Apple's Plans to Release 5G iPhone in 2020 Could Be Stymied by Intel Delays

[Baymowe335]

Oh you are just too funny. That used to be the case but not anymore. Just look at the mess with MacBook keyboards.

Yeah, come back with some facts before you question sales execution. Apple just wrapped up their most profitable year ever ($60B in profit) and that is ALL sales execution.

Apple understands better than any company on Earth how to execute.

MacBook keyboards are a MINOR issue. Apple shipped 18M+ Macs in 2018. A few threads and complaints is not a design flaw. It's the normal process of shipping 300M different devices per year.
[doublepost=1554387348][/doublepost]

Found Tim’s mom.

Come back with a fact or argue Apple isn't the most profitable and successful company on Earth?

You guys love to be snarky, but you have no facts.

Apple made $60B in profit in 2018.

#2 made $23B.

Tell me more about how Apple is unsuccessful.
[doublepost=1554387485][/doublepost]

300m in total? or just in 2018, please show source.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/382302/unit-sales-of-apple-by-product-category/
this source supports my conclusion pretty strongly.

apple does have a problem with its design for mbp, not one single reviewer or youtube personality would disagree with that, the number of butterfly revision apple has pushed out since 2016 is a strong testament to that. the avg consumer prob is too lazy or don't care enough if one of their keys on the keyboard is not responding well or double typing.

the number of lawsuits and complaints/news media coverage of apple hardware failure is at an all time high. you have to be living under a rock or just straight up don't pay attention if you failed to see that.

the china slowdown argument has been overly magnified, its not the only factor but just one of the factor, only a few month later apple is pushing strong trade in deals to get their Xr out of the door. that is something unprecedented in the history of iphones. apple will face a uphill battle now that trump got the chinese consumers rallying behind huawei phones. apple will not do well in vietnam since their avg income is no where near enough for someone who makes 10k usd a year to justify an iphone purchase, this pattern has been shown in india where apple tried to push into that market but ultimately failed.

Ready to be wrong? I know the numbers:

JUST for 2018:

• iPhone: 218M
• iPad: 44M
• Mac: 18M

So that is ironclad, 280M devices in 2018 without counting Watch, AirPods, and HomePod. Various estimates support 20M Airpods, 20-25M Watches, and another 1-2M HomePods. That is 325M units of Apple gear, not counting accessories.

Source: 10K (the best data possible) https://s22.q4cdn.com/396847794/files/doc_financials/quarterly/2018/Q4/10-K-2018-(As-Filed).pdf

Your source supports what I said too. It's listed by quarter and only lists iPhone, iPad, and Mac. Add up all 4 quarters and you'll see it's what I said.

China was over 100% the reason for the revenue miss last quarter as stated by Cook and was confirmed in the official numbers. Deals on products are just normal for pushing your stuff. This is a tough game and you have to push harder and harder to sell more and more product.

 

[farkingdom]

The problem with this argument, harks back to the classic statement of, I don't need a car, and don't see the point, as my horse is great and horses currently do all the things we need.

Classic thing to say, which as time goes by demonstrated how this is generally not a good stance to take.

We already have cars (because of convenience) and now we are dealing with carbon pollution and climate change partly because of cars.

5G on the other hand, is another matter because we already have 4G and the speed on 4G is more than satisfactory for general consumers. So the proper comparison should be we already have cars, but why do we need an even faster car that emits even more pollution?

5G is like that unnecessary faster car that emits more pollution, its increase of base station and higher frequency means your body will be constantly been bombarded with higher RF everyday. And that’s even worst than your WiFi or any other RF radiation.
Why do you think scientists are appealing to the UN to study more on 5G effect to the body. Please do some read up on 5G and effect and you will think twice of its implementation to the general public.

 

[asdforce]

there is one best 5G chip in the shelf right now except Qualcomm, yes it is Huawei's chip.
Huawei also control quite large percent of patents in 5G
and because Huawei also make 5G base station etc, its chip has unique advantage when working with its own 5G base station. for instance, much lower power consumption, faster network response and many others.
this is the most advanced combination in the world.

 

[keysofanxiety]

By day, I'm a professional dancer at the @keysofanxiety mansion. Great job, can't complain much; I just wish he'd let us out sometimes.

You’ll get your three minutes of fresh air when I get my sponge bath!

 

[JetTester]

Focus, Apple. Instead of spending all your resources chasing celebrities to boost your content sales, maybe you should focus on the things that pay the bills. Get it done, others are. Don't let them eat your lunch!

