Apple’s MacBook Pro: Rotting Core? What Apple Doesn't Want You To Realize.

[CP123]

Now this argument gets old, really old

I like Apple for the most part, hence why I am a member here and why I participate as much as I do.

However, I am not going to drink the Koolaide and think whatever Apple is doing is infallible. Jeebus, some of you think Apple has the golden touch and to question it means to be exiled from the Apple community.

Now this argument is really old...

"I still like Apple, but I'm going to come on here and continue to gripe and complain about Apple and what they're doing. And any one who disagrees with me is drinking the Kooaid."

Now you may not be drinking the Koolaid now, but you must have drank enough to leave quite an aftertaste. Why else would you be here going on and on complaining about the same thing.
Dude, you have options.

 

[dukebound85]

As I've said before my money doesn't matter to Apple. I'm repeating myself far too often in this thread.

I get what you are saying. Voting with ones wallet doesnt do any good if people still buy these machine with antique hardware at todays premium component prices

Now this argument is really old...

"I still like Apple, but I'm going to come on here and continue to gripe and complain about Apple and what they're doing. And any one who disagrees with me is drinking the Kooaid."

Now you may not be drinking the Koolaid now, but you must have drank enough to leave quite an aftertaste. Why else would you be here going on and on complaining about the same thing.
Dude, you have options.

If you look at this thread, I am not the complainer you make me out to be. I do find it odd though at how people just like to sit back feeling totally ok for paying for 3 year old tech whereas the same prices would buy one todays tech. I like OSX perios. I have too much time and money invested in the OSX platform to really want to change. However apple is really just making a killing off their hardware profit wise by selling outdated (talking years) chips and other components when they could implemtn newer tech . How that can't rub some one slightly the wrong way is puzzling imo

As far as options? Like what? I want OSX.

My only other option is a hackintosh....which I have done but that doesnt work well for laptops

 

[Eidorian]

I get what you are saying. Voting with ones wallet doesnt do any good if people still buy these machine with antique hardware at todays premium component prices

Seriously, we're all tired of the endless return of the same old arguments and insults.

Next up my fellow Mac users extol unto me the virtues of OS X. What's to extol to me when I'm using OS X as well?

 

[ippikiokami]

If I know about newer technology and choose not to let that get in the way of my computer experience, that is not ignorance. Ignorance is the lack of knowledge, education, or awareness. Many people know that there will always be newer technology. Hell, many know about the newest tech. Don't think for a moment that the i5/i7 is the newest technology. Somewhere in some lab there is better technology. You will never have the latest tech.

So spare me and everyone here and take your arrogant rant somewhere else.

Oh gosh it's arrogant now.. I really am stretching to figure out how is it possible that it's arrogant when i'm stating facts.

Yes in general there is a lack of "knowledge, education, or awareness" of how much an upgrade of any sort can HELP you if you use your computer for professional means.

Say for example.
X cpu "does the job" Y cpu is around whatever % quicker (i5 20% faster based on apple's press release)

I'm a photographer that shoots around 70k pictures a year. Mostly JPG's but a LOT of raws. If I even save 2 seconds on editing each of these pics because of the processor alone i save myself 38 hours over the course of the year on processing. Say you only value your time at $10/hr (hope not). You are saving yourself 380$ of worktime over 1 year having the better processor. Multiply that by the amount of years you use your laptop!

It's not the fact that.. Ohhhhh I must have the new technology to make myself feel better! It's the fact the technology is out there today and available through normal consumer channel means at theoretically the same price that can save me in that one scenario, 38 hours or 380$ a year!

Take this same scenario.. and apply it to any of the major professions that use Macs as their backbone, Graphics, Video, Music, Photography. All have software that can take advantage of the speed benefits than the new processor can provide.

I'm not one of those that say apple is trying to pull wool over our eyes by not releasing an update. But there is no doubt in my mind there are many mac users that can benefit a lot from a refresh

 

[Quad 2.5 G5 =)]

OSX.

Does it eat you away inside so much that some people honestly prefer OSX to windows so much that we don't care if we have to pay for it? The general tone of your post is beyond sad, I can't believe you care enough to put that much emotion and snideness into the discussion.

It's not just the cost of OS X. I don't get why people think it's just cost of hardware+cost of OS+"apple tax". it's the cost of the hardware, the cost to employ the various teams to design and build the computers, and then, the cost of building and running the stores, which, if I need to remind you, is not what MS, HP, Dell, or any other manufacturer does. It isn't just the cost of the hardware. All of you need to cool it, and give them some more time.

