Apple Silicon MBAs have left me without any options

[dduraznito]

I'm writing this to check if there are more people that find themselves in my situation.

I'd like a Mac because I prefer macOS over Windows (especially Windows 11, which is a mess). I'd use the device for work, which is office stuff (Word, Excel, tons of Safari tabs, etc.), and I need portability because I travel, but I also work a lot from home where I have my preferred setup.

Historically, the MBA was the best device for this, but I feel there's a gap between the MBA and the MBP. For comfort, I use two large external monitors at home, and having used other devices with higher refresh rates, 60hz tires my eyes more.

I appreciate how Apple Silicaon has been a tremendous jump in efficiency and power, but I don't think I can take full advantage of that power: in my setup, the most demanding factor is having two external monitors plus the one in the laptop.

The M3 has been released and the MBA still supports 1 external display and does not support 120hz. Since I don't edit video or any of the other cool things you guys typically talk about, I don't think all of these jumps in processing power apply to me.

I don't think I need to mention that I don't need a MBP either. It's heavier and it's designed for way more demanding tasks. I wish Apple would design the MBA to allow users like me apply that power for a better viewing experience (120hz) and another external display. If I remember correctly, the Intel MBAs did allow multiple displays, so the Apple Silicon MBAs should be able to handle it (I'm not an expert in chips, so maybe I'm wrong.)

Sorry for the long rant, but after 3 Apple Silicon MBAs I still feel there's no room for me in the lineup, and I really don't want a Windows 11 machine, nor an overly powerful machine that's too heavy (a MBP feels like getting a Ferrari just for something silly like extra leg room.)

Also, do you think these limitations are purely for commercial purposes or is there a real technical reason? I guess I'll have to wait until M4...

Thanks for reading.

 

[Chancha]

M3 Die Shot suggests display engines take up nearly the same area as P-cores

According to the M3 annotated die shot images, it appears that each display engine is nearly as large (edit: even larger) in terms of area taken on the die as a P-core , excluding its L2 cache. Of course, this is only a fairly loose way of measuring transistor counts between the two (transistor...

forums.macrumors.com

The thread linked above had some discussion on this issue that you are interested in / troubled with. This was posted before the M3 Air dual external but lid-close firmware change for the M3 14". In short, we can only speculate, Apple's reason seems to be both technical and market driven.

With an Intel MBA, while it was true that it could output one internal + two externals, but it couldn't handle both those externals at 4k + high Hz that you want. (I believe 4k60 without HDR was its limit), and if the Air only had 8GB it absolutely would choke since the VRAM is occupied as extra unlike Apple Silicon's unified memory.

Apple indeed has no answer to your requirement. But if you ask me, with the external display ability as prerequisite, at least you got a 14" (M1 Pro / M2 Pro / M3 Pro) which isn't *that* worse than 13" MBA in terms of portability.

 

[theorist9]

Well, the external display engines on Apple Silicon are relatively large (i.e., they take up a decent amount of real estate on the chip), so if you want to drive a total of three displays (two externals + the MBP's internal display), you need to upgrade to a bigger chip, namely the M3 Pro, that has the space for two external display engines + one internal. So it's not entirely silly--Apple didn't want to spend the silicon budget to include those on the base chip.

Plus there's probaby some product segmentation thinking as well.

[And, fortunately, for those who need their M3 Air to drive two externals, Apple finally enabled a mode where, if you put it in clamshell, it can use the M3's two display engines to drive those instead of one external + the internal. But that doesn't solve your problem, since you want to run two externals plus the internal.]

Now you might wonder why Intel can use smaller display engines, and thus support multiple displays on a relatively smalll chip. I think the large size of Apple's external display engines is partly b/c Apple requires them to support 6k, and partly because it enables a more efficient design, thus increasing batterly life.

 

[Bigwaff]

You could consider DisplayLink -

M1 or M2 Air DisplayLink Experiences

I’m interested to hear about people’s experiences using the DisplayLink adapter to get a second external monitor. Was it as seamless as native support? Any issues with the drivers? Any odd hiccups? Thanks in advance!

forums.macrumors.com

 

[rb2112]

I'm writing this to check if there are more people that find themselves in my situation.

I'd like a Mac because I prefer macOS over Windows (especially Windows 11, which is a mess). I'd use the device for work, which is office stuff (Word, Excel, tons of Safari tabs, etc.), and I need portability because I travel, but I also work a lot from home where I have my preferred setup.

Historically, the MBA was the best device for this, but I feel there's a gap between the MBA and the MBP. For comfort, I use two large external monitors at home, and having used other devices with higher refresh rates, 60hz tires my eyes more.

. . .

Sorry for the long rant, but after 3 Apple Silicon MBAs I still feel there's no room for me in the lineup, and I really don't want a Windows 11 machine, nor an overly powerful machine that's too heavy (a MBP feels like getting a Ferrari just for something silly like extra leg room.)

