ms doesn't control the hardware or the drivers. They signed an bugged driver.

Thats a hardware issue. Not drivers. Doesn't happen to me or anyone else I know with Windows 7 and an nvidia GPU running the latest drivers.

Basically, mosx isn't looking for a solution -- he simply enjoys stirring up the pot on MacRumors.

Nope. I point out how Apple really is. And the fans don't like to hear it.

Below is a post from the OP from slightly over THREE YEARS ago. Sound familiar?

I wasn't the only one who had those issues. There were threads at Apple's own support site that were hundreds upon hundreds of pages in length regarding the 3G iPod nano tilted screen as well as Apple screwing people over on iPod games.

I think the kids today call it…

How? He showed that I like to point out the truth about Apple. So what?

I've had my share of issues - 4 in total and each time, Apple has completely honoured Applecare and/or their warranty to my satisfaction.

It depends on your definition of satisfied. Some people are "satisfied" having to send their system in multiple times for repair. I'm not. If I buy something that costs significantly more than it should, like an Apple product, I expect it to be of stellar quality. If something does go wrong, I expect nothing but the best warranty service. If I'm told one thing and another thing happens, thats not satisfactory. At all.

You should have seen sony with my mp3 player (5 months and they decided they couldn't fixed it and gave my money back).

Hows that bad? Sony did the right thing and refunded your money. Apple will continue to push repairs and refurbished replacements until they are legally required to give you a refund.

It's exactly this type of petty childish behaviour that gives some Americans a bad name.

And making such a comment completely destroys any credibility you might have had.

I don't believe for one second half of the alleged complaints from the OP and it seems quite clear that it's just another trolling post about how great PC's are.

You're free to believe whatever you want. I have better things to do than lie about these things.

But for the OP, please never, ever, ever buy another Apple product, we'll all be much happier.

I won't be. And thanks to whats happened and me telling people my HONEST story, Apple has already lost about 50 sales for various items.

Ha, you nailed it; this isn't a customer who had bad luck or was ripped off, it's someone who trolls around on forums trying to stir up an argument

Nope. Its someone telling an honest story painting a real picture of Apple that fans get all upset when they hear it.

I wonder if microsoft would give you a new Zune if the product breaks under warranty.

From what I've read, they do. Let's not forget that Microsoft actually started feature updating the Zune through firmware updates back when Apple was refusing to back-port new features to old hardware, before the iPod touch was released. Apple's excuse was "Accounting" or "if you want new features you need to buy the new product" while Microsoft was giving Zune owners new features with every update.

If a product breaks and the manufacturer rectifies the problem by giving a replacement that is functionally identical, then I don't see that as a big problem.

Its a big problem if its used and I paid for new. I didn't buy used. I bought new.

At this point I would absolutely LOVE for Apple to give me a refund. I don't want this thing any more.

 

[wordoflife]

Do I have to repeat myself again?

The Genius, if you can call them that, specifically told me that I would be receiving a new unit in the store. When he started the swap process I asked him if it would be brand new or refurbished. He said brand new. When he saw there was no stock and suggested mail-in or him ordering, I asked if mail-in would still give me a brand new unit, not refurbished, he said yes.

Again, the person helping me specifically stated I would be getting a brand new replacement. Whether it happened in store or mail-in.

Fair enough, but accept that he made a mistake, and move on with your life. If you want this to hold you back, then fine ... I don't care.

Anything with Apple is not guaranteed to be perfect!

However, I paid for new. I want new

.

To be fair, you broke your nano. If you hadn't had touched it, then the button wouldn't have gotten messed up. Obviously, thats not the point, but do you see my point?

I don't care about correcting the employee. I paid $168 for a device, after taxes, that should have been priced more about $75. I want what i paid for or a refund.

If you thought it was worth $75, then you shouldn't have bought it. Your fault for "overpaying"

Look at sales. Macs are still single digits and Android is taking over iOS.

And that describes why people don't buy Macs?

Including COST and the fact that you get significantly less hardware, less capable hardware, and almost no upgrade path.

There are more reasons to why people buy/do not buy Macs. Do you want me to explain?

How? A 2003-2004 iBook would have had a G4 800MHz, 256MB of RAM (limited to just over 1GB upgrade), a 30GB HDD, a CD writer, and a Radeon 9200 32MB. And it would have sold for $1100. A PowerBook from 2003-2004 would have had a G4 1GHz, 256MB of RAM (upgradeable to 2GB), a CD writer with a DVD writer being an extremely expensive upgrade, and a 60GB HDD. And it would have cost $2,000.

The fact that anything from Apple pre-2006 uses PPC architecture means it is obsolete. Apple has abandon support for the architecture and none of their new software releases even support that architecture any more. Before you know it, 3rd party browsers won't even support PPC.

Let's not forget the upgrade paths for those systems. The last generation of iBook was only upgradeable to 1.5GB. Good luck upgrading the HDD, unless you like performing full system surgery on it.

Some people don't value upgrades or higher specs (as you posted) so they may decide to buy a Mac. Some people value specs and upgrades, so they buy accordingly. There is nothing wrong with buying a Windows computer.

What did you get in 2003/2004 from a PC? $1300 would have gotten you an Athlon 64 2GHz or Pentium M 2GHz, Radeon Mobile 9700 with 128MB of RAM, DVD writer standard, 60GB standard, 512GB to 1GB of RAM, etc.

People who love Apple would argue "Look what you didn't get".
In other words, no one cares what you could have gotten, its a personal preference.

Well, you certainly don't buy a Mac for horsepower. Not when a $1500 desktop system comes with a dual core Core i3.

If you value specs, then a Mac isn't for you. If you don't like it, then don't buy it.

I don't care about specs. I care about overall performance ... and the Mac seems to do better in that aspect for me.

Thin? So? Thin also means poor cooling system, which means a hotter system on your lap and lower quality internal components that run cooler.

No, I meant thin as in thin. I couldn't find a thinner laptop for the price, with the same features (or more features) than a Macbook Pro.

