Apple Vision Pro Could Take Four Generations to Reach 'Ideal Form'

[Surf Monkey]

I don't have (and never will) an AVP, but my understanding is that for your eyes it's all screen that show the windows layered onto a display that shows the outside world. While the windows may be scaled on to the screen to look 6 feet away relative to everything else on the screen, the actual light source that your eye uses for focus is still only a few inches away. It may fool your brain, but your actual eye still has to focus on something that's very close for the entire time.

Even if your eyes are focused at 6 feet that’s still not enough. You need to look into the distance. 20 feet or more about every 20-30 minutes.

 

[Tagbert]

Not the only one. Fact of the matter for these sorts of things is that the impact won't be prevalent for some many years. By the time it becomes well documented; the damage is already done and things like class actions only serve to benefit the lawyers.

Studies are only recently showing the link between shortsightedness in children/teens & digital device use.

I'm a parent and we try to minimise screentime, but it doesn't help that now schools are requiring iPads

There have been lots of people claiming that shortsightedness is caused by reading too much. Be careful with studies that have not been properly validated. It can take years before you can tell if an effect is real and if it is strong enough to actually matter.

 

[Tagbert]

I don't have (and never will) an AVP, but my understanding is that for your eyes it's all screen that show the windows layered onto a display that shows the outside world. While the windows may be scaled on to the screen to look 6 feet away relative to everything else on the screen, the actual light source that your eye uses for focus is still only a few inches away. It may fool your brain, but your actual eye still has to focus on something that's very close for the entire time.

No, your eyes are focusing on an image about 5 feet out. The screens are close but there are lenses that refract the light to let you focus further out. Without that you would be unable to focus just a few inches from your eyes.

 

[Surf Monkey]

There have been lots of people claiming that shortsightedness is caused by reading too much. Be careful with studies that have not been properly validated. It can take years before you can tell if an effect is real and if it is strong enough to actually matter.

Reading is problematic too if you don’t look into the distance periodically.

 

[Antoniosmalakia]

Maybe in 20 years time there will be a medical condition called Vision Pro face… people’s faces showing the signs of all day Vision Pro usage… permanently present on their faces 🥴

I really wonder about that… I mean if you’re wearing something like that all day and it leaves marks… what happens after 1, 2, 5 years of usage all day etc

A valid question

You’ll probably end up with bright red callouses like a baboons butthole. That, or constant spots when the skin can’t breathe and has the same dirty oils pressed back on.

 

[MilaM]

The naysayers never consider they are naysaying because they are old and their computer experience involves a mouse, keyboard and being tied to a desk. The iPad is close to 13 years old and iPhone another 17 years old. For anyone in this age group touch is natural and using a traditional computer is a step backward. Vision Pro is the next step for them. Why hold something when you can see it?

When all you do on your device is consuming videos all day, play games, and occasionally send a message with a few characters and emojis, then sure, you can do that on an iPhone, iPad or using a headset. Once you need to bring together different files, data sources, work with audio, video, iOS will seriously hamper your productivity. Is it possible to get most things done on an iPad? Sure. But you will waste a lot of time with numerous artificial obstacles and spend much more time than necessary.

 

[cardfan]

I don't have (and never will) an AVP, but my understanding is that for your eyes it's all screen that show the windows layered onto a display that shows the outside world. While the windows may be scaled on to the screen to look 6 feet away relative to everything else on the screen, the actual light source that your eye uses for focus is still only a few inches away. It may fool your brain, but your actual eye still has to focus on something that's very close for the entire time.

It’s a little more than that. Your eye is the ui. You get used to it but it’s a bit more tiring having to focus on what you want to click (or pinch) constantly.

Maybe in small doses it’s ok like games, movies, traveling, etc but couldn’t imagine using one of these for a full work day.

 

[Smartass]

What's the point of buying iPad instead of MacBook if both can run macOS.
iPad is a dying product segment, will still have its niche market (kids & non-tech savvy people) due to its simplfied OS.

Vision Pro will replace your iPad as coach/bed computer.

I'm sure people would flock to iPad, if it ran normal macOS. Just having a normal PC in iPad formfactor would be a great selling feature. A lot of people dont carry their notebooks around due to the weight or size of it. But with iPad, having a PC the size of a small book, would be a completely different game.

Too bad Apple is sabotaging it's own products

 

[cardfan]

I'm sure people would flock to iPad, if it ran normal macOS. Just having a normal PC in iPad formfactor would be a great selling feature. A lot of people dont carry their notebooks around due to the weight or size of it. But with iPad, having a PC the size of a small book, would be a completely different game.

Too bad Apple is sabotaging it's own products

Yep. And after the sale Apple doesn’t make much from Mac’s. With iPads they’re locked into the iPad App Store.

Better for Apple if they have an iPad any day whether it has macOS capabilities or not.

I know the argument is they want to sell you a Mac too. But many iPad owners don’t do that. They have windows.