 

[Hal Itosis]

actually, he's right. if 95% of the world used OS X, and 5% used Windows, the argument would be reversed.

Ho-hum. Obviously you didn't even read (or perhaps failed to comprehend) the article to which i linked. If you're trying to claim that the attack vectors of Windows and Mac are identical somehow, then your credibility is minus 7 at most.

And finally, you can spin "what if it were reversed" scenarios all day... but that still won't offset the cost factors of the *current* reality. IOW: even if he was "right" (which he isn't), it doesn't matter.

Actually.

 

[gfiz]

Ho-hum. Obviously you didn't even read (or perhaps failed to comprehend) the article to which i linked. If you're trying to claim that the attack vectors of Windows and Mac are identical somehow, then your credibility is minus 7 at most.

And finally, you can spin "what if it were reversed" scenarios all day... but that still won't offset the cost factors of the *current* reality. IOW: even if he was "right" (which he isn't), it doesn't matter.

Actually.

Hal, I read your article. And clearly you don't understand the discussion, so I'll keep it simple. If OS X were more popular, there would be more unscrupulous people discovering new "attack vectors" on the Mac. All your link does is support the argument.

 

[Hal Itosis]

Hal, I read your article. And clearly you don't understand the discussion, so I'll keep it simple.

A thousand thanks for that kind offer, but... since i'm the one who started this particular (sub)discussion, the burden of "understanding" is on you.

If OS X were more popular, there would be more unscrupulous people discovering new "attack vectors" on the Mac.

Totally irrelevant to the reality of now. Absolute meaningless information (whether fantasy or fact). Either you got lost and missed the essential point, or you're deliberately trying to confuse the issue (so as to appear clever).

All your link does is support the argument.

No one who read (and understood) the article could possibly make that statement with a straight face. Any more jokes?

 

[ippikiokami]

A thousand thanks for that kind offer, but... since i'm the one who started this particular (sub)discussion, the burden of "understanding" is on you.

Totally irrelevant to the reality of now. Absolute meaningless information (whether fantasy or fact). Either you got lost and missed the essential point, or you're deliberately trying to confuse the issue (so as to appear clever).

No one who read (and understood) the article could possibly make that statement with a straight face. Any more jokes?

Then what was this miraculous point that you tried to link the article for?

http://trailofbits.com/2009/08/10/advanced-mac-os-x-rootkits/

If someone wants to root a mac.... the small stuff your article talks about is not going to stop them.

here is a quick quote about security in general

"In January, security researcher Neil Archibald, who has already been credited with finding numerous vulnerabilities in OS X, told ZDNet Australia that he knows of numerous security vulnerabilities in Apple's operating system that could be exploited by attackers.

"The only thing which has kept Mac OS X relatively safe up until now is the fact that the market share is significantly lower than that of Microsoft Windows or the more common UNIX platforms.... If this situation was to change, in my opinion, things could be a lot worse on Mac OS X than they currently are on other operating systems," said Archibald at the time."

And

"Gaining root access to a Mac is "easy pickings," according to an individual who won an OS X hacking challenge last month by gaining root control of a machine using an unpublished security vulnerability."

Again the simple fact that if you have a Mac right now and there chance for you to get a virus (which is a good thing) .. if you look at the core reason it's not exactly something to go toot your horn on.

That's the last i'll mention this since it's totally off topic.

 

[TiBo44]

What are you talking about? Unless you're refering to the 50 year old ones that are on the verge of retirement, you're completely wrong (and even there, there's plenty of older people that know about newer technology and even post here on Macrumors).

Photographers and Film Editors are among the biggest techies I know by far.

You may think that you know some Photographers and Film Editors (or some students or teachers in those industries) that don't know about computers. But I guarentee you that if you actually took the time to talk to them about technology, you would surprised at how much they know. Even if they don't make it a point to bring up with you personally, i7 processors and the advantages of blu ray and the benefits of the enormous storage it offers for their industry, they more likely than not know about it.

They spend hours on cnet and engadget every week reading up the very latest cameras, camera lenses and drolling over the latest tech.

And invariably they learn about processors and such while they're there. Try talking to them, before making assumptions about how much they know.

In the days before digital (and I'm only 40yrs old) they called those photographers you describe as "Equipment Junkies". They spent more time dreaming about and buying gear than shooting images. I know one single photographer who would spend hours on techie websites or drooling over the latest tech. I have amateurs ask me tech questions about photo gear all the time and I generally say "I don't know, go to DPReview.com, or better yet, learn how to shoot on Manual and go make some images".

