Apple to Hire 4,000 Employees in Hyderabad, India to Work on Maps Development

[PinkyMacGodess]

More places to hide money from Uncle Sam?

India seems like an odd place, especially considering that the H-1B Visa program is so abused and overused. I worked on a project with a big ten (eleven?) university that brought in something like 80 people from India to work on the project. They were nice enough people, but they worked all hours, and weekends too. I never found out what they had for a contract, but if it was for a set time to get it done, I can see them wanting to hurry it along. Supposedly one of the leads had a family emergency back home, and flew back, and was back in something like three days. I didn't know you could get there and back that quickly.

Others made fun of them, but I could see the writing on the wall. They were our replacements! Such was the truth. This was in the early/mid-nineties. Try to get someone without an Indian accent when calling Microsoft. Google the H-1B Visa Program, and read about how Spencer Abraham rode that from obscurity to fame in the 'Job Killing Department' of the then republican party. The Chamber of Horrors LOVED him...

 

[bladerunner2000]

No, reality a fact and twisting things to ones viewpoint

Why only chastise Apple?

Because this is an Apple forum? Duh.
[doublepost=1463694572][/doublepost]

And how about google not giving a damn who already has 6,500 employees in Hyderabad alone, and will soon be doubling that. Right... google along with loads of other US companies in India "hate" America too. You are aggressively taking them to task as well, right?

This isn't about Google. Stop trying to change the stop. This is about Apple being scumbags and nobody caring enough to call them out on their greed.

 

[PinkyMacGodess]

Maybe! But hey... Apple don't care!

As much as it hurts me to say it, even at 'dirt wages', American programmers are far too expensive. Seriously.

With overtime, benefits, hours, attitude, it's hard to find good domestic help 'cheap'.

Now, if they didn't have to pay more than $50 a day, and 'benefits' were a Keurig machine that you brought in pods for, and you worked, willingly, 10 to 12 hour days, and six to seven days a week, Apple might think about hiring more American programmers.

Free Trade Isn't Free. It gave the 'job creators' an untapped market of slave labor on other third world countries, and there is absolutely no way that American programmers can compete for much of that work. Heck, my sister is a programmer by training, and she works for a corporation doing nothing but as a 'liaison' between the India based programmers and their American based QA group. Funny, she went there to help setup a QA department there, and after spending two weeks there, they yanked her back and scrubbed the idea. The just hired a few more QA engineers, and they had to pretty much work the daylight times of India so they could 'liaison' with them in 'real time' rather than having to see what they got done, and have to play voicemail tag to get changes done.

One day, her whole department, except for a few people, including her, were canned. She became the number one QA engineer and the supervisor of what was left. And I thought I had it bad at the university...

Cheers...

 

[Kabeyun]

Basing your narrative on a lie tends to negate any credibility. Sticking to facts makes it seem more like imparting information instead of pushing an agenda.

Says you.

 

[69Mustang]

Says you.

No. Says facts. That portion of your statement I quoted was a blatant untruth. That is, unless you have any supporting evidence to back it up.

 

[Kabeyun]

No. Says facts. That portion of your statement I quoted was a blatant untruth. That is, unless you have any supporting evidence to back it up.

15-second first pass. I'm sure I can find more without breaking sweat.

http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2012/10/how-much-do-google-and-facebook-profit-from-your-data/

Also:
http://www.forbes.com/sites/parmyol...cal-governments-track-its-users/#29f924f51db6

https://moz.com/blog/the-evil-side-of-google-exploring-googles-user-data-collection

http://www.salon.com/2014/02/05/4_w...ing_privacy_and_collecting_your_data_partner/

http://www.theguardian.com/commenti...orations-google-should-not-sell-customer-data

http://m.imore.com/giving-up-on-google

http://mobile.nytimes.com/2013/03/1...ays-fine-over-street-view-privacy-breach.html

I can keep going all day.

 

[weup togo]

We've been living in economically global market for decades. Companies pay tax where that money is earned, according to the laws in that country. That is not tax dodging, no more than a company setting up it's "headquarters" in Delaware because of that state's friendly business laws and tax.

I would expect a multi-national company like Apple to have employees around the world. Again, I don't know what is so scandalous about that concept. Do all you people complaining about this also irk you that BMW makes all but one of it's SUV/SAVs in S.C. or that VW has a plant in TN or Kia in GA or Mercedes in AL providing thousands of jobs for people there and related parts suppliers, transport companies, and helps to sustain the local economy in those respective plant's towns?

