Apple’s MacBook Pro: Rotting Core? What Apple Doesn't Want You To Realize.

[MacSince1990]

http://www.tomsguide.com/us/macbookpro-apple-refresh-opinion,review-1513.html

Yikes!

At first I thought it was a hit job, but once I thought about it and then compare it to this...

http://www.sonystyle.com/webapp/wcs...gId=-1&categoryId=8198552921644570897#gallery

Now here's a premium laptop that is actually worth the premium price. Because it actually innovates, something Apple it seems has forgotten how to do..



I think that Tom's Guide article is right on the money. Especially with the recent rumor that the MBP line won't see an update until April at the earliest.

Apple NEEDS to adopt an i5, the ATI 5830, a higher resolution screen, Blu Ray, and maybe even some different color options for the top of the laptop with their next update or their brand name is going to take a big hit atleast among the tech community and eventually the general population.

But here is the upgrade that would be a dream come true and be a knock out killing blow to all other competing laptops. Because it would really make for blazing fast speeds, much lower power consumption and close to instantanous boot times...


I would even be happy with a Built in HD Radio/HD TV tuner with QASM cable-in

Here's a comparison of an upconverted dvd on a 7 inch screen, versus a blu ray on a 7 inch screen.

Whether you guys realize it or not, the opinion of the tech community filters out to the rest of the population pretty quickly. EVERYONE has some techie that they know and turn to for advice whenever they're buying something as expensive as a new laptop. An year or so ago, any techie could honestly say that the Macbook Pros perform just as well or better than any Windows computer. Hell, for the longest time, the G3, G4 and G5 PowerPC processors consistently outperformed the Intel offerings.

What are your guy's opinion on the article?

And yes, before I ask that question here, I fully realize that some people on this forum are Apple fanboys who will defend any thing Apple does to their grave as if Apple is a member of their family. And yes I realize that some people here regularly and adamantly insist that the majority of Macbook Users are idiots when it comes to computers and have no idea what components are in them and use that basis to defend Apple's actions. I surmise that this claim is not true, lots of Macbook PRO users are aware of what it's in their laptops.

Nevertheless, even if you naysayers are correct and Mac users are indeed stupid or ignorant regarding technology, it's still unfair of Apple to charge the exact same for a laptop with two to four year old components that are now far cheaper and outdated as it charged for them two years ago when they were still fairly new. Just as it would be wrong if Apple still used G4 processors, 1 gig of ram, and other technology from many years ago in their Macbook Pros and continued to charge $2000 for them. Even if as you guys argue, Apple would get away with it and make a ton of profit, because it's customers are too stupid to know the difference or care.

Lawl.

Couple quick points... the 5830 would burn a hole in the MBP, and Apple has never and will never include anything but a midrange graphics card in their laptops (going strong 15 years, just stop it already)

Also, the G4 was already getting beaten by the time it was dropped to be honest. It may have been better clock for clock but its slow FSB, lack of DDR support, and shallow pipeline killed that advantage.. when you can't ramp past 500 MHz while your rivals are over 1 GHz, you're screwed.

 

[Hal Itosis]

And I don't mind at all, I'll pay for the experience I want. It's not like I have to do it often.

but comeon, doesn't it rub you the wrong way at some level being charged premium prices for old tech?

be honest here

No, I'm no spec jockey. If it were some sort of huge gap I'd feel a little differently, but it does everything I want amazingly.

And your not just a blind fanboy, that buys anything with a fruit logo on it?
Even with OUTDATED hardware sold at a premium (rip off) price?

Like f---ing wow, what is up with the PeeCee crowd in here? Some strange mixture of inferiority/superiority complexes or something? NT1440 said he's happy getting what he gets and paying what he pays for it... for those infrequent times his hardware upgrades are needed. He's satisfied. So why are you guys buggin'?

