Apple Says Government Trying to 'Rewrite History' by Using All Writs Act as 'All-Powerful Magic Wand'

[dk001]

"A court hearing to address the issue is scheduled for next Tuesday, March 22, the day after Apple's media event where it is expected to introduce a new 4-inch "iPhone SE" and a new 9.7-inch iPad, as well as make a few additional announcements."

Tim Cook is going to be really busy next week.

Do you expect TC to attend the hearing?
[doublepost=1458151736][/doublepost]

It is hard to take anything he says seriously anymore.

I used to watch LWT with John Oliver a lot, and enjoyed it. I ignored occasional bias and sometimes totally one sided commentary because I thought it was was mostly funny and I really wasn't watching it to learn anything.

But, after the voting episode, John Oliver loses all credibility. Especially about the voter IDs. How can anyone take him seriously?

"Great run of shows John however I do say your one fapp on the voter thing makes you forevermore an unbelievably moronic comedian."

Really? One strike and out syndrome? Yep.
[doublepost=1458153878][/doublepost]

All powerful magic wands? I just got invested in this story ... Perhaps this if the real 8th Harry Potter novel.

The Evil FBI is trying to get into Gringotts to recover a secret Horcrux and Tim Cook is The Boy That Lived.

and this makes Obama the head of the "Ministry of Silly Things"? or the magical equivalent.
[doublepost=1458154214][/doublepost]

Your ignorance of the laws regarding what you call "The separation of church and state" is painful to read but not surprising. Seems like you're from the "I get my facts from MSNBC" crowd. The constitution says that the government cannot establish a state religion or restrict the free exercise of religion. That's it. It is expected that our leaders can be and can be influenced by their religious beliefs and that is evident throughout our founding and our political leadership throughout the life of this nation. BUT it is not requirement to be religious and there will be not religious qualification for office. The state does not have the right to establish a state religion. You can be of any religious opinion and be elected to office and push legislation in support of your religious view. You know . . .Religous freedom, not religious separation.

You support abortion on one hand and then talk about child care on the other. How about getting consistent in your view and learn to respect all childrens lives. You libs always amaze me with how you're so concerned about the kids that are born but are just fine and speak with pride about your ability to slaughter them.

[doublepost=1458154250][/doublepost]

You repubs always amaze me with how you're so concerned about the kids that are not born yet, but once they're born, screw them if their parents are poor.

[doublepost=1458154284][/doublepost]

You have to ignore the existence of all of the religious charities that help and support children and families to believe that. Screw no one, but if you think the road to a stable life for you and your family is living on government handouts you're wrong. Socialism is not for the USA.

Would you kindly take this 4th Ring of our current 3 Ring Circus outside this thread?
Having too much fun with the basic 3 Rings and don't want to overload my minimally challenged intellect.

 

[phillipduran]

I didn't mention socialism so I don't know where you're getting that from. I'm referring to republican polices that care more about the unborn than the born.

But speaking of socialism, im amazed that repubs favor corporate welfare vs people welfare.

We do care about children after they are born. It's a false and unverifiable talking point from your side that our care for children ends at birth. But heck, if you want to go down that route, I bet more republican kids are better off than democrat kids. I can't prove it but I bet that is the case.

We don't favor corporate welfare and I have been appalled at the too big to fail mentality. That is not capitalism and that is not conservatism. It is elitist politician ideology that has created that and if you haven't been paying attention, there is a huge uprising in the republican side of the citizenry to squash that kind of thinking and to get away from this political elitism and establishment crowd that has taken over the party. Look at how scared those politicians and Washington is of a possible outsider getting in. They are even looking to subvert the will of the voters if Trump comes out ahead of the others in the primaries. Conservatives and republicans are tired of all of the things you are accusing republicans of and the numbers are showing it. What you complain of is not from the people who call themselves republicans, it's from the elitists in DC and they are on the way out.

 

[Doctor Q]

The privacy vs. security tradeoff is obviously a societal issue, but there's also the technical side. Yesterday the Washington Post reported that security experts say that government efforts to force tech firms to give them backdoor access will do little to stop terrorists. Short but interesting article.

 

[Larry-K]

It is elitist politician ideology that has created that and if you haven't been paying attention, there is a huge uprising in the republican side of the citizenry to squash that kind of thinking and to get away from this political elitism and establishment crowd that has taken over the party.

Who better than "The Donald" to fight Elitism!

 

[LordBeelzebub]

I really like knowing my drug dealing and trafficking women data is secure and that Apple is protecting me and hampering law enforcement.