 

[DaveRivera]

As far as I can tell, though maybe I missed it somewhere in my research, AT&T is not even going to have 5G in my area before the end of 2019 (Boston) for anything other than their tethered hot spots. I get perfectly fine speeds on LTE for phone usage, and the tethering I do on the train everyday with my MacBook, while spotty, is not an issue of LTE vs 5G. I'm perfectly fine waiting another year or two for 5G.

 

[realtuner]

Of course that’s all largely meaningless. Not all patents are equally important, and these “share” figures are typically done by self-declaration. If a company is willing to declare that X-number of patents are “essential” to the standard (and hence be willing to license them as FRAND), it is assumed they are actually essential.

I’ve looked in detail at massive “essential” portfolios and found that oftentimes many of the patents are not actually essential. I’ve also looked at non-essential patents and found that sometimes they actually are. Then you have patents that are essential in the sense that you need them, but only if you implement OPTIONAL parts of the spec (so many times you don’t need the license anyway).

So in the end I don’t think people should spend too much time comparing the number of patents.

I agree. But the poster I replied to was the one who initially brought up the percentage share of patents as an argument.

 

[ElectricPotato]

Just pay a few bucks and keep up with the rest of the 5G world until there are alternative chips.

It is a lot more than a few bucks and I assume at this point getting Qualcomm's cooperation would involve crippling legal agreements that would prevent using a competitor for a long time. For better or worse, Apple and Qualcomm are in a scorched earth battle to the end.

 

[cmaier]

I agree. But the poster I replied to was the one who initially brought up the percentage share of patents as an argument.

Understood. It's hard to "reply" to multiple people on here.

 

[derekamoss]

Back in the day when Apple moved from their own chips in G5 Quad PowerPC's etc. to Intel, every upgrade was always delayed because Intel was never able to deliver on time according to their own projections, so this is nothing new.

Ummm Apple NEVER made their own chips. IBM made the G5 processors and they moved to Intel because they had promised a G5 in a laptop in a year and IBM could never get the heat down enough to be put in a laptop. The first processor Apple ever made was their Arm Ax Processors.

 

[unlovbl]

2020 seems so soon for the iPhone and 5G. That doesn't give enough time for every iPhone competitor to have it out already. Tim and his team hate to be in the front of the pack these days.

 

[udayan81]

I’m fine with LTE for now. It’s not like i can do anything useful in the phone form factor with near-gigabit internet anyway.

I have to absolutely agree with this. There is absolutely no use of the speed beyond what we currently have. Even online games never disconnect with the current lte speeds. Besides, they limit the speed anyways after 24 gb.. cant do much with that limit.

 

[MrX8503]

[doublepost=1554380113][/doublepost]
It's irrelevant, the smartphone market is saturated right now and its harder and harder for manufacturers to distance themselves from the competition.
Back then the smartphone market was still growing at a fast pace. That is obviously not happening right now.

The number of people jumping ship over 5G would be negligible.

 

[DocMultimedia]

It is a lot more than a few bucks and I assume at this point getting Qualcomm's cooperation would involve crippling legal agreements that would prevent using a competitor for a long time. For better or worse, Apple and Qualcomm are in a scorched earth battle to the end.

Few bucks/phone. Definitely a big payout when multiplied by oodles of iPhones. Yeah, the legal wars will make it a challenge. Apple better advise Intel on getting things out early. Like the AirPower.

 

[Stewie]

Yes, but almost 3 years behind? Besides, the demand for smartphones wasn't nearly as high as it is now, not exactly the most fair comparison. People expect the latest tech as soon as possible in today's market.

The aveage consumer, or people as you put it, do not care what tech is on the phone. They want cheap and what everyone else has so they can do their facebooking and send messages. A very, very, very small group of people that think tech specs are important expect the lastest tech as soon as possible.

 

[techwhiz]

They really aren’t, not in the US anyway.

5G is a fixed wireless play anyway. Cell carriers want to compete with cable and landline phone carriers for home internet service. I can’t imagine how little benefit mobile users will get from it.

I get more than 100Mbps down and 30Mbps up with a latency of 17ms.
Why do I need 5G when the current LTE can't be fully utilized?
[doublepost=1554399236][/doublepost]

It would be better if Apple could design their own chips. The world would be a better place for Apple (and delays almost eliminated) if Apple did all their own chips.

That's probably less likely to happen.

How do you figure delays almost eliminated?
Apple doesn't own FABs. Engineering is engineering and schedules slip for a variety of reasons.
They would have the same design issues, now just with internal groups and not a supplier.
The engineering challenges don't disappear because Apple is now designing the chip.