Speaking of bugs, don't you have some anti-virus scans to do or something? How much time & money does your company spend each year trying to keep every machine on its network disinfected anyway? ... does that cost figure in with these great savings you obsessively (and repetitiously) yap about?

I'm sure Symantec, McAfee and Norton enjoy the money they make off "you fanboys".

 

[MacSince1990]

Like f---ing wow, what is up with the PeeCee crowd in here? Some strange mixture of inferiority/superiority complexes or something? NT1440 said he's happy getting what he gets and paying what he pays for it... for those infrequent times his hardware upgrades are needed. He's satisfied. So why are you guys buggin'?

Speaking of bugs, don't you have some anti-virus scans to do or something? How much time & money does your company spend each year trying to keep every machine on its network disinfected anyway? ... does that cost figure in with these great savings you obsessively (and repetitiously) yap about?

I'm sure Symantec, McAfee and Norton enjoy the money they make off "you fanboys".

Anyone with a non-PowerPC or 68k-based CPU in their computer is a PC user....

 

[Hal Itosis]

Anyone with a non-PowerPC or 68k-based CPU in their computer is a PC user....

There are at least 2 ways that could be disputed and 10 ways it doesn't even matter. Let's start with the simple concept that PC stands for "personal computer", and then note the word i used was PeeCee. But anyway... your technical definition doesn't match perfectly with common historical -- and more importantly -- political usage.

PeeCee
A Personal Computer, generally known as a PC, based on an Intel Corporation ExEightySix microprocessor, and designed to run Microsoft Windows or MsDos.

To think that 'PeeCee' (or even PC) is somehow defined solely by a particular microprocessor seems strange on one hand, and (even if it is/was true) totally trivial on the other. If you are a grey-bearded hardware guru and that indeed is how the term 'PC' originated... then, congratulations. But i think you'll find that (on the OS battlefront) the "PeeCee versus Mac" context co-opted that term for other purposes.

But, thanks for chiming in.

EDIT: interesting (googled more), one could also argue that PC was a company division within Big Blue: IBM sells PC group to (China-based) Lenovo

 

[ippikiokami]

Like f---ing wow, what is up with the PeeCee crowd in here? Some strange mixture of inferiority/superiority complexes or something? NT1440 said he's happy getting what he gets and paying what he pays for it... for those infrequent times his hardware upgrades are needed. He's satisfied. So why are you guys buggin'?

Speaking of bugs, don't you have some anti-virus scans to do or something? How much time & money does your company spend each year trying to keep every machine on its network disinfected anyway? ... does that cost figure in with these great savings you obsessively (and repetitiously) yap about?

I'm sure Symantec, McAfee and Norton enjoy the money they make off "you fanboys".

It's really amazing that Apple Fanboys still promote this as a "feature". The fact that there are not enough Mac people in the world to make it worth it for a hacker to release a worm / virus to them? I mean come on!

BTW I'm pretty sure most companies would throw and anti-virus on their computers in their networks regardless if they had macs or pcs on there. It's just good practice

People aren't too drunk on the Kool-Aide, nor is it a common trait amongst fanboys. Did you ever think, no one really cares that much about the technology except for tech savvy people. Why do you care so much why other consumers will buy outdated Macs? Are you trying to save them from themselves. As long as you know you are not getting ripped off, that should be good enough for you. Y'all keep shouting but no one wants to listen. Buy your windows based PC and enjoy life.

People who don't are ignorant to the truth. Why WOULDN'T you want to buy the most updated hardware when it's available to other companies. Why WOULD you want to buy older hardware at the same price point as it was when it was released (esp with technology jumping at this rate.) In my case people have been telling me for years to buy a Mac (I work with them in the music and photography industry). How mac's are just as fast and they are the cutting edge. I finally cave in and decide to buy one... but it's not the case! there are a lot of advancements that just aren't in the laptops.

