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everyone's sales is being affected. everyone's market share is not.

apple's latest notebook renewal was clearly turn to worse.


First off, your grammar is completely ridiculous. Second, if you seriously believe, that the new macbook line up is a turn for the worse, you are off your rocker.

Third, why don't people actually read the article? The Q4 for Apple is generally lower than others. This is not a big deal, seriously.
 
Actually, you're not grasping growth.

I do grasp it.

I was commenting to someone who said that the Q4 drop is normal.

It is, but I pointed out that it looks a bit more serious of a drop than in recent years.

In fact, there's been negative growth since Q2.

But of course, it's only one data point.
 
I do grasp it.

I was commenting to someone who said that the Q4 drop is normal.

It is, but I pointed out that it looks a bit more serious of a drop than in recent years.

In fact, there's been negative growth since Q2.

But of course, it's only one data point.

We're in the midst of a severe recession. Nobody is immune. As I pointed out above, a much more meaningful way of interpreting these numbers is to compare Apple's YoY sales growth the the rest of the industry's YoY sales growth. By that measure, Apple is doing far better than the balance of the industry, just as they have been for the last several years.
 
It's funny you mention that.

I was just in a Sony Store this past weekend. I hadn't set foot in one for years and thought I'd look at the laptops to see what sort of competition Apple was up against.

I was really surprised at the specs and price points. I remember Sony as always being the other "way overpriced" computer manufacturer, but they had an 18" laptop with 1TB storage, 4GB ram, a BluRay drive and FW for $1,700! And remember, this was at the horrible Sony Store, which sells things for MSRP and above. I bet you could easily find that model from a reseller for under $1,500!

And that's all just the high end competition. With all these Net Books nibbling at the low end, I'm not very optimistic as far as Apple is concerned.

If you type "Sony Loss" into Google, you'll find that Sony is posting a $1.1 billion operating loss, the first loss in 14 years. Maybe Apple knows something that Sony doesn't.
 
191704-gartner_4Q08_us_trend.png


Actually, if you look at the chart, it has gone downhill a bit. In the two previous years, Q4 was down from Q3 - but still higher than Q2. In the latest year, Q4 was even down from Q2.

You're right. But year ago Apple had better lineup than today; we're all practically awaiting new products and therefore not buying anything (if possible). Give us new desktops and at least I'm buying :) Mac Pro, where are you?
 
If you type "Sony Loss" into Google, you'll find that Sony is posting a $1.1 billion operating loss, the first loss in 14 years. Maybe Apple knows something that Sony doesn't.

I reckon that has a lot more to do with things like their music label and motion picture divisions (both areas Apple doesn't deal with) than electronics, but I could be wrong...
 
Perhaps Apple's lack of interest in the netbook market ought to be reconsidered.

Only if there is profit -- otherwise, what's the point? Apple jumping in on the race to the bottom isn't a great strategy...

Any one have recent profit data on Acer? I seem to recall they earn a very slim 3-4%, but I could be wrong on that.
 
Only if there is profit -- otherwise, what's the point? Apple jumping in on the race to the bottom isn't a great strategy...

Any one have recent profit data on Acer? I seem to recall they earn a very slim 3-4%, but I could be wrong on that.

Acer was not profitable in 2008.

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WHEN Apple produces a pocketable computer in the same size range, I expect it will make the current round of netbooks look sick and pretty much blow away that market as Apple is currently blowing away the Smartphone market.
Why would Apple build a netbook when they're "just a fad," as you say? Not to mention that Steve doesn't see the appeal of netbooks, anyway.

Not to mention that the primary appeal of the netbook market is the price. If Apple builds a netbook that starts $500 or more, I doubt it will be all that successful. The Sony Vaio P, for example, is very tempting, but starts at $900, which makes it more of an ultra-portable than a true netbook.
 
Apple's "netbook" should be a 10" MacBook Air

Not to mention that the primary appeal of the netbook market is the price. If Apple builds a netbook that starts $500 or more, I doubt it will be all that successful. The Sony Vaio P, for example, is very tempting, but starts at $900, which makes it more of an ultra-portable than a true netbook.

I don't get the assumption that an Apple netbook would have to compete with the $300 tier of netbooks. Apple doesn't compete in the bottom price bracket in any of their existing models - so why not a premium netbook?

Think more of a 10" MacBook Air, and that $700 to $900 price point is fine. (10" is about the minimum for an adult-sized keyboard.)

Use the Atom CPU for long battery life. Make it a bit thicker than the MBA, and square the edges a bit so that ports won't need the door flap. Add a couple of ports, too.

And give it a 3G radio, finally.
 
It's funny you mention that.

