Apple Vision Pro May Now Be Out of Production

[Allen_Wentz]

...It is a solution without a problem.

Wrong. The fact that some individuals lack the vision to see the use of the AVP concept to solve problems does not make the AVP "a solution without a problem." There are many folks out there actively investigating use of the AVP concept to solve real problems [a lot of v1 AVP were sold despite the price and the alpha nature of being v1]. E.g. the AVP is being used to assist in brain surgery as one example.

Many individuals similarly lacked the vision to see the use of the Newton concept to solve problems. Yet one can also argue that the work on Newton very much allowed Apple to make the important handheld products that followed.

 

[Allen_Wentz]

Hopefully building content to make any new version worth buying will be the first priority

AVP is a new conceptual tool at [IMO] alpha level. All kinds of things of course need to evolve, primarily users figuring out how to use the new conceptual tool to solve their own individual problems. IMO AVP is off to a very good start.

Users figuring out how to use the new conceptual tool to solve their own individual problems takes lots of time. But Apple has the resources to support the evolution.

 

[Allen_Wentz]

Really bad news for the early adopters but it was predictable. Apple made the device so complicated that they lost control of the cost for most users. $3k+ is a lot of money for what it does. I have a friend who bought one and used it for a while and now very seldom.

Tell your friend I may buy it from him. I do want to see v2 AVP first though.

 

[Allen_Wentz]

I did not buy one or even try it on. I personally could have afforded one but could not see a use for it in my life style today.

I have one of my G4 Cube computers and it's monitor and speakers on a shelf for historical reference and design ingenuity. That is my only historical Apple gear that I kept except for a cable drawer that has stuff from over 40 years I thought I should keep.

All of the other Apple stuff just moved along to family, friends or the dump as newer and more capable Apple gear came out.

Apple floated a very expensive trail balloon.

Reminds me of the Ford Edsel (called an Oldsmobile sucking on a lemon) innovative design. Ford is still around and Apple will still be here.

The entire AVP headset cost is just a small blip when Apple is a four trillion dollar company. It made no difference to the investor's dividends or balance sheet. But the exercise helped focus Apple's attention on new technologies that will probably be used in the years ahead on products which will appear when Apple gets them ready.

This and other articles have stated that Apple had made millions of these AVP devices so the good news is at least there will be warranty replacements when needed.

The AVP is no Edsel. It is actually a very good first shot into a new direction.

 

[vartanarsen]

I did test drive appointment the first week, and my neck and head were hurting after the half hour. I knew then it was doomed

 

[WarmWinterHat]

Wrong. The fact that some individuals lack the vision to see the use of the AVP concept to solve problems does not make the AVP "a solution without a problem." There are many folks out there actively investigating use of the AVP concept to solve real problems [a lot of v1 AVP were sold despite the price and the alpha nature of being v1]. E.g. the AVP is being used to assist in brain surgery as one example.

Many individuals similarly lacked the vision to see the use of the Newton concept to solve problems. Yet one can also argue that the work on Newton very much allowed Apple to make the important handheld products that followed.

Companies blaming the user is a classic bit, but unattractive. Don't copy them.

 

[Allen_Wentz]

I did test drive appointment the first week, and my neck and head were hurting after the half hour. I knew then it was doomed

Nonsense. Apple sold hundreds of thousands of expensive AVPs. That is not "doomed," it is a darn good start on a totally new product direction. IMO the AVP is very good for what is basically an alpha version.

AVP as a v1 of course has lots of little learning curve things to evolve, like a few folks who had "neck and head were hurting after the half hour" that would need use training or perhaps can never use that type of device. Watch it evolve.

E.g. In my case the visionOS evolution to v2 is helping solve my particular needs.

 

[Allen_Wentz]

Companies blaming the user is a classic bit, but unattractive. Don't copy them.

?? No one is blaming the user. I am saying some folks cannot see the potential of a new technology. I am blaming the whiners, not blaming the users. I celebrate the users for their forward-thinking.

And in addition to the hundreds of thousands of such users that spent their $3k+ there are thousands more like me who have tested AVP, like it, and are still working on how to usa AVP to specifically solve their individual usage needs.

 

[WarmWinterHat]

?? No one is blaming the user. I am saying some folks cannot see the potential of a new technology. I am blaming the whiners, not blaming the users. I celebrate the users for their forward-thinking.

I should have said consumers.

How about the users who say, "naa, this isn't it."? I have a couple people close to me who bought it, used it for a while then gave up on it..one sold it and the other hasn't picked it up in months.

