Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
It runs on the Epic Unreal engine! They‘ll appreciate your support
That’s the same as saying, Samsung will be thankful that you did not by a Samsung and bought an Apple instead as Samsung makes the displays. However, still Samsung tries to sell more phones than Apple as it is more profitable.
 
it's not up to Apple to dictate prices

Errr, what? This most definitely requires either a citation or withdrawal.

You can argue many aspects as to the moral right or wrong of the App Store, but I’ve never ever heard of any circumstance when dapple tells a developer where price their app should be.

The only price restriction I can find is which of the 90 price tiers the app should be in (hence why you don’t find apps price at $3.76 for example).

Aside from that, unless you can prove - with citations - that Apple have required developers to arbitrarily change a different price outside of the tier (other than for either tax or FX reasons) you should retract this statement that I believe to be a blatant lie.
 
  • Like
Reactions: idiiamots
My Tesla has an operating system that runs on the center console. It only supports Spotify. Spotify is different than The Tesla. Therefore Apple can sue Tesla for not supporting Apple Music?

Your leap from point 1 to point 2 is missing a lot of steps, and makes no legal sense.
I would love to have Apple Music on my Tesla or better yet, CarPlay. However, I agree. It’s not something I think Tesla should be sued to allow. But hey, lawyers gotta make a buck I guess.
Where does all this end? Sue Motorola because I can’t play Fortnight on my flip phone? Sue my bank I think because my ATM fee is to high?
 
f.lux was rejected because of „to weird“ and now is a feature of iOS.
No it wasn't "Currently, iOS does not allow developers to access the Private APIs we need to make f.lux work on iOS." - f.lux

Apple's stated that not accessing the Priatte APIs "was to protect against any changes in the API that could render an App dysfunctional." ie they are things Apple may stop support or may abandon in a future patch.

One of the reasons 1980s-1990s Mac and Windows software had problems was programers took advantage of undocumented APIs (the Private APIs of their day) and di other things you weren't supposed to do. So when the OS got an update the software broke and Apple/Microsoft got the flack rather than the developer for being what amounted to a lazy twit.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: MacCheetah3 and SqB
It doesn’t have to be illegal to not be enforceable. Contracts are supposed to be “meetings of the minds” between two approximately evenly matched parties that hash out the individual terms. But most contracts today are what are called “contracts of adhesion” where one side writes the full contract out and the other party just signs it. Just about any contract that you have probably signed with a retailer. Since the contract is written by only one side not all the terms are enforceable and terms that are ambiguous are always interpreted against the side that drafted the contract. Whether a term is enforceable depends if a court thinks it is reasonable and not unduly unfair.
There is a huge difference between contracts governed by consumer protection laws (business to consumer) and contracts between businesses (business to business). If a business signs a contract, that's it. (Yes, ambiguous terms are interpreted against the side that drafted the contract; I'd hope that Apple's lawyers are good enough not to put ambiguous terms into these contracts).
 
That’s the same as saying, Samsung will be thankful that you did not by a Samsung and bought an Apple instead as Samsung makes the displays. However, still Samsung tries to sell more phones than Apple as it is more profitable.

no it’s not. You said you were boycotting Epic by downloading and playing PUBG, another Epic “unreal engine” game.

as to your post, Samsung make money on their own phones and on Apple iPhones
 
Prove that. Certainly there are consequences of such regulations - less interoperability, the hazard of overchoice, consumer confusion, race-to-the-bottom in support, etc.

So prove that the regulations you refer to are a net benefit to me.

the auto market.
the tech market.
the food market.
the textiles market.
absulotely any market I’ve not already mentioned.

come back with a better idea buddy.
 
the auto market.
the tech market.
the food market.
the textiles market.
absulotely any market I’ve not already mentioned.

come back with a better idea buddy.
The auto market is a great counter example. The laws on car companies not owning car dealers have made things demonstrably worse for consumers.

and just mentioning the names of industries without explanation doesn’t “prove” anything. Please explain.
 
So I then argue, how is Apple running a monopoly?

If Acme Industries creates a brand new Smartphone platform tomorrow, based on neither Apple nor Google, and, as a result has a dedicated App Store; would that be classed by you as a monopoly?

If no, then what’s the break even point? When does an exclusive become a monopoly?

Can you come up with an argument about how you’ll be in any way worse off with competitors to the App Store on iOS?

You have to admit your stance is pretty odd. Apple wouldn’t piss on you (for free) if you were on fire and here you are defending them, to your own detriment. Come back with some sort of coherent justification of your position.
 
I always avoided ordering on Amazon as much I can, I usually seek local "offline" stores, but I admit corona forced me to buy a few more stuff online, because all the local offline stores were closed, but I rarely ordered on Amazon.

Very civic minded of you. Glad you are willing to pay more to support your local businesses.

