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Apple Reinstates Epic Games EU Developer Account, Paving the Way for Alternative App Store
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Mmm that EU Viagra is making the EU boys feel so virile — watching them pile on Apple here is a sight to behold!
Too bad, once the dose of bureaucratic intervention wears off, they’ll realize they’re still just as soft as before 😂
Too bad, once the dose of bureaucratic intervention wears off, they’ll realize they’re still just as soft as before 😂
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Absolutely not. It’s a convenient argument to make, but it’s not the truth. It’s not in the same category of things that should be regulated with gusto, which is good, water, air, financial institutions. The people who have android survive life just fine.
Because the consumer would not pay full price for games so non they offer a "free" version with ads and ways around those ads.
If that’s all it was you’d be right. Why on earth do I have to pay to speed up production of goods in the game? It’s a way of turning the game into a slot machine.
I have purchased several very expensive iOS games but I won’t play games that have these stupid timers that ruin the experience and have no fixed limit on how much money they can suck up when trying to have a good experience.
So you honestly believe a person without a smartphone is able to access services and move through the world just as well as someone with one? Digital guidance systems alone are enough to point out the silliness of that idea.
Exactly. I was really hoping this would allow iPhone users to run arbitrary code. But that is not the case. Disappointing to say the least.
Yes. I honestly believe the people without an IPHONE will live life just fine. And then there are those who have flip phones. Can you tell me they are worse off from someone who has a smartphone? Even if they are high net worth? What a silly argument as you pointed out.
OK, Apple gave a statement to The Verge.
Apple alluded to its earlier ongoing ban on Epic’s accounts in a statement to The Verge. “Epic’s egregious breach of its contractual obligations to Apple led courts to determine that Apple has the right to terminate ‘any or all of Epic Games’ wholly owned subsidiaries, affiliates, and/or other entities under Epic Games’ control at any time and at Apple’s sole discretion.’ In light of Epic’s past and ongoing behavior, Apple chose to exercise that right,” said spokesperson Fred Sainz.
Apple kills Epic’s iOS game store plans over App Store criticism
Apple’s lawyers called Epic “verifiably untrustworthy.”
www.theverge.com
Yup, it's amazing how backwards they got that. Apple gets massive profits from pay-to-win games. It's probably a majority of their App Store profits. And now they are also selling an antidote, Apple Arcade.
That's not to say there aren't any issues with Epic (and others) with their pay-for-cosmetics system, but it's much preferable to pay-to-win.
They are - unless they’re really high net worth and have butlers, chauffeurs, concierges and others on speed dial to serve them.
https://forums.macrumors.com/thread...es-to-app-store-connect.2418959/post-32931702
When I open and manage bank accounts on my smartphone, authorise transactions on it, stay in touch with my friends through a messenger app and the phone is my only way to reasonably plan my travel or transit itinerary “on the go”, it is more than just a lifestyle product.
It’s comparable to the internet access or the phone networks - which are also regulated markets.
I do all of the above from windows. What’s your point? It can be done from multiple methods.
Yeah… pretty sure governments everywhere have long regulated things expanding far beyond just the things critical to literal survival. This isn’t some libertarian fantasy land.
I’m not sure what you do.
But I’m not ordering Ubers or cabs from Windows or macOS.
Neither do (can!) I use a printed map in a city I’m not familiar - or look things up in the street on my Windows device.
Nor do my friends that I’ll be meeting in 20 minutes send emails with their locations to my Windows device.
Banking apps often don’t work on Windows.
And I’m not opening my Windows laptop on a crowded bus or train to look up connections.
Can everything be done on non-smartphones? Theoretically yes.
But practically not, or only very inconveniently so.
I can’t even control my apartment’s heating system without an app (though granted, that’s certainly not a common requirement today and may just be a restriction on browser access imposed by the landlord, and).
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This isn't about people who don't have the iPhone. This about people who already have their digital lives embedded in their iPhones and (more importantly here) businesses who make their livelihood targeting mobile OSs.
Is a Windows machine a "lifestyle product"? A phone is essential for modern life. Having a device that can access the internet/websites is essential. A smartphone isn't essential for everyone, but a smartphone can serve both roles in one device. Many people use smartphones as their only personal general-purpose computing device. More people have smartphones than desktop PCs.