And so what about thin? When my laptop leaves the house its in a case. I'm not carrying it by its own body.

I care about thin. Obviously, the preference of thinness matters differently to both you and I ... but for people who value it, a Macbook Pro is a good consideration.

Core 2 Duo and GeForce 320M? Fast in 2006 maybe. $1,000 in the PC world will get you a dedicated GPU faster than anything in any shipping Mac as well as a true quad core 8 thread Core i7.

No one forced you to buy your computer. You saw all of this coming when buying a computer.

Soft metals that scratch, bend, warp, etc. aren't exactly "Sturdy".

Would you please recommend a better laptop to me? (preferably NOT with Windows)

The only positive thing about Apple's systems would be the battery life. However, that comes as a result of having extremely low end hardware, by modern standards. Theres also a lot of shortcuts taken to get to that point, like down clocking the GPU a lot. However, my HP in 2007 had better battery life than my Mac in 2008 thanks to double capacity batteries and user replaceable batteries. I had 10 hours of battery life across two batteries while Macs didn't even have 4 hours real world.

Okay then, go buy an HP. No one here cares what computer you have.
And by the way, who are you kidding with "extremely low end hardware by modern standards". Thats a joke. I know you can get better stuff, but really, what you posted is rubbish.

Longevity? Thats debatable. The batteries on my HP are still original and still reporting 98% capacity. My MacBook's battery was not even a year and a half old when it swelled up and died while supposedly at 98% health itself and less than 200 cycles.

Good for you.

Runs cool? Depends on your definition of cool. My HP has a Merom based Core 2 Duo at 2GHz and my Mac has a Penryn Core 2 Duo at 2GHz. Technically, the Penryn should run cooler and use less energy. Oh the HP has a dedicated nvidia GPU as well. The HP runs an average 30-40F cooler under load and idle and while playing games compared to the Mac, thanks to Apple's poor cooling design and focus on being thin rather than useful.

I don't care how hot my computer is inside. I just don't want it burning my lap after 20 minutes.

I bought my first Mac nearly 4 years ago for OS X. In that four years, going from Tiger to Snow Leopard now, I see absolutely no benefit in OS X compared to Windows. None. I can think of a lot of things that Windows can do that OS X can't, like proper video decoding and blu-ray playback. But I honestly cannot think of a single thing that OS X can do that Windows cannot. I can think of things Windows does better. But I can't think of anything OS X does better.

Some people do value OS X over Windows. If you don't, then okay.. go buy a PC. It doesn't really matter ... its just a computer.

Don't make me laugh. There is NOTHING better about the build quality of a Mac compared to a PC. The plastic Macs have all kinds of issues with cracking, discoloration, and other failures.

Build quality is superior in my opinion. When I pick my Mac off the table, I don't hear creaking and other random noises. Also, it doesn't have 20 different holes in the back for ventilation and what not. I couldn't find something similar to the MBP in the PC market

Go and compare the MacBook "Pro" to the actual professional lines from HP and Dell. Those things are built like tanks. You don't have to worry about setting it down hard denting it, or heat warping it. Or a non-user replaceable battery swelling up.

There is nothing to compare the MBP with an HP or Dell. They are completely different computers ... for completely different computer users.

Explain to me how a $999 plastic MacBook that will crack and discolor and comes with a 4 year old processor architecture, 2GB of RAM, and integrated graphics is somehow priced appropriately against a $999 PC that will have a quad core 8 thread CPU, dedicated graphics, 2-3x the RAM, blu-ray, larger screens, etc.

I'm not sure what you are asking or saying here.

Well, why would you honestly buy a Mac?

I already told you, and people like the actual operating system.

I've owned several notebook PCs. Including that $1300 one I mentioned earlier.

Me too

When I pay 2-3x what a product is actually worth, I expect it to be perfect.

Well, that's your fault.

 

[blackburn]

Idled at 70c? I don't think so. You're not being honest there or your fan was dying. I've never had a non-Apple computer reach a temperature that high idling or under load.

The temperature thing was the hp dv5 series in 2008 (google lots of people complaining of it overheating)

As far as your LCD is concerned, blame your countries laws. Here in the US, no company could legally void your warranty because of that.

Well in this country everything is an excuse to void your warranty so apple wins here, got a new bottom plate under warranty.

I've been running Windows for the better portion of 2 decades now. And OS X for 4 years. I've seen OS X go berserk more in the last 4 years than I ever had problems with Windows. Tiger, 10.4.8, was the first time I had seen a computer fully lock up and become unresponsive since the 90s.

Well today I've completely crashed windows 7 and even got a blue screen with it. I've had os x and linux also crash. But once in a blue moon.

A combo update for OS X is bigger than all current Windows 7 patches combined.

Yes their combo updates are big, but they include all languages. And they don't need previous patches installed.

I get paid to repair computers as well. With the exception of hardware failure, every single software issue I've ever seen in Windows is the result of user error. However, with OS X, all I ever encounter are issues caused by the OS itself. I mean, how stupid is it that your wireless networking can just disappear? That happened to me once and I've seen it happen to others. In OS X my wireless adapter just completely disappeared. It worked in Windows on the same machine. Thats how I was able to get online and find the solution. But in OS X it was gone.

Never had an issue with wireless even when running mac os x in the hp laptop with an broadcom card. And in windows in my university printer sharing works so well that I have to configure it every time I want to use it. With mac os x or linux I only need to configure once. (and guess what it uses smb)

Thats a hardware issue. Not drivers. Doesn't happen to me or anyone else I know with Windows 7 and an nvidia GPU running the latest drivers.

And the nvidia thing, it's definitely a bug. Doesn't happen on linux or mac os x. With 258.96 it didn't happen now with 260.xx happens all the time.

 

[mosx]

Fair enough, but accept that he made a mistake, and move on with your life. If you want this to hold you back, then fine ... I don't care.

Sure, maybe if the iPod had cost $50 or so. But it cost $163.53 after taxes (looking at the receipt). Thats too much money to accept a mistake.

