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Apple Refused to Build Copyright Filters for iPod

Nice job NBC ... for that type of flexibility, you only have to sacrifice 85% of your online sales.

Oh well, it doesn't affect me either way since the content on NBC is really a snorefest these days. I can't even think of the last thing I watched on that network.
 
LOL, I am too busy with work, reading MacRumors and posting on MacRumors to have time for TV anyway.

What ever they come up with will not work and is very likely to cause nothing but problems for people with legal content.

Hackers and pirates are not worried, they can always make their content look like legal content so it plays.

What NBC is likely to get is an increase in pirated material.
 
They better not screw with my anime collection.

How the hell are they going to "legalize" stuff from not-america?

dam selfish corps.

Go Apple!
 
monke said:
Thanks arn.

That's just (insert word combination of stupid, bogus, crazy, etc. here).

I buy a DVD from anywhere. I paid $25 dollars for it. I play it in my DVD player, in my computer, but then I can't play it on my iPod because it's classified as illegal.

I have to say Apple made the right move here. Anyone who buys into this is crazy, unless they solve the problem of putting a DVD on your device.
Click to expand...

This is what drives me nuts. After I purchase a DVD or CD ... I have the right to play it where I choose.

$25 for a DVD is already too expensive. That already limits the number of purchases I will make. Especially with the way the economy is these days.

Why should I purchase legal content with these silly restrictions in place ? Thats like buying a cell phone and being told you are allowed to use it every where, except x, y and z. (Not the best example, but you get my point)

The more restrictions they put in place, the more they are going to force legit customers to get the content in other means.

Although I understand this is a chicken and egg problem, the networks are going about it all wrong. They will pay for it in the end.
 
Congratulations apple for being the only one acting like an adult and not signing up to half-baked crackpot software solutions that solve nothing but cause more problems. And well done microsoft for giving us yet more proof that your vision really does only extend to the end of your nose ;)
 
So now MS is denying it? Hmm..... I don't know who to believe. I don't trust MS enough. They are probably just using semantics. I won't believe otherwise until it's proven.
 
MrCrowbar said:
I'm actually amazed that ad supported TV content still works. I mean, who actually watches commercials? No one except unattended children and zombies really watch commercials, and those two don't really have significant buying power.
Click to expand...

You're exactly right and this is the root of the real problem. These guys have to be scrambling for ways to make money. The problem is they are vested in an infrastructure that was based upon freely distributing content and subsidizing it with commercial revenues.

I'll make a couple of predictions here - we'll see a significant increase in cable and satellite fees for local channels over the next decade as the networks increase what they charge your cable company to carry their content, commercials and all. The networks will ban together to demand implementation of a mechanism to disallow you the capability of fast-forwarding over commercials on TIVO'd and DVR'd material.
 
slate1 said:
You're exactly right and this is the root of the real problem. These guys have to be scrambling for ways to make money. The problem is they are vested in an infrastructure that was based upon freely distributing content and subsidizing it with commercial revenues.

I'll make a couple of predictions here - we'll see a significant increase in cable and satellite fees for local channels over the next decade as the networks increase what they charge your cable company to carry their content, commercials and all. The networks will ban together to demand implementation of a mechanism to disallow you the capability of fast-forwarding over commercials on TIVO'd and DVR'd material.
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When people feel they are being raped with out so much as a kiss, they have a tendency of getting even. Expect more pirate activity and not less.
 
Sigh...NBC doesnt get it. People have spoken, they dont want to be locked down and your solution is to...further lock people down to 'sustain your business model' :confused:

DRM does NOT work!. Get it in your heads already!
 
I believe it is Apple's long term strategy to show convenience accessable legitimate copies of media, trumps labor-intensive pirated copies, for the "target market".

Remember Apple's own iPhone has shown "significant" "piracy" (in this case labeled as unlocking).

The commerce of iPhone not only remains strong but the pirated unlockers provided "bleeding edge market penetration" in otherwise hard to crack phone markets.

