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Apple's Rivalry With Google Gets Personal

cmaier said:
For Apple to beat MS in market share, its stuff would inevitably end up being full of the same compromises and lack of coherent vision as MS's stuff.
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Quoted.For.Truth

Here's another (excerpted) quote i toss into my sig from time to time...

"Regardless of how Apple corporate wants to portray its products,
the Mac isn't a machine for the masses any more than red wine is
the preferred beverage at baseball games.
:
So who cares about ubiquity anyway?" --D. Story​

DaveSW said:
<snip> That is why Google seems to be everywhere, launching or announcing half-assed 2nd-rate wannabe products and throwing everything at the wall to see what sticks. <snip>

iPhone = Android

iPad = Chrome OS Tablet

iTunes = Youtube/Google Video/Google Music Search

Apple App Store = Android Market

Twitter/Facebook = Google Buzz / Orkut

Yahoo Mail!/Hotmail = Gmail (this one's ok but can still be categorized as a "wannabe" product)

MS Office/Outlook = Google Docs/Google Apps

Paypal = Google Checkout

IE/Firefox/Safari = Chrome

Amazon/eBay/Shopping.com = Product Search

Flickr = Picasa

Amazon/Barnes and Noble = Google Books

and so on...
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DynDNS / EveryDNS / OpenDNS = Google "Public" DNS (Dec. 2009)
 
There's a big problem here.

The thought that Apple would think these other new devices is scaring them and could "harm" their sales of the iphone is just plain moron.

Apple, please have more confidence.

With the way Apple integrates their Marketing into Culture and their LONG creditable history as a friendly computer business, Google and Microsoft would never stand a chance. This whole thing is just childish. Here we are again... "Big Egos", "Ruling the World" yata yata yata...

Truth is, there would of NEVER been an Android or Nexus if an iPhone didn't come around. There's nothing like the original. But guess Apple wants the credit.

BOTH companies are guilty.

And why the Hell did Google make a Phone anyway? Because the babies wanted a piece of what Apple had. Google's goal is to control the worlds information. They want people to talk about Google, NOT Apple. They also wanted the attention Apple got with the iphone, so a lot of this is plain jealousy.

Anyway, that's really all this is about when you get to the root of it. We're all a bunch of 4 year olds, for the rest of our lives. We want what we can't have, plain and simple. I'm guilty too :-(
 
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (Linux; U; Android 2.1-update1; en-gb; Nexus One Build/ERE27) AppleWebKit/530.17 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/4.0 Mobile Safari/530.17)

I have no problems with either Apple or Google luckily and will continue to use both services happily.

I would like to say, its good to see how people think the iPhone was the first capacitive handset in its current form factor (See: LG Prada KE850, the first capacitive touchscreen handset which was announced on Dec 12th 2006 and pictured by the Dec 15th 2006).

This has been an interesting read from people on both sides but I'd like to say, screw what the CEOs of big companies do. Get the device(s) and use the software that suits your needs, enjoy using it and sit back and watch the fireworks as the big boys fight.

Sticking with one company out of personal judgement can be detrimental to your computing/smartphone experience. :p
 
Really? Bing? I don't know...

Well, one of the many reasons why I switched to Mac from PC is that it represents a lot of things that Microsoft doesn't. I'm sure you guys all know what I am talking about.

I felt so free when I didn't have to use my old PC notebook or Windows. (Sorry, it is just me, but then again, I guess it makes me a fanboy.) But if Apple ever changes its search engine from Google to Bing on the iPhone, I don't know... Maybe I wouldn't use Bing on the iPhone. I don't know... Maybe it would be time to cancel the Internet data plan... :eek:

How long do you think it would take for Apple to come up with its own search engine? Or buy one for that matter. I mean, it's not like Apple doesn't have money to develop one or acquire one, right? I'm just curious. Cheers. :apple:
 
ChazUK said:
I would like to say, its good to see how people think the iPhone was the first capacitive handset in its current form factor (See: LG Prada KE850, the first capacitive touchscreen handset which was announced on Dec 12th 2006 and pictured by the Dec 15th 2006).
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It took almost a year to get one ready for public release... and thus insiders knew about this long before December 2006.

Note: During the keynote [introducing the iPhone] Steve Jobs said:" This is a day I been looking forward to for 2.5 years..." so Apple worked on the iPhone for at least this time, before the introduction.
 
