Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
No one said Apple was first.

Apple started the trend.

What HIGH volume FLAGSHIP device introduced the general public to the fingerprint scanner? The iPhone.

Aside from us nerds on here, no one can even name a high volume flagship device that had a fingerprint scanner before the iPhone. Good luck with people knowing what the "Atrix" is.
They were already introduced on phones before the iPhone saw the light of day in 2007. Toshiba made the first one and Motorola had a smart phone with fingerprint scanner before the iPhone came out with it.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Demo Kit
Glad you recognize Apple wasn't the first!
Well, I knew they weren't first. My point is, the general public doesn't know about all of these low budget devices that experimented with features like that. Apple makes those features popular, and its forces OEM to follow suit. Apple wasn't first with removing the headphone jack, but it will start a trend and everyone other major manufacturer will get in line and remove it as well. Samsung is first in line, with their flagship device. Most people only know: iOS (iPhone), Android (Galaxy) anyway.
 
  • Like
Reactions: WWPD
They were already introduced on phones before the iPhone saw the light of day in 2007. Toshiba made the first one and Motorola had a smart phone with fingerprint scanner before the iPhone came out with it.
Who? ;) That's my point. Only NERDS know stuff like that.

Just like the average customer doesn't complain on message boards about every little feature the iPhone has and doesn't have. We are a special group of people. Those people just want to use their phone and keep it moving.
 
Fair points - except - The atrix was a $700+ phone - full price - so not so much a 'budget' phone!

iPhone not having a headphone jack wouldn't be so bad if the ear phones could be used on other devices ( without any dongles ).

Well, I knew they weren't first. My point is, the general public doesn't know about all of these low budget devices that experimented with features like that. Apple makes those features popular, and its forces OEM to follow suit. Apple wasn't first with removing the headphone jack, but it will start a trend and everyone other major manufacturer will get in line and remove it as well. Samsung is first in line, with their flagship device. Most people only know: iOS (iPhone), Android (Galaxy) anyway.
 
At the risk of piling on—I will. If in my book unwise to disrespect the Macintosh, by some measures they can get away with it. But no secret that the iPhone is Apple's bread and butter; there is no way to rationalize declining sales or consider it other than a quite worrying and bad trend.

. . . or maybe excellent. Minting money with the iPhone for years has allowed Apple to grow fat and arrogant. To, among other things, dismiss otherwise loyal customers out of hand. Things may now have to change.

This was probably foreseeable and why Apple has been exploring alternative businesses like self-driving vehicles and AI. The smart phone market is near saturated, or at least the cream now taken. It will become more a commodity market and even Apple will have to accept lower margins. A kick-ass iPhone 8 would help, if they've probably already accepted this business cannot be what it once was. At least not without some new product as innovative as the iPhone, iPad and Mac were on introduction.

Likely not there yet, but if wise they'll begin to get their ship of state in order, tighten things up, and return with renewed enthusiasm to mundane things like QA and excellence.

They could get some good practice in that by making the Macintosh line what it should be.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Ladybug
Fair points - except - The attix was a $700+ phone - so not so much a 'budget' phone!
That's true.

Let's be COMPLETELY honest: The Atrix fingerprint scanner was HORRIBLE when you compare it to the iPhone 5S.

This article is funny (it was from three years ago) when Apple introduced the iPhone 5S, with a fingerprint scanner.

http://phandroid.com/2013/09/12/iphone-5s-fingerprint-scanner/

Fast forward to 2017, not having a fingerprint scanner on a flagship device is unheard of. Just like we won't see many flagship with headphone jacks in a few years. Who knows? Maybe in 2018-2020, I'll find this post.
 
  • Like
Reactions: riomp300
That's true.

Let's be COMPLETELY honest: The Atrix fingerprint scanner was HORRIBLE when you compare it to the iPhone 5S.

I never used the finger scanner on that phone but can completely imagine the quality difference would be vast.
 
I highly doubt its because of the headphone jack. Its basically the same design for THREE years...people don't see a reason to upgrade. With the AirPods doing so well, people are coming around to the whole "wireless" idea. Apple had to lay the groundwork..the 7 is a placeholder for the 10th Anniversary iPhone. Mark my words: you will see more Android phones without the headphone jack next year... wireless is the future. Most flagships won't even have a headphone jack by the end of 2018.

I don't really agree with that. Firstly we don't know how many Airpods have sold, all we know is there is limited stock. That could be from overwhelming sales but it could also be due to constrained supply. They did after-all delay the Airpods about two months. Furthermore the only people buying them are going to be iPhone / Mac owners of which there are 150+ million in the world so it has no bearing on Android switch rates.

Secondly the push back on the lack of the 3.5mm jack was really quite high, I'm sure it persuaded some Android phone owners from switching to iOS when they could stick with flagships from other companies. It's also what analysts are saying who are more qualified than I in these matters.

iPhone owners like myself didn't really have a choice in the matter. If we want to keep using iOS and stay invested in this ecosystem that we've spent a lot of money on (Apps, Watch, Laptop) but we wanted a new phone we had to get the iPhone 7. But that's just not true of Android owners, they had more options.
 
Been using Apple products for 12+ years. And to be honest after Cook came out with cheaper versions of iPhones, I felt things for Apple is just becoming more and more mediocre while charging higher prices. Apple seems to be selling its brand name more than actual well thought out products lately.
 
SO ... we'll have absolutely NO idea how many of those sales where 7 and 7+ ... Apple pulling the wool as always.


No, we will have a very close idea, and Apple may break it down, but will probably include the SE and 6s in those sales in the report.
 