What you'll really like is if the government gets their way and this back door into iPhones gets into the wrong hands and your phone ends up being the one that gets hacked and your sensitive, personal, important data gets stolen and you find out your accounts got hacked. iTunes, Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, Apple Pay info, you name it. Because all that data is stored on your phone, and if someone can hack it, you and every other iPhone user is f'ed. It's a lot more serious than the stupidity of your reply.

 

[Keirasplace]

We do care about children after they are born. It's a false and unverifiable talking point from your side that our care for children ends at birth. But heck, if you want to go down that route, I bet more republican kids are better off than democrat kids. I can't prove it but I bet that is the case.

We don't favor corporate welfare and I have been appalled at the too big to fail mentality. That is not capitalism and that is not conservatism. It is elitist politician ideology that has created that and if you haven't been paying attention, there is a huge uprising in the republican side of the citizenry to squash that kind of thinking and to get away from this political elitism and establishment crowd that has taken over the party. Look at how scared those politicians and Washington is of a possible outsider getting in. They are even looking to subvert the will of the voters if Trump comes out ahead of the others in the primaries. Conservatives and republicans are tired of all of the things you are accusing republicans of and the numbers are showing it. What you complain of is not from the people who call themselves republicans, it's from the elitists in DC and they are on the way out.

OMG, do you actually believe the tripe you just dropped. The "revolution" (sic) is the same old crap as before, one elite replacing another and using the poor saps bellow as fall guys making them believe they actually won.

Both the dems and GOP do that all the time; but the GOP are particularly adept at it.

Considering the GOP has been pushing for trickle down economics for 30 years and its what got most of their voters into the dumpster (read as : red state are mostly basket cases), yet there is not much that's changed in the positions of Tea-publicans regarding that. How did this happen? Because whoever running is distracting those folks by making them vote against themselves through narrow focused issue politics (abortion, family values, etc). This year is more of the same; it just has switched to nationalism and identity politics (for whites).

You're getting fed the same goop and thinking you're getting something new; you're not.

That anyone would think that Cruz or Trump! is for the little guy, would be a funny SNL sketch if some people didn''t actually believe it. Anyone who has actually followed WTH this guy has done and said for 40 years know how crazy this whole proposition really is. He's got thousands of absurd quotes and actions on files that will come to bite him hard in the general where he won't only have sycophants to deal with.

 

[duffman9000]

We do care about children after they are born. It's a false and unverifiable talking point from your side that our care for children ends at birth. But heck, if you want to go down that route, I bet more republican kids are better off than democrat kids. I can't prove it but I bet that is the case.

We don't favor corporate welfare and I have been appalled at the too big to fail mentality. That is not capitalism and that is not conservatism. It is elitist politician ideology that has created that and if you haven't been paying attention, there is a huge uprising in the republican side of the citizenry to squash that kind of thinking and to get away from this political elitism and establishment crowd that has taken over the party. Look at how scared those politicians and Washington is of a possible outsider getting in. They are even looking to subvert the will of the voters if Trump comes out ahead of the others in the primaries. Conservatives and republicans are tired of all of the things you are accusing republicans of and the numbers are showing it. What you complain of is not from the people who call themselves republicans, it's from the elitists in DC and they are on the way out.

I complain and ridicule the repubs in office because they call themselves repubs. What else can I call them? How else can I judge them? I think I'm a fair judge for I judge them for how they vote. Some of the repubs who voted for the bailouts looked like they were eating turd sandwiches. But they still voted in mass for the bailouts. If you can't stand by your principles when things get tough then your principles were weak to begin with.

As for paying attention, I've been paying attention on and off for about 20 years. The repubs currently have a candidate that would he be murdered in the Senate, no one would press charges. Another guy that would have ordered me to commit war crimes. You talk about this uprising to get away from the establishment crowd, and you support the ultimate politician. Do you see the irony?

The elitists in DC are not going anywhere. Don't go crazy when very little changes.

 

[You are the One]

The privacy vs. security tradeoff is obviously a societal issue, but there's also the technical side. Yesterday the Washington Post reported that security experts say that government efforts to force tech firms to give them backdoor access will do little to stop terrorists. Short but interesting article.

The U.S. government can't really stop what developers do outside of its borders, so cracking down on domestic tech companies that offer strong encryption protections may just drive consumers to foreign competitors without the same restrictions, analysts said.

That and the possibility of US tech companies moving out of US because the fascist government and legislation harms their business.

I hear you will get nutritious food in Russia coming years, they banned GMO and made a strategic move to turn their agricultural industry ecological. People there are smarter, better educated and less obese as well. No wonder the west hates them.

I, for sure, will give up all products if/when they become a subsidiary to the US police state.