I think it's funny how easily Apple can brainwash people.

If Apple has some battle against Google, suddenly people who like Apple are saying that "Google is bad, boo!" and most of those people had nothing against Google before that.

If Steve says that Flash causes crashes, suddenly people who like Steve are saying "Adobe is bad, boo!" and many of those people are actually using products by Adobe.

If Apple don't put HDMI to laptops, people who like Apple are saying that "HDMI is bad, boo!" and when Apple finally puts HDMI to laptops, I'm sure those same people will be saying "HDMI is good, I can finally send both picture and audio to my TV using only one cable, I like it!".
 
Master Chief said:
It took almost a year to get one ready for public release... and thus insiders knew about this long before December 2006.

Note: During the keynote [introducing the iPhone] Steve Jobs said:" This is a day I been looking forward to for 2.5 years..." so Apple worked on the iPhone for at least this time, before the introduction.
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I don't entirely get your point? Are we now suggesing LG stole ideas from Apple from the inside?

Wikipedia as source:
Apple announced the iPhone on January 9, 2007
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source
It [prada] was first announced on December 12, 2006.[2] Images of the device appeared on websites such as Engadget Mobile on December 15, 2006.[3] An official press release showing an image of the device appeared on January 18, 2007
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source
Word on the Net has it that the LG Prada masterpiece will make its official debut in less than 3 weeks on the 22nd of March.
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source
The Prada was publicly announced first, images of it were leaked before the iPhone and it debuted on the 22nd of March 2007 and the iPhone had it's release on the 29th of June 2007.

Looks like LG came first to me.
 
I can't understand, why it's so pathetic.

I think the problem with Mr Jobs personally, who can't tolerate any competition, resistance or different opinion organically.

Since his return at 1997, apple saw a few competition.
Their products were so outstanding, that any comparable devices were absent. There was nothing comparable to ipods or Mac OSX.
People didn't choose between apple products and something else, they thought whether they could afford it or not.
Now they see a lot of competition on smart phone market with android devices and probably with forthcoming Windows phone. The same with Windows 7 on laptop market.
Last year HP sales grew faster then Macs and Microsoft income growth outpaced this of Apple. They want to compete with Amazon over printable content, and trends which they want to bring to ebook market ain't good for consumers. Mp3 players market , where they still dominate slowly vanishing and cease to be profitable in 3-4 year.

The idea itself that Apple competitors are "evil" it's pretty stupid. It's a business. All this hysteria about Google "betrayal" is funny. Corporations couldn't be friends, they aren't people. Google shouldn't satisfy Apple fanboys or MS haters. They should conduct their business the way they think is best. They do. Apple does, Microsoft does.

Don't worry about good and evil, left it for philosophers. Don't bring ideology to consuming.
 
From where I'm sitting, and this is just how I view things after watching recent events unfold, is that Jobs is still disturbed at the whole Windows/Microsoft scenario that occurred in the mid 80's at the time of the first Macintosh.

Back then, if I'm getting my nerd history correct, Apple were the huge company on the ascendancy and Microsoft were the young upstarts. Microsoft managed to beat Apple to the punch by essentially stripping down Mac OS and using it to develop the first version of Windows.

I think that experience could be what has made Jobs the paranoid individual he is, he will not allow someone "inside" to rip him or his company/products off. Schmidt sat on the Apple board during the development of the iPhone, I would imagine he's seen the prototypes or some versions of them at some point, and has sat there and absorbed the information as much as possible. I don't think Schmidt came and sat on the Apple board with the sole intention of ripping Apple off. However I do think Schmidt seen a feasible business model that he didn't think existed for "computing" companies, ie: mobile phones.

When Jobs unveiled the iPhone in 2007 he told the audience that he'd been waiting two and a half years for the moment he could unveil the device. So it's obvious Apple had been working on the iPhone for a long time before launching it.

Look at mobile phones before the launch of the iPhone, and take the blinkers off before doing so. Touch screens were rare but unresponsive, often requiring a stylus for precise control ... in fact some, namely from Nokia, still do operate better with a stylus. The whole full front touch screen/minimal physical button interface didn't exist, and neither did actual dedicated Apps or changing the device orientation to alter the display from portrait to landscape.