I love how every year orders go down in Q1, yet no one seems to bat an eye when it's claimed to be due to poor sales.

Maybe, and stay with me here guys, you don't need to produce as many phones a month as you do during the run up to the Holiday season??

I'd love to know how to get an analyst job, must be nice to be paid to just make claims regardless of the impact or veracity of them. I'd start with a piece on Butterball being in trouble because turkey sales mysteriously slowed down after November...for some unknowable reason. :rolleyes:
Well, you misunderstood the situation. It'seems not that the production is being cut compared to the previous quarter. That's indeed would be expected. 10% drop is compared to the same period previous year (i.e. compared to iPhone 6S). Just read the linked Nikkei article. So, yes it'a a big problem.
 
  • Like
Reactions: HVDynamo
I don't really agree with that. Firstly we don't know how many Airpods have sold, all we know is there is limited stock. That could be from overwhelming sales but it could also be due to constrained supply. They did after-all delay the Airpods about two months. Furthermore the only people buying them are going to be iPhone / Mac owners of which there are 150+ million in the world so it has no bearing on Android switch rates.

Secondly the push back on the lack of the 3.5mm jack was really quite high, I'm sure it persuaded some Android phone owners from switching to iOS when they could stick with flagships from other companies. It's also what analysts are saying who are more qualified than I in these matters.

iPhone owners like myself didn't really have a choice in the matter. If we want to keep using iOS and stay invested in this ecosystem that we've spent a lot of money on (Apps, Watch, Laptop) but we wanted a new phone we had to get the iPhone 7. But that's just not true of Android owners, they had more options.
I was basing it off Tim Cook said, and the recent article about AirPods suppliers increasing production capacity.

Those Android phone owners will have no choice but adopt to wireless in 2017 and 2018 when their beloved headphone jack is gone.

As I said, I personally believe wireless is the future. I've love to see if I'm right in a few years. Right now, we are going through a transition to wireless. 2016 was all about laying the groundwork for whats to come in the future.
 
i don't see how it's good news that the iphone/mac have been losing market share pretty steadily in the last bunch of quarters.

so apple is becoming more and more of a flashy luxury company, with snazzy new products that scream : i'm rich and you're not, but becoming increasingly useless/brittle/backwards/etc.

meantime chromebook is like surpassing macs like it's a piece of cake
normal people including myself, who have been lifelong apple users have begun buying their *first* PCs ever and getting to know linux (and actually being surprised)

in the meantime, it is the other companies (google, MS) who are innovating, apple sacrifying features and battery life for not much, really. and the watch is such a big symbol for this baaaaaad new direction apple is headed !

the watch should serve as a warning. poor sales, no enthousiasm except maybe in the high ultra-rich spheres of the population.... that's kind of the future of apple products if they don,t reconnect with the jobs spirit.

how can we really find these hard facts to be good news ?
 
Last edited:
Well, you misunderstood the situation. It'seems not that the production is being cut compared to the previous quarter. That's indeed would be expected. 10% drop is compared to the same period previous year (i.e. compared to iPhone 6S). Just read the linked Nikkei article. So, yes it'a a big problem.


Literally not a big problem. Every adjustment in orders doesn't merit a ****ing article like this. You know Tim and Phil are face palming at this garbage reporting that's now spreading everywhere.

You cannot predict anything by following this information.
 
That's true.

Let's be COMPLETELY honest: The Atrix fingerprint scanner was HORRIBLE when you compare it to the iPhone 5S.

This article is funny (it was from three years ago) when Apple introduced the iPhone 5S, with a fingerprint scanner.

http://phandroid.com/2013/09/12/iphone-5s-fingerprint-scanner/

Fast forward to 2017, not having a fingerprint scanner on a flagship device is unheard of. Just like we won't see many flagship with headphone jacks in a few years. Who knows? Maybe in 2018-2020, I'll find this post.
While all this is true it is not clear to me why would you give credit to Apple for improving the fingerprint sensors. A trip version was not that good not because Motorola screwed it up but because the sensors (and phone CPUs) were not that good at the time. Sensor vendors improved their products since then. That's it
 
While all this is true it is not clear to me why would you give credit to Apple for improving the fingerprint sensors. A trip version was not that good not because Motorola screwed it up but because the sensors (and phone CPUs) were not that good at the time. Sensor vendors improved their products since then. That's it

Then they should have waited until they had the proper hardware to support their fingerprint scanners. This is wrong with companies always trying to put stuff out before it's ready. You see Apple paid the price when they came out with Apple Maps before it was ready.
 
While all this is true it is not clear to me why would you give credit to Apple for improving the fingerprint sensors. A trip version was not that good not because Motorola screwed it up but because the sensors (and phone CPUs) were not that good at the time. Sensor vendors improved their products since then. That's it

Then they should have waited until they had the proper hardware to support their fingerprint scanners. This is wrong with companies always trying to put stuff out before it's ready. You see Apple paid the price when they came out with Apple Maps before it was ready.
 
What's wrong with using wired USB head phones? You can buy USB headphones today.

When Samsung bring out their head phone jack-less phone(s) more USB head phones will appear on the market, Samsung will bring out their own wired and wireless versions.

I was basing it off Tim Cook said, and the recent article about AirPods suppliers increasing production capacity.

Those Android phone owners will have no choice but adopt to wireless in 2017 and 2018 when their beloved headphone jack is gone.

As I said, I personally believe wireless is the future. I've love to see if I'm right in a few years. Right now, we are going through a transition to wireless. 2016 was all about laying the groundwork for whats to come in the future.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Demo Kit
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.