Smart photographers know enough, or know people who know enough, to make things work. There's just too much else to learn and do.

T

ps I'm more techie than most photographers I know. I know what Blu-Ray is, never heard of i7

 

[Hal Itosis]

That's the last i'll mention this since it's totally off topic.

You would like it to be off-topic, i'm sure.

But the cost factor is a big part of what the PeeCee pundits have been pushing in here. Since i got my first machine (a IIci in 1989) i haven't spent 1¢ on anti-virus software.. nada, never. Nor have the various Mac-only offices i have been acquainted with. I'm sure most Mac users reading this never spent any money on anti-virus software either. Can you (or the companies you've worked for, or the majority of PeeCee users) truthfully make that statement? And what have been the costs of preventing (or recovering from) getting hacked?

There are many ways Windows users pay more (like tech support for example) which you would like to conveniently ignore... but computer ownership isn't only about a piece of hardware. Without software and ease-of-use, it's just a bunch of useless molecules. So we can't really partition this thread's topic to exclude these matters.

--

Finally, nowhere did i say anything like "Macs were miraculous" and couldn't be rooted. (even the article i linked to mentioned an early Mac rootkit). The point there was about the security foundations of the two operating systems, and why it's been so much easier to root a PC, and much more difficult to defend against. Windows is inherently weaker in those respects, by its very design.

If there was an exact 50/50 marketshare between Macs and PeeCees, do you honestly believe that the resulting share of vulnerable exploits would also be 50/50? If so, i'd expect we should have heard about tons of successful attacks against Unix/Linux by now. Alas, that honor belongs to Microsoft... and it will continue to lead in that arena, despite decreasing popularity.

That's why my *hardware* will avoid Microsoft software at all costs.

 

[Beric]

-snip-

I have never bought a single piece of antivirus software on my PC. I simply use that which is freely available, as well as the best antivirus software, which is common sense.

I do my own tech support for my PC. It's good enough. But if I hadn't had Applecare, I'd be out a lot of money. Says something right there.

 

[Eidorian]

I have never bought a single piece of antivirus software on my PC. I simply use that which is freely available, as well as the best antivirus software, which is common sense.

I do my own tech support for my PC. It's good enough. But if I hadn't had Applecare, I'd be out a lot of money. Says something right there.

I still wonder about the ravages of the wild as well. The only time I've ever encountered a virus was intentionally mounting a free 60 GB hard drive (this was 2004 mind you).

 

[NT1440]

I have never bought a single piece of antivirus software on my PC. I simply use that which is freely available, as well as the best antivirus software, which is common sense.

I do my own tech support for my PC. It's good enough. But if I hadn't had Applecare, I'd be out a lot of money. Says something right there.

I still wonder about the ravages of the wild as well. The only time I've ever encountered a virus was intentionally mounting a free 60 GB hard drive (this was 2004 mind you).

See this is what I don't get. I, like you, never had one virus on my personal PCs. Yet somehow my sisters, my mom, my dad, my uncle, cousins, aunt, etc always managed to screw up so bad that I've had to reformat for each of them at least once. I don't know what the hell they possibly could be doing, but I've always installed free software hoping it would prevent them from screwing up again, it just doesnt work with certain...types of people.

 

[zipa]

You would like it to be off-topic, i'm sure.

But the cost factor is a big part of what the PeeCee pundits have been pushing in here. Since i got my first machine (a IIci in 1989) i haven't spent 1¢ on anti-virus software.. nada, never.

Good for you. I got my first computer back in 1983. A C-64, it was. Since then, I've spent exactly $0.00 on anti-virus or firewall software, even though I've used Windows pretty much ever since Win 3.0 was published on seven floppy disks. And here we go, still sitting on Windows, virus-free, but eager as hell to get a MBP w/ Arrandale as soon as Mr. J will see fit to release them.

 

[Hal Itosis]

I have never bought a single piece of antivirus software on my PC. I simply use that which is freely available, as well as the best antivirus software, which is common sense.

I do my own tech support for my PC. It's good enough. But if I hadn't had Applecare, I'd be out a lot of money. Says something right there.

Yeah, it says we are all individuals in here and we should probably respect that fact. What is so stupid is people that post here (without quoting a specific person) and rant about "you fanboys blah blah blah". It's beyond immature really, it's more like pre-school.