I tried it in the store, thought the demo was okay but not $4-digits okay, then proceeded to be so motion sick for the next two hours that I couldn't even look at a tv.

 

[bodonnell202]

Why do so many here think that everything has to be a "solution without a problem?" This phrase is so hackneyed as to be meaningless!

Plenty of devices are created simply to be something that people may like or enjoy. They don't have to be solutions. I still love certain aspects of my AVP, especially viewing movies, shows, etc. If that's all it did, I'd be very happy to spend $499 on it. So many assumptions with no basis in fact or experience are made here.

Thing is that technology should provide a solution to a problem in order to be useful. The only useful thing you included is watching movies and shows. How many people do you think are going to spend $3500 to strap an uncomfortable device with limited battery life to their face so they can watch TV, when they can get a 65” TV for $300 and the whole family can watch together. For mass market appeal it either has to do something that folks can’t already do, or make something folks already do easier or cheaper. The AVP does none of these and thus at this point is just a novelty for Apple enthusiasts with lots of disposable income.

 

[Allen_Wentz]

I should have said consumers.

How about the users who say, "naa, this isn't it."? I have a couple people close to me who bought it, used it for a while then gave up on it..one sold it and the other hasn't picked it up in months.

I tried it in the store, thought the demo was okay but not $4-digits okay, then proceeded to be so motion sick for the next two hours that I couldn't even look at a tv.

Interesting that it makes you sick. I have had no such issues using it for more than an hour a couple of times now. As to people getting rid of them, we do not find super low priced AVPs available on eBay.

Neither the price nor the headset comfort creates some product fail issue for me or for others like me. The AVP is a new high priced, high competence new product direction. Usages will need to evolve, and the AVP will also evolve; visionOS is now at v2 for instance.

E.g. I have three external displays that cost me >$1k each. It looks like use of the AVP could replace two or three of those displays, but that involves long term workflow changes. Long term evolution. Also use of AVP involves big changes in my workstation. Again, long term evolution. Wags thinking AVP should be an instant adoption device are just wrong

 

[jjudson]

The only way I see this product viable is in three areas:

1. OS gender neutral -- Should support Mac, Windows, Linux OS -And/Or-
2. Focus on industrial/scientific use cases -And/Or-
3. Build out their own gaming infrastructure to compete against Steam -- THEN release the headset

Otherwise, this will always be an Apple niche product...

 

[turbineseaplane]

Why do so many here think that everything has to be a "solution without a problem?" This phrase is so hackneyed as to be meaningless!

Plenty of devices are created simply to be something that people may like or enjoy. They don't have to be solutions.

In that case, can we get iPhone Minis again please?

Way more people were buying those than AVPs and yet….cancelled.

 

[Allen_Wentz]

Thing is that technology should provide a solution to a problem in order to be useful. The only useful thing you included is watching movies and shows. How many people do you think are going to spend $3500 to strap an uncomfortable device with limited battery life to their face so they can watch TV, when they can get a 65” TV for $300 and the whole family can watch together. For mass market appeal it either has to do something that folks can’t already do, or make something folks already do easier or cheaper. The AVP does none of these and thus at this point is just a novelty for Apple enthusiasts with lots of disposable income.

We disagree strongly.

Your statement "technology should provide a solution to a problem in order to be useful" is only correct when looked at long term. Despite the fact that we are still in the short term, AVP already has been used to do things like assist with brain surgery. So wait, and watch more solutions happen as the novel product evolves.

You say "For mass market appeal it either has to do..." but that falsely assumes that every product needs to fall into the category of "mass market appeal." Reality is that there are lots of important products that do not fall into the category of "mass market appeal."

We would argue that it is very appropriate for a $4T company to also build products that are not simplistically only for the mass markets. Mass spectrometers, as just one simple example, are a rapidly growing $7B market but have zero "mass market appeal."

The unfortunate fact that many people lack the vision to see beyond simple "mass market appeal" does not mean that AVP "is just a novelty for Apple enthusiasts."

 

[UltimaKilo]

The Quest 3 starts at less than 1/11th the price of the Vision Pro. $299 vs $3499. Might be why it's more popular?

Yes, you understood my point. Congrats.

 

[paradox00]

None of that addresses the problem

(Price is but one of them)

No content and a lot of folks don’t like having this be a primary interaction experience for more than short periods.

It’s a really different situation than a smart speaker

The primary problem is that the Apple Vision Pro currently is an entertainment device priced like a mid to high end workstation. But even with zero additional content, there's a price where it becomes worthwhile just to watch movies on.

