Apple Updates App Store Review Guidelines to Allow Streaming Game Services That Submit Each Game to the App Store [Updated]

[Physicsdummy]

Unless the Microsoft streaming games are being executed entirely off device and only rendering on the device, it’s consistent with Apple’s security posture to want to review the code.

As you stated, there's absolutely no code from the game being run on your device. As far your phone goes, watching a YouTube video and playing a Streaming game are exactly the same.

 

[happyprozak]

They are doing this with games and not with Netflix because they know games have DLC and micro transactions and they want their 30% on EVERYTHING!

You may certainly be right. The Verge article I read mentioned that gaming is the biggest sector of the app market and Apple may be aggressively protecting that territory.

I think another reason is that cloud gaming is not big and important at this time. They can get away with keeping cloud gaming off of their platform but they certainly couldn't do that with video or music streaming because too many people would switch to Android to get services like Spotify and Netflix.

 

[Piggie]

I think Apple needs to insist every web site submits itself for review before Safari will allow it to be displayed

 

[Ethosik]

Umm how would streaming what basically amounts to a YouTube video give you malware? Can we send out malware through H.265 format videos now?

Game - 4 hours into gameplay prompts for credit card details or some other social engineering tactic.

Movie 4 hours in does not prompt for any input in text format

 

[Physicsdummy]

I think another reason is that cloud gaming is not big and important at this time. They can get away with keeping cloud gaming off of their platform but they certainly couldn't do that with video or music streaming because too many people would switch to Android to get services like Spotify and Netflix.

Getting there though, might be better to get a grasp on it now rather than later.

Half a Billion Dollars in 2020: The Cloud Gaming Market Evolves as Consumer Engagement & Spending Soar | Newzoo

How much revenue will cloud gaming generate by 2023? Which markets contribute most? Learn more in this article based on Newzoo's Global Cloud Gaming Report.

newzoo.com

 

[farewelwilliams]

have you looked at a calendar lately?

have you studied physics at all? apparently you didn't understand my point. there's a minimum amount of latency needed to communicate information to the data center to receive a partial video frame. you can't break the laws of physics.

stadia, geforce now, playstation now all suffer the same input lag as when onlive launched.

 

[0092762]

there is, just buy a cheap android phone and use it with stadia, xcloud, geforce now etc,

Streaming doesn't work well over cellular connection or where there is no internet, I'd like to play on the device itself.

 

[Physicsdummy]

Game - 4 hours into gameplay prompts for credit card details or some other social engineering tactic.

I like how you assume it's some wild west badlands streaming games or something. These are Xbox games in Microsoft's well developed eco system with all their securities and safeguards in place, running remotely. Beholden to all the policies of the ESRB and the ones they developed themselves.

The ESRB already mentions if games have additional purchases possible in them along with all their content descriptors.

 

[metalsiren]

I dont agree with apple on this One bit, (but I do agree with them with the whole Epic nightmare)

not even Rene Agrees with apple this time.

 

[hans1972]

Then why doesn't Apple just leverage the ESRB rating system for Content? aka literally the system the entire video game industry uses in NA besides Apple.

In fact Apple's system is a lot worse for concerned parents because their ratings are nowhere near as detailed as the ESRBs

Does this system take into account Apple's control of its store and is revenue?

 

[ervingv]

have you studied physics at all? apparently you didn't understand my point. there's a minimum amount of latency needed to communicate information to the data center to receive a partial video frame. you can't break the laws of physics.

stadia, geforce now, playstation now all suffer the same input lag as when onlive launched.

lol And somehow they all work great for me.

 

[farewelwilliams]

lol And somehow they all work great for me.

casual gamers have a higher tolerance of lag it seems.

 

[ervingv]

Does this system take into account Apple's control of its store and is revenue?

Who cares about Apple's control of its store. What is it with all the fanatics here and their love of having a dictator tell them what they need and should do with their devices? lol I don't get the fetish.
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casual gamers have a higher tolerance of lag.

lol meh, whatever. Its working fine.

 

[Ethosik]

I like how you assume it's some wild west badlands streaming games or something. These are Xbox games in Microsoft's well developed eco system with all their securities and safeguards in place, running remotely. Beholden to all the policies of the ESRB and the ones they developed themselves.

The ESRB already mentions if games have additional purchases possible in them along with all their content descriptors.

People writing malicious software do these things. If its the ONLY way to truly get malware on millions of iOS devices, they will try their best at doing this.

Again, you are comparing this to big companies. The games I write for educational purposes are not rated by the ESRB. And if I want to do something like xCloud for my educational games, and I do not have the proper infrastructure in place to do it safely (just argument here, but even big companies can have breaches), bad things can happen.

Unless you think Apple should be able to play favorites, only allow game streaming from Microsoft because its Microsoft and Google because its Google?

 

[ervingv]

Streaming doesn't work well over cellular connection or where there is no internet, I'd like to play on the device itself.

Good. Then download the games on the store. Others who can stream and have a great connection can use the streaming services. Its called choices.

 

[rafark]

No, you pause, fast forward and other actions on a BUFFER - local cache of the video/audio. This is why when you fast forward past the buffer, you need to wait some time as it needs to pull down a new buffer.

You have to make remote connections to the server to get the data. Buffering depends on the client. I know because I have worked with video APIs in the past. You can tell a server to stop sending data when you pause a video, for example. That’s an interaction. When you’re steaming video you’re still interacting with a remote server.