To top it off the i5 series is just that much better of a processor! It performs better in the processes that a huge part of the professional audience that buy macs use! Time is money to these people. It's not like we are asking for a non existent processor.. and it's not like apple is a smaller company that is unable to R&D this type of product.

 

[CP123]

People who don't are ignorant to the truth. Why WOULDN'T you want to buy the most updated hardware when it's available to other companies. Why WOULD you want to buy older hardware at the same price point as it was when it was released (esp with technology jumping at this rate.) In my case people have been telling me for years to buy a Mac (I work with them in the music and photography industry). How mac's are just as fast and they are the cutting edge. I finally cave in and decide to buy one... but it's not the case! there are a lot of advancements that just aren't in the laptops.

To top it off the i5 series is just that much better of a processor! It performs better in the processes that a huge part of the professional audience that buy macs use! Time is money to these people. It's not like we are asking for a non existent processor.. and it's not like apple is a smaller company that is unable to R&D this type of product.

If I know about newer technology and choose not to let that get in the way of my computer experience, that is not ignorance. Ignorance is the lack of knowledge, education, or awareness. Many people know that there will always be newer technology. Hell, many know about the newest tech. Don't think for a moment that the i5/i7 is the newest technology. Somewhere in some lab there is better technology. You will never have the latest tech.

So spare me and everyone here and take your arrogant rant somewhere else.

 

[zipa]

Of course it is. If you don't like it, don't buy it. That's feedback right there. Whining to people who are hearing it for the millionth time and have no control over Apple's specs or prices would seem a bit futile, wouldn't it?

If you don't care for the whining, then why do you keep posting in this thread? It's not like anyone forces people to read these "whine-threads".

 

[MacSince1990]

There are at least 2 ways that could be disputed and 10 ways it doesn't even matter. Let's start with the simple concept that PC stands for "personal computer", and then note the word i used was PeeCee. But anyway... your technical definition doesn't match perfectly with common historical -- and more importantly -- political usage.



To think that 'PeeCee' (or even PC) is somehow defined solely by a particular microprocessor seems strange on one hand, and (even if it is/was true) totally trivial on the other. If you are a grey-bearded hardware guru and that indeed is how the term 'PC' originated... then, congratulations. But i think you'll find that (on the OS battlefront) the "PeeCee versus Mac" context co-opted that term for other purposes.

Lol... thanks for taking my comment so very literally. Your argument was great, by the way, really it was.

However, try to imagine it from my point of view. Probably 75% of the people on these forums didn't use a Mac until they were based on the x86 architecture.

What was it that dear old Stevey touted for over a decade as the thing that made Macs special? Oh right, the PowerPC architecture.

And try to remember, when you swap out the PPC for an x86, you're changing everything. Not just the processor, but the entire motherboard.. you've got an entirely new machine.

Also please note that Macs can now natively run windows... and PCs can also run Mac OS X, albeit with a little work. They have precisely the same architectures... there is nothing unique about Macs anymore besides the pretty pretty cases they're placed in.

If you have an apple-based computer with an intel processor, you're using a glorified PC.

 

[NT1440]

Lol... thanks for taking my comment so very literally. Your argument was great, by the way, really it was.

However, try to imagine it from my point of view. Probably 75% of the people on these forums didn't use a Mac until they were based on the x86 architecture.

What was it that dear old Stevey touted for over a decade as the thing that made Macs special? Oh right, the PowerPC architecture.

And try to remember, when you swap out the PPC for an x86, you're changing everything. Not just the processor, but the entire motherboard.. you've got an entirely new machine.

Also please note that Macs can now natively run windows... and PCs can also run Mac OS X, albeit with a little work. They have precisely the same architectures... there is nothing unique about Macs anymore besides the pretty pretty cases they're placed in.

If you have an apple-based computer with an intel processor, you're using a glorified PC.

OSX.

Does it eat you away inside so much that some people honestly prefer OSX to windows so much that we don't care if we have to pay for it? The general tone of your post is beyond sad, I can't believe you care enough to put that much emotion and snideness into the discussion.

