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Locked in how? Since when did you become so dramatic? As I recall, you used to be reasonable.

Simple. IF Apple decides to lower their iPod line to a smaller size what choices do I have because of Fairplay DRM? I have to stick with Apple because all my DRM tracks can't be transfered over to a competitors device. OR can't be without losing already marginal quality. (Read: Burn to CD and rip is not an option.) I'm reasonable as long as Apple remains reasonable. Dropping their current iPod storage space by that much is not reasonable.
 
My prediction

I predict that, eventually, iPods will be surgically implanted with direct connections to the visual and auditory processing centers of our brains. You will be able to hear a song or watch a video simply by thinking about it. The only external evidence will be a small plastic circle on your forehead--the cover for the Bluetooth and wi-fi antennae.
 
I don't like streaming. All of my streaming experiences have been poor.

I don’t like streaming either, but at this point we’re only considering it in this context because a string of hypothetical things may happen. If Apple moves to flash by the end of 2007. If the capacity is smaller, which as suggested, they may not be if multiple drives are combined. If they rely on Wifi for streaming.

In any case, it would be surprising if they went that route with iPods if the streaming it relied on had the same drawbacks that plague other applications of streaming.

If you have an iPhone (ATN :) )

Rocketman, what’s up with your persistent use of that acronym for the iPhone? I do love nearly everything you say on MR. But it seems brutal and unfair to use such an acronym without giving ignorant readers, like myself, any hint as to what each of the letters represent.

If I used the acronym NMDA for N-methyl-D-aspartic acid and if I, as convention dictates, used it in full (defined the acronym), everything would be cool for the rest of that post. But if I made a new post I would have to say again, N-methyl-D-aspartic acid (NMDA), instead of just using it or without clarifying what the relationship between the two is.

WHEN wimax fully arrives and is deployed we will have, nearly free, always on, internet in our hands, everywhere, with near brodnand speeds.

Will we see WiMAX before CDMA2000 and UMTS? It seems like a pretty serious trickle down will have to take place before it’s widely deployed. And certainly a while before it’s in any iPod. Why nearly free?

Just like usenet, email, quicktime and web pages.

Rocketman

/= streaming

Why always sign your posts? Isn’t the space that says Rocketman macrumors 6502 and shows your avatar enough? Plus it smacks of immodesty. Perhaps rocket scientists don’t like applying the principle of redundancy reduction to their personal communications.
 
while i do agree longer battery life is important I believe having variety on my iPod is my main feature i like. I have a 60 gig and it is nice having my whole music library and a few movies with me. I sure hope they don't abandon the non flash based iPods until they at least hit the 80 gig mark which i don't see happening for some time.
 
Rocketman, what’s up with your persistent use of that acronym for the iPhone? I do love nearly everything you say on MR. But it seems brutal and unfair to use such an acronym without giving ignorant readers, like myself, any hint as to what each of the letters represent.

If I used the acronym NMDA for N-methyl-D-aspartic acid and if I, as convention dictates, used it in full (defined the acronym), everything would be cool for the rest of that post. But if I made a new post I would have to say again, N-methyl-D-aspartic acid (NMDA), instead of just using it or without clarifying what the relationship between the two is.

ATN = Apple, Tablet, Nano
 
ATN = Apple, Tablet, Nano

Please, everyboady, stop using "ATN". Everything from iPhone to :apple: Phone to "the thing they showed at MacWorld" is fine. But the ATN Acronym is just wrong, it's not a Tablet (no stylus) and too big to be called a Nano.
 
Apple will not do this until Flash has caugh up more significantly with Micro HDD on $/gb and probably gb/sq in. Micro HDD still destroys flash when it comes to these things. Sure speed is an issue, as is reliability, but no one is going to pay $3000 for a 32GB Flash iPod for the sole advantages of quicker song loading, higher reliability, and 3 mm thinner.

-Clive
 
Please, everyboady, stop using "ATN". Everything from iPhone to :apple: Phone to "the thing they showed at MacWorld" is fine. But the ATN Acronym is just wrong, it's not a Tablet (no stylus) and too big to be called a Nano.

I was just answering jhedges question.

People seem to think of the iPhone as an ATN from what I've read and as I understand it, this is why the acronym was adopted.

Personally I think it's fine to use it. But, it's becoming tiresome that so many people are using the acronym, without explaining what it means.
 
Please, everyboady, stop using "ATN". Everything from iPhone to :apple: Phone to "the thing they showed at MacWorld" is fine. But the ATN Acronym is just wrong, it's not a Tablet (no stylus) and too big to be called a Nano.

People just want to make it what it isn't. They want a Mac Tablet so bad that they're desperate. Thus they change the name of the already existing product, iPhone, to reflect their desparity.