To be fair, you broke your nano. If you hadn't had touched it, then the button wouldn't have gotten messed up. Obviously, thats not the point, but do you see my point?

Come on, thats flat out stupid. I was using it as it was intended and designed for and it died. Its happened to many others. Google is your friend in this case.

If you thought it was worth $75, then you shouldn't have bought it. Your fault for "overpaying"

Aside from the tilted screen on my 3G nano, I've never had issues with iPods. I have an almost 6 year old iPod mini 2G that still holds a full charge. And I'm a sucker for neat touch screens. It is my fault for buying it. However, Apple should have lived up to its word.

And that describes why people don't buy Macs?

Cost. Low specs for the cost. $1500 for Core i3 iMac? The only place you'll find that in the PC world is in some low-end Black Friday special at Walmart.

There are more reasons to why people buy/do not buy Macs. Do you want me to explain?

OS X? No benefit over Windows. As I said before, I can think of plenty of things Windows can do that OS X cannot. But not the other way around.

Some people don't value upgrades or higher specs (as you posted) so they may decide to buy a Mac. Some people value specs and upgrades, so they buy accordingly. There is nothing wrong with buying a Windows computer.

And what are you going to get by putting software first? Keep in mind that in a real computer, unlike a smartphone or the iPad, software is only HALF of the total equation.

People who love Apple would argue "Look what you didn't get".
In other words, no one cares what you could have gotten, its a personal preference

And I would say "look what you didn't get by buying Apple" right back at them. They got a system that cost more than that PC would have in 2003/2004 and that Mac would not be usable today. However, the PC I pointed out, with a RAM upgrade, would be fully capable of running Windows 7.

In fact, that PC would have features that Apple only made standard recently, like a DVD burner (don't forget that Apple still sold CD writers up until 2008) and card reader.

I don't care about specs. I care about overall performance ... and the Mac seems to do better in that aspect for me.

How so? You get slower processors (sometimes, significantly), slower HDDs, significantly slower GPUs. Not to mention the fact that Snow Leopard is a resource hog.

No, I meant thin as in thin. I couldn't find a thinner laptop for the price, with the same features (or more features) than a Macbook Pro.

Thats because PC manufacturers put functionality before form.

Show me a Mac with USB 3, eSATA, full size ExpressCard, HDMI with full LPCM and "HD Audio" support, modern dedicated graphics, multi-card readers, user changeable batteries, blu-ray readers and writers, proper cooling systems, etc.

I care about thin. Obviously, the preference of thinness matters differently to both you and I ... but for people who value it, a Macbook Pro is a good consideration.

There are "thin" PCs out there that are more feature complete than Macs. They just have a "wedge" shape so they're thicker at the back. But that accommodates proper cooling systems and significantly higher end components.

No one forced you to buy your computer. You saw all of this coming when buying a computer.

When I bought my Mac, I was led to believe everything Apple says about OS X being better and all that nonsense. Problems didn't start until the return window had closed.

Would you please recommend a better laptop to me? (preferably NOT with Windows)

Why not with Windows? You don't want an OS that can do EVERYTHING?

Okay then, go buy an HP. No one here cares what computer you have.
And by the way, who are you kidding with "extremely low end hardware by modern standards". Thats a joke. I know you can get better stuff, but really, what you posted is rubbish.

Core 2 Duo at $1,499 (high end 13" MBP) isn't low-end by modern standards? quad core 8 thread Core i7 have been available in PC notebooks for more than a year and a half now.

I don't care how hot my computer is inside. I just don't want it burning my lap after 20 minutes.

Then you shouldn't be using a Mac. The metal casing can get hot to the touch. If I'm encoding video in Handbrake, my Mac's case gets hot to the point where I can't touch it. My HP case, on the other hand, barely gets warm to the touch even while playing games.

Some people do value OS X over Windows.

But why? Theres no logical reason to. Theres no benefit to running OS X over Windows, except for iOS development.

Build quality is superior in my opinion. When I pick my Mac off the table, I don't hear creaking and other random noises. Also, it doesn't have 20 different holes in the back for ventilation and what not. I couldn't find something similar to the MBP in the PC market

So, lack of ventilation is somehow a good thing? It's good that your computers casing will run hotter? Its good that the internal components will run hotter and shorten their overall lifespan as a result?

I don't hear any random noises from my plastic HP either. And its older than my Mac.

There is nothing to compare the MBP with an HP or Dell. They are completely different computers ... for completely different computer users.

According to Apple, the MacBook Pro is a "Professional" machine meant to be used the same as those from Dell or HP or Lenovo's professional lines.

I'm not sure what you are asking or saying here.

Asking how the Mac is priced appropriately when compared to competitors products. Will post that again: "Explain to me how a $999 plastic MacBook that will crack and discolor and comes with a 4 year old processor architecture, 2GB of RAM, and integrated graphics is somehow priced appropriately against a $999 PC that will have a quad core 8 thread CPU, dedicated graphics, 2-3x the RAM, blu-ray, larger screens, etc."

Well, that's your fault.

So, what, I shouldn't expect my moneys worth?

The temperature thing was the hp dv5 series in 2008 (google lots of people complaining of it overheating)

I've never encountered this problem myself or with others. Sounds, again, like user error.

Well today I've completely crashed windows 7 and even got a blue screen with it. I've had os x and linux also crash. But once in a blue moon.

Bluescreen is a driver problem. I haven't seen a bluescreen since 2001. Somethings wrong with your hardware. If its on your Mac, blame Apple. Apple has terrible Windows support. The glass trackpad in the unibody systems didn't even work right in Windows until Boot Camp 3.0. Apple let that go for a full year.

Yes their combo updates are big, but they include all languages. And they don't need previous patches installed

Not true. When I recently did a fresh install of Snow Leopard there were several additional patches pushed through with the combo update.

And in windows in my university printer sharing works so well that I have to configure it every time I want to use it. With mac os x or linux I only need to configure once. (and guess what it uses smb)

Blame your University. I only had to set up my wireless printer once. It works just fine in Windows and OS X.