The ban may have been Apple’s tactic to put pressure against epic for epic’s filing of the bad faith compliance notice in the US case. I don’t think that Apple was expecting the EU to respond so quickly. Apple probably didn’t want to raise further questions with the EU DMA… its a good sign when even Apple is scared of the DMA. I don’t know if this will be enough to prevent a DMA investigation against Apple though as it is too little too late.
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It appears the higher ups at Apple got the memo about how petty and anti-competitive that move made them look. Better late than never but what a dumb decision and bad look from Apple all the way around. I think the EU is going to find them in violation of the DMA for their fee structure for 3rd party app stores as well so if they have a brain in Cupertino these days they’ll go ahead and address that before the EU makes an example out of them on that issue as well just as they did on this.
let’s back up 4 or 5 levels, why does Apple think a smartphone is different than a PC or Mac — which I have absolute control over installing whatever app I want?
OK I will explain it to you and it really isn't that difficult to understand. Honestly it really isn't it.
Can sum it up there are two camps involved.
Camp One bought Apple products BECAUSE of what the product is.
Camp Two bought Apple products DESPITE of what the product is.
I am in Camp One that bought the Apple products precisely because they are closed. We want Apple products to remain as how Apple made them.
You are in Camp Two and bought an iPhone even though you want an open ecosystem phone. You want to change Apple iOS into Android.
I cannot comprehend why on earth someone who wants their device their way buys Apple when there are alternatives that they could use there hard earned money on.
It is like going into a car showroom to buy a people carrier as you need to do the school run with 5 kids and then buy a two seat sports car and then complain that cannot fit all the kids in. To me that is what Camp Two are doing.
For longer explanation then will refer you too https://itif.org/publications/2023/...arkets-act-exemplifies-laws-uncertain-future/
Closed mobile ecosystems, like Apple’s, control both the hardware—the mobile device—and its software—the operating system, app store, and apps—to limit what is allowed on a device. These ecosystems standardize their user experience through default software settings, limited hardware configurations, and standard features. By limiting users from accessing other app stores or downloading apps directly, closed ecosystems restrict users to only installing pre-screened apps on their devices. These restrictions can protect consumers from privacy and security threats.
Alternatively, open mobile ecosystems, like those on many Android devices, offer users more freedom to customize their hardware and software. While this means users have more control over what is on their devices, these products may require more effort to set up and will vary in performance between different configurations and users. Users may only download pre-screened apps from a trusted app store, but they have the option of downloading apps from elsewhere if they want more choice. In an open mobile ecosystem, it is up to users to determine whether they trust the alternative app stores or other websites they can use to download apps.
Having both open and closed mobile ecosystems as options provides users with more choices and encourages each model to address and compete with the benefits of its alternative. But by mandating sideloading, the European Commission and the DMA’s proponents ignore inter-platform competition to focus only on intra-platform competition. The DMA forces intra-platform competition by requiring gatekeepers like Apple to allow users to install alternative app stores and apps on their devices, regardless of the consequences or their previously closed mobile ecosystem. By doing so, the DMA overlooks how offering users the ability to select between closed and open mobile ecosystems contributes to inter-platform competition.
Essentially, the DMA removes the inter-platform competition between open and closed mobile ecosystems from the equation. By making gatekeepers’ closed mobile ecosystems open up to third-party app stores or alternative app distribution, the DMA prevents users from choosing Apple's closed mobile ecosystems and forces Apple to allow users to load apps from third-party stores it has not reviewed. For all Apple users, this would expose them to new privacy and security threats, even though they may have chosen a closed ecosystem specifically to mitigate these risks. Other users could also be tricked into installing malware from third parties, and Apple would have limited ability to block bad actors that enter their customers’ devices through alternative channels and app stores. Effectively the DMA removes the closed mobile ecosystem business model from the mobile device market and deters any future innovation from competing models in the name of “fair competition.”
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I don't have a problem with people wanting an Open Mobile Ecosystem. However buy an Open Mobile Ecosystem product, don't buy a Closed mobile ecosystem product and then moan that it is a closed mobile ecosystem when you had the opportunity to buy an Open Mobile Ecosystem. Especially when that is the key differentiator between the two players in the mobile os market.
