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Discussion in 'MacRumors.com News Discussion' started by MacRumors, May 16, 2019.
Tarrifs baby watch out that notch will cost you 50 bucks more lol
Smart phones are becoming a commodity. When the user can't tell the difference then a commodity is created and the lowest cost provider wins.
Used iPhones are getting cheaper now too especially on Facebook Marketplace. I got me a used iPhone X and iPhone 8 Plus for total of $650 from a co-worker. I saw a lot of iPhone 7 Plus for sale for $200-250 which is still a really good phone imo. Apple Watch is kinda different though some people still want to sell their series 1 for $200 which is ridiculous and funny.
Well you wont buy it but many others wood. Currently the cheapest iPhone xs on swappa is selling for $744. The average is over 800 though.
Their sure is!
It is roughly in line with all other Statistics, that Apple has 60%+ of Market Share in Smartphone in US, ( not Shipment Numbers ). The only market where these Active Devices would not represent one Active users is in China where the culture norm is to have two or even many. Not to mention there are millions of iPhone only use for writing fake reviews and all sort of other uses. But in the grand scheme of things those number *should* still be a small percentage. Apple has roughly 300M active iPhone in China.
The highest iPhone market penetration is Japan, where at one point it was over 80%. I believe it is still over 70% now.
I believe Apple is aiming at 1B iPhone users in 2020. Assuming China don't have a significant drop in iPhone usage, And then there could be another 300M possible iPhone users from the India and SEA market in the next 5 years.
Again we will need to see how BBK, Huawei and Xiaomi play their Cards. For now the XR seems to be doing good enough. But of course we demand more, Apple and its press will need to work harder on its value proposition and not sit on its branding to do its job.
I missed where you were talking about developing markets, however this makes your point makes even less sense lol.
Are you from a developing market? Because I am so I have first hand experience.
1. Most developing markets dont have an Apple store, so how should they sign up for the iup program?
2. Many developing markets has tariffs on phones, so they wont be paying just $50 per month.
3. I can't speak for every developing country but the one I am from, majority do not purchase on lease or contracts because the prices are so jacked up. So please show me proof where this is a fact of the market.
4. If you think consumers in developing countries can't afford 1000 then why do you think they can afford 50 dollars every month which works out to be more expensive than buying outright?
5. Majority of consumers in developing countries hold on to their phones for MUCH longer. A 1000 XS they would keep for at least 2-3 years. However an XS in most developing countries wouldn't cost just 1000 dollars.
Back to my first point...how does Apple push their iup program when they dont have a store in these countries? Why do you think Apple does not have a store in most of these countries?
As long as it's growing, it doesn't much matter. It may not even matter regardless as the resale market for Apple devices is huge and iPhone's last so long. In the end, Apple made the right move pivoting to wearables, which is the next big thing in tech. They have a huge lead there already.
Who said users don’t know the difference? Cars are a commodity also.
Such rant for nothing. Go read my post and tell me where I said “developing”. Re read my post and stop embarrassing yourself.
Is this sarcasm?
Apple relies on its iPhone and services for their greatest revenue. With all smartphone sale plateauing, Apple truly must come up with the "next best thing" to maintain long term revenue growth, not just rely on price increases.
Leasing is leasing. Using credit for something not necessary is not financially wise. People should realize one thing that by putting everything in credit is living beyond financial means. If someone cannot afford buying a thousand dollar iPhone upfront, then they should buy something less.
Only thing that should put on credit is something will appreciate in value, i.e house. I failed to understand why would anyone sign themselves up to bunch of loans that need to be repaid every month and put themselves into a situation for living pay by pay.
Some currencies have seen dramatic losses against the US dollar. Apple actually adjusted prices in some countries on certain models such that Apple is absorbing price increases due to foreign currency exchange rates, instead of passing them on to customers. Although that reduces profitability, it does increase unit sales
They already have, wearables. Apple Watch and AirPods already own a large chunk of the market and have a ton of potential. iPhone isn't going anywhere so they'll still see revenue there and obviously services has huge upside as well. It all works in conjunction.
Lmao why did I see developed first then see developing later.
Doesnt matter how you twist it, iup works out more expensive. That's why so much people are in debt. They look on the payments each month instead of the total price. Oh its just 400 a month for a BMW over 6 years?! I can afford that!
Their is no advantage other than convenience.
Because Investment and stock trader firms (who don't actually put money into the company itself, but are just playing the market) don't care about any of that. They just care about return on their stock. And stock pricing is entirely speculative based on future performance.
If stock buyers purchase with a set expectation in sales and revenue growth, and numbers come out that don't meet their expectations, than the speculative market will punish the price.
It's also why when Apple stopped reporting unit sales numbers the stock market punished the stock as well. Information not available leads to further speculation, which affects the price.
Apple knew this would happen for years. No way you can sustain high growth year over year. It has to plateau, no matter what you do. So this should t be a negative on Apple.
That’s your opinion and preference. Doesn’t change the fact of the market. In the US, for example, most smartphones are sold through carrier contracts and/or some type of leasing programs. That’s the fact of the market, and I believe this is my original point that since that’s the case, Apple should be pushing its iUP program further. Your insistence about your choice doesn’t really change the facts.
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So it’s me twisting it despite you read my post wrong? Ok buddy, just stop it before you embarrass yourself further. Enough.