Get over it. There are no borders in commerce. If you put up barriers then you are going to lose a lot of products that are not naturally available in the U.S. That is not only an inconvenience, but will result in lower employment and a worsening of the economy.

Now whether this is a smart move remains a question. Honestly I do wonder if Apple can't get something as "simple" as Maps right after 3 years (recall Apple chose to ditch Google Maps before it's contract expired) then how does anyone expect them to have a production ready car out by 2020?

This isn't about politics or race or labor laws. It is about Apple's engineering culture. Nothing personal, but all of your arguments here are irrelevant.

That culture already took a huge hit when the iPhone ramped in absolute secrecy and then, once public, went on an epic hiring binge. Scott Forstall went around bragging that he ran the fastest growing startup in silicon valley; he was referring to iOS. The problem with that is they still lived in their secret silo, and were told they were God's gift, but they never had any exposure to the rest of the company.

Fast forward to today where you have an iOS QA org that is more than 80% former retail 'geniuses' with no engineering background, let alone QA experience. But they sure are grateful to finally be at the mothership, so they work themselves to death, confusing working hard for doing good work. And these folks think they are the cream of the crop because that's how iOS started behind closed doors. Unfortunately for them, working hard doesn't make up for terrible decisions. The quality of products has suffered as a result.

Now if it's that hard to maintain continuity of culture with people who work in the same building, there is absolutely no credible argument that can be made that anything remotely like Apple's culture will magically be transferred half way around the world.

There are a few good engineers trained in India, but the other negative commenters are correct about that workforce. Their quasi-British educational system turns out hordes of people who can spew rote facts, but lack the most basic capacity for creative problem solving. And they'll lie to your face to get what they want. Only the very cream of India's CS schools even have a shot at making it into America. Whatever is left behind in Hyderabad is not worth hiring, and absolutely is not up to Apple's standards.

 

[Thunderhawks]

Because this is an Apple forum? Duh.
[doublepost=1463694572][/doublepost]

This isn't about Google. Stop trying to change the stop. This is about Apple being scumbags and nobody caring enough to call them out on their greed.

So, a fact gets discarded, because you say so and want to be Apple centric?

Apple hiring 4,000 people in India is a strategic move to get into that country expand the markets they sell to
and do business.

Who are you to decide what is greed? You don't know the profit margins, the R&D percentages, distribution advertising , in short you know nothing about Apples cost structure.

The fact that Apple makes a lot of money is due to the market tier they decided to be in and they make good products. (Lately a little long in the tooth, or not what I need)

If you want to tell me that if you had a product that costs you $ 100 and you could sell it for $ 500 easily and all day long, but you wouldn't do that to not appear greedy you are not honest!

If Apple galls you so much, just stop buying their products and go to the other guys who also produce offshore are in China and will be in India, Africa (not yet)

The entire eco structure has shifted to Far East and you can think the politicians.

Apple is only one of many protecting their $$ and wanting to make more, oh wait ,can't mention anybody else.

 

[PaulRustad007]

India will not allow Apple to sell refurbished products in their country...they are on Made in India kick at the moment, so Apple is opening up there, software and Foxconn will open a building facility and they will make iphones for India in India. That is the only way Apple is to compete when the Indian Govt says they will not allow to sell unless.......

 

[RockSpider]

And then saves it in Google HQ as part of a progressively richer profile of who you are, what you like, where you go, and who you know, to be used to sell you things and sold to other people who also want to know these things about you.

Google's entire reason for being is the accumulation of data. Apple's is to build products. Follow the money. Yes, Siri has flaws, but I'll take my privacy over a more convenient feature every time. Especially these days.

Okay, so when I search for something online on my iPad why is it that, that same item keeps coming up in advertising on my iPad.

 

[konqueror4u]

This isn't about politics or race or labor laws. It is about Apple's engineering culture. Nothing personal, but all of your arguments here are irrelevant.

That culture already took a huge hit when the iPhone ramped in absolute secrecy and then, once public, went on an epic hiring binge. Scott Forstall went around bragging that he ran the fastest growing startup in silicon valley; he was referring to iOS. The problem with that is they still lived in their secret silo, and were told they were God's gift, but they never had any exposure to the rest of the company.

Fast forward to today where you have an iOS QA org that is more than 80% former retail 'geniuses' with no engineering background, let alone QA experience. But they sure are grateful to finally be at the mothership, so they work themselves to death, confusing working hard for doing good work. And these folks think they are the cream of the crop because that's how iOS started behind closed doors. Unfortunately for them, working hard doesn't make up for terrible decisions. The quality of products has suffered as a result.