Some thirty years back I enjoyed traveling to and in the US, friendly people and much to see, nowadays I'd rather eat a dead rat than going there.
[doublepost=1458202315][/doublepost]Here is an informed comment from Cyber_Investor relating to the same Washington Post-article:

Why the government can't stop encryption?
Unless the U.S is willing to disconnect from the entire global Internet Americans will have access to encryption technology from foreign sources.

Why the U.S. shouldn't attempt to stop encryption?
Encryption is simply a branch of mathematics. A country can no more curtail the use of encryption than they could restrict the intellectual endeavors of its citizens. Do we want the U.S. to become the country that fears prime numbers? What's next? poetry?

Why any attempt to make encryption illegal will fail?
The first amendment guarantees people the right to express themselves as they will. If Americans want to express themselves in a foreign language, sign language, morse code or digitized ciphertext (encryption) that's their choice. So is the strength of the encryption for those that choose to use it.

Why is the use of encryption even a debate?

 

[shacky]

FBI, DOJ have become synonymous with "Republicans" who always "think backwards, in reverse."

Maybe you missed the memo but the current administration pushing this issue is of the Democrat party.

 

[Larry-K]

Some thirty years back I enjoyed traveling to and in the US, friendly people and much to see, nowadays I'd rather eat a dead rat than going there.

They must have pretty good "Dead Rat" Where you are.

We're just fine here, don't worry about us.

 

[You are the One]

We're just fine here, don't worry about us.

In all fairness most European countries are right behind and following suit. The police state insanity policy seems very contagious. Must be spreading through the banking system.

However there seems to be some positive news as well. The FTC have sent letters to app-developers telling them that:

"Companies should tell people what information is collected, how it is collected, and who it's shared with."

That is a splendid approach. Now the FTC should turn to their fellow colleagues in federal agencies and teach them something about privacy, why it's important and how to respect it.

 

[jonnysods]

FBI, DOJ have become synonymous with "Republicans" who always "think backwards, in reverse."

This isn't just a matter of right vs left IMO, it's the whole establishment. This is a huge control grab and privacy invasion.

 

[You are the One]

This isn't just a matter of right vs left IMO, it's the whole establishment. This is a huge control grab and privacy invasion.

The same people control both of them, the left and right is just a part of the modern "bread and circus".

The real Masters are here:

 

[jonnysods]

The same people control both of them, the left and right is just a part of the modern "bread and circus".

The real Masters are here:

What about Rockerfellers?

Soros?

 

[You are the One]

What about Rockerfellers? Soros?

Same gang.

“Pretty much every politician in the western world is basically an employee of the ruling class, which is made up of a handful of traditionally powerful families including the Rothschilds and Rockefellers.”

It's all explained here, one of the most important lectures in modern history.

“If voting made any difference they wouldn’t let us do it.” ― Mark Twain

“What is the use of voting? We know that the machines of both parties are subsidized by the same persons, and therefore it is useless to turn in either direction.”—Woodrow Wilson

“The Federal Reserve, through its extensive network of consultants, visiting scholars, alumni, and staff economists, so thoroughly dominates the field of economics that real criticism of the central bank has become a career liability for members of the profession. . . . This dominance helps explain how, even after the Fed failed to foresee the greatest economic collapse since the Great Depression, the central bank has largely escaped criticism from academic economists.”

“The light has gone out at the great American universities as far as monetary science is concerned. Through bribe, blackmail, and attrition all upright and serious monetary economists were bumped from their academic chairs. The Great Chinese Cultural Revolution was a picnic in comparison to the Great American Cultural Revolution eliminating monetary economics from the curriculum.”

 

[You are the One]

And here we have more people at with real character and integrity. Take that FBI.

Apple engineers rebel, refuse to work on iOS amid FBI iPhone battle

The opposition to the FBI's demand runs so deep that some Apple engineers have even threatened to walk away from the company: The New York Times cited "current and former" employees who said members of Apple's engineering teams are prepared to quit if they are ordered to weaken iOS's security mechanisms.

This is front page stuff, MacRumors.

 

[thermodynamic]

This is fast becoming a competition to see who can use the most ear-catching analogy to defame the other side.

So far, I think Apple is winning.

Apple marketing strategy. No matter how condescending, it tends to be effective. Nothing beats their ipad ad, though recent events are more interesting...

http://www.cracked.com/video_18522_why-apple-clearly-thinks-youre-stupid.html
[doublepost=1458345718][/doublepost]

And here we have more people at with real character and integrity. Take that FBI.

Apple engineers rebel, refuse to work on iOS amid FBI iPhone battle



This is front page stuff, MacRumors.

LOL.

Noting Tim Cook's selective human rights championing (people have posted links often enough recently) and how the previous CEO was a real piece of work, it's nice to read some of his coders have those qualities. And now I will go read the article...

