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Apple Releases First Developer Preview of Mac OS X Lion

Phil A. said:
I'm a fully paid up member of the iOS and Mac OS developer programs and can't see this preview anywhere in or the Dev centre or the App Store as (as mentioned in the article which seems a strange way to distribute it?). Guess I'll have to wait a bit longer.
Hopefully, as it integrates OS X Server, Apple will allow virtualisation of this so I can play with it without dedicating a machine to a very early preview...

Edit
And just after I typed this, the Dev centre went down. Guess it'll be here soon now :)
Click to expand...

just a question when you're in the dev program do you get to download the final version of the o/s when it's released too? thanks
 
johnalan said:
For me this is not desireable becuase:

For instance, when I use Steam on my MBP to say play Counter strike or left for dead 2, I generally make sure most other apps are closed. I get much worse performance in these games and in other heavy apps such as logic and final cut if I have the system loaded with other apps.


So hypothetically If im running lion for the day and have used itunes, iphoto, logic, garageband, safari and say a load of other apps, I dont want ANY of these running while i'm playing games or doing seriously intensive work.

I want the cpu and ram to be as free as possible to give me maximum performance in my game.
Click to expand...

But that's the point...the fact that YOU have to do that isn't a law of the universe. It means the OS failed to do what it should...give you the most power for what you're currently doing.

Perhaps Lion will finally fix this out-dated mode of thinking. When you had to close those apps you shouldn't be thinking "I'm glad I can do this!" You should be thinking "Why the %*#^ does the OS make me do this!?"

Isn't it funny that you've been trained for so long that you've decided this is your problem and not the computer's? It doesn't even occur to you that the computer should be fixing stuff like that. That's how ingrained it is into our minds.

I dunno if Lion will properly do this kind of management, but Apple sure seems to think it can. If it does it'll be fantastic and you'll feel silly for ever complaining that you wanted to do more work instead of less.

EDIT: And about your comment about needing to force-quit apps on your iPhone when they act up...what makes you think you won't be able to do the same thing in Lion? They're replacing Open/Close with Launch/Hide, essentially, but that doesn't mean 'Force Quit' can't still be an option. I mean, if the iPhone can do it, why wouldn't the Mac be able to?
 
Last edited:
Resize form all corners? That's just catering to the anti-apple crowd. I liked it when that was used as a "superior" quality of windows. LOL

This sounds necessary but it really isn't.
 
karsten said:
just a question when you're in the dev program do you get to download the final version of the o/s when it's released too? thanks
Click to expand...

You have in the past so I assume you will be able to. It actually makes it cheaper to join the dev program than buy the upgrade if they charge it like they have previous versions before snow leopard, and you also get access to the betas :)



Small White Car said:
But that's the point...the fact that YOU have to do that isn't a law of the universe. It means the OS failed to do what it should...give you the most power for what you're currently doing.

Perhaps Lion will finally fix this out-dated mode of thinking. When you had to close those apps you shouldn't be thinking "I'm glad I can do this!" You should be thinking "Why the %*#^ does the OS make me do this!?"

Isn't it funny that you've been trained for so long that you've decided this is your problem and not the computer's? It doesn't even occur to you that the computer should be fixing stuff like that. That's how ingrained it is into our minds.

I dunno if Lion will properly do this kind of management, but Apple sure seems to think it can. If it does it'll be fantastic and you'll feel silly for ever complaining that you wanted to do more work instead of less.
Click to expand...

That's a great post and perfectly sums up the way Lion is trying to change the way we use computers
 
Small White Car said:
But that's the point...the fact that YOU have to do that isn't a law of the universe. It means the OS failed to do what it should...give you the most power for what you're currently doing.

Perhaps Lion will finally fix this out-dated mode of thinking. When you had to close those apps you shouldn't be thinking "I'm glad I can do this!" You should be thinking "Why the %*#^ does the OS make me do this!?"

Isn't it funny that you've been trained for so long that you've decided this is your problem and not the computer's? It doesn't even occur to you that the computer should be fixing stuff like that. That's how ingrained it is into our minds.

I dunno if Lion will properly do this kind of management, but Apple sure seems to think it can. If it does it'll be fantastic and you'll feel silly for ever complaining that you wanted to do more work instead of less.
Click to expand...