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Apple's big advantage is they still have the innovation edge, and they still know how to design gorgeous products that integrate seamlessly into our luscious ecosystem.
I'm still upgrading iPhone every year because I want the best technology money can buy, and every year I'm still seeing giant leaps forward.
The problem with the reliance on wearables as a secondary stream of income is their reliance on iPhone as the primary.
if iPhone user base drops (playing rhetorical here, this isn't true today), than the market for those wearables also declines.
While these wearables (Including HomePod in this) are making good mint now. They are still way to explicitly linked to the iPhone.
Where Apple has to venture to for the pundits to be more satisfied is more open platform options to sell goods/services to non-iPhone users.
much of Apple's initial iPhone sales practices were based on eco-system lock down and tie in. For a long time, the notion was that the services and integrations between iPhone, Mac, iPad were stand above anything else available. The only way to experience this was to go all-in with Apple.
As the markets matured, more and more other vendors are offering many of the same features and ecosystem compatibilities, without the lock-in.
I think Apple has started doing the right things and disentangling all of their services from iPhone directly. Things like AppleTV being available on 3rd party televisiions is the right move. The credit card and venturing into financial services with the backing of their wealth is a good move.
Jacking up the price of the iphone to sell less, but with higher profit? not a good long term move.
But those two things are relatively inexpensive compared to the iPhone.
Wearables is a growth area but has years to go before really realized as a huge revenue producer.
Right now, the watch really needs to be tied to an iPhone to utilize its full potential. Sure, iPhone isn’t going anywhere but still needs to keep growing at a good pace. I’ll never give up my iPhone but after 32 years of buying Apple products, they are slipping a little in the innovation leadership/bang for large bucks territory.
I think Apple is very happy:
Statcounter reports that iOS has significantly higher usage share than Android in many developed nations around the world.
Countries where Apple’s iOS dominates Android by web share:
Japan: iOS = 72%. Android = 27%
Australia: iOS = 64%. Android = 36%
Canada: iOS = 64%. Android = 36%
Sweden: iOS = 63%. Android = 36%
Denmark: iOS = 62%. Android = 38%
USA: iOS = 58%. Android = 41%
UK: iOS = 55%. Android = 44%
Norway: iOS = 53%. Android = 47%
And a few other countries where iOS is very close to Android
Singapore: iOS = 45%. Android = 54%
Netherlands: iOS = 44%. Android = 55%
And China is right on the worldwide average for iOS web share – one reason why the glabal average for iOS is dragged down so far:
China: iOS = 27%. Android = 70%
However, more importantly Apple is in fact the dominant OS in all the metrics that actually matter worldwide.
Apple dominates the Business mobile and tablet markets to the tune of 72% - 82% worldwide for example.
iOS users generate an incredible 1,790% greater advertising ROI than Android users, the latter of whom actually lost money for advertisers according to Nanigans.
Google is reliant on the iOS platform for an amazing 75% of their mobile search revenue.
App Annie reports that Apple's iOS platform generates 90% greater 3rd party App Developer revenue than Android.
Apple's iOS platform generates 400% more e-commerce revenue for retailers in the US than the Android platform according to IBM and Adobe.
And that is not even considering Apple's revenue and profit share figures for every industry that they participate in.
Lmao when I said you twist it I meant no matter how you twist the iup program it's still more expensive. I read wrong when I thought you said developing.
You're right most buy on contract. My point grom my very first post was that you seemed to be implying with the iup program you save money which you dont.
You make some good points. Obviously I think the long term goal will be to remove reliance on the iPhone, but at the same time - that reliance may keep customers coming back as they are happy with their wearables and Apple still offers a quality phone, which we will likely keep on our person for years to come, although likely smaller. I get the price thing, but this is typical Apple and it has always worked out for them. The competition today very well may force prices down (probably a solid move either way) though and I think that's a great thing for customers. In the end, Apple is still in a very envious position when it comes to tech products and anybody claiming they are in the decline is delusional in my opinion. Do they need to make some changes? For sure, cost being one, they could open up a ton of customization options or other software changes to drive growth, really get aggressive when it comes to hardware, etc. but they have always taken the slow road. The numbers today may force them to accelerate in these areas, which is good for everyone.
Yup. Despite how everybody thinks the Android OEMs are doing better, every single one of them want to be like Apple.
However, there is the issue of “where do you go from here?” Apple seems to get the handle of the developed markets, but the next wave will be from the emerging markets. Apple’s main selling point is their store experience and support, which is severely lacking in many emerging markets due to local regulations. Apple needs to go in to keep their brand image since even today, too many resellers and independent stores tricking customers in the emerging markets. IMO that’s something where Apple needs to think about as their competitors are gaining huge tractions over Apple.
Case in point, Singapore. During the early iPhone days, Singapore was like an iPhone country. Literally every single person on the subway was using a version of the iPhone. The rumor of an Apple store was there, but it never happened (until recently). Meanwhile, Samsung pushed heavily and have taken over a large chunk of the brand mindset from the consumers there. Now Apple is only at 45% or so based on your stat. This could’ve been 60 or 70% if Apple had acted quickly and built their Apple store sooner.
The next challenge are countries like India and Indonesia. Just a percentage point in these markets mean a lot of people due to their population. Apple seems to be looking at India at least, but the damage is done with the Chinese going in heavily into these markets.