By doing this then the EU removes peoples right to buy and keep the Closed Mobile Ecosystem that we bought and paid for.
It is called buying the right product for the right job.
Too many people have bought iPhones and then complained essentially that it isn't Android as opposed to buying an Open Mobile Ecosystem product in the first place.
There is a place for both closed and open ecosystems. For people that want the flexibility and choice then they can buy an open ecosystem and for those of us that wanted and have bought for with there money.
Apple doesn't stop you buying an Open Model Ecosystem if that is what you want.
However the DMA DOES stop people buying the Closed Model Ecosystem as it no longer exists,
And because everyone loves a car analogy
I used to drive an Audi A5 Sportback, however these days I am running my elderly parents around more and they started to find it difficult to get in and out due to how low to the ground the A5 Sportback is.
At that point I had two choices.
1.) Complain to Audi that the A5 Sportback is too low and that they need to raise the height of the car.
2.) Change my car for a car model that is actually designed and sold with a higher ride height.
I took the sensible route and took my parents round the car dealerships and got them to get in and out of cars was looking at and ended up with a Renault Austral. And yes I do miss the A5 when driving.
The DMA basically is option 1 and then forcing the product to change as opposed to consumers simply buying the product that has all of the features/functions that the DMA is mandating.
I don't say to people on here why don't you buy an Android because trying to be mean. It is because if you want a mobile phone that has multiple app stores, allows side loading, basically allows you to do whatever the hell you like, then that is all available on Android Systems. Why would you NOT buy the product that has all of the things that asking for.
Instead people are trying to argue that they want all of that but they bought a closed mobile ecosystem instead and the product that they have bought has to change. Nobody has made you buy an iPhone as opposed to an open ecosystem mobile. Did Apple hold gun to you and make you spend your money on the iPhone.
By keeping Apple iOS Closed I don't prevent you from having a phone with what you want (other then it having an Apple Logo on it and why is it important that has an Apple Logo on it)
By opening Apple iOS up after 17 years then you do prevent me from buying a closed ecosystem. By having alternatives to the the defaults ie other app stores, ability to side load, even if i don't use them the ecosystem is no longer closed.
And if the number of people that is claimed want this on iOS had actually bought Android instead then Apple wouldn't have become a Gatekeeper as simply wouldn't have anything like the sales it has and so wouldn't attract the attention. It also wouldn't be 2.64triillion dollar company.
This is why people are on here backing Apple.
And lastly because everyone loves a steve jobs reference.
Steve famously responded to a person when he came back to apple critiscing what Apple was doing. The youtube been reference numerous times here. You cannot please everyone.
He also at another time said Apple makes products that are aimed at specific targets and aim to do those as well as they can. We're sorry if our products don't meet your needs.
As a consumer you are perfectly entitled to not buy Apple products, if they don't meet your needs.
Thing is if like you said then developers remove there apps from App Store and use alternative payment then will it actually be 30-50billion a year they lose.
They may be getting that now but won't be getting that if people actually move out and stop using Apples Services
More and more of Apples revenue is from services as opposed to hardware sales. Services are also way higher margin so even more of a drop on profitability if the services dissapear.
Every other major OS, Windows, macOS, and Android, are doing just fine, there isn't panic in the streets about their insecurity despite the scary statistics you'll probably pull up. Most people successfully use these devices without problems for the device's entire lifetime. They all even have vetted app stores that you can install exclusively from. The "closed" differentiator that is literally just iOS and only iOS is not really that important to security in reality, only in theory and scary statistics similar to car crash data vs plane crash data. Quit being overly paranoid. You're probably more afraid of the hit to convenience, not security, be honest (or be even more honest, you've invested in AAPL).
Tim Sweeney stated the truth!
It always surprises me how invested people are in ‘Epic verses Apple‘ content after all this time. Some (non-Epic) MacRumors articles get a dozen or so comments (over the lifetime of the article), but anything ”Epic” is guaranteed to try a few hundred comments in an hour or so. 🤣
It’s been years! At what point has everybody said all that they can possibly say about Epic and Apple? I guess at the point that Apple and Epic themselves just finally stop.
It’s been years! At what point has everybody said all that they can possibly say about Epic and Apple? I guess at the point that Apple and Epic themselves just finally stop.