Now if it's that hard to maintain continuity of culture with people who work in the same building, there is absolutely no credible argument that can be made that anything remotely like Apple's culture will magically be transferred half way around the world.

There are a few good engineers trained in India, but the other negative commenters are correct about that workforce. Their quasi-British educational system turns out hordes of people who can spew rote facts, but lack the most basic capacity for creative problem solving. And they'll lie to your face to get what they want. Only the very cream of India's CS schools even have a shot at making it into America. Whatever is left behind in Hyderabad is not worth hiring, and absolutely is not up to Apple's standards.

I am sure Apple knows how to identify talented engineers better than you and me. They will find the people they need in India. Never underestimate anybody. Negative commentators here might have done few hiring mistakes which might have landed them in trouble we cannot blame talent of a whole country. If we are hiring some body we should have the capability to judge and hire the right one. If we have hired some one who is not good we need to know that he is our own choice and we should also realize that we are not good at identifying and hiring good engineers. if we are not capable we should accept it before blaming others.

 

[bladerunner2000]

So, a fact gets discarded, because you say so and want to be Apple centric?

Apple hiring 4,000 people in India is a strategic move to get into that country expand the markets they sell to
and do business.

Who are you to decide what is greed? You don't know the profit margins, the R&D percentages, distribution advertising , in short you know nothing about Apples cost structure.

The fact that Apple makes a lot of money is due to the market tier they decided to be in and they make good products. (Lately a little long in the tooth, or not what I need)

If you want to tell me that if you had a product that costs you $ 100 and you could sell it for $ 500 easily and all day long, but you wouldn't do that to not appear greedy you are not honest!

If Apple galls you so much, just stop buying their products and go to the other guys who also produce offshore are in China and will be in India, Africa (not yet)

The entire eco structure has shifted to Far East and you can think the politicians.

Apple is only one of many protecting their $$ and wanting to make more, oh wait ,can't mention anybody else.

Just, wow.

 

[69Mustang]

15-second first pass. I'm sure I can find more without breaking sweat.

http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2012/10/how-much-do-google-and-facebook-profit-from-your-data/

Also:
http://www.forbes.com/sites/parmyol...cal-governments-track-its-users/#29f924f51db6

https://moz.com/blog/the-evil-side-of-google-exploring-googles-user-data-collection

http://www.salon.com/2014/02/05/4_w...ing_privacy_and_collecting_your_data_partner/

http://www.theguardian.com/commenti...orations-google-should-not-sell-customer-data

http://m.imore.com/giving-up-on-google

http://mobile.nytimes.com/2013/03/1...ays-fine-over-street-view-privacy-breach.html

I can keep going all day.

You could go on all day and still be dead wrong. Not one of the articles you linked claims this: "...and sold to other people who also want to know these things about you." You are trying to say collecting data and using it to anonymously sell ad space is selling customer data. That simply isn't true. If you don't know the difference, I'm not sure what to say. Advertisers who buy the ad space have no idea who you, me, or any other customer is. But if you want to keep looking all day, by all means, find a credible article that claims Google sells customer data. Again, none of the ones you linked remotely make that claim. Should probably read the article instead of the titles though. They tend to be click bait.

 

[neutralguy]

All the genius bars are moving to India!

 

[Kabeyun]

Okay, so when I search for something online on my iPad why is it that, that same item keeps coming up in advertising on my iPad.

What search engine are you using?

 

[travwill]

Apples Building will be one of three. My company is in this one (part of it), Apple will take up the entire 2nd building (that is under construction here) almost, and the 3rd building will be multi-tenant again.

The building pictured is mainly Accenture & TCS, and a different style on other side of campus - but all together the 4 buildings make WaveRock.


-T

 

[jimbobb24]

When high taxes prevent businesses from bringing profits home, they spend that money elsewhere. It's too band. We are hurting ourselves with the highest corporate taxes in the world.
[doublepost=1463713114][/doublepost]

Apple should really set an example and open places like this in America instead of China & India. This is proof that trickle down economics do not work. You could give all the tax breaks in the world to big companies, and they'd still move their plants overseas for Cheap labor.

This is proof! We too can punish the evil corporations because they are not working for us. I hope we punish them so hard that we can join Venezuela in the beautiful future.

Apple would build this here if we didn't make America such a business hostile place. Don't worry - ito can get so much worse.

