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Apple Releases First Developer Preview of Mac OS X Lion

Small White Car said:
Isn't it funny that you've been trained for so long that you've decided this is your problem and not the computer's? It doesn't even occur to you that the computer should be fixing stuff like that. That's how ingrained it is into our minds.[/I]
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I'm skeptical that Lion is going to be fixing everything. What if an application has background threads that are bogging the system down? What if it's just enough to annoy you or lower the performance of a game? What's the OS going to do for you? If it thinks things are performing fine, you'll just have to live with it.

I'm sure some kind of force quit will still exist - even if it's just a kill -9 from the Terminal. But there are applications that have special startup and shutdown behaviors. The Eclipse Java IDE for example - there's certain housekeeping functions it performs on shutdown. That may be a poor design pattern, but it's reality. And some applications don't like being force quit, and you try to avoid the practice whenever possible, because you know you'll have some issues when you restart it.

Is it going to detect memory leaks? When will it kill Evernote - when it has been using over 1GB of ram for a certain amount of time? And then what will I notice - the app window mysteriously changing state and bumping me out of the record I was looking at as it restarts for real?
 
Anyone know the system requirements? I'd really like to know if it supports 32 bit processors and what the RAM requirement is.
 
johnalan said:
Another good point! Good to meet someone so insightful on these forums!

I still think it's important to have low level system access under all the gloss, anyone one know if the lowly terminal is still in OS X Lion??

Also any thoughts on the sandboxing turning desktop class apps into toy apps small white car?
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Dropping Terminal would be a huge mistake.
 
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Having Mac OS X Server integrated to the client OS is good for consumers and bad for Enterprises. I hope Apple will allow installation of the server only components.
I am also interested to see how Versions works. Having Time Machine already covers the need to restore older files. I know that this isn't really versioning, but it is close.
Windows Users had this feature for ages but didn't know how to activated :)
The other new features seem to be interesting, but we will have to see how useful they really are when we get to use the OS.
 
Hopefully Apple will realise that Snow Leopard sold well because of its price and take that onboard when pricing Lion.

Now, I'm not saying Apple should/will charge £25 for it, but something reasonable like £60 and they have me sold.
 
Stuipdboy1000 said:
Hopefully Apple will realise that Snow Leopard sold well because of its price and take that onboard when pricing Lion.

Now, I'm not saying Apple should/will charge £25 for it, but something reasonable like £60 and they have me sold.
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They priced Snow Leopard at $30 because it wasn't a *full* OS upgrade - few new features for users, as it focused more on the backend. I'd expect Lion to be more, probably ~$60 or so.
 
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That would make more sense. I haven't read the Apple website yet, but I find it hard to believe that Apple will integrate the Server components into the client OS.
Mac OS X Server needs better server hardware to run on. Only then can it be taken seriously in Enterprise.
 
It would be a full 129$ cost, and almost nobody would pass on the upgrade because of the cost, no matter what they're saying now. It's a steep upgrade, like 10.5, no reason for it to be cheaper.
 
Mark Booth said:
All of the torrent downloads I've seen are dated at least a week ago, if not longer. Apple just released Lion to developers today. I'd be very careful downloading anything from the torrent sites.

Mark
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Yup, you're absolutely correct. When I RD'd into my home computer to check out the descriptions of the "fresh batch" they were all being reported as bad. :)
 
petvas said:
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I am also interested to see how Versions works. Having Time Machine already covers the need to restore older files. I know that this isn't really versioning, but it is close.
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Not nearly close enough. Time Machine archives snapshots based on the date/time of the backup process run. Version control tracks things at the file modification level.

I'd be interested in some sort of system that lets you enable a folder for Versioning, and then you get some kind of automated CVS/SVN/git type behavior. Maybe it will really be something like git under the hood, so you can use your own tools to operate on it if you want.

Interested to see if it's integrated with Finder or some new tool.
 
Of course I will probably have to wait until late 2011/early 2012 to make sure my Adobe Suite won't break when using Lion...
 
paddyhazard said:
This is going to seriously screw with my JITouch gestures. I don't think there has been much talk about gestures as anyone that really wants them has already got them via JITouch or bettermouse or those other 3rd party add-ons
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You do realize that Apple targets 100% of customers with these releases, and 99.9% of them have never heard of JITouch or bettermouse.