Now Apple will sell into markets with pre-established mindshare with a "convenience" product.

Rocketman
 
Another day, another attempt by Microsoft to get Zune in the headlines. I would like to quote my good pal Stephen Colbert on this one...

Stephen Colbert said:
For the sake of our nation, distance your self from John McCain and humanity. Put a tin foil hat on your hat, buy a Zune! Just, please, do anything Mr. President.
Click to expand...
Proof here. Go to about 4:45 in it.
 
This reminds me of that big wall the US is building along the mexican border. It will take years and cost billions but after it is done some Mexican will defeat all this work by using technologies like
  1. running fast
  2. using a shovel
  3. fake paperwork
Same here they will just waste their time.
 
arn said:
localoid said:
Actually, "fair use" is part of the U.S. code... section 107
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ah. thanks, noted.

arn
Click to expand...

But please note: section 107 has nothing to do with if you can make a private copy or play it whatever media player you want. Fair use is an exception that allows for people to make copies for the purpose of research, or education, or criticism (no, not criticizing DRM - criticizing the underlying work), i.e., I don't like 2livecrew lyrics, so I can write a newspaper article decrying what they say and literally quote the lyrics.

For everyone that thinks you have the right to play a DVD where ever you want, you really don't. Under the DMCA, you are circumventing a copyright protection mechanism to get access to the underlying work. While the MPAA isn't going to come after you for your own personal copy, it is still technically unlawful.

-p-
 
arn said:
This also means if you copy a TV show or Movie yourself from the DVD (rather than buy an official digital copy), it will not play on your Zune (once this software is in place).
Click to expand...

I guess no one told the networks that the first D stands for digital.
 
zap2 said:
Looks like MS did the right thing!!!


NBC should admit they made a mistake, and go back to iTunes(as well as any other service they please)
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Actually it depends on what your definition of the term "content filtering" is. Who knows what MS is or isn't doing.

Someone mentioned fair use not being statutory law. It's not, but the copyright code, which is statutory, makes provisions for it, though if challenged they are open to interpretation. The point is, it's complicated. They don't have to make "fair use" easy, but you, or a class, can sue a seller of personal licenses to copyrighted material for making use of that copyrighted material according to the "fair use" doctrine. And you could win.

At any rate, no amount of anything will ever stop piracy, digital or otherwise. The best way to limit piracy is to make the product attractive and sell it with as few restrictions as possible at a reasonable price. Make it easier to buy it than steal it, essentially. iTunes has proven this works in music, and video content should easily follow that model.

Further, the notion of shaking in your boots at piracy over a product you broadcast in the clear, with no encryption or DRM whatsoever over public airwaves, is laughable. NBC is taking no steps to prevent you from recording their programming to tape, DVR or DVD-R. What NBC should be concerned about is getting you to watch the ads, which is where they make their money. Alternative sales through digital downloads are just a perk. NBC has already made their money on every TV program they air, or they cancel it. The icing, the extra revenue, is selling it via a digital download service. So this is about money, not piracy, and it would follow that MS is not going to content filter anything, that this is indeed about Apple refusing to bump the pricing on NBC programming or cut NBC a bigger share -- and from what I understand, content providers already get the lion's share, so this is about raising prices. But you can't tell your customers we dropped iTunes as a store for our products because they wouldn't jack up the prices on you like we wanted. Don't be surprised if MS offers the NBC content for the same price as iTunes. It's just now they've lost the overwhelmingly biggest game in town, if they're too proud to go back and grovel, they're going to MS because they're afraid of not being somewhere in the catalogs of name-brand digital download services.
 
Not quite. Fair use is open to interpretation has been interpreted in copying to included such things as back ups of software one owns.

And DMCA is particular about how you circumvent DRM. It's only unlawful if you circumvent it in a particular way.