And the nvidia thing, it's definitely a bug. Doesn't happen on linux or mac os x. With 258.96 it didn't happen now with 260.xx happens all the time.

Doesn't happen to me. I have nvidia cards in both of my systems. Both running 260.99 on Windows 7 x64 Home Premium.

Funny how Windows 7 x64 isn't even supposed to be supported on my system, according to Apple. But if you run the installer as an admin, everything installs and works beautifully. Windows 7 x64 is faster than Snow Leopard.

Back on topic, now I need to decide what steps to take next against Apple. Even after pointing out California laws and Magnuson-Moss, and my witnesses backing up my statement about the Apple store employee guaranteeing me a new replacement, Apple will not budge on this refurbished unit. So now I need to decide on whether to take Apple to court for breaking those laws. But at the same time, I could keep it and tell people my story about it. Nothing illegal about that as long as I don't slander the company. Anti-SLAPP laws mean I can say anything about what happened as long as its honest. And I've already swayed 5 people from buying one today. So I might just do that.

 

[wordoflife]

What don't you get? Not everyone in the market for specs. There is no easier to explain that.

If you are unhappy with Apple, then don't buy from them. It looks like you've been unhappy them for a really long time, so just move on and stop buying their stuff. (looking at a post from you a few years ago)

Stupid if me not to realize this before, but your points are no good. I'm not going to write and comment about everything you're saying because you're just turning this into a giant pissing contest.

Just for your own sake though, and so you don't get a headache with the way Apple does things... stop buying Apple products! (you should know how Apple does things though since you've been using their products for a while)

WOW, you would really consider taking this to court and paying so much more money. Your better using the money you would use in court and the money gained by selling your iPod Nano (just make sure you write that its a refurbished model without any imperfections) and use it towards a new Zune and Dell laptop.

 

[And1ss]

OP, I'll agree with you that Apple may not have the perfect record at customer service, but when you use your experience to say this is the real example of Apple's customer service, then that's not fair. --> "Show people what Apple's CS truly is" How do you account for the other good experiences posted all over this site?

And besides, I don't understand the whole concept of having to buy your money's worth. If the buyer is happy with the product, has money, and wants to spend the money, then that's that. End of story.

 

[mosx]

What don't you get? Not everyone in the market for specs. There is no easier to explain that.

Like I said, software is only half of the equation when it comes to computers. Hardware plays every bit as important of a role as software.

With a Mac, you get inferior software AND hardware.

If you are unhappy with Apple, then don't buy from them.

I'm not any more. And I will do my best to honestly and in a non-slanderous way discourage others from buying Apple.

Stupid if me not to realize this before, but your points are no good. I'm not going to write and comment about everything you're saying because you're just turning this into a giant pissing contest.

If my points aren't good then you'd be able to counter them.

Just for your own sake though, and so you don't get a headache with the way Apple does things... stop buying Apple products! (you should know how Apple does things though since you've been using their products for a while)

The whole problem here stems from the fact that the Apple store employee told me one thing and Apple delivered another. And they only thing the woman from corporate executive relations could say is "he shouldn't have told you that".

WOW, you would really consider taking this to court and paying so much more money.

Costs about $45 to file small claims suit. And in California and under Magnuson-Moss, I'd get that back and all of my costs related to this incident, including lost wages, gas, etc.

and use it towards a new Zune and Dell laptop.

Why would I want a Dell laptop?

I'm smart enough to build my own system. I don't need a laptop, and when it comes to a personal computer, I want something I can service myself without having to call the manufacturer for support or parts.

"Show people what Apple's CS truly is" How do you account for the other good experiences posted all over this site?

Because different people have different definitions of "good". Some people are perfectly happy with having their products fail multiple times and having them replaced or repaired multiple times.

And besides, I don't understand the whole concept of having to buy your money's worth. If the buyer is happy with the product, has money, and wants to spend the money, then that's that. End of story.

Some people don't know any better, really.

 

[wordoflife]

If my points aren't good then you'd be able to counter them.

You clearly don't understand, and it seems you never will, and I don't have time to keep explaining myself. I told you many times, buy what ever makes you happy.

Costs about $45 to file small claims suit. And in California and under Magnuson-Moss, I'd get that back and all of my costs related to this incident, including lost wages, gas, etc.

Go for it

Why would I want a Dell laptop?

I'm smart enough to build my own system. I don't need a laptop, and when it comes to a personal computer, I want something I can service myself without having to call the manufacturer for support or parts.

I assumed you needed a laptop. I'm smart enough to build my own computer too, you can check my sig for specs.

 

[Weepul]

I don't know why I'm bothering, but:

I've been running Windows for the better portion of 2 decades now. And OS X for 4 years. I've seen OS X go berserk more in the last 4 years than I ever had problems with Windows. Tiger, 10.4.8, was the first time I had seen a computer fully lock up and become unresponsive since the 90s.

Your experience is nearly opposite of mine. Can I blame "user error" for your OS X troubles, too?

OS X? No benefit over Windows. As I said before, I can think of plenty of things Windows can do that OS X cannot. But not the other way around.

Having used Windows XP for a while, even after installing extensions and modifications to make it more acceptable, I find it still gets in my way and is less compatible with how I want to work, in many ways that I believe are not changeable (awkward keyboard shortcuts, double-click text selection character eating, always sorting folders above files, forgetting folder layout options and yes I have edited the registry setting to increase the count). Fortunately, many programs I use don't follow the Windows paradigm in those aspects and thus are tolerable.

OS X is more fluid and streamlined for me. I have not bothered, but I believe you could experimentally determine that I am less stressed and more productive on a computer running OS X.

Show me a Mac with USB 3, eSATA, full size ExpressCard, HDMI with full LPCM and "HD Audio" support, modern dedicated graphics, multi-card readers, user changeable batteries, blu-ray readers and writers, proper cooling systems, etc.

Of those features, the only ones I personally care about are the GPU and "proper" cooling if it is effective and quiet. Remember, other people may have different priorities than you.