The iPhone DID change mobile phones forever, because as soon as every mobile manufacturer seen what the iPhone did, they set out to imitate it ... please note my choice of words, "imitate". I'm not accusing anyone of copying, although on closer inspection you can understand why some within Apple, including Jobs, could feel like they're being ripped off.

Does Jobs paranoia grate at times? Of course it does, but we all know he's somewhat self centred and ego maniacal ... but he wouldn't be the successful CEO he is if he weren't that way inclined.
 
teme said:
I think it's funny how easily Apple can brainwash people.

If Apple has some battle against Google, suddenly people who like Apple are saying that "Google is bad, boo!" and most of those people had nothing against Google before that.

If Steve says that Flash causes crashes, suddenly people who like Steve are saying "Adobe is bad, boo!" and many of those people are actually using products by Adobe.

If Apple don't put HDMI to laptops, people who like Apple are saying that "HDMI is bad, boo!" and when Apple finally puts HDMI to laptops, I'm sure those same people will be saying "HDMI is good, I can finally send both picture and audio to my TV using only one cable, I like it!".
Click to expand...

Flash on Mac OS X is a joke, a resource hog of the highest proportion that shows off how poorly optimised it is. This in turn, from where I'm sitting, shows a massive lack of commitment and effort on Adobe's part.

While applications like CS3 and CS4 run well on the Mac, it seems Adobe just cannot be bothered optimising Flash to work on the Mac properly without heating up your iMac to levels that could cook a full English breakfast.
 
Apple will probably not use Bing as their search engine for the iPhone. This has been discussed earlier, and the rumour turned out to be based on nothing much. Everyone agrees that Google is the best search engine, simply because most people use Google, allowing it to collect more data about searches than other engines, giving better search results.

I don't think Apple would use a worse search engine, made by their even bigger competitor, Microsoft, just to annoy Google. As far as we can see, most companies, including Apple, prioritise user experience before most things. So I don't think anyone should be afraid of Bing now.

I can't say much for the competition between Apple and Google, all I can say is that I see people all the time with iPhones in their hands, be it young people, women or men. This shows that it works for everyone. On the other hand, I've never seen anyone with an Android device. The only place I've ever seen Android phones was on the internet. I wouldn't be able to tell you what kind of shop to go to to buy an Android phone, I have no idea. I'm not saying they don't exist, I'm saying that they don't have as much character and personality as iPhones, thus blending in with the rest. The iPhone has its own category, and every other phone falls in the "Other phones" category. You either have an iPhone or another phone. I've never thought that Google is competing with Apple much.

Now I understand patent infringement with Multi-Touch and all. However, that's totally normal. Companies sue each other all the time for stuff like that.

But I don't see any of Google's technologies being dangerous for anyone... I mean Gmail quickly replaced Hotmail for many of us, but that's about it. We all use Google search but there was nothing before that. I use Google Maps all the time, but that's also something unique to Google, no other company makes such a good mapping service.

Google are very "Open Source"-based and they're really experimental. They love trying new stuff that eventually doesn't work, and they have the money to do that. Apple, on the other hand, only tries stuff that is bound to work. They work in different ways, and I think the two companies complete each other rather than replaces one another. Google's Chrome Operating System is also something that doesn't compete with Apple. I don't see that being competition to the iPad, I see it as a slight competition to Windows and Linux based netbooks, but seriously, it's not really an OS, it's a freakin' browser, no local storage, no music, no native apps, no media whatsoever except for YouTube. It has nothing to do with the iPad.

The Google Chrome browser was a good hit, especially for people stuck on very old computers. Other than that, it's not such a big innovation.

So yeah, I don't think Google has any dangerously amazing ideas at this time.
 
ChazUK said:
I don't entirely get your point? Are we now suggesing LG stole ideas from Apple from the inside?
...
Looks like LG came first to me.
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No, but some people think that Apple knew about Prada's phone long before the iPhone came out. That Steve made that remark just to be first. But I'm not one of these people.
 
Master Chief said:
No, but some people think that Apple knew about Prada's phone long before the iPhone came out. That Steve made that remark just to be first. But I'm not one of these people.
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I don't know who suggested in this thread that Apple copied LG but I have seen some posts stating that without the iPhone, HTC (and others) wouldn't be producing large screen, capacitive screened handsets as if Apple were the first to produce a phone this form factor.