-Clive
 
I would rather see a large 40-80 gig hardrive drastically cheaper than a flash based iPod :)

Well, if the iPod does indeed transition to flash then you should be able to pick up a HD pod much cheaper.

That's my plan, actually - wait until the current iPods are superseded by a full-video or flash (or both) pod and then buy one of the current models at close-out price.
 
Well, if the iPod does indeed transition to flash then you should be able to pick up a HD pod much cheaper.

That's my plan, actually - wait until the current iPods are superseded by a full-video or flash (or both) pod and then buy one of the current models at close-out price.

The current price on refurbed 30gb 5G's is already close to rock bottom close out. $180 for a unit that was $299 originally it pretty cheap. I was going to hold out for the 6G to get a 5G as well, but decided they weren't going to get that much cheaper than they already are. Lowest I could see the 30GB is $149...
 
I was just answering jhedges question.

People seem to think of the iPhone as an ATN from what I've read and as I understand it, this is why the acronym was adopted.

Personally I think it's fine to use it. But, it's becoming tiresome that so many people are using the acronym, without explaining what it means.

What's tiresome is one particular user using it over and over again in a desperate attempt to extend his 15 minutes of fame...

sosumi :rolleyes:
 
Steve Jobs himself said just the other day in his anti-DRM manifesto that Apple's research indicates most iPods are nearly full. The solution is more capacity, not less. MacRumors states this analyst doesn't have a good track record. However, I suspect the introduction of a widescreen/touchscreen Video iPod with 80GB/120GB hard drives would allow Apple to "reinvent" the current iPod using NAND Flash and a thinner, slightly smaller case while retaining the same screen.

Holiday 2007:

iPod Shuffle- 2 GB (FLASH)
iPod Nano- 8,16 GB (FLASH)
iPhone 8,16 GB (FLASH)
iPod Classic (same as 5.5G) 80,120 GB (HDD)
iPod (6G- touchscreen) 32 GB (FLASH)
 
Even if I don't have (much) videos, I currently use 30GB for my Music... I wound't like to be forced to bring two iPods on vacation... :( ;)

Same problem here. If I am anywhere near enough my collection that I can stream it, I won't be watching it on my iPod. The value of an iPod for me is to make my collection portable. Not some small portion of my collection, not the favorites in my collection, but my whole collection - or near enough to my whole collection that I don't notice the missing bits.

A nano or shuffle is great for a jog, but I want something more for long plane rides, 2 week business trips and vacations.
 
It's fine that Apple wants to work more with flash, they should be, it is the future, but they can't give up their harddrive ipods either cuz right now flash doesnt have the capability to hold the archive of music people want. Apple needs to be able to do both, possilby give more options, maybe get ride of the 2 gig flash and just make 4 8 and 16 gig or somehing like that
 
a 32 GB iPod for $2499? It better be able to play movies like the holodeck in Star Trek for that much! I'm sure you mean $249, right?

No. He meant $2499, referring to the price of flash memory. Flash can't replace hard drives until the cost per gigabyte comes down. And by then, hard drive will be cheaper too. Flash has a lot going for it, but cost (as compared to rotating memory) is not one of them.

Chris
 
a 32 GB iPod for $2499? It better be able to play movies like the holodeck in Star Trek for that much! I'm sure you mean $249, right?

Sarcasm, people, sarcasm. Go read "A Modest Proposal" by Jonathan Swift, then come back.
 
No. He meant $2499, referring to the price of flash memory. Flash can't replace hard drives until the cost per gigabyte comes down. And by then, hard drive will be cheaper too. Flash has a lot going for it, but cost (as compared to rotating memory) is not one of them.

Chris

A 32 GB flash card costs $2499?!? :eek: That's a lot! I know I can get a 2 GB USB flasg drive at Microcenter for like $40, so I'm just really surprised by how steep the price curve gets for 32 GB.

Edit: just looked www.dealram.com and saw that an 8 GB compact flash card is $89 and a 16 GB Compactflash card is $589. Holy guacamole! (I work at an elementary school so I have to watch my language.) Geez! Usually on that site, when you double the size of a flash drive, you double the cost plus or minus a few bucks. But that's more than 5x the cost! I just didn't know that. You learn something everyday. Maybe Apple can cut costs by having 4 8 GB flash cards or something?
 
I don’t like streaming either, but at this point we’re only considering it in this context because a string of hypothetical things may happen. If Apple moves to flash by the end of 2007. If the capacity is smaller, which as suggested, they may not be if multiple drives are combined. If they rely on Wifi for streaming.