I'm hugely critical of the AVP, v1 is a flop (and least by Apple's standards) and won't see a redemption arc before it's discontinued. The next pro version is going to need to learn a lot of lessons from their low end headset. What I'm not though, is blindly critical... I've used devices in this space, and see plenty of reasons for optimism. Price solves a lot more than you give it credit for.

A stripped down device without the cost, weight and complexity of Eyesight and maybe even a plastic casing would dramatically improve the ergonomics of the headset. I'm not going to make any assumptions that Apple will ever figure gaming out (they simply refuse to), but they will eventually unlock fitness. I've done plenty of workouts on the Quest (until my health got in the way a regular workout routine). Fitness, movies, tethering to a Mac, the iOS app library (especially messaging apps), and the spatial OS that is VisionOS would absolutely move units at a sub $2000 price (I'd love $999 like I mentioned before, but it's Apple...), even if they have to sacrifice some visual fidelity to get there. Developers would be on board with a sufficient user base to address the much of the content problem you mention (caveat on the Pro version below). While you're right that most people won't use these all day until ergonomics are dramatically improved, but that's not pre-requisite for finding some success in this market, it just puts a ceiling on price.

Price doesn't solve everything, especially with the Pro version, because there's only so low that Apple will go there. If Apple wants to sell a $3000+ Pro version they will need to be doing some heavy app development lifting themselves and reimagine all their creative apps for best use on this platform. That or straight up turn it into a Mac that's also wearable. I'm with you on the content problem on this front, but not on a cheaper device. Apple has the pieces, it's just a question if they put it together.

 

[paradox00]

Apple Vision Pro - this is the third time in my life I've been an early adopter with Apple. The first was my Apple power book 145. That was the first truly standalone portable computer from Apple. That product line is still growing strong decades later.
The second was my apple Newton 2100. I loved that device and was brokenhearted when they killed it off. It was way ahead of its time and Apple was hemorrhaging money at the time. However, it's legacy in the myriad of smart phones. certainly lives on decades later

I'm optimistic that the Apple Vision Pro is going to thrive.

It's a cutting edge device and Apple is flush with money and has the ability to really turn this into an incredible new product line. Otherwise all we're going to see is get another phone get another iPad get another laptop, etc. Apple really needs a new product space and AVP will definitely that.

AVP is indispensable for me because I travel a lot on airplanes and watching films with that is astonishing.

I do use it with my MacBook Pro for the incredible monitors and extra screens that provides.

However, I really wish Apple would design a new magic keyboard, which is small compact and has a trackpad instead of a mouse. I would love to travel with my Vision Pro and an appropriate magic keyboard that does not require a mouse.

With more disposable income I'd do that, but instead have Viture glasses for this. Not the same visual fidelity, but a fraction of the cost, weight, and bulk. The AVP has the pieces for success, just not in the form it's currently assembled. Hopefully they get there (at a lower price).

 

[eifelbube]

The new wide and ultra-wide remote display for Macs is incredible.

All they have to do is make it a portable Cinema Display for MacBooks, connected via Thunderbolt cable. Remove the external battery, the CPU subsystem, the silly front eye display, and sell it for like $1500.

That's all I wanted.

Agreed. Limited to just the tech needed for that purpose it would sell like hotcakes at $995.

 

[Reason077]

What, exactly, are the use cases/potential? Anyone that says they have one and use it are literally just using it as a monitor.

I don't have a Vision Pro (would love to try it for a while, but can't justify $3500 on something that is really just an early preview / technology demonstrator for future products). I do have a Quest. Admittedly I only really use it for VR games and 3D movies, but as far as those go it's an extremely impressive device for the $300 or so it costs. There's no better way to watch a 3D movie (like Avatar 2): even compared to when I saw it on a state-of-the-art dual laser HDR Dolby Cinema, it's miles better on a headset.

My Quest doesn't support using it as a monitor, but running its own internal apps (web browser, movie player, etc) shows me what the potential would be. You don't just get a monitor: you get an extremely huge, high-res monitor that is far more portable and practical than a real monitor of that size would be. Multiple monitors, in fact, if you want.

It has no input other than voice or pinching.

This is no longer true with recent Vision OS versions. You can pair input devices (physical keyboards, trackpads, etc) directly with the Vision Pro.

But I'd argue that its ability to work on gestures alone is actually a huge advantage: the Quest has those little puck controllers that you hold in your hand. They work fine but they're kind of a pain to have to pick up, carry around, change their batteries, etc. I've often just wished I could just use my hands as the controller, which of course is exactly how Vision Pro works.