With LG's announcement in 2006 and subsequent release in 2007, it seems that phones were headed in this direction regardless of the existence of the iPhone.
 
NinjaHERO said:
It's so funny. This site used to be very pro Google. Now that Apple and Google are "battling" suddenly everyone thinks they are evil. Hilarious.

Please Steve Jobs, tell us who we should hate next. LMAO
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So true. Some people are like sheep - unable to think for themselves.

WeegieMac said:
Flash on Mac OS X is a joke, a resource hog of the highest proportion that shows off how poorly optimised it is. This in turn, from where I'm sitting, shows a massive lack of commitment and effort on Adobe's part.
Click to expand...

Actually, some of the fault lies on Apple. OSX does not provide the necessary API to enable Flash to make use of hardware acceleration, therefore until this changes, Flash will be inefficient on the Mac, compared to its windows counterpart ( Windows does provide the necessary API ).
 
DaveSW said:
Is Google becoming a ravenous rat?


Google is a one hit wonder and they know it.

That is why Google seems to be everywhere, launching or announcing half-assed 2nd-rate wannabe products and throwing everything at the wall to see what sticks. They add or change features and modify the business model.

Other than that there is absolutely very little innovation in Google products.

Some Google products have nice features and are actually helpful, but there's nothing that I can think of that can make me say.."wow that's brilliant".

They're good at search (and maybe mail). that's it.

and if you think Google is the model company everyone think they are. Think again. They're one of the most evil companies out there.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Censorship_by_Google





iPhone = Android

iPad = Chrome OS Tablet

iTunes = Youtube/Google Video/Google Music Search

Apple App Store = Android Market

Twitter/Facebook = Google Buzz / Orkut

Yahoo Mail!/Hotmail = Gmail (this one's ok but can still be categorized as a "wannabe" product)

MS Office/Outlook = Google Docs/Google Apps

Paypal = Google Checkout

IE/Firefox/Safari = Chrome

Amazon/eBay/Shopping.com = Product Search

Flickr = Picasa

Amazon/Barnes and Noble = Google Books

and so on...
Click to expand...

Youtube and Google Video are nothing like iTunes. Google Checkout was not meant to compete with PayPal and they differ in many ways. Orkut came before Twitter and Facebook. Picasa came before Flickr. And Product Search is nothing like Amazon or eBay since Google doesn't actually sell anything. And Google's concepts and ideas of how the Chrome OS might look on a tablet were released 2 days before the iPad announcement.


Any more fail?
 
Stella said:
Actually, some of the fault lies on Apple. OSX does not provide the necessary API to enable Flash to make use of hardware acceleration, therefore until this changes, Flash will be inefficient on the Mac, compared to its windows counterpart ( Windows does provide the necessary API ).
Click to expand...

Interesting.

When my wife plays Farmville on Facebook for an hour, the top left corner of my iMac is hot enough to cook breakfast on ... it's frightening.

However, it's also given me a fantastic excuse to ban Farmville in the house. :D
 
baryon said:
Apple will probably not use Bing as their search engine for the iPhone. This has been discussed earlier, and the rumour turned out to be based on nothing much. Everyone agrees that Google is the best search engine, simply because most people use Google, allowing it to collect more data about searches than other engines, giving better search results.
Click to expand...
Quality of a search engine doesn't depend on how many people use this. Just on the interface, crawling and parsing algorithms e.g. results relevance, and the way how results are presented
 
distortedloop said:
I also had Palm Vx

1543949067_e8e7063604.jpg
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A great device for it's time... Palm lost there way though not long after and did not evolve... closed their research labs...
 
If Apple feels that Google has copied them and entered the mobile device market via the success of Apple... then maybe Apple should fight fire with fire.

Buy Yahoo.

When Apple goes Cloud crazy and MobileMe becomes everything it could become, then a search site would complete the package.
 
niuniu said:
Nailed it. Never seen so many Adobe and Google critics since Jobs came out supposedly against them. Reality distortion in full effect :cool:
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+1

People need to think for themselves instead of agreeing with everything Jobs says. I notice a lot of people here now prefer Bing over Google just because Jobs says that Google is bad. The same is true for Adobe critics. Adobe used to be well respected on these forums now it is nothing but a junk software maker.
 
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