 

[JimKirk]

That laptop fully loaded costs 5 grand. Please

Specs say boot up time is 60 seconds on SSD. Please

 

[NT1440]

Specs say boot up time is 60 seconds on SSD. Please

I boot up in under 45 seconds using a HDD

 

[jamesryanbell]

Comment I heard last night at a restaurant here in town while waiting for a table:

"OSX makes the necessary specs WAY less than what a PC needs. If Apple is "behind", it's by choice and because they don't NEED the same hardware to run OSX as well....a benefit of a better OS"

I was like "Wow...macrumors is infiltrating Macaroni Grill now. hahaha.

 

[thebeautyisfake]

Comment I heard last night at a restaurant here in town while waiting for a table:

"OSX makes the necessary specs WAY less than what a PC needs. If Apple is "behind", it's by choice and because they don't NEED the same hardware to run OSX as well....a benefit of a better OS"

I was like "Wow...macrumors is infiltrating Macaroni Grill now. hahaha.

I like how when the MBPs contained top end hardware people were always like "oh yeah you get great performance for your money!".
The second the stuff becomes outdated, suddenly arguments crop up stating "OH ITS K APPEL DUESNT NED GD HARDWAREZ!".

xD

 

[NT1440]

I like how when the MBPs contained top end hardware people were always like "oh yeah you get great performance for your money!".
The second the stuff becomes outdated, suddenly arguments crop up stating "OH ITS K APPEL DUESNT NED GD HARDWAREZ!".

xD

Yup, not being part the bleeding edge "lets release a new model every 3 weeks when a new component comes out!" crowd suddenly makes existing hardware not good anymore.

And what's with the stupid spelling?

 

[dukebound85]

Once again if you don't like Apple and their policies or products, why are you here? Do you think you know better than all the consumers who buy Apple products. Why not go on Sony's, HP's, Toshiba's, Dell's, etc. forums and talk about their products there? Why come here?

Now this argument gets old, really old

I like Apple for the most part, hence why I am a member here and why I participate as much as I do.

However, I am not going to drink the Koolaide and think whatever Apple is doing is infallible. Jeebus, some of you think Apple has the golden touch and to question it means to be exiled from the Apple community.

 

[Hal Itosis]

Also please note that Macs can now natively run windows...

And that's the only appropriate time to invoke the notion of PeeCee and Mac being identical. We may as well call that "PeeCee mode" (and whip out the antivirus utilities immediately). Otherwise it's totally immaterial, and a fairly infantile subtopic for us to pursue anyway.

 

[Gomff]

Now this argument gets old, really old

Not anything like as old and tedious as "I can buy PC model X from Store Y for $Z and it has this processor and that GPU and that memory" etc etc etc etc etc.

Jeebus, some of you think Apple has the golden touch

Stock market seems to think they're doing OK.

 

[gfiz]

Lawl.

Couple quick points... the 5830 would burn a hole in the MBP, and Apple has never and will never include anything but a midrange graphics card in their laptops (going strong 15 years, just stop it already)

umm....

Nvidia 9600M GT = 23 TDP
ATI mobile 5830 = 24 TDP

(p.s. 5830 is midrange)

 

[Hal Itosis]

It's really amazing that Apple Fanboys still promote this as a "feature". The fact that there are not enough Mac people in the world to make it worth it for a hacker to release a worm / virus to them? I mean come on!

Oh yeah right, you only get attacked because your OS is so... special.

Rootkits Roam the World of Windows

[Church-lady voice:] Well now... isn't that special?

Try not displaying such disingenuousness, and you might be taken seriously one day.

--

Anyway, you can try arguing about the actual reasons and make all sorts of denials until doomsday... but you still have to factor in those *costs* when making price comparisons and purchase decisions.

 

[gfiz]

Oh yeah right, you only get attacked because your OS is so... special.