So yes, we should stop with the generalizations. But —at the same time —Windows users (and Windows-based organizations) do generally spend more on antivirus (blah blah blah).

 

[Eidorian]

See this is what I don't get. I, like you, never had one virus on my personal PCs. Yet somehow my sisters, my mom, my dad, my uncle, cousins, aunt, etc always managed to screw up so bad that I've had to reformat for each of them at least once. I don't know what the hell they possibly could be doing, but I've always installed free software hoping it would prevent them from screwing up again, it just doesnt work with certain...types of people.

I can ramble off plenty of factors with most of them involving user apathy or social engineering.

I remember a few problem clients that never had problems again after switching their user accounts under Windows XP to standard users. Failing that I run SteadyState on a few kiosk machines I have around. 100% root all the time only compounds the problems and dragging users kicking and screaming into typing in passwords or dare I say UAC just seems to increase click here to ignore.

I'm sure we can rattle off plenty of stories about user ignoring what's blatantly on screen and short of speaking or flashing at you. There's even a botnet that asks its users if they are human and has the users solve captchas for its creator.

When I was managing more Macs I'd just image blast the damned things and not even care about the local machine's state when user space was backed up to tape and on the network.

 

[thermodynamic]

13" screen at 1920x1080? ROTFLMAO! (And for a 17", I'd expect 1920x1200 - vertical resolution is important. I also develop, not play games or watch movies on a computer. A computer is capable of more...)

Don't forget: Sony's prices are lower because they put in Winbloat 7 and a ton of crapware; the latter to subsidize the costs.

Some of the technically inclined do know the ills of Windows (file fragmentation, the !*@&#^$%ing registry, etc).

Yes, by now the Core2Duo technology is lower in price. Apple does need to move on with the latest hardware available.

 

[thermodynamic]

I have never bought a single piece of antivirus software on my PC. I simply use that which is freely available, as well as the best antivirus software, which is common sense.

I do my own tech support for my PC. It's good enough. But if I hadn't had Applecare, I'd be out a lot of money. Says something right there.

Free isn't a business model, much less common sense. You get what you pay for, and I'd choose Trend or Kaspersky over freeware fluff anyday. The free stuff isn't updated as quickly...

 

[Beric]

Free isn't a business model, much less common sense. You get what you pay for, and I'd choose Trend or Kaspersky over freeware fluff anyday. The free stuff isn't updated as quickly...

What I was suggesting is that free simply is good enough, unless you're computer illiterate or something. I wouldn't trust my Mom with a PC; hence why she uses a Mac. My parents' older friends all seem to get viruses all the time. Yet I'm certain I download far more data and browse the web more than any of them. It's just got to be due to user ignorance and lack of common-sense web knowledge. Viruses seem far more prevalent, the older the user.

 

[NT1440]

What I was suggesting is that free simply is good enough, unless you're computer illiterate or something. I wouldn't trust my Mom with a PC; hence why she uses a Mac. My parents' older friends all seem to get viruses all the time. Yet I'm certain I download far more data and browse the web more than any of them. It's just got to be due to user ignorance and lack of common-sense web knowledge. Viruses seem far more prevalent, the older the user.

Working at the Help Desk for the Office of Information Technology here at my school, I can tell you that this definitely has nothing to do with age. The sheer stupidity of some of the people that come in here with their messed up computers astounds me. If anything it seems like we should start making basic computer maintenance a part of the education system, or have MS come up with a way to keep these people from screwing up everything.

 

[Eidorian]

Working at the Help Desk for the Office of Information Technology here at my school, I can tell you that this definitely has nothing to do with age. The sheer stupidity of some of the people that come in here with their messed up computers astounds me. If anything it seems like we should start making basic computer maintenance a part of the education system, or have MS come up with a way to keep these people from screwing up everything.

There is no wealth like knowledge, no poverty like ignorance.

 

[thebeautyisfake]

The only virus I have ever had was one that flipped my display upside down. It was disturbingly fun trying to navigate windows explorer that way.

 

[zipa]

Don't forget: Sony's prices are lower because they put in Winbloat 7 and a ton of crapware

How is that different from Apple bundling OhS*** it suX?

 

[kny3twalker]

How is that different from Apple bundling OhS*** it suX?

Two reasons, first those windows stickers give the manufacturer a break on windows OS and second the bloatware gives the manufacturer a break on manufacturing.

And OSX is pretty awesome, what other unix environment looks like it?