My situation is similar to yours but not the same, as 60 Hz is fine for me. I have an AS laptop for travel but my home with multiple displays is a 2018 Mini, given my preference for MacOS over Windows. I feel too that the current lineup is not worth the price for me, no need for the pros.

Maybe in a year with used MBP prices that will be doable for your hi-refresh needs?

Or maybe now M2 Pro mini which can do I high refresh display (per everymac: Alternately, this model can support "up to two displays" -- one display with up to 6016x3384 (6K) resolution at 60 Hz over Thunderbolt and one external display with up to 3840x2160 (4K) resolution at 144 Hz over HDMI or one external display up to 7680x4320 (8K) at 60 Hz or 3840x2160 (4K) resolution at 240 Hz over HDMI.)

 

[throAU]

If you MUST have multiple external displays on an MBA check out a DisplayLink dock.

They use a virtual GPU + circuitry in the dock and pretty sure they can drive multiple monitors without needing the onboard GPU to do it.

It may be good enough to keep you on an Air without needing to go to windows or a Pro. Doesn't the air also support 2 external displays in clamshell mode?

Alternatively consider an ultra-wide monitor. Personally I prefer them to two displays as there's no bezel in the middle of your view.

 

[johannnn]

So you don't like the 60hz internal screen? Are your external screens 120hz then? And is the MBA able to run external 120hz screens? I dont know the answer to that. I assume the 60hz is just the limitation for the internal screen?

You could just buy an ultrawide display, and use that instead of 2 external displays.

Or, just get a M3 MBP. It's not only made for "more demanding work". It can be used by anyone that e.g. appreciated the better screen or better support for external screens. If you get a M3 MBP, you can easily use it for 5 years, which is good bang for the buck.

 

[G5isAlive]

People routinely want to mold the MBA to be something Apple doesn't market and includes features found on the MBP. Often the variable people are tap dancing around... is cost. They want more ports like the MBP, at the same price as MBA. Or MBP's screen at MBA prices. Or more Ram at same cost. People have also wanted more monitors like the MBP, at MBA prices. You are somewhat unique that you move the goal post to include 120 hz on two external displays and presumably on the built in screen (why demand it external if not built in?) so as to make it impossible to achieve. For MBA prices.

Apple isn't going to change the MBA design that radically any time soon, so the best one can do if they really want a Mac is to buy last year's MBP, on sale, at today's MBA prices. Even Apple has them on sale on the refurb site. You say you don't need all that CPU power, fine, but you are getting it cheap so just consider it 'future proofing.' Doesnt seem like a big burden.

You cite as a negative that the MBP is heavier. You are right. The 14" MBP is 0.1 pounds heavier than the 15" MBA, or 0.6 lbs for a 13" MBA. Is half a pound really so much to make you give up on the two external screen Mac you say you want?

Apple is a lot of things, the one thing it is not is a have your pie and eat it too type of company. You want Pro features, you pay Pro price. You want a lower price with less features, or you want the ultimate in portability, you buy the MBA.

If that doesn't suit you. Then okay. You can rant, or you can try to find what you want with windows machines.

Having said that, the M3 supports two external screens (but in clamshell mode, so thats a compromise for you). They are 60Hz because they are supposed to be able to support 6k. People have reported being able to support 4k at 120 hz by use of the USB C to display port adapter and using displayport alternative mode. I did this back with the M1. Havent done it personally with the M3. And I only ran 1 external. Dont know about 2.

I have never been one to complain about what Apple doesn't offer, but tried to see if what they do offer can hit enough of my requirements to be useful. Have to admit my deal breaker on a computer is 'does it run Mac OS.' Thats my primary concern.

Good luck.

 

[G5isAlive]

If you MUST have multiple external displays on an MBA check out a DisplayLink dock.

They use a virtual GPU + circuitry in the dock and pretty sure they can drive multiple monitors without needing the onboard GPU to do it.

Don't forget he also demands 120 Hz. DisplayLink (which I have used and find acceptable) does not support 120 Hz.

Not trying to take away from what you suggest, just pointing out the OP's goal posts. Me? I would compromise.

 

[Torty]

So you don't like the 60hz internal screen? Are your external screens 120hz then? And is the MBA able to run external 120hz screens? I dont know the answer to that. I assume the 60hz is just the limitation for the internal screen?

You could just buy an ultrawide display, and use that instead of 2 external displays.

Or, just get a M3 MBP. It's not only made for "more demanding work". It can be used by anyone that e.g. appreciated the better screen or better support for external screens. If you get a M3 MBP, you can easily use it for 5 years, which is good bang for the buck.

I would even say that it is “more demanding work”, regarding display space. So the MBP M3 pro 14” is available is for the OP.

 

[throAU]

Don't forget he also demands 120 Hz. DisplayLink (which I have used and find acceptable) does not support 120 Hz.