I should add here, what studios want is to sell you the content more than once in different formats even if you have the equipment to produce your own varied format of content for which you paid. The recent Juno DVD came with an iTunes copy of the movie. The regular-priced DVD did not have the iTunes version. The special edition, at several dollars more, did. It came with some trash, like a copy of the shooting script, but what was happening it you were being charged a premium for an iTunes copy of the movie plus a DVD copy. That's fine if you so choose, but we should also be able to do it ourselves if we care to spend the time and money for the equipment.

We're lucky, as when we buy, we buy Blu-rays, HD DVDs, and when not available on an HD format, DVDs. And that's how we watch them. What winds up on the AppleTV or iPod connected to a TV are childrens' TV shows or "throwaway" family movies for the kids. So we really have little inconvenience in lack of hardware portability. I did at one point try converting my DVDs to digital files and storing them for use on our AppleTV, but it was just too much of a hassle. If I want it digital file, I'm going to buy a digital file and live with that. But I know some people want variety of hardware use and they shouldn't have to pay over and over again.


psxndc said:
But please note: section 107 has nothing to do with if you can make a private copy or play it whatever media player you want. Fair use is an exception that allows for people to make copies for the purpose of research, or education, or criticism (no, not criticizing DRM - criticizing the underlying work), i.e., I don't like 2livecrew lyrics, so I can write a newspaper article decrying what they say and literally quote the lyrics.

For everyone that thinks you have the right to play a DVD where ever you want, you really don't. Under the DMCA, you are circumventing a copyright protection mechanism to get access to the underlying work. While the MPAA isn't going to come after you for your own personal copy, it is still technically unlawful.

-p-
Click to expand...
 
So NBC didn't want to continue selling shows that were already locked in DRM unless Apple put software in the iPod that prevented people from putting pirated versions of the shows on the iPod.

The leverage they held over Apple was the availability of premo legal content. It's kind of a lazy way to go after pirates. It would be like NBC telling Best Buy they can't sell NBC DVDs until Best Buy can catch the perps selling pirated DVDs in Chinatown.

But you have to ask, how much was piracy already hurting their viewership and DVD sales?

And, doesn't pulling legal content create a huge vacuum for illegal content to fill?
 
jawzzy said:
Go Apple!

I find it amazing how hard the content distributors are working to try to prop up such an antiquated business model. A new age of distribution requires a new age model!

I can see this system on the Zune causing nothing but problems...
Click to expand...


Especially after the whole "PlaysforSure" fiasco...
 
lol, its not like ITMS has 100% DRM free music, or users are allowed to transfer music back from iPod to computer anyway.

iPod is restricted enough already. making fuss over nothing.:p

Apple refuses to do xxxx.... how about "apple refuse to offer 100% DRM free music"? I know, I know, Its not up to apple..... whatever, it seems all up to amazon tho. :p
 
I have a hard time believing that Redmond could do this LEGALLY. Couldn't one argue that this could become anti-competitive in the sense that they would be limiting the content that can be played to what they only deem legal?
 
Why are you folks really complaining about this?

All that's going to happen is a market correction. NBC will try to corral and control their customers; customers out there are becoming hip to a lot of this and, most importantly, the fact that they have a choice and a say in the matter. Most people have already chosen an iPod and/or iTunes, so NBC is, by definition, starting out at a disadvantage.

Lots of us will NEVER obtain our content from them. In fact, this is probably going to have an inverse halo effect in as much as, if this is how they are treating their customers AND this is representative of the content they're putting out, then I (third-party I, not just me personally) will want to avoid the rest of their distribution model and the rest of their product line.

Time will tell, I suppose -- it always does -- but I'm not overly worried about Apple getting hurt significantly by this process.

NBC is already losing. They just don't fully appreciate that fact yet.
 
Why so many negatives?

The only thing I don't understand is why this the tally for this story is leaning more towards the negative. Do people misunderstand something here? Right now it's 44 positive, 56 negative... I would have thought the overwhelming response to NOT having DRM would have been positive... Am I missing something or are they?
 
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