 

[Victor Mortimer]

Don't worry, Apple will tell us 4G is better than 5G, and you'll eat it up.

It's not like they haven't done that before. Remember the original iPhone? Yeah, I already had a 3G phone when it came out. Steve told us how much better it was that it only did 2G. Steve lied.

But they didn't just pull that stunt once. Remember when the new iPhone 4S came out? Sure, Samsung had a 4G LTE phone out a year earlier, but Steve told us it was better to not have LTE. It took two years after the first LTE phones were out before Apple had a LTE iPhone with the 5.

So now 5G will slip at least another year, Apple will tell us it's better to not have it, and you'll eat it up.

And Apple will be lying yet again.

 

[mikethemartian]

We already have cars (because of convenience) and now we are dealing with carbon pollution and climate change partly because of cars.

5G on the other hand, is another matter because we already have 4G and the speed on 4G is more than satisfactory for general consumers. So the proper comparison should be we already have cars, but why do we need an even faster car that emits even more pollution?

5G is like that unnecessary faster car that emits more pollution, its increase of base station and higher frequency means your body will be constantly been bombarded with higher RF everyday. And that’s even worst than your WiFi or any other RF radiation.
Why do you think scientists are appealing to the UN to study more on 5G effect to the body. Please do some read up on 5G and effect and you will think twice of its implementation to the general public.

There is a giant nuclear fusion reactor in the sky bombarding us with massive amounts of radiation and you are concerned about 5G?

 

[CostaMoses]

This may be a little off topic as I don't really care if Apple releases 5g phones next year or not, but won't having more people jump to 5g free up some bandwidth for us luddites that are still on 4g so the 4g experience will improve?

 

[THE ONE!!]

Lol. I didn’t actually think that would trigger anyone.

Really lol, theres always one or two that will.never disappoint.

 

[mikethemartian]

They have like $200,000,000,000 in cash to buy people that DO have experience, that's why. You think Tim Cook and Ive are going to be the ones designing modems?

No doubt they have the cash, but do they have the time?

 

[cmaier]

The engineering challenges don't disappear because Apple is now designing the chip.

All true. But apple gets much more visibility into delays if they design their own chips (AirPower foul-up notwithstanding). Often times, if the chip team runs into a delay, they can solve it in software since they control the whole stack. And if the chips do not have to support multiple customers, it’s possible they can be simpler and the design process can be expedited.

 

[mzs.112000]

Sure, I would like Apple to have a 5G iPhone as early as possible, however, it's not like I need 5G, and the good thing is, more people on 5G, means less congestion for those of us still on LTE....

 

[techwhiz]

All true. But apple gets much more visibility into delays if they design their own chips (AirPower foul-up notwithstanding). Often times, if the chip team runs into a delay, they can solve it in software since they control the whole stack. And if the chips do not have to support multiple customers, it’s possible they can be simpler and the design process can be expedited.

No doubt.
I was just indicating to the poster that some of the same types challenges exist for Apple.

 

[ChrisMoBro]

Yeah, come back with some facts before you question sales execution. Apple just wrapped up their most profitable year ever ($60B in profit) and that is ALL sales execution.

Apple understands better than any company on Earth how to execute.

MacBook keyboards are a MINOR issue. Apple shipped 18M+ Macs in 2018. A few threads and complaints is not a design flaw. It's the normal process of shipping 300M different devices per year.
[doublepost=1554387348][/doublepost]
Come back with a fact or argue Apple isn't the most profitable and successful company on Earth?

You guys love to be snarky, but you have no facts.

Apple made $60B in profit in 2018.

#2 made $23B.

Tell me more about how Apple is unsuccessful.
[doublepost=1554387485][/doublepost]
Ready to be wrong? I know the numbers:

JUST for 2018:

• iPhone: 218M
• iPad: 44M
• Mac: 18M

So that is ironclad, 280M devices in 2018 without counting Watch, AirPods, and HomePod. Various estimates support 20M Airpods, 20-25M Watches, and another 1-2M HomePods. That is 325M units of Apple gear, not counting accessories.

Source: 10K (the best data possible) https://s22.q4cdn.com/396847794/files/doc_financials/quarterly/2018/Q4/10-K-2018-(As-Filed).pdf

Your source supports what I said too. It's listed by quarter and only lists iPhone, iPad, and Mac. Add up all 4 quarters and you'll see it's what I said.

China was over 100% the reason for the revenue miss last quarter as stated by Cook and was confirmed in the official numbers. Deals on products are just normal for pushing your stuff. This is a tough game and you have to push harder and harder to sell more and more product.

Keep drinking the Kool Aid, brah