Then you shouldn't be using a Mac. The metal casing can get hot to the touch. If I'm encoding video in Handbrake, my Mac's case gets hot to the point where I can't touch it. My HP case, on the other hand, barely gets warm to the touch even while playing games.

Although I haven't used a Mac laptop for those purposes (my main is a Mac Pro), my experiences with an HP and a Lenovo were that both got unbearably hot on the bottom when playing games. The HP had a very noisy fan even when idle, and worse when the battery was being charged (also computationally idle). From my perspective, your claim seems exceptional and I am skeptical.

Also, both had shorter battery life than a comparable Mac, the Lenovo was less well-equipped for a similar list price (though I found it discounted used), and the HP was heavier, hotter, noisier, with a worse screen and worse tactilely, although cheaper and better specced.

Back on topic, now I need to decide what steps to take next against Apple. Even after pointing out California laws and Magnuson-Moss, and my witnesses backing up my statement about the Apple store employee guaranteeing me a new replacement, Apple will not budge on this refurbished unit. So now I need to decide on whether to take Apple to court for breaking those laws. But at the same time, I could keep it and tell people my story about it.

Go for it. The Apple support rep goofed and if you're not the forgiving sort, you sound like you have a right to your claim. You can tell your story anyway; settling it in court ought to make it even stronger, right?

I won't be. And thanks to whats happened and me telling people my HONEST story, Apple has already lost about 50 sales for various items.

And I've already swayed 5 people from buying one today. So I might just do that.

It's too bad that those people are so easily swayed by one person's anecdotal experience.

 

[flyfish29]

You obviously didn't read all of my posts then.

Has ANYONE here actually read all of your posts? I don't think I have that much time in my day!

NO really, you should let others decide for themselves if Apple products are for them, clearly they are not for you though!!!

 

[mosx]

Your experience is nearly opposite of mine. Can I blame "user error" for your OS X troubles, too?

It's not user error when the OS just comes down crashing for no reason. There was a few times the OS crashed just as I tried to move the mouse cursor. Another when I clicked "Burn" in a "Burn Folder" (Tiger). Another when I emptied the Trash filled with pictures.

Having used Windows XP for a while

The last time Windows XP was relevant was what? 4 years ago?

even after installing extensions and modifications to make it more acceptable, I find it still gets in my way and is less compatible with how I want to work, in many ways that I believe are not changeable

Everything in Windows can be customized to the way you'd like. Everything.

awkward keyboard shortcuts

Compared to OS X's multiple keyboard combinations needed to alt-tab to a specific window? Or the fact that cut and paste STILL isn't directly supported in Finder (not apps, Finder)?

double-click text selection character eating

Never had that problem.

always sorting folders above files

Folders should be above files. It makes a lot more sense from an organization stand point than OS X's mix everything up approach of organizing.

forgetting folder layout options and yes I have edited the registry setting to increase the count

Never had that problem. The only way options like that would get changed is if you actively changed them yourself.

Of those features, the only ones I personally care about are the GPU and "proper" cooling if it is effective and quiet. Remember, other people may have different priorities than you.

So you don't care about things that the rest of the world does? You don't care about expandability? You'd rather your computer be a toy than something that can actually be upgraded and used as time progresses?

Although I haven't used a Mac laptop for those purposes (my main is a Mac Pro), my experiences with an HP and a Lenovo were that both got unbearably hot on the bottom when playing games. The HP had a very noisy fan even when idle, and worse when the battery was being charged (also computationally idle). From my perspective, your claim seems exceptional and I am skeptical.

Find an Apple notebook and try encoding some video. You'll see what "hot" means.

Fan noise doesn't equal running hot. I can hear the soft hum of my HP fan when the system is idle. But also runs several tens of degrees cooler than my Mac.

Also, both had shorter battery life than a comparable Mac, the Lenovo was less well-equipped for a similar list price (though I found it discounted used), and the HP was heavier, hotter, noisier, with a worse screen and worse tactilely, although cheaper and better specced.

Keyboard is subjective. I can't stand Apple's keyboards. It took about a year of use to finally "break in" my MacBook's keyboard and get it to the point where I could type as fast on it as I could on my HP.

I'm not concerned about weight because going from a 5lb system to a 6lb system isn't a big deal.

But theres no way a PC runs hotter than a Mac. Not at all. With Apple's poor cooling system designs, its impossible for a modern PC to run hotter than a modern Mac.

It's too bad that those people are so easily swayed by one person's anecdotal experience.

It's an honest story. Plus I have pictures and video to back it up.

you don't understand business
do you?

they arn't going to launch everything at once

Apple is the only company that gets away with deliberately holding back features to sell them on a next generation device.

Look at iPad competitors. Within weeks of the iPads release we had devices already being released that had all of the specs iPad should have had. Dual cameras, 512MB of RAM, multi-tasking, etc. Look at the iPod touch. The first one had a bone head design of not having any physical volume buttons. They waited for second generation for that. It took two more generations to finally have a half baked camera put in. Sony was selling media players with cameras more than half a decade ago.

your sounding more and more like someone that doesn't own any apple products and is trolling from some windows forum

Would you like pictures? I'll post a picture. iPod nano with the little plastic screen cover on (hence the blue tab) that it comes with when you get it back from warranty service sitting on the lid of my MacBook closed.

Taken with my iPhone 4. But edited to remove GPS data.

I think he is harping about his Nano ... I told him he should have sprung for the Touch

And I said I had an iPhone 4 and just wanted something for active use.

 

[cav23j]

Look at iPad competitors. Within weeks of the iPads release we had devices already being released that had all of the specs iPad should have had. Dual cameras, 512MB of RAM, multi-tasking, etc.

the playbook still doesn't have a set release date
RIM rushed out the announcement long before the product was ever coming..they had no hands on demo after the announcement and only had 1 on stage

announce and release are two different things

Apple is the only company that gets away with deliberately holding back features to sell them on a next generation device.