 

[happyprozak]

I don’t have a particularly strong view one way or the other on the changes, etc. But, the comparison to Netflix is questionable, I think. Streaming video doesn’t pose nearly the risks to device security that games executing code on device do. Unless the Microsoft streaming games are being executed entirely off device and only rendering on the device, it’s consistent with Apple’s security posture to want to review the code.

The games on video game streaming services are not running on device. For Microsoft's xCloud the games are running on actual XBOX hardware in some server farm. Yes, they are literally running on XBOX's because the licensing agreements for XBOX games are for those games to run on an XBOX and not other type of hardware. Sony is in the same situation where they have a server farm of PS4's to run games.

So your iOS device is not executing any of the game code. You are basically doing a fancy remote desktop to an XBOX instead of a computer. In theory you could remote desktop to a PC and run your game library and you are doing the same basic operations of xCloud, except it would be a very poor experience.

I've seen some reviews of xCloud and it's not a perfect experience, games that require twitch reflexes have a noticeable latency which hurts the user experience but other games do provide a good experience.

 

[0092762]

Good. Then download the games on the store. Others who can stream and have a great connection can use the streaming services. Its called choices.

But games on ios App Store suck and many games are simply not available there to begin with because touchscreen gaming will never advance beyond match-3 puzzle games. I pity the fool who uses Apple as a gaming platform because it's FAR WORSE than Steam, PSN, Xbox, Nintendo, etc.

 

[Ethosik]

How about this then, why is the Steam Link app allowed? With it I can stream my local Steam library to my iOS device and use a controller. The only difference is that I have to host it myself. This allows me to play any of the steam games I've purchased without Apple interfering.

The difference is I'm hosting the content vs Microsoft hosting it and I can only play locally, not remotely. I can play any game or content I've got a Steam license for regardless of it's content.

This says to me that Apple just doesn't want gaming besides their own Apps made easily accessible. There are numerous other instances where Apple allows streaming content where there is an overlap (iTunes Movies, Netflix, Hulu, Amazon) they have decided to police game streaming here arbitrarily since I think we all know in-app game purchases make up MUCH more of Apples revenue stream than streaming services or movie purchases.

It is allowed because of what you already stated. It is your library. If you bought a bad game on Steam, its on you as its YOUR library.

 

[ervingv]

People writing malicious software do these things. If its the ONLY way to truly get malware on millions of iOS devices, they will try their best at doing this.

Again, you are comparing this to big companies. The games I write for educational purposes are not rated by the ESRB. And if I want to do something like xCloud for my educational games, and I do not have the proper infrastructure in place to do it safely (just argument here, but even big companies can have breaches), bad things can happen.

Unless you think Apple should be able to play favorites, only allow game streaming from Microsoft because its Microsoft and Google because its Google?

lol good lord. Bad things can happen on Netflix with some hack that would show porn movies. Take off the tin foil hat man.

 

[Abazigal]

I guess it makes some sense. Apple wants to maintain the vitality and viability of the App Store, and their policy changes reflect as such.

A game streaming app is pretty much a stand-alone App Store in its own right, and if Apple isn’t allowing Epic to have its way, I don’t see why they would allow any other company to run their own game streaming service on iOS as is.

 

[hans1972]

Someone defending Apple tell me how this approach benefits the consumer.

Go on, ill wait.

Why does it have to benefits customers?

It does have some benefits for customers. Especially for those customers who wants just one store and and essentially wants these streaming games to work just as other iOS games with regards to the iOS functions like parental control, ScreenTime, etc.

 

[Ethosik]

You have to make remote connections to the server to get the data. Buffering depends on the client. I know because I have worked with video APIs in the past. You can tell a server to stop sending data when you pause a video, for example. That’s an interaction. When you’re steaming video you’re still interacting with a remote server.

No you are stopping the buffer. I am streaming a movie on Netflix, 1 hour in my internet goes out, but I can still watch the movie that has been buffered. I can pause, play and fast forward as long as the buffer is there. How do I know? I have bad internet and it happens quite often. What actually happens, based on the company and storage available on the client, is the buffer will load up as much as it can. I have had entire 2 hour live stream sessions buffered before on YouTube, which was good as I still had it when the internet went out.
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lol good lord. Bad things can happen on Netflix with some hack that would show porn movies. Take off the tin foil hat man.

If you do look hard enough, you can find some spicy things on YouTube you know.

 

[0092762]

I guess it makes some sense. Apple wants to maintain the vitality and viability of the App Store, and their policy changes reflect as such.

A game streaming app is pretty much a stand-alone App Store in its own right, and if Apple isn’t allowing Epic to have its way, I don’t see why they would allow any other company to run their own game streaming service on iOS as is.

So they should all make a deal with Amazon and stream their games through prime video since they seem to have cracked the Apple App Store guidelines. And if Apple disagrees, we'll see how not being able to sell Apple devices on Amazon.com works out for them.

 

[ervingv]

Why does it have to benefits customers?

It does have some benefits for customers. Especially for those customers who wants just one store and and essentially wants these streaming games to work just as other iOS games with regards to the iOS functions like parental control, ScreenTime, etc.

I think Apple customers need to spend some time outside the walled garden for some air. Xcloud would be one app and that can be controlled just fine with the iOS functions you mentioned. The customer is still dealing with one App Store.