It comes down to differentiating between three things here:

1. Live streaming (almost always sucks)
2. Live down load with local cache (similar to how Quicktime, iTV works)
3. Load slow, play fast (Bluetooth, wifi, wimax, edge, firewire, usb, ethernet) (iPod).

Current large capacity iPods assume you need your entire music collection on the PORTABLE device.

Current iPod Nano's assume your main collection is on another device and you load "playlists" onto the portable device occasionally. This paradigm is what Apple is gravitating toward on all portable devices. I endorse it too.

A third option is a device whose local storage is used only for cache (Quicktime model), so you can, say, play enough content to consume most of your batery life and not much less, or maybe only offer skip protection of 20-60 minutes.


Rocketman, what’s up with your persistent use of that acronym for the iPhone? I do love nearly everything you say on MR. But it seems brutal and unfair to use such an acronym without giving ignorant readers, like myself, any hint as to what each of the letters represent.

I made a post some time ago in another thread where people were complaining abot the price of the iPhone. I pointed out that iPhone, while the marketing name of the device, is only ONE application on a multi-application device which ships with several killer applications. More later. This is a new "ecosystem". Mac was an "ecosystem" with numerous hardware and feature implementations over the years. iPod was an "ecosystem" which while more closed was the basis for several device implementations.

iPhone as a multi-aplication device with a "new" OS and justifies an "ecosystem catagory".

I called it ATN for Apple Tablet Nano. I happen to like literal, descriptive names. Nobody has "adopted" my "coined term", although I would have no objection to it. It serves my very self-centered purpose of enlightening those readers in the know about the term, the iPhone is WAYYY more than a mere iPhone. It is a PORTABLE, HANDHELD, TABLET FORMAT device with MULTI-TOUCH operation and WIRELESS access via Wifi 802.11 presumably a,b,f,n now and Wimax 802.16 later, bluetooth and a dock.

So ATN=Apple Tablet Nano.

That top level description of this first implementation within an ecosystem implies there might be a second, and a third, etc. I have been stating ATNN Apple Tablet Not Nano is what we saw with the bottom CD patent and the announcements by Seagate of microdrives with 80 and 120 gb capacities. I could be wrong. Apple sold Asteroid when it was disclosed.

Will we see WiMAX before CDMA2000 and UMTS? It seems like a pretty serious trickle down will have to take place before it’s widely deployed. And certainly a while before it’s in any iPod. Why nearly free?

Why always sign your posts? Isn’t the space that says Rocketman macrumors 6502 and shows your avatar enough? Plus it smacks of immodesty. Perhaps rocket scientists don’t like applying the principle of redundancy reduction to their personal communications.

The cellular protocols you cite are already deployed but only regionally due to proprietary issues. Wimax is an open standard several carriers, Sprint included, have stated they would deploy next to cellular since the ranges are similar to analog cellular, albiet at higher data bitrates and better overall bandwidth.

I sign my posts probably because it is a holdover from usenet and email. Call it a habbit. I have been on the internet since 1992 and online before that as early as 1981. I am old and stuck in my ways. Sorry.

Rocketman

no sig file here :)
 
I made a post some time ago in another thread where people were complaining abot the price of the iPhone. I pointed out that iPhone, while the marketing name of the device, is only ONE application on a multi-application device which ships with several killer applications. More later. This is a new "ecosystem". Mac was an "ecosystem" with numerous hardware and feature implementations over the years. iPod was an "ecosystem" which while more closed was the basis for several device implementations.

iPhone as a multi-aplication device with a "new" OS and justifies an "ecosystem catagory".

I respectfully disagree. If Apple had made the iPhone the new Newton, and sold it in a few configurations - say, The Newton which would be like the iPhone we have now, minus the cell phone integration, The Newton iPod edition which would be the same as the regular Newton, but with a 30gb HDD and the thicker/larger form factor that would need, and the Newton iPhone edition, which would be what the iPhone is now - then I would agree that it needs a whole new classification for what it is.

As it is, Apple has completely linked the iPhone to a cellular PHONE service/plan. As such, it's a cell phone. It's a nice one, with some really cool PDA like and iPod like features, but none the less it is a PHONE. Period. Not an PDA. Not a tablet computer. Not anything but a really cool cell phone. Deal with it. The fact that there COULD be a product which is similar to the iPhone but isn't doesn't mean you can classify the iPhone as anything but a phone.
 
a 32 GB iPod for $2499? It better be able to play movies like the holodeck in Star Trek for that much! I'm sure you mean $249, right?

Estimated cost of flash to Apple is $10 per GB, so $320 for 32GB. Apple wants to make profit, sales people want to make profit, taxman wants his cut, so make it $640 for the end user. Or $480 more than a current 8GB iPod.
 
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