Apple Says iOS is Safer Than Android Because Sideloading Apps Isn't Allowed

[vipergts2207]

Nice deflection, please answer the question, do you believe that other hardware platforms such as cars or TVs should be mandated to allow "sideloading".

It's a qualified statement, not a deflection. If a platform in some space, be it TV's, infotainment systems, or mobile phone OS's, has significant market share and there exists only two competitors in that space, then yes I would support forced sideloading. Otherwise I don't care if they're forced to sideload or not. In your example, Tesla falls far short of that line, with an insignificant 3% market share.

 

[zorinlynx]

Allowing sideload apps is like putting a garbage dump behind a building. Some people may care, some may not, some may not even notice. But one thing is certain, the garbage dump devalues the entire property.

It's more like having an invisible garbage dump that you can only see and smell when you physically decide to walk into it. And sometimes in that dump you'll find good stuff that you can't buy at the gleaming beautiful shopping center across the street, but you have to sort through a lot of rubbish to get to it.

In this situation I'd rather have the dump there.

 

[I7guy]

indeed we do have some semblance of anti-trust legislation here so hopefully those checks and balances work on corporations

Right. It doesn’t mean one particular view of antitrust is the supreme courts. It can go all ways.

 

[toobravetosave]

Right. It doesn’t mean one particular view of antitrust is the supreme courts. It can go all ways.

It can and thankfully the EU has even an even stronger and less corrupt system than america so there's higher chance of actual pro consumer action being taken that will benefit the entire world. Like when steam started offering refund windows to everyone because australian law required it

 

[icanhazmac]

and just like side loading you take on the risks of what you do that's the beauty of freedom

I agree but how to you address the desired breakdown of the "walled garden" for those that do not want it to be broken down? There is a segment of the Apple community that bought into this ecosystem because they value "1 stop shopping". If sideloading and alternate stores come into being then it is reasonable to say that the store environment becomes severely fractured. I have used the example of Epic before, the very second that Epic is able to remove Fortnite from the Apple store and host both the app and the payment system themselves they will do so and so will many others, no more one stop shop.

From what I see here the pro-hardware freedom team doesn't at all want to acknowledge pro-walled garden teams loss if they get their way. The pro-hardware freedom team does have other options in the Android ecosystem, which contains MANY hardware options and near complete software freedom. The pro-walled garden team has no where else to go if we lose the App store as a focused location for all apps and payments.

 

[coolfactor]

It's not in anyone but Apple's interest to have so many restrictions.

We live in a scary world where people (yes, people, not companies) will try to take advantage of any weakness that exists. It happens all the time. We saw this with Windows endlessly and then Android. Apple's position may seem restrictive and self-serving in one light, but the outcome is the same — a safery, saner user experience. This is 100% Apple's choice to build into their products and services because it's ... drumroll please ... theirs, top-to-bottom. Consumers have a choice to use an alternative platform. Simple as that.

 

[4743913]

They all came from the Mac app store with the exception of Firefox, so yes, I have one.

so you don't even stand by your convictions

 

[coolfactor]

and just like side loading you take on the risks of what you do that's the beauty of freedom

But, sadly, the majority of consumers don't understand that, and they'd blame Apple for any problems that happen.

 

[vipergts2207]

Is that a valid analogy? By tuning you are just modifying existing parameters not installing new software.
If I am wrong about that I am willing to learn. Alternate software would require a different ECU.

Tuning also voids warranties correct?

I actually agree, it is not a valid analogy. Someone else came up with it, I was simply responding to it. My analogy around asking to simply be allowed to put whatever brand of oil in my car that I got from places that aren't the car dealership makes far more sense.

 

[ian87w]

People already install third-party engine control software. It's called ECU tuning. If you're going to try to make something sound ridiculous, you might not want to compare it to something that already exists.

But it’s not endorsed by the car manufacturer. It’s akin to jail breaking. Nobody forces car manufacturers to actually open up their car software and advertise users to tune it. People doing it are akin to people jailbreaking their iPhones.

And alternative app stores already existed on smartphones as well, on Android.
Basically what you want already existed. You’re behaving as if Android doesn’t exist.

iOS in its current state is a choice, simply because a more dominant and open platform already existed. Wanting iOS to be the same as Android is removing choice.

 

[davidjytang]

To anyone lacking basic logic. Apple is just stating the obvious here.

Does having the ability to install _any_ app from _any_ unchecked source reduce security?

In what parallel universe is the answer "no"?

In those universes where allowing sideloading does not necessarily equal to install __any__ app from __any__ unchecked source.

 

[toobravetosave]

But, sadly, the majority of consumers don't understand that, and they'd blame Apple for any problems that happen.

so what apple already deflects all blame back onto consumers anyway

 

[icanhazmac]

so you don't even stand by your convictions

Well if a single line is all you were able to take away from my nuanced post then I can't help you.

I own a PC where the vast majority of software is purchased from individual stores versus the Microsoft store, that doesn't mean I don't wish the Microsoft store were as robust and useful as Apple's.