Microsoft has done the same thing with the Zune
Nintendo with the DS
Sony with the PSP

of course they could of on launch have everything they have currently but they didn't to make more money

 

[mosx]

the playbook still doesn't have a set release date
RIM rushed out the announcement long before the product was ever coming..they had no hands on demo after the announcement and only had 1 on stage

PlayBook is just one of MANY. It's certainly not the only one.

Microsoft has done the same thing with the Zune
Nintendo with the DS
Sony with the PSP

First, do you realize how long the PSP and DS have been on the market? They're both around 6 years old at this point.

Second, the Zune? What did MS hold back? Don't forget what I said earlier, Microsoft was giving feature updates for the Zune via firmware when Apple was giving excuses as to why they couldn't. When a new Zune came out, the previous Zunes received ALL of the new features through firmware updates. Apple kept saying they couldn't do that because of "accounting" or other times "if you want the new features you need to buy the new product!". Look at the 5.5G iPod and the iPod classic. When Apple debuted movie rentals, the iPod classic got a firmware update to support it. iPod 5.5G was left out in the dust. Why? Because it was a "new feature". The iPod classic didn't ship with that feature but was updated for it. So why couldn't the 5.5G be updated? Zune got new features through firmware updates. iPod did not until the iPod touch. And let's not forget that Apple tried to charge for those until this year. Remember the whole 1.1.4 update for the iPod touch? $20 if you wanted the email, stocks, and a couple of other apps? Then $10 later in the year for the 2.0 update?

What features did Nintendo leave out of the DS at first? When the DS was first released, Nintendo released it as fully featured as it could be for what it was. The DSi, with its digital cameras, wasn't released until 4 years after the fact.

Same goes for the PSP. What features were left out? None.

Now look at Apple. The executives at Apple and those in charge of certain departments knew what was coming for the iPhone 4, iPod touch 4G, and the iPad. Yet, despite having planned the iPhone 4 with dual cameras and 512MB of RAM, they made the decision to make release the iPad with half the memory and no cameras. Why? Profitability. Because if they released the iPad with 512MB of RAM and dual cameras, then people would know what was in store for the iPhone 4 and stop buying iPhone 3G S. If they held these features back, they could continue to sell the iPhone 3G S and then push sales of the iPhone 4, AND get the early adopters of the iPad to rebuy it a year later when iPad 2 comes out with all of the features it should have had from the start.

 

[blackburn]

If your in love with windows why the hell did you buy a macbook an iphone and an ipod nano?

Why didn't you bought an professional dell laptop, an htc desire and sony walkman? Better for you, better for us. And for the 5,5Gen ipod there's something called rockbox. It does wonders.

And I don't run windows on my mac. But I run mac os x in my pc.

 

[gnasher729]

What don't you get? Not everyone in the market for specs. There is no easier to explain that.

I'd say everyone is looking at specs, but some people have a narrower view of specs, and some have a wider view. When I bought a MacBook Pro, I bought it purely on specs. Part of the specs were: The operating system. The backlit keyboard. The perfect size. The fact that it can stay in the living room without looking ugly. The fact that in my experience MacBooks easily last four years (my previous MacBook is now 4 1/2 years old and still running fine). The fact that I can go to a store that is not filled with (I almost said blathering idiots, but they are mostly really fine young people who unfortunately have no product training ). The fact that _I_ have never had any problem with an Apple product that wasn't fixed promptly and without any fuss; which I assume is just my friendly and convincing personality . The processor speed; same as the top speed of a Rolls Royce: Fast enough. The graphics speed; much faster than I need. RAM: Plenty, easily upgradable to 8GB when the price goes down. Hard drive: Plenty, easily upgradable to 1 TB. No fear of viruses. Very little maintenance. My wife can use it without any problems. Actually, many people who never used a Mac before can use it easily. A trackpad that is intuitive. Easy backup. Connects to a large monitor without any problems. Connects to my TV without any problems. Free professional software development tools. Ten hours battery life, with a battery that lasts 1000 charges.

That is all part of the specs that I consider.

Of course there is a lot of irrationality around. Like people who are in fear of using a Core 2 Duo instead of an i3, even though they will never in their sad live notice any speed difference.

 

[wordoflife]

I'd say everyone is looking at specs, but some people have a narrower view of specs, and some have a wider view. When I bought a MacBook Pro, I bought it purely on specs. Part of the specs were: The operating system. The backlit keyboard. The perfect size. The fact that it can stay in the living room without looking ugly. The fact that in my experience MacBooks easily last four years (my previous MacBook is now 4 1/2 years old and still running fine). The fact that I can go to a store that is not filled with (I almost said blathering idiots, but they are mostly really fine young people who unfortunately have no product training ). The fact that _I_ have never had any problem with an Apple product that wasn't fixed promptly and without any fuss; which I assume is just my friendly and convincing personality . The processor speed; same as the top speed of a Rolls Royce: Fast enough. The graphics speed; much faster than I need. RAM: Plenty, easily upgradable to 8GB when the price goes down. Hard drive: Plenty, easily upgradable to 1 TB. No fear of viruses. Very little maintenance. My wife can use it without any problems. Actually, many people who never used a Mac before can use it easily. A trackpad that is intuitive. Easy backup. Connects to a large monitor without any problems. Connects to my TV without any problems. Free professional software development tools. Ten hours battery life, with a battery that lasts 1000 charges.

That is all part of the specs that I consider.

Of course there is a lot of irrationality around. Like people who are in fear of using a Core 2 Duo instead of an i3, even though they will never in their sad live notice any speed difference.

Well, yeah. Everyone account for those things when buying a computer. I'm just saying that from my experiences, my 'poorly specced' Macbook Pro is a bit smoother when, I don't know - checking Facebook, than needing a whole i7 wih 16GB RAM. The actual operating system, OS X, makes the experience smooth, whatever the specs may be.

 

[jamin100]

OP - I for one agree with you entirely..

Here's my story:

2 years ago i brought a white macbook, within 2 months i started to get cracking around the keyboard and my screen would flicker every now and again. I phoned apple and asked for a replacement. Because i was out of the 14 day replacement window i was told that the machine needed to be repaired.