Rootkits Roam the World of Windows

[Church-lady voice:] Well now... isn't that special?

Try not displaying such disingenuousness, and you might be taken seriously one day.

actually, he's right. if 95% of the world used OS X, and 5% used Windows, the argument would be reversed.

 

[Ulysses11]

agreed

However, I am not going to drink the Koolaide and think whatever Apple is doing is infallible. Jeebus, some of you think Apple has the golden touch and to question it means to be exiled from the Apple community.

Agreed. I've been working on Macs in one way or another since 1984. In the past I gladly drank the Koolaid because my favorite company was desperately trying to catch up... now, because of the iPhone, it is still a company I love, but I certainly no longer worship it. There is a smugness that has crept into Apple's relationship to its customers; and Steve is beginning to develop a smug attitude in his talks and presentations. It just doesn't feel good. The way the company has become like Doctor No's island in the old James Bond film... paranoid secrecy, and hermetically sealed lie a high tech fortress of brilliance... it is a stance that just projects lack of trust of the very people who buy its products.

So, what the hell is wrong with telling fiercely loyal customers when the new MacBook Pro is coming out? I know several ex-Apple worshippers who are abandoning ship cause they just are sick of the wait, and are buying other non-Apple machines.

 

[dernhelm]

Voting with my wallet just isn't going to work though. I bring this up elsewhere but for every Mac I don't buy there are plenty more who will.

You've just made my quote list. This is awesome. It isn't enough for you to say "I'm done buying Apple products" - EVERYONE ELSE MUST DO SO TOO.

Prepare to stay disappointed for some time to come. It doesn't appear that the rest of society is going to stop buying Apple products because you don't like the processors used in them.

Just awesome baby!

 

[Eidorian]

You've just made my quote list. This is awesome. It isn't enough for you to say "I'm done buying Apple products" - EVERYONE ELSE MUST DO SO TOO.

Prepare to stay disappointed for some time to come. It doesn't appear that the rest of society is going to stop buying Apple products because you don't like the processors used in them.

Just awesome baby!

My point is the futility of voting with your wallet. It's always brought out as a solution.

 

[dernhelm]

My point is the futility of voting with your wallet. It's always brought out as a solution.

A solution to what? A solution to Apple not putting the processors you want in their products soon enough?

That may be a problem for you (me too, BTW, I'm awaiting new processors in the MBP line) but it isn't a problem for Apple. Apple will upgrade it's line when it makes sense for it to do so - financially and from a market standpoint.

They aren't hurting for sales, so there is no real point to criticize here. If YOU (or I) don't like their current product line, we can either go somewhere else and buy a different product, or wait for the current product to improve. But to make some of the claims that have been made here (Apple is out to screw people, or Apple is producing subpar products on purpose), is just people blowing a lot of hot air. Apple sales are better than almost anyone's in the industry; year over year over year. That isn't an accident, nor is it because they have some legion of lobotomized drones giving them money. They are obviously doing something right, whether you understand it or not.

 

[Eidorian]

A solution to what? A solution to Apple not putting the processors you want in their products soon enough?

That may be a problem for you (me too, BTW, I'm awaiting new processors in the MBP line) but it isn't a problem for Apple. Apple will upgrade it's line when it makes sense for it to do so - financially and from a market standpoint.

They aren't hurting for sales, so there is no real point to criticize here. If YOU (or I) don't like their current product line, we can either go somewhere else and buy a different product, or wait for the current product to improve. But to make some of the claims that have been made here (Apple is out to screw people, or Apple is producing subpar products on purpose), is just people blowing a lot of hot air. Apple sales are better than almost anyone's in the industry; year over year over year. That isn't an accident, nor is it because they have some legion of lobotomized drones giving them money. They are obviously doing something right, whether you understand it or not.

As I've said before my money doesn't matter to Apple. I'm repeating myself far too often in this thread.