Ha, you know when you put it like that it does actually seem silly that I close apps myself! you have a VERY valid point!

But at the same time I dont wanna lose control over the system.

The user should still be able to 'kill' troublesome apps, and have access to all areas of the system, (filesystem, terminal, processes) IF they NEED to, ya know what I mean?


Also the app development enviorment on the iPhone is nice, I dont mind the sand boxing! But if you take the desktop, I have an app called Airfoil which hi jacks audio from any app and can send it to airtunes (airport express speakers)

I have a feeling if i'm reading the dev blurb correctly they don't want apps like this, they want them all to be good little apps and mind there own business... I have a feeling this will make for less innovative apps and also less robust/complicated apps going forward, thoughts?
 
pmz said:
I'm still considering suing Apple for the $2000 in iTunes purchases I lost when my first snow leopard install destroyed my iMac.
Click to expand...

im fairly sure you just re-download everything. as long as you bought it it is yours. its all recorded in your itunes account history
 
Phil A. said:
You have in the past so I assume you will be able to. It actually makes it cheaper to join the dev program than buy the upgrade if they charge it like they have previous versions before snow leopard, and you also get access to the betas :)
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do you have to keep renewing your subscription to get new serials for the final or doesn't it expire? thanks:)
 
What is the difference between AirDrop and just regular AFP file sharing? My Macbook already identifies and logs in to my iMac with zero config...
 
djp2 said:
Isn't that basically the same as Shadow Copies in Windows?
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Once again, being able to justify buzzwords on the bullet list of features is not enough; how you implement something matters.

Shadow Copies are whole copies of saved files. So you have to save manually (instead of Auto Save), they're much bigger (Versions saves diffs), and they're stashed somewhere. They also serve as backup copies, which is good and bad. If you're already doing backups (no-brainer on OS X with Time Machine), do you really need another copy of all your files, which haven't changed in weeks, taking up your disk space?

And hopefully Versions will provide a better interface for actually using the older versions when you really need them.
 
Phil A. said:
That's a great post and perfectly sums up the way Lion is trying to change the way we use computers
Click to expand...

Snow Leopard and Windows 7 are both, I think, running up against solving all the computer problems users think they have.

Where else to go? Well, Apple is apparently decided to move on to the problems users didn't know they have. It'll be a fascinating time because suddenly they'll have to start explaining problems to people before they can explain the solution. We've all been trained for 30 years (by both PCs and Macs) to ignore so, so many things.

But just because our minds ignore them now doesn't mean they're not problems!

As I said, it'll be fascinating to watch the transition.

johnalan said:
The user should still be able to 'kill' troublesome apps, and have access to all areas of the system, (filesystem, terminal, processes) IF they NEED to, ya know what I mean?
Click to expand...

I added an edit while you were posting, go back and check. It took a minute, but this occured to me as well.
 
karsten said:
do you have to keep renewing your subscription to get new serials for the final or doesn't it expire? thanks:)
Click to expand...

In the past, only OS X server has had a serial number which expires (no serial numbers at all on "normal" OS X, so no expiry). I don't know if they'll implement serial numbers in Lion at all now they're integrating server and desktop.
 
saving107 said:
9 pages and I haven't seen much talk about the new Gestures.

http://www.apple.com/macosx/lion/#video-gestures

The TrackPad now Supports:

-5 finger Pinch in to launch the LaunchPad
-Gesture to go into Full Screen (I couldn't make out the gesture)
-3 finger swipe to swipe between Application
-3 finger swipe up to launch MissionControl
-2 finger Tap to Zoom (in Safari)
-2 finger Pinch to Zoom (in Safari)
-2 finger swipe to Navigate (in Safari)
Click to expand...
I use 3-finger gesture for dragging. Is it still an option? Ta.
 
- Application persistance. Apps and their states are saved when you logout and back in. Background apps may be terminated by Mac OS X and will restore if the user picks them again. Basically the concept of open and closed apps is gone.
Click to expand...

Hmm... this is how iOS has been doing it. I'm not sure why Lion needs to quit apps running in the background. Its not like my Mac is going to run out of resources with the amount of RAM I have.