Now, since the local offline stores re-opened, I avoid online shopping even more, to support these local "offline" stores, this helps to keep people employed. Yes local offline shops prices are often higher than online prices, but i don't want to end in a abandoned city, that's one my contributions and can't be wrong.

We go to local restaurants for the same reason.

2 Amazon: It's not about higher or lower prices, Amazon should not dictate any prices, it's up to the seller to set prices and up to the customer to buy it or not. But thats just one of the issues.

Amazon is a retailer, they act just like every other retailer and set their prices, and pay their suppliers.

2 Apple: More or less the same, it's not up to Apple to dictate prices, as they currently also do. Apple goes even further and also dictates, that you're not allowed to offer cheaper prices on your own non-apple related website. But that's just one of the issues, too.

Apple does neither of the things you just said they do. They do not set the prices on the App Store, the developer does. Apple takes a percentage of whatever the developer has chosen to charge. Also, Apple does not prohibit cross platform products from selling at lower prices through their own stores (for in app purchases). They only prohibit advertising that your in the iOS/iPadOS/tvOS/WatchOS apps.

Epic already sell V-bucks through their own store (at a slight discount). Epic can advertise this on their own store, and on ads anywhere else they want, just not in other companies’ stores.

Both companies facing antitrust for good, and I hope both companies faceplants and break all their teeths.

Just those two, or Google (the actual monopoly on search and web advertising), MicroSoft, Nintendo and Sony? Given that you do not use any Apple products, and that they have such a small market share in almost every market in which they sell, why do you care about them? You are clearly not in the U.S., so it is quite likely that Apple has less than a 20% share in your country. Why does it matter to you at all what a company with so little influence on your life does? Is this just envy?

And what I hate most, are these people who goes to a local "offline" store, checks something out, a gadget whatever, then goes away and order it online, because it's 5-10€ cheaper there. That's just asocial.

That is why most stores now price match. We often do the opposite. Look on Amazon to figure out which product and then go to Best Buy to purchase it.
 
  • Like
Reactions: MacCheetah3
The auto market is a great counter example. The laws on car companies not owning car dealers have made things demonstrably worse for consumers.

and just mentioning the names of industries without explanation doesn’t “prove” anything. Please explain.

feel free to come back with a market where the consumer hasn’t benefited from competition.
 
Can you come up with an argument about how you’ll be in any way worse off with competitors to the App Store on iOS?

You have to admit your stance is pretty odd. Apple wouldn’t piss on you (for free) if you were on fire and here you are defending them, to your own detriment. Come back with some sort of coherent justification of your position.
I’ve previously stated one reason i’d be worse off. Since apps sold in those other stores would have to be actually able to RUN on ios, that would mean a weakling of the certificate/provisioning security model used to ensure that only apps that Apple has approved and which are unmodified from the version submitted by the developers to the App Store can run. Whatever the new mechanism is, the laws of cryptography tell us that this introduces a new attack vector.

Then imagine that Apple modifies the operating system to provide new features for developers who sell apps through apple’s App Store. As a result of these changes, apps sold by Joe’s crApp Store stop working. Now Joe sues Apple, and Apple gets gunshy about dropping support for out-of-date SDKs. So the OS slowly becomes decrepit and Android/Windows-like.

So there are two reasons right there why we’d be worse off.

Now, again, prove that somehow we’d be better off. It can’t be that prices will come down - after all, 85% of apps are free, and the rest are 10x cheaper than pre-App Store (and no different in price than on Android, where this “freedom” exists). It can’t be that we’d meaningfully have “more choices” of apps, because those who care about such things would be on Android anyway. So what possible plausible advantage does this bring other than introducing chaos?
 
  • Like
Reactions: Maximara
You know that's fake right? You can't install/use any android apk on iphone.
Top 7 Best Android Emulators For iOS (iPhone and iPads) in 2020
  • iAndroid.
  • Alien Dalvik Emulator.
  • GBA4iOS. Android Emulator for iOS, iPhone and iPad.
  • iNDS.
  • NDS4iOS.
  • ApowerMirror. Android Apps and Games on iOS and iPhone.
  • Bluestacks Android Emulator.
There there is "Android Emulator is nothing but an awesome application which helps iPhone and iPod user to have all the functions, usability, app and features without Android Smartphone."

I can research proof faster then you and cough up unsupported Know Nothing nonsense.
 
feel free to come back with a market where the consumer hasn’t benefited from competition.
I just did. Go buy a car and deal with car dealers. Now compare that to buying from Tesla, who circumvented those laws. Which is a better experience?

You’ve provided NO evidence other than listing industries without explanation - you don’t even say what government regulations that caused competition you are relying on. I keep providing actual evidence.

And the reason our approaches are different is because your argument is dead wrong.
[automerge]1598825248[/automerge]
Feel free to list instances where consumers have benefitted from a lack of competition, innovation and efficiency.

Forcing ”competition” doesn’t bring “innovation and efficiency.”
 