 

[tooltalk]

I think this is just the beginning of outsourcing their high cost US programmers. It will start with maps and iOS will follow. Step by step so that we accept it

According to the Times of India, 1 in every 3 Apple engineers are already Indians (as of 2014). You guys are two years too late.

... Apple filed 1,750 H-1B applications during the 10-year period 2001 to 2010, but the number increased sharply to 2,800 during 2011-13 ...

"About one-third of Apple's engineering headcount consists of Indians who are either on H-1B or on Green Card," said Pareekh Jain, principal analyst at HfS Research.

 

[Chupa Chupa]

This isn't about politics or race or labor laws. It is about Apple's engineering culture. Nothing personal, but all of your arguments here are irrelevant.

That culture already took a huge hit when the iPhone ramped in absolute secrecy and then, once public, went on an epic hiring binge. Scott Forstall went around bragging that he ran the fastest growing startup in silicon valley; he was referring to iOS. The problem with that is they still lived in their secret silo, and were told they were God's gift, but they never had any exposure to the rest of the company.

Fast forward to today where you have an iOS QA org that is more than 80% former retail 'geniuses' with no engineering background, let alone QA experience. But they sure are grateful to finally be at the mothership, so they work themselves to death, confusing working hard for doing good work. And these folks think they are the cream of the crop because that's how iOS started behind closed doors. Unfortunately for them, working hard doesn't make up for terrible decisions. The quality of products has suffered as a result.

Now if it's that hard to maintain continuity of culture with people who work in the same building, there is absolutely no credible argument that can be made that anything remotely like Apple's culture will magically be transferred half way around the world.

There are a few good engineers trained in India, but the other negative commenters are correct about that workforce. Their quasi-British educational system turns out hordes of people who can spew rote facts, but lack the most basic capacity for creative problem solving. And they'll lie to your face to get what they want. Only the very cream of India's CS schools even have a shot at making it into America. Whatever is left behind in Hyderabad is not worth hiring, and absolutely is not up to Apple's standards.

You actually make my point. Apple isn't the same company it was pre-iPhone. It's an order of magnitude larger. In fact it's one of the most valuable companies on planet earth. It can't continue to operate as it did in the past. No multinational company even half Apple's size has every engineer employee in one building, city, state, or country. Not MS, not Google, not Intel, not GE, not Disney.

I don't know where you went to business school but they taught you some unorthodox and odd principles on how to run a multinational company. Also you have zero idea how Apple will be utilizing the India hires. Apple never said they would be on the front line. Obviously they are up to Apple's standards for what it will task them for or it wouldn't have hired them. TC has too much on the line here.

And my original post was not based on politics. It was based on how multinational companies operate. Apple will never be what it was pre-iPhone. It's maintain sales in mature markets and continue to grow in new ones or bust.

 

[MacCurry]

Wow! The racist hate on this thread is incredible. Apple is only investing $25 million with RMSI. Up to 4,000 employees will be hired, but they will not be Apple employees, rather RMSI or other Indian IT companies who have a contract with Apple. It is an insignificant amount of investment for Apple, but brings a lot of PR goodwill to Apple in India that already has over $1 billion in revenue there without any retail presence.

Instead of beating up on Indian companies and Indians in general, for a paltry $25 million, why do we not see so much self-flagellation about Foxconn having tens of billions in contracts with Apple for all of our iDevices where skilled manufacturing has been done in China for nearly a decade now?

 

[FrozenDarkness]

i think it's funny that opening a company developing apple maps is seen as a tax dodge move. do you know how to dodge taxes? india is probably not the country for you to do so. I suggest some reading on the double irish tax invading network before thinking every country is a tax haven.

 

[weup togo]

I don't know where you went to business school but they taught you some unorthodox and odd principles on how to run a multinational company.

Apple University. You probably haven't heard of it.

 

[73CortinaV8]

------------

 

[vooke]

How much of butts will Apple kiss in India?

 

[swingerofbirch]

There is a way, get a Nexus phone ...

I actually got the Nexus 6 on black friday for $200. I love it. I haven't switched my SIM over to it. I keep debating about it. I have an iPhone 5s I've used as my phone for so long. The Nexus 6's Google Now stuff is great. Really good camera, although it's a bit buggy. It'll sometimes stop recording video randomly and sometimes says it can't connect to the camera. I use it around the house for browsing on WiFi. The Google Now page (the thing when you swipe to the left of the homescreen) is what I check first every day.