Besides when did Apple start worrying about Mac sales or market share in that category? Beside Apple silicon they have hardly done much else with it. Putting macOS on iPads would actually help them with exposing more to macOS. And sell a lot more iPads.

 

[Night Spring]

I would be interested to hear the views of people who think AVP will replace an iPad to be honest. It’s such a bizarre statement as they are such different devices. Would people sit watching tv whilst browsing safari wearing an AVP? Or buy one for each of their kids to chuck around and do their homework on?

I’ll ring my boss now and tell him I don’t need my Dell workstation anymore as I have an old iPod for WFH.

When I saw the VP introductory presentation in the Fall Apple event, I thought it could replace my iPad, provided it was comfortable enough to wear. I mean, I use my iPad to browse Safari and watch YouTube, with the VP I'd do the same thing, expect I'd be wearing the device on my head instead of holding it in my lap with my hands. Sure, in some situations, having a device that can be shared among multiple people can be more important, but the thing is, I've often wished my iPad had a bigger screen, but obviously a bigger iPad would be heavier and more difficult to handle. The VP lets me have any size screen I want. And while the VP is very bulky to carry, I currently only use the iPad at home, so portability isn't a concern for me.

So while obviously the VP can't replace the iPad for everyone, in my particular use case, it very well could.

 

[jjwwqq]

I can't envision a day where I'd replace my ipad with a vision pro.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

The naysayers never consider they are naysaying because they are old and their computer experience involves a mouse, keyboard and being tied to a desk. The iPad is close to 13 years old and iPhone another 17 years old. For anyone in this age group touch is natural and using a traditional computer is a step backward. Vision Pro is the next step for them. Why hold something when you can see it?

Older people typically throw up reasons, justifications and supposed roadblocks to adapting new technology because as people age they pick up those traits and end up stuck in their ways. They also try to bring legacy items with them to new platforms (e.g. mouse and keyboard). The young ones adapt to the features of the tools they are given and never start identifying items that are missing or not present in the traditional format.

One example is iPhone with no physical keyboard. The naysayers went hard with it not having a traditional keyboard. For those of us who never had a phone with anything but a touch keyboard it was not even a consideration because it was an improvement. No wasted space added to the footprint and something that could be adapted for any use with source code. Examples: Horizontal keyboard with larger buttons, character limited keyboards, and foreign keyboards, which were an extra costs for manufacturers.

Is it alright to be young and interested in the technology of the AVP but have no desire to ever use it myself? Unless it’s forced and other products like iPads and iPhones are discontinued, I won’t be buying it and I won’t be paying £3.5k for it in any case. It currently does not replace anything I use yet, so it doesn’t really factor.

This isn’t an age thing and if it was, it’s often younger people who don’t like change as much as older. Try working in engineering where people of all ages are stuck in their ways. I deal with far more resistance from people in their twenties than those in their forties.

 

[turbineseaplane]

I'm sure people would flock to iPad, if it ran normal macOS. Just having a normal PC in iPad formfactor would be a great selling feature. A lot of people dont carry their notebooks around due to the weight or size of it. But with iPad, having a PC the size of a small book, would be a completely different game.

Too bad Apple is sabotaging it's own products

It's amazing that they've still not come up with a "hybrid OS" situation on the iPad Pro's at least

I'd be an instant buyer for an iPP that could run both macOS and iPadOS in one device
That would be an insanely great travel device ... and honestly for me, even solve my full time macOS needs

 

[spinedoc77]

4 generations my a$#. If it isn't going to look like a simple pair of glasses, it's still going to be a glorified VR headset. Even the visor.com, which is MILES more compact and almost ready for everyday use, is going to have a difficult time being an always on AR solution.

 

[turbineseaplane]

4 generations my a$#.

Agreed

More like..."maybe when everyone reading this is already dead"

 

[spinedoc77]

Here is the visor, if it doesn't turn out to be vaporware it seems a much more significant hardware iteration on the VR concept, and something you might actually get away with wearing out in public for AR. Granted the HUGE caveat here is they are missing Apple 's app market and dev power, but for just viewing multiple screens (yep you can actually view multiple screens instead of only one when using with a Mac/PC) it's king so far. THIS is what Apple should have made IMO and is already "4 generations" ahead of the VP IMO.

 

[G5isAlive]

It’s a little more than that. Your eye is the ui. You get used to it but it’s a bit more tiring having to focus on what you want to click (or pinch) constantly.

Maybe in small doses it’s ok like games, movies, traveling, etc but couldn’t imagine using one of these for a full work day.

Key word ‘imagine.’ Have you gone for a demo yet? You should, might help in the imagining. Turns out its not that difficult.

 

[turbineseaplane]

Here is the visor, if it doesn't turn out to be vaporware it seems a much more significant hardware iteration on the VR concept, and something you might actually get away with wearing out in public for AR. Granted the HUGE caveat here is they are missing Apple 's app market and dev power, but for just viewing multiple screens (yep you can actually view multiple screens instead of only one when using with a Mac/PC) it's king so far. THIS is what Apple should have made IMO and is already "4 generations" ahead of the VP IMO.