I was just in a Sony Store this past weekend. I hadn't set foot in one for years and thought I'd look at the laptops to see what sort of competition Apple was up against.

I was really surprised at the specs and price points. I remember Sony as always being the other "way overpriced" computer manufacturer, but they had an 18" laptop with 1TB storage, 4GB ram, a BluRay drive and FW for $1,700! And remember, this was at the horrible Sony Store, which sells things for MSRP and above. I bet you could easily find that model from a reseller for under $1,500!

And that's all just the high end competition. With all these Net Books nibbling at the low end, I'm not very optimistic as far as Apple is concerned.

Check it out.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834117831

Man that is a good computer for the price from Sony!!!! Are you kidding me,
 
It's funny in a strange and sad way, but this debate about what Apple should be doing continues on and on, despite the fact that Apple once again has outperformed the rest of the PC industry by a huge margin. Still, the argument that they must be doing something horribly wrong persists -- even when the objective evidence continues to show that precisely the opposite is true.

All I can say is, it's a good thing none of you are running the company.
 
Check it out.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834117831

Man that is a good computer for the price from Sony!!!! Are you kidding me,

If you read the reviews on Newegg (i.e., using the link you provided), you will note that the price point is obviously subsidized by bloatware. That being said, I'm sure an advanced user will figure out how to disable or re-install... but good luck to the rest of the world.
 
If you read the reviews on Newegg (i.e., using the link you provided), you will note that the price point is obviously subsidized by bloatware. That being said, I'm sure an advanced user will figure out how to disable or re-install... but good luck to the rest of the world.

I don't read anything to indicated this machine is any different than every other PC - they've all got bloatware preinstalled. And I'm not sure at all about any PC being "subsidized" by software either...

What makes me crazy is the bloatware MS Office 2004 preinstalled on my Macbook that keeps taking over my Office X that I installed on my own. Talk about bloatware that you can't get rid of...
 
I don't read anything to indicated this machine is any different than every other PC - they've all got bloatware preinstalled. And I'm not sure at all about any PC being "subsidized" by software either...

4th paragraph.

What makes me crazy is the bloatware MS Office 2004 preinstalled on my Macbook that keeps taking over my Office X that I installed on my own. Talk about bloatware that you can't get rid of...

I agree that does suck. I found this using Google search "how to remove ms office 2004 trial from mac os x".
 
4th paragraph.



I agree that does suck. I found this using Google search "how to remove ms office 2004 trial from mac os x".

$50 to remove bloatware? I'll admit that does imply subsidization.... doh! Still, even with $50 extra, that laptop does seem like a good deal. Mostly I like the idea of Blu-ray...

Things are OK regarding Office on my Macbook now. It seemed to have been gone twice, but then mysteriously resurrected itself. I'm not sure what I did differently, but now the beast seems gone for good... :D
 
Apple's share will increase once they come out with a new Mini and an updated iMac.
The Mini needs to come out yesterday.:cool:
 
In all this talk about Steve's health and how Apple will tank without him as CEO, I think you could legitimately argue that he is now starting to hold back Apple.

You know, many people are going to agree with you, especially since Apple's stock numbers dropped about 8% last night immediately after Jobs' email. However, in looking at Apple's numbers today, they made up almost 6 points and are only down 2.3% from time of close yesterday--before his email. This tells me that despite the news, Apple's prospects are still good and are expecting to resume their steady rise in installed market.

I think it's missed that the lack of decent update to the Mac mini, the lack of decent sub-$900 Macbook, and Steve's opposition to a mini-notebook and obsession with ridiculously high-end user unfriendly boutique laptops with non-removable batteries has resulted in Apple NOT fully capitalizing on their success of the ipod/itunes combo in capturing more of the computer market share. Very, very few parents are springing for 17 inch Macbook Pros.

However, parents and individuals, as well as businesses, are still buying nearly every model at a higher rate than they did this same time last year. It seems your logic fails in the face of real numbers.


I was talking to a devoted Apple fan whose Titanium Powerbook was finally dying. He would like a Macbook Air but the price compared to what he needs it for has him for the first time considering Windows based mini-notebook. Apple is passing up a market they could have possibly owned a large junk of.

When times get better, is someone going to switch back to Apple ?

Why should they, when they're not switching away? Ok, I'll grant that some may buy cheaper during this downturn, but in all honesty, just go into any Apple store and watch how quickly new machines are going out the door. Their numbers are still showing increasing growth despite the current problems.

I, for one, can't see the benefit of a downsized laptop when you still have to put it down on something and use two hands to type on it. Something better is already on the market and it won't be that long before something revolutionary is available.
 
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