 

[Allen_Wentz]

The primary problem is that the Apple Vision Pro currently is an entertainment device priced like a mid to high end workstation. But even with zero additional content, there's a price where it becomes worthwhile just to watch movies on.

I'm hugely critical of the AVP, v1 is a flop (and least by Apple's standards) and won't see a redemption arc before it's discontinued. The next pro version is going to need to learn a lot of lessons from their low end headset. What I'm not though, is blindly critical... I've used devices in this space, and see plenty of reasons for optimism. Price solves a lot more than you give it credit for.

A stripped down device without the cost, weight and complexity of Eyesight and maybe even a plastic casing would dramatically improve the ergonomics of the headset. I'm not going to make any assumptions that Apple will ever figure gaming out (they simply refuse to), but they will eventually unlock fitness. I've done plenty of workouts on the Quest (until my health got in the way a regular workout routine). Fitness, movies, tethering to a Mac, the iOS app library (especially messaging apps), and the spatial OS that is VisionOS would absolutely move units at a sub $2000 price (I'd love $999 like I mentioned before, but it's Apple...), even if they have to sacrifice some visual fidelity to get there. Developers would be on board with a sufficient user base to address the much of the content problem you mention (caveat on the Pro version below). While you're right that most people won't use these all day until ergonomics are dramatically improved, but that's not pre-requisite for finding some success in this market, it just puts a ceiling on price.

Price doesn't solve everything, especially with the Pro version, because there's only so low that Apple will go there. If Apple wants to sell a $3000+ Pro version they will need to be doing some heavy app development lifting themselves and reimagine all their creative apps for best use on this platform. That or straight up turn it into a Mac that's also wearable. I'm with you on the content problem on this front, but not on a cheaper device. Apple has the pieces, it's just a question if they put it together.

Sorry but stating that
"The primary problem is that the Apple Vision Pro currently is an entertainment device priced like a mid to high end workstation."

starts with a flawed premise. The AVP is decidedly not simply "an entertainment device."

Most negative comments here start based on such grossly flawed logic.

 

[burgman]

AVP is a new conceptual tool at [IMO] alpha level. All kinds of things of course need to evolve, primarily users figuring out how to use the new conceptual tool to solve their own individual problems. IMO AVP is off to a very good start.

Users figuring out how to use the new conceptual tool to solve their own individual problems takes lots of time. But Apple has the resources to support the evolution.

Since majority of users can’t create content optimized for this class of product consumers have voted. Alpha level? Pricewise absolutely, technically absolutely stunning screens, practicality and value not so much. Beautiful, elegant, useless for most, that’s not a good start in my world. How could they have misread the market that badly. $600 price point, given software and content limitations is the sweet spot for now.

 

[Mike_313]

To me the AVP release looks like as if the iPod would have been released without iTunes Store. They made an overpriced product and missed to create the market.
At $ 1.500 with 3D video and gaming content this would have been a big success. Without content it is a big failure.

 

[Johnstrass2]

Instead of wasting billions of R&D on an overpriced and uncomfortable to wear AVP, Apple could have used that money to invest in AI / AI infrastructure instead.

As far as new product spaces go, there's great opportunity in home automation, robotics, and health-related technology.

Apple made great success by inventing a new product space, not by coming up with a better mouse trap. The iPhone was completely revolutionary and different from the flip phone in hundreds of ways. The iPad similarly created the space for tablets.

The vision Pro is not a competitor for other goggles;it really is it’s owned separate space. Unfortunately, unless you really spend time figuring out how to use it properly it’s really hard to appreciate it. The demonstration options in the Apple Store are just not good enough

 

[iluvcrap2000]

Duh. People at Apple need to wake up and see the writing on the wall.

 

[johnsawyercjs]

I'm not even sure people would buy this at $499. It is a solution without a problem.

Given that the entire series of Quest headsets, from the original Oculus model through the Meta Quest 3, have sold about 17.5 million units according to some estimates, with price points between $300-$650 depending on the amount of storage and price increases and decreases, I'd say there's a big enough market for VR/MR/gaming/virtual big screen headsets, which will probably expand quite a bit once they're significantly less bulky and heavy, and more comfortable without having to buy aftermarket head straps, and the pricing stays somewhere in that ballpark. Which, given Apple's pricing, even if they reduce the price of the Vision Pro line significantly, means success for this product category, measured in terms of number of units sold, will probably continue to reside with companies other than Apple, though it's likely Apple will still continue to make a model superior at least in some ways to headsets made by other companies.