So, i sent it off to a apple repair center and it came back 2 weeks later. 2 WEEKS, just to fix some casing and whatever was causing the flicker.. So again i complained to apple and was very politely told where to shove it..

So fastforward a year later. The same macbook screen started to flicker again (why do i keep wanting to type flickr insted of flicker, anyway) SO i call apple again (i had applecare) to get the problem fixed. I was then denied support because they claim that i do not have applecare even though i have all the paper work saying that its registered to my machine, the box and the recipt...

I told myself then, thats it.. I've had enough with apple and i'm never NEVER buying anything from them again. EVER! So many promises, so many lies. It just hurt, real bad.

It got that bad that i contemplated creating a post on macrumors, telling all the people that love macs that they were all wrong and that they should stop buying apple products to teach Mr Jobs a lesson. "We'll get him" i though to myself..

In the end though, i woke up and realised that it was all a bad dream, and that infact my white macbook with the flickering screen HAD been replaced with a new unit, and that my applecare still remained.

Infact, i also remember selling that macbook later that year for almost what i paid for it and then buying a 24" imac. Again, once it had all come back to me i realised that i now own, about 6 apple products and that they all give me a great experience and a warm fuzzy feeling inside when i use them.

I did have to go to church and confess that I had bad thoughts, well dreams about telling everyone to stop buying apple products just to spite Mr Jobs . . .

But God forgave me, and now loves me again.

God uses an ipad.

amen.

 

[iCole]

OP - I understand your frustration but looking at the good image the customer service of Apple has... i think you're just having bad luck or you are stuck with a bad customer service in your neighbourhood. Some idiot or newbie must have messed up over there. But remember that you can get that ******** with every other computer manufacturer. Hell, in the case of Acer (to name something) you don't even have a real customer service.

But as I've said: I can understand your frustration It's never fun to get a faulty product and get screwed over it again.

 

[cav23j]

What features did Nintendo leave out of the DS at first? When the DS was first released, Nintendo released it as fully featured as it could be for what it was. The DSi, with its digital cameras, wasn't released until 4 years after the fact.

they could of launched the DS Lite on launch if they wanted to
instead they made a slimmer version a few years later
plus they could of put cameras in at launch or on release of the DS Lite

they been holding stuff back to make more money

 

[galstaph]

I've actually read all the op's posts...
I can see you are truly frustrated and feel that you have been wronged by Apple. You feel such injustice that you feel that you have grounds to lay a lawsuit on them, for replacing your ipod with a refurbished unit while under the manufacturers warranty.

I took a perusal of the Magnunson-Moss Warranty Act, (MMWA) and the Apple ipod/isight warranty, based on your comments, and these documents, you do not have a legitimate case.

1. Did the apple store employee expressly, in writing, guarantee that you would get a NEW replacement for your used ipod (I say yours was used because once you open the original packaging and turn it on/connect to itunes it has become used)?

2. So we get things straight from the get go, a full warranty, which is what Apple provides for a period of 1 year from the purchase date is defined by the MMWA as:

(6) The term “written warranty” means— (A) any written affirmation of fact or written promise made in connection with the sale of a consumer product by a supplier to a buyer which relates to the nature of the material or workmanship and affirms or promises that such material or workmanship is defect free or will meet a specified level of performance over a specified period of time, or
(B) any undertaking in writing in connection with the sale by a supplier of a consumer product to refund, repair, replace, or take other remedial action with respect to such product in the event that such product fails to meet the specifications set forth in the undertaking,
which written affirmation, promise, or undertaking becomes part of the basis of the bargain between a supplier and a buyer for purposes other than resale of such product.

3. OK, so now that we know what a warranty is what does Apple warrant?

Apple’s warranty obligations for this hardware product are limited to the terms set forth herein: Apple, as defined in the table below, warrants this hardware product against defects in materials and workmanship under normal use for a period of ONE (1) YEAR from the date of retail purchase by the original end-user purchaser (“Warranty Period”). If a hardware defect arises and a valid claim is received by Apple within the Warranty Period, at its option and to the extent permitted by law, Apple will either (1) repair the product at no charge, using new parts or refurbished parts that are equivalent to new in performance and reliability, (2) exchange the product with a product that is new or refurbished that is equivalent to new in performance and reliability and is at least functionally equivalent to the original product, or (3) refund the purchase price of the product. Apple may request that you replace defective parts with user-installable new or refurbished parts that Apple provides in fulfillment of its warranty obligation. A replacement product or part, including a user-installable part that has been installed in accordance with instructions provided by Apple, assumes the remaining warranty of the original product or ninety (90) days from the date of replacement or repair, whichever provides longer coverage for you. When a product or part is exchanged, any replacement item becomes your property and the replaced item becomes Apple’s property. Parts provided by Apple in fulfillment of its warranty obligation must be used in products for which warranty service is claimed. When a refund is given, the product for which the refund is provided must be returned to Apple and becomes Apple’s property.

So we read here that Apple warrants that in the event the product needs warranty service, at their discretion they can repair OR replace with new or REFURBISHED parts.

4. To Envoke the use of the MMWA Apple must have breached one of the following:

§ 2304. Federal minimum standards for warranties

(a) Remedies under written warranty; duration of implied warranty; exclusion or limitation on consequential damages for breach of written or implied warranty; election of refund or replacement In order for a warrantor warranting a consumer product by means of a written warranty to meet the Federal minimum standards for warranty—


(1) such warrantor must as a minimum remedy such consumer product within a reasonable time and without charge, in the case of a defect, malfunction, or failure to conform with such written warranty;
(2) notwithstanding section 2308 (b) of this title, such warrantor may not impose any limitation on the duration of any implied warranty on the product;
(3) such warrantor may not exclude or limit consequential damages for breach of any written or implied warranty on such product, unless such exclusion or limitation conspicuously appears on the face of the warranty; and
(4) if the product (or a component part thereof) contains a defect or malfunction after a reasonable number of attempts by the warrantor to remedy defects or malfunctions in such product, such warrantor must permit the consumer to elect either a refund for, or replacement without charge of, such product or part (as the case may be). The Commission may by rule specify for purposes of this paragraph, what constitutes a reasonable number of attempts to remedy particular kinds of defects or malfunctions under different circumstances. If the warrantor replaces a component part of a consumer product, such replacement shall include installing the part in the product without charge.