Some people need to take a step back and realize what Apple is.
 
Stuipdboy1000 said:
Sweet! Hopefully this stays for the final release.
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It's only sweet in that they won't ever use the Core Duo in a new product (though they've already done that).

I guess it was bound for my now 5 year old iMac to stop being supported. It's a shame since it still runs perfectly with Snow Leopard.
 
johnalan said:
The user should still be able to 'kill' troublesome apps, and have access to all areas of the system, (filesystem, terminal, processes) IF they NEED to, ya know what I mean?
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What in the world makes you think you won't be able to force quit applications? It's highly unlikely the Activity Monitor is going anywhere. And though I haven't tried yet, I will hazard a guess that CMD-Q or equivilent will still be available. You can fully quit suspended apps in iOS. There is no reason to think that ability would be removed from OS X. EDIT: In iOS, multitasking/suspend support is opt-in. App's that were not compiled against the iOS 4 or later SDK did not support it. And the developer can still disable the support when building the project, if they desire. It's almost an absolute certainty that the situation will be the same on OS X. Completely removing the ability to manually quit any and all applications is not plausible to even try to implement. Your fears are unfounded.

Also the app development enviorment on the iPhone is nice, I dont mind the sand boxing! But if you take the desktop, I have an app called Airfoil which hi jacks audio from any app and can send it to airtunes (airport express speakers)

I have a feeling if i'm reading the dev blurb correctly they don't want apps like this, they want them all to be good little apps and mind there own business... I have a feeling this will make for less innovative apps and also less robust/complicated apps going forward, thoughts?
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This will be opt-in. An app will have to be specifically designed for it and compiled against the Lion APIs. It would be nigh impossible to retroactively, and forcefully sandbox applications system wide without breaking the majority of software on the platform. It may, or may not interfere with applications like the one you describe being able to interact with apps that are designed to be sandboxed. But the enhancement to security is, IMHO, more than worth such a tradeoff.
 
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Littleodie914 said:
Few initial points of interest:

  • Few graphical anomolies on my Macbook w/ GMA965
  • Window resizing from all corners/edges is awesome
  • You now have to scroll (via gestures) in the opposite direction as you're used to. To scroll down, you put your fingers at the bottom of the trackpad, and move them up.
  • UI looks great. All the little improvements and polish really shine through.
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Just to clarify are you running a MacBook with the GMA950 or GMA X3100?

And can you run the OpenGL Extension Viewer and comment on what OpenGL version is supported by the software renderer? Most notably the shader language version. I believe updating the software renderer and the shader language version is the biggest holdup for Apple updating OpenGL so if only GLSL shading language 1.50 is support, ie. the minimum for OpenGL 3.2, then we'll probably be stuck at OpenGL 3.2 throughout Lion's lifecycle.

If you do have the GMA X3100, I'd be interested to know if OpenGL support has been increased to OpenGL 2.1 to reach parity with other OS whereas Snow Leopard was still at OpenGL 2.0.

http://www.realtech-vr.com/glview/
 
WestonHarvey1 said:
I'm sure some kind of force quit will still exist - even if it's just a kill -9 from the Terminal. But there are applications that have special startup and shutdown behaviors. The Eclipse Java IDE for example - there's certain housekeeping functions it performs on shutdown. That may be a poor design pattern, but it's reality. And some applications don't like being force quit, and you try to avoid the practice whenever possible, because you know you'll have some issues when you restart it.
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That's why Apple introduced Sudden Termination support in Snow Leopard, to get apps moving in the right direction. With Auto Save and Versions, there's even fewer reasons they shouldn't. Resume may even require it.

Apps that don't support these modern features will probably be treated differently by the OS. And users will start switching to modern alternatives when possible.
 
Another thing, I think launchpad is cute, but again, We already have Folders, so having an additional analogous folder implementation ala iOS seems to be pointless to me.

I'd be very interested in how this is implemented in the file structure, can anyone with Lion dev release comment on how 'Folders' you create in launchpad are in the actual underlying directory structure?

Really glad Terminal is still there! Important to lots of ppl who enjoy and require the underlying UNIX subsystem.

Maybe that it has a fullscreen mode means it's there to stay!
 
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