Not trying to take away from what you suggest, just pointing out the OP's goal posts. Me? I would compromise.

Yeah I saw that, I think the OP's demand for 120hz is unrealistic. Very few business laptops do 120hz, MacBook Airs have never done 120hz (which is what he was running before), etc.

it's not like the days of CRTs where you got horrendous screen flicker from the 60hz refresh.

 

[za9ra22]

Also, do you think these limitations are purely for commercial purposes or is there a real technical reason? I guess I'll have to wait until M4...

This question is surely irrelevant. You describe a purpose for which you need this system and would intend to use it, so the question as to why Apple don't make it doesn't matter in the slightest. The question that does matter is which product that is available is the best one for your needs.

Just about every purchase you can make contains some compromise or another. As a consumer, you don't really get to ask why they make it this way or that way, you just get to pick from the choices they offer.

Of course if you can wait for the M4, then you don't appear to need to purchase now anyway, and you can't get a better way to 'future proof' your purchase than not actually buy it, so given your options, and your lack of obvious immediate need, it'll likely be better to wait and see... and possibly keep waiting.

On wider issues: Windows 11 isn't that bad, just different. Some of Microsoft's policies and emerging practices with Windows, such as blocking the use of local accounts on the system and the workarounds to achieve them, deleting or blocking the use of some customization utilities to change the start menu of manage Windows components, the arrival of advertising in the start menu... well, these aren't good things. Neither is the fact that they occasionally move to enforce a feature update you might not want, and still can't secure an operating system so it doesn't need monthly fixes that sometimes won't install or other times break things, but millions of people manage quite well, and some even like it. Or you could try Linux instead.

I would be curious about the ways in which 60Hz refresh causes 'eye tiredness' though, because curiously enough, 60Hz refresh rates have been standard in screens for many years, so one assumes this must be a new problem? If so, while there is always the option for a faster display in the MBP, there may also be options in settings for brightness and color profile you could find to reduce or minimize the issue.

But if you absolutely must have 120Hz, it means that even though the MBA supports 2 external monitors (in clamshell mode) as you wish it to, it simply isn't the system for you, regardless of its other benefits to your use case. This would be a compromise you wouldn't really want to make. A MBP may well be more powerful than you need, but too much power is an easier compromise to live with than a screen you actually can't live with.

 

[JaredB985]

I'm writing this to check if there are more people that find themselves in my situation.

I'd like a Mac because I prefer macOS over Windows (especially Windows 11, which is a mess). I'd use the device for work, which is office stuff (Word, Excel, tons of Safari tabs, etc.), and I need portability because I travel, but I also work a lot from home where I have my preferred setup.

Historically, the MBA was the best device for this, but I feel there's a gap between the MBA and the MBP. For comfort, I use two large external monitors at home, and having used other devices with higher refresh rates, 60hz tires my eyes more.

I appreciate how Apple Silicaon has been a tremendous jump in efficiency and power, but I don't think I can take full advantage of that power: in my setup, the most demanding factor is having two external monitors plus the one in the laptop.

The M3 has been released and the MBA still supports 1 external display and does not support 120hz. Since I don't edit video or any of the other cool things you guys typically talk about, I don't think all of these jumps in processing power apply to me.

I don't think I need to mention that I don't need a MBP either. It's heavier and it's designed for way more demanding tasks. I wish Apple would design the MBA to allow users like me apply that power for a better viewing experience (120hz) and another external display. If I remember correctly, the Intel MBAs did allow multiple displays, so the Apple Silicon MBAs should be able to handle it (I'm not an expert in chips, so maybe I'm wrong.)

Sorry for the long rant, but after 3 Apple Silicon MBAs I still feel there's no room for me in the lineup, and I really don't want a Windows 11 machine, nor an overly powerful machine that's too heavy (a MBP feels like getting a Ferrari just for something silly like extra leg room.)

Also, do you think these limitations are purely for commercial purposes or is there a real technical reason? I guess I'll have to wait until M4...

Thanks for reading.

Just buy a docking station...? You really not think about that?

 

[StoneJack]

just buy MBP.
problem solved

 

[ascender]

I know there is cynicism about the external monitor support being a money-making thing from Apple, but I don't think its an unreasonable assumption to make, that if you need to run more screens, you have to buy the Pro. I think its a reasonable product distinction to have between the two lines.

As for the 120Hz screen - if you need it, you need to buy the Pro anyway. But if you don't need it, the screen on the Air is really nice. I only notice the difference if I go back and forth between an Air and a Pro. I quickly get used to whatever screen I'm using.

 

[Janichsan]

The M3 has been released and the MBA still supports 1 external display and does not support 120hz.

In clamshell mode, the M3 MBA supports two external displays with 144 Hz at 4K for the primary display and 100 Hz at 4k for the secondary display.