SO to sum this up tidily, You noticed a problem on your in-warranty ipod. You brought it to Apple, who, replaced it with a new in box model at the store. You noticed a problem with that ipod, you brought it back to the store, they did not have any ipods to replace it with and advised you to send it in for replacement (verbal indication of new is not legally admissable, it must be in writing, besides Apple can replace with new or refurbished at their discretion (or replace the defect part)).Your replacement arrived and happened to be a refurbished unit that 'is equivalent to new in performance and reliability and is at least functionally equivalent to the original product."
OK we've agreed on these facts. So you feel that by replacing your ipod with a refurbished ipod (which is a option that Apple has the legal right to exercise), you have been cheated, therefore you feel that you need to sue Apple for damages that it has caused you (lost wages, travel time, gas, meals between your place and the Apple store, tread ware on your tires, maintenance and insurance costs for said vehicle, loss of device, probably loss of sexual desire for your spouse/partner (really try and sue for this while you're at it, because it is evident that you have been brooding on the issue of Apple providing you with poor service and poor products for a long time and you could conceivably attribute this to making you depressed and angry, leading to sexual and emotional problems and damages, really lawyers love this stuff).
So now you get all you documents together, initial reciept, proof of written confirmation that unit was to be new, proof that he refurbished unit was in a used and inferior condition, recorded discussions with apple customer service, etc.
So now we need another reading of the MMWA to verify that we can go to court:

(d) Civil action by consumer for damages, etc.; jurisdiction; recovery of costs and expenses; cognizable claims (1) Subject to subsections (a)(3) and (e) of this section, a consumer who is damaged by the failure of a supplier, warrantor, or service contractor to comply with any obligation under this chapter, or under a written warranty, implied warranty, or service contract, may bring suit for damages and other legal and equitable relief— (A) in any court of competent jurisdiction in any State or the District of Columbia; or
(B) in an appropriate district court of the United States, subject to paragraph (3) of this subsection.

So it seems that you can go to court, if Apple breached their warranty, but for sh*ts and giggles lets read on a bit shall we?

(2) If a consumer finally prevails in any action brought under paragraph (1) of this subsection, he may be allowed by the court to recover as part of the judgment a sum equal to the aggregate amount of cost and expenses (including attorneys’ fees based on actual time expended) determined by the court to have been reasonably incurred by the plaintiff for or in connection with the commencement and prosecution of such action, unless the court in its discretion shall determine that such an award of attorneys’ fees would be inappropriate.

so far so good, but wait one more thing...

(3) No claim shall be cognizable in a suit brought under paragraph (1)(B) of this subsection— (A) if the amount in controversy of any individual claim is less than the sum or value of $25;
(B) if the amount in controversy is less than the sum or value of $50,000 (exclusive of interests and costs) computed on the basis of all claims to be determined in this suit; or
(C) if the action is brought as a class action, and the number of named plaintiffs is less than one hundred.

(e) Class actions; conditions; procedures applicable No action (other than a class action or an action respecting a warranty to which subsection (a)(3) of this section applies) may be brought under subsection (d) of this section for failure to comply with any obligation under any written or implied warranty or service contract, and a class of consumers may not proceed in a class action under such subsection with respect to such a failure except to the extent the court determines necessary to establish the representative capacity of the named plaintiffs, unless the person obligated under the warranty or service contract is afforded a reasonable opportunity to cure such failure to comply. In the case of such a class action (other than a class action respecting a warranty to which subsection (a)(3) of this section applies) brought under subsection (d) of this section for breach of any written or implied warranty or service contract, such reasonable opportunity will be afforded by the named plaintiffs and they shall at that time notify the defendant that they are acting on behalf of the class. In the case of such a class action which is brought in a district court of the United States, the representative capacity of the named plaintiffs shall be established in the application of rule 23 of the Federal Rules of Civil Procedure.

So wait... as I read it, to fully punish the Evil Jobs and the Apple Conglomerate you need to bring a CLASS ACTION LAWSUIT to trial, a lawsuit based on Apple not providing their warranty to consumers, oh and you need more than 100 people on your side, OR sue for more than $50,000....

Don't forget, while in criminal law the prosecution must prove their case, in civil court the complainant has to prove they were wronged, in other words the onus is on you to make your case airtight.

So to sum up, you received a replacement as per Apple's warranty. You were unhappy that they complied with their warranty as it is expressly defined in writing. You are unhappy because you were promised verbally that it would be a new unit by a store level employee (not a person of authority with the right to act on the company's behalf outside of its warranty policies). You feel that your only recourse is to sue as Apple refuses to do anything to placate you (because they think they have fulfilled their contractual obligation to replace your equipment undoubtedly), and have been alienating you with inferior products for years.

If I have misrepresented you in any way let me know. I am sure you will be able to provide a redress and rebuttal to my statements and reading of the law within the United States of America (What do I know, I'm Canadian, and we use English Common Law here). I was merely wanting to address the areas I saw flawed logic on your end in contrast to the actions by Apple.

I am also not going to get into your discussion of Apple as either good or bad, they are a business and as such, operating in a capitalist free market society, such as the United States, they are allowed to run their affairs as they see fit, within the law. I am reminded that a few years ago a GM VP was quoted as saying "If people want to buy a 12 mpg truck, we will sell them a 12 mpg truck", take that as you will.
Good Day Sir

 

[Indy500fan1977]

Does anyone else find it condescending that 'he is smart enough to build his own system?'. I think the majority of us here know how to build our own systems if we chose to do so. Plus, I don't necessarily equate 'smart' with knowing how to build something. There are plenty of smart people who don't know how to build there own system.

Also, OP, have you thought of the possibility of what may happen if you lose your lawsuit against Apple?