What if I am running Terminal and want to keep a session open, it will forcefully quit it. I'm not sure if I like this idea, hopefully there is an option to override this auto app quiting.
 
johnalan said:
I have a feeling if i'm reading the dev blurb correctly they don't want apps like this, they want them all to be good little apps and mind there own business... I have a feeling this will make for less innovative apps and also less robust/complicated apps going forward, thoughts?
Click to expand...

I think this will be true for people who just write little apps and leave it at that.

But, much like on the iPhone, those who take full advantage of the system's APIs will find they can do more than ever. I'm betting you'll see many, many new APIs come to the Mac very soon.

And just like on the iPhone, if developers ignore things like push notifications then their apps will fall behind. But for those who learn all these new tricks...I think they'll be just fine.

They'll just have to change their worldview. The days of a stand-alone apps that ignores the OS are passing. Good apps of the future will use the OS and treat it as a partner.
 
Perhaps if they're doing full-disk encryption for 10.7 they'll also be implementing it for iOS 5 as well. I wince whenever people tell me how secure their iPhone now is, and smile as I show them how to crack it.

I still prefer win7 over OSX, although I didn't blow away OSX completely when I put win7 on my new macbook; I kept it with one application (DVD player) for those long flights when I need a movie, or two, or three. I deleted everything else on the system to free up space for win7. OS X is my glorified DVD player! Thanks, Apple battery life!

Lion is a step in the right direction, but until they give me the option to have a real text-based taskbar at the bottom like Windows that shows me all information on all open windows at once instead of pictures you have to hover over, I'm not interested in replacing win7, or Ubuntu that I keep on my other computers.
 
tombilske said:
im fairly sure you just re-download everything. as long as you bought it it is yours. its all recorded in your itunes account history
Click to expand...

For some things, yes. The last time I checked, for music it states:

"You've already purchased this item. Would you like to buy it again?"

On another topic, those are some "cutesy" features. What changes are going on under the hood? Resolution Independence? Full 64-bit? File structure still HFS+?

Finally great to see OpenGL 3.0+ support!
 
linux2mac said:
Am I reading this correctly? Lion Server will not cost $500 like SL Server? Wow!

This will make people feel more inclined to try Apple server software. This will be interesting.
Click to expand...

that or it a sign that Apple is one step closer to completely killing off server market completely for them
ten-oak-druid said:
Resize form all corners? That's just catering to the anti-apple crowd. I liked it when that was used as a "superior" quality of windows. LOL

This sounds necessary but it really isn't.
Click to expand...


Really that is your excuse for that.
I think more Apple finally listen to its users telling them that they want that because is is really nice feature windows has over OSX. Now if they could only include all sizes as well and it would be able to match windows in easy resizing.
 
Sky Blue said:
You assume wrong.
Click to expand...

saving107 said:
9 pages and I haven't seen much talk about the new Gestures.

http://www.apple.com/macosx/lion/#video-gestures

The TrackPad now Supports:

-5 finger Pinch in to launch the LaunchPad
-Gesture to go into Full Screen (I couldn't make out the gesture)
-3 finger swipe to swipe between Application
-3 finger swipe up to launch MissionControl
-2 finger Tap to Zoom (in Safari)
-2 finger Pinch to Zoom (in Safari)
-2 finger swipe to Navigate (in Safari)
Click to expand...
This is going to seriously screw with my JITouch gestures. I don't think there has been much talk about gestures as anyone that really wants them has already got them via JITouch or bettermouse or those other 3rd party add-ons
 
Small White Car said:
Snow Leopard and Windows 7 are both, I think, running up against solving all the computer problems users think they have.

Where else to go? Well, Apple is apparently decided to move on to the problems users didn't know they have. It'll be a fascinating time because suddenly they'll have to start explaining problems to people before they can explain the solution. We've all been trained for 30 years (by both PCs and Macs) to ignore so, so many things.

But just because our minds ignore them now doesn't mean they're not problems!

As I said, it'll be fascinating to watch the transition.



I added an edit while you were posting, go back and check. It took a minute, but this occured to me as well.
Click to expand...



Another good point! Good to meet someone so insightful on these forums!

I still think it's important to have low level system access under all the gloss, anyone one know if the lowly terminal is still in OS X Lion??

Also any thoughts on the sandboxing turning desktop class apps into toy apps small white car?
 
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