 

[electronicsguy]

What I don't understand about Apple's objection to not being able to guarantee security of this "tool" is this: The tool is nothing more than a firmware update, with 10 times wipe feature removed. So basically it's just some piece of code right?
Ok.

Now can apple or microsoft or any software company answer: What is an OS? Its also some code right? Do we today, have the source code of Ios, Windows around? Or lets take some commercial apps - do we have source code of Photoshop, VMware products or Oracle DB around? No. (correct me if I'm wrong). So if these companies, over the last so many decades, have been able to protect their source code, why can't they protect this "tool"?

Do we have people interested in the source code of the products I mentioned above - Yes, all the time! But even now, I cannot see how I could get my hands on this code.

So what exactly is this "Scare" about?

 

[t0mat0]

Can't shake the feeling the FBI might be contemplating libel, slander, mistruth on Tuesday. If they can't win the legal arguments, maybe they try and stir up popular opinion with rhetoric and overly simplistic examples and misleading statements.
Quick snappy headline comments seem to favour the FBI if they wanted to do this - Apple come across as acing morally superior/overly self righteous with long winded arguments that the general public can't comprehend. Can Apple make a decent simple argument and counter arguments to what the FBI will sling?

 

[pdjudd]

So what exactly is this "Scare" about?

An official compromised OS is far more desirable to criminals and evildoers versus the secured OS. The only value that iOS source code has is to competitors who want to steal code elements to adapt onto their own. You don’t need the source code. Jailbreakers don’t. The problem is that this code has known flaws to it. Serious ones. It’s far more desirable to more parties who aren’t interested in the source code, but the product itself.

 

[electronicsguy]

An official compromised OS is far more desirable to criminals and evildoers versus the secured OS. The only value that iOS source code has is to competitors who want to steal code elements to adapt onto their own. You don’t need the source code. Jailbreakers don’t. The problem is that this code has known flaws to it. Serious ones. It’s far more desirable to more parties who aren’t interested in the source code, but the product itself.

What do you mean the source code has no value? If someone has the source code, they could write backdoors themselves, compile it and load it on a target's phone themselves. Its far easier to manipulate the inner workings (like remotely switch on camera, etc.). The source code is the product.

 

[pdjudd]

What do you mean the source code has no value? If someone has the source code, they could write backdoors themselves, compile it and load it on a target's phone themselves. Its far easier to manipulate the inner workings (like remotely switch on camera, etc.). The source code is the product.

You cannot load firmware without it being signed by Apple. FBiOS has an inherent advantage over a home-brew OS with backdoors - its signed by Apple. Believe me, not having the source code has not stopped people finding exploits that exist accidentally (that can be patched by Apple). So far, all they have done is use it for jailbreaks. The FBiOS is much much worse. It’s a signed OS that has known flaws. It would be real bad.

The thing about just having the source code as it is isn’t valuable for long. Apple can just change big portions and it’s obsolete.

 

[electronicsguy]

You cannot load firmware without it being signed by Apple. FBiOS has an inherent advantage over a home-brew OS with backdoors - its signed by Apple. Believe me, not having the source code has not stopped people finding exploits that exist accidentally (that can be patched by Apple). So far, all they have done is use it for jailbreaks. The FBiOS is much much worse. It’s a signed OS that has known flaws. It would be real bad.

The thing about just having the source code as it is isn’t valuable for long. Apple can just change big portions and it’s obsolete.

I think you're picking hairs here. By "code", lets mean the entire eco-system needed. Sourced code, keys and IDE. Now with all this, anyone can do whatever they want on the device.

Now if apple and other companies can protect such IP, there's no reason why they cannot protect the code that FBI is asking them to make.

 

[Tech198]

Isn't there always a clause somewhere where it says in government .. " you can protect anything except if offered a subpoena" .?

 

[AdonisSMU]

The privacy vs. security tradeoff is obviously a societal issue, but there's also the technical side. Yesterday the Washington Post reported that security experts say that government efforts to force tech firms to give them backdoor access will do little to stop terrorists. Short but interesting article.

Its not going to stop terror groups and others from using encryption. Its just going to make the American people less safe.
[doublepost=1458539231][/doublepost]

I think you're picking hairs here. By "code", lets mean the entire eco-system needed. Sourced code, keys and IDE. Now with all this, anyone can do whatever they want on the device.

Now if apple and other companies can protect such IP, there's no reason why they cannot protect the code that FBI is asking them to make.

Apple can't protect it. We are on a site called Macrumors for crisis sake...with daily leaks on up and coming products and experiments going on inside of Apple.