View attachment 2349017

Apple should make something like this with a wireless connection (perhaps a proprietary one if need be) between and iPhone/iPad/Mac and the Visor

That has a chance of being useful and priced to move much more than AVP

 

[Yebubbleman]

Admittedly, iPadOS makes a decreasing amount of sense on larger iPads. The iPad Pro is king for drawing because ProCreate is king for drawing. Otherwise, it's awkward and getting more and more awkward the more Apple half-asses multi-tasking features to make iPadOS stand out from iOS. It's even further muddled by the fact that the iPad mini really doesn't make sense as a Mac/PC replacement nor really fit in (nor is really benefited by) Apple's "advancements" to iPadOS that make it stand out from iOS (let alone how iOS was on iPad before iPadOS).

The iPad still has a lot of potential. I hope Apple can make it make more sense.

 

[spinedoc77]

Apple should make something like this with a wireless connection (perhaps a proprietary one if need be) between and iPhone/iPad/Mac and the Visor

That has a chance of being useful and priced to move much more than AVP

If you look at the specs it hits a lot of the checkmarks the VP has, way more than it's $1k price implies. No it's still not as good as the VP, but sometimes pure specs takes a backseat to comfort. Anyway they are 2 different devices, and visor doesn't hide that they want to mainly be a device to allow you to have multiple screens out of your Mac/PC, much different than Apple's kitchen sink approach. I could only imagine if a big company, maybe Meta or Google, bought out Visor's tech and decided to run with it.

 

[turbineseaplane]

It just seems like they could make a sweet spatial audio/video/memories experience device with something like the Visor.

That would be an actually focused and useful product that would have a compelling sales case

 

[G5isAlive]

The naysayers never consider they are naysaying because they are old and their computer experience involves a mouse, keyboard and being tied to a desk. The iPad is close to 13 years old and iPhone another 17 years old. For anyone in this age group touch is natural and using a traditional computer is a step backward. Vision Pro is the next step for them. Why hold something when you can see it?

Older people typically throw up reasons, justifications and supposed roadblocks to adapting new technology because as people age they pick up those traits and end up stuck in their ways. They also try to bring legacy items with them to new platforms (e.g. mouse and keyboard). The young ones adapt to the features of the tools they are given and never start identifying items that are missing or not present in the traditional format.

One example is iPhone with no physical keyboard. The naysayers went hard with it not having a traditional keyboard. For those of us who never had a phone with anything but a touch keyboard it was not even a consideration because it was an improvement. No wasted space added to the footprint and something that could be adapted for any use with source code. Examples: Horizontal keyboard with larger buttons, character limited keyboards, and foreign keyboards, which were an extra costs for manufacturers.

This is just wrong. Speaking as an old person, that has lived through and embraced all these changes, I find this ageism to be short sighted. My first computer experience was called a slide rule. Google it.

And read these forums, some of the more vocal naysayers are those that dont have life experience to know better.

And its also true, that most things that make it to market do so with older people helping, if not leading, and almost always financing, the way. Some of your best advice comes from those that have been there, done that.

 

[spinedoc77]

This is just wrong. Speaking as an old person, that has lived through and embraced all these changes, I find this ageism to be short sighted. My first computer experience was called a slide rule. Google it.

And read these forums, some of the more vocal naysayers are those that dont have life experience to know better.

And its also true, that most things that make it to market do so with older people helping, if not leading, and almost always financing, the way. Some of your best advice comes from those that have been there, done that.

I was reading a psychology article/studies which were postulating why today's students seem to be unable to grasp concepts or even do extended reading and how a lot of professors these days hesitate to even assign more than 10-20 pages of reading homework. Heck when I was in college 35 years ago my assignments would be to read entire books, then write a paper which might be 20-30 pages long. I wonder if we, as a society, will ever realize the damage these devices are doing to our brains, especially now that we are getting ready to strap screens a few inches away from our eyeballs. Anyway I'm as guilty as the rest of 'em.

 

[turbineseaplane]

I was reading a psychology article/studies which were postulating why today's students seem to be unable to grasp concepts or even do extended reading and how a lot of professors these days hesitate to even assign more than 10-20 pages of reading homework. Heck when I was in college 35 years ago my assignments would be to read entire books, then write a paper which might be 20-30 pages long. I wonder if we, as a society, will ever realize the damage these devices are doing to our brains, especially now that we are getting ready to strap screens a few inches away from our eyeballs. Anyway I'm as guilty as the rest of 'em.

Deep thinking, let alone more complex analysis and reasoning seem to be going by the wayside

 

[TVreporter]

There was a story that the AVP was presented to board members prior to last spring’s announcement - wonder if anyone complained about the weight or were they too scared to upset Tim?