  • Like
Reactions: cyb3rdud3
Errr, what? This most definitely requires either a citation or withdrawal.

You can argue many aspects as to the moral right or wrong of the App Store, but I’ve never ever heard of any circumstance when dapple tells a developer where price their app should be.

The only price restriction I can find is which of the 90 price tiers the app should be in (hence why you don’t find apps price at $3.76 for example).

Aside from that, unless you can prove - with citations - that Apple have required developers to arbitrarily change a different price outside of the tier (other than for either tax or FX reasons) you should retract this statement that I believe to be a blatant lie.

Okay, they reverted it, still had this in memory.

Anyway, just proves how they like to abuse, it's their philosophy.
At least they reverted this one, the other ones will be reverted by law if they don't do freely.
 
That's 3rd party apps.
Nope. Third party services. Apple used to have their own AOL Instant Messenger client, and even had a special deal for people to use their Mac.com/Me.com addresses as AIM IDs. The client was completely Apple’s. Apple would pick the top 10 services and build clients for them and then build the other apps that people want. Developers would lose much more than Apple. I was on an iPhone before the App Store and the apps the only non-Apple app I have in the top 10 is Daily Yoga, which would just become a web app, or get replaced by Apple’s subscription fitness service.
 
  • Like
Reactions: cyb3rdud3
I just did. Go buy a car and deal with car dealers. Now compare that to buying from Tesla, who circumvented those laws. Which is a better experience?

You’ve provided NO evidence other than listing industries without explanation - you don’t even say what government regulations that caused competition you are relying on. I keep providing actual evidence.

And the reason our approaches are different is because your argument is dead wrong.
[automerge]1598825248[/automerge]


Forcing ”competition” doesn’t bring “innovation and efficiency.”

It’s not forcing competition, it’s opening the platform. Plenty of examples of that being a winner for all concerned.
 
....
Anyway, just proves how they like to abuse, it's their philosophy.
At least they reverted this one, the other ones will be reverted by law if they don't do freely.
By abuse, do you mean enforce their regulations so the app developers can’t take advantage of their customers?

It will be “reverted” by law if and when that event happens.
 
Would you also support Apple raising the subscription fee for xCode from 99 $/year to, let's say, 1 million?
Would it be better for developers? Maybe for Epic, maybe not so much for small developers.
So, your idea would just hurt small developers over big big developers... is that what you want?

how is sideloading bad for small developer?
 
I’ve previously stated one reason i’d be worse off. Since apps sold in those other stores would have to be actually able to RUN on ios, that would mean a weakling of the certificate/provisioning security model used to ensure that only apps that Apple has approved and which are unmodified from the version submitted by the developers to the App Store can run. Whatever the new mechanism is, the laws of cryptography tell us that this introduces a new attack vector.

Then imagine that Apple modifies the operating system to provide new features for developers who sell apps through apple’s App Store. As a result of these changes, apps sold by Joe’s crApp Store stop working. Now Joe sues Apple, and Apple gets gunshy about dropping support for out-of-date SDKs. So the OS slowly becomes decrepit and Android/Windows-like.

So there are two reasons right there why we’d be worse off.

Now, again, prove that somehow we’d be better off. It can’t be that prices will come down - after all, 85% of apps are free, and the rest are 10x cheaper than pre-App Store (and no different in price than on Android, where this “freedom” exists). It can’t be that we’d meaningfully have “more choices” of apps, because those who care about such things would be on Android anyway. So what possible plausible advantage does this bring other than introducing chaos?

Thats 2 great examples of c-list benefits. You’re absolutely correct with those and I endorse them both.

Of course they’re both entirely insignificant compared to the more prominent benefits of competition lowering prices, driving innovation and creating efficiencies.
 
I just did. Go buy a car and deal with car dealers. Now compare that to buying from Tesla, who circumvented those laws. Which is a better experience?

You’ve provided NO evidence other than listing industries without explanation - you don’t even say what government regulations that caused competition you are relying on. I keep providing actual evidence.

And the reason our approaches are different is because your argument is dead wrong.
[automerge]1598825248[/automerge]


Forcing ”competition” doesn’t bring “innovation and efficiency.”
Tesla’s a great example of innovation and market disruption leading to advances and efficiencies, I welcome them to the argument. Now let’s have competing innovative efficient app stores on iOS.
 
Nope. Third party services. Apple used to have their own AOL Instant Messenger client, and even had a special deal for people to use their Mac.com/Me.com addresses as AIM IDs. The client was completely Apple’s. Apple would pick the top 10 services and build clients for them and then build the other apps that people want. Developers would lose much more than Apple. I was on an iPhone before the App Store and the apps the only non-Apple app I have in the top 10 is Daily Yoga, which would just become a web app, or get replaced by Apple’s subscription fitness service.
They didn't build google maps, stop. Google had complete control on what features apple could have.
 
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.