Furthermore it has nothing to do with convictions, it has to do with how I personally feel about the iOS ecosystem as a standalone entity, it does not need to be compared to or mirror any other ecosystem I may be part of.

 

[toobravetosave]

But it’s not endorsed by the car manufacturer. It’s akin to jail breaking. Nobody forces car manufacturers to actually open up their car software and advertise users to tune it. People doing it are akin to people jailbreaking their iPhones.

And alternative app stores already existed on smartphones as well, on Android.
Basically what you want already existed. You’re behaving as if Android doesn’t exist.

iOS in its current state is a choice, simply because a more dominant and open platform already existed. Wanting iOS to be the same as Android is removing choice.

you do realize less than 1% of android users sideload right?

 

[vipergts2207]

The car OEM doesn’t have to support a person trying to modify their car’s ECU.

You're right they don't, but they don't make it impossible to do so either.

 

[ian87w]

you do realize less than 1% of android users sideload right?

Any proof of that? Do note that Amazon App Store users are basically sideloaders, as well as fortnite players, etc. you sure about that 1% number?
Besides, however number of people sideloading is not the point. The point is, you can already do it on the majority platform. Harping on Apple to allow sideloading makes no sense, as if Android didn’t exist. Forcing Apple iOS to behave like Android is basically removing choice, as the two platforms is becoming more alike than different. Choice means having two different options, not two of the same options.

 

[jz0309]

I for one do NOT want side loading enabled, politicians "forcing" Apple (and/or Google for that matter) to do that in the "name of the people" they claim to represent is simply sad ...

 

[toobravetosave]

Any proof of that? Do note that Amazon App Store users are basically sideloaders, as well as fortnite players, etc. you sure about that 1% number?
Besides, however number of people sideloading is not the point. The point is, you can already do it on the majority platform. Harping on Apple to allow sideloading makes no sense, as if Android didn’t exist. Forcing Apple iOS to behave like Android is basically removing choice, as the two platforms is becoming more alike than different. Choice means having two different options, not two of the same options.

Google Transparency Report

transparencyreport.google.com

you can read google's security report or this article that summarizes key points

Google Data Shows Tiny Fraction of Android Devices Run Malicious Apps

A new transparency report on Android security shows that far less than one percent of all devices have a potentially harmful app running on them.

duo.com

it's actually much less than 1%

edit: nobody is forcing anybody to sideload you literally do not have to sideload if you don't want to

 

[vipergts2207]

But it’s not endorsed by the car manufacturer. It’s akin to jail breaking. Nobody forces car manufacturers to actually open up their car software and advertise users to tune it. People doing it are akin to people jailbreaking their iPhones.

Thank you for recognizing that this analogy of yours was bad. You're right, ECU tuning is akin to jailbreaking and we're not asking for the ability to jailbreak.

And alternative app stores already existed on smartphones as well, on Android.
Basically what you want already existed. You’re behaving as if Android doesn’t exist.

iOS in its current state is a choice, simply because a more dominant and open platform already existed. Wanting iOS to be the same as Android is removing choice.

I'll say it again, many factors outweigh the ability to sideload apps when deciding on a smartphone. As such, many others and I will continue to advocate for changes we'd like to see to the products we use. There are many differences between iOS and Android outside of the ability to sideload.

 

[4743913]

Harping on Apple to allow sideloading makes no sense,

allowing apple to be the gatekeeper of the software one installs on his device is the height of kool-aid guzzling

 

[elptdbi3lYI]

I for one do NOT want side loading enabled, politicians "forcing" Apple (and/or Google for that matter) to do that in the "name of the people" they claim to represent is simply sad ...

Almost as sad as big tech forcing people into consuming content they deem right

 

[ian87w]

Google Transparency Report

transparencyreport.google.com

you can read google's security report or this article that summarizes key points

Google Data Shows Tiny Fraction of Android Devices Run Malicious Apps

A new transparency report on Android security shows that far less than one percent of all devices have a potentially harmful app running on them.

duo.com

it's actually much less than 1%

edit: nobody is forcing anybody to sideload you literally do not have to sideload if you don't want to

Having harmful app != sideloaders. Red herring.
Or are you validating Apple’s concern of sideloading by equating sideloaders as having harmful app…?

 

[toobravetosave]

Having harmful app != sideloaders. Red herring.
Or are you validating Apple’s concern of sideloading by equating sideloaders as having harmful app…?

Yes they actually include malware with sideloading as they consider them all the same so it's actually very few people who use the feature

edit: malware already exists in the app store curate by apple and once again people should be allowed to side load apps or as we call it on the computer...installing programs

 

[ian87w]

Yes they actually include malware with sideloading as they consider them all the same so it's actually very few people who use the feature

Wait, so you actually agree with Apple’s concern then, that sideloading can bring problems like malware….

 

[icanhazmac]

edit: nobody is forcing anybody to sideload you literally do not have to sideload if you don't want to

If the App store becomes fragmented by allowing alternative stores you are actually forcing everyone to choose between the app and sideloading, funny how no one wants to acknowledge this!