Heh, true. They are even making a solid profit, unlike Tesla. I would not begrudge Tesla to win over these competitors. But each of them is enormous and has been around for over a century; they are in it for the long run and have a lot of weight to throw around. They can afford to spend years on catching up technologically. Until then they can out-produce and undercut a small company like Tesla to stay in business, and once they are on the same level technologically, it will only get worse. This race is not over.
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Chris Lattner Says Opportunity to Work on Tesla's Ambitious Self-Driving Efforts Was 'Irresistible'
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Heh, true. They are even making a solid profit, unlike Tesla. I would not begrudge Tesla to win over these competitors. But each of them is enormous and has been around for over a century; they are in it for the long run and have a lot of weight to throw around. They can afford to spend years on catching up technologically. Until then they can out-produce and undercut a small company like Tesla to stay in business, and once they are on the same level technologically, it will only get worse. This race is not over.
Nice distraction, Wikidictionary. Defunct. It's not happening with them old brands anymore. Gone, gone, gone. I'd be shittin' oil bricks if I had any investments with those old car manufacturers.
My husband and I each own GM trucks. Mine can burn fuel synthesized from corn, but it's hard to find where I live. Someday all cars will be electric and hopefully when that day comes, our power plants will also be clean energy sources, too--though wind power comes at the cost of subsonic noise pollution that may be harming wildlife and humans (I experienced that first hand from a different cause, it will drive a person insane) and the wind turbines themselves are killing endangered birds at an alarming rate. http://science.howstuffworks.com/environmental/energy/risks-associated-wind-energy1.htm
http://www.michigancapitolconfidential.com/20690
Also we need to figure out the battery technology. We need to figure out how to manage the costs of production, of ownership (very high for a friend of ours who owns a hybrid) and figure out the recycling or disposal to reduce environmental impact.
Meanwhile, our existing vehicles are far from defunct. And the assisted driving on my husband's truck is amazing. It really isn't too far off from self driving. He gave me a demonstration out on an open stretch of empty highway down south and I was awestruck by how good it was. If GM keeps developing it they could have an autonomous car in a few years. My own truck assists me with an incredible array of sensors and cameras. I had been driving a 24 year old car that doesn't even have power windows, so this has been an eye opening experience for me.
And if you ever stop and take stock at how many accidents there are, you would not deride "metal junk". I don't know anyone, not one single man, woman or child who has not been in an auto accident of some kind. My husband, who has had to log a lot of miles over the years on our congested crazy roads, has been hit by inattentive drivers in rear end collisions and head on collisions, as well as by one insane deer. He and many of our friends riding with him would not be alive if he had not switched over to heavy bodied metal trucks few years ago after having his lightweight economy car smashed into too many times.
I'm not saying your vision is the wrong one. Oh no, no, no. But we are not even close yet to being there. It is doing a disservice to the future to deny that even such desirable outcomes as what Tesla is trying to achieve is the only alternative and is completely without environmental and safety impacts, at least currently.
We need to keep open a frank discussion of the merits and costs of all the choices open to us at a given point in time.
...then they don't need software developers, they need lawyers and rent-a-senators to get the regulations in place, because if it's going to be "enabled" by the end of the year, the software needs to be pretty much finished and in to comprehensive proving trials by now.
Seriously, there is a huge, huge gap between 'low-hanging fruit' like self-parking and cruise-control-plus and complete driver replacement.
...with a professionally-trained pilot and co pilot standing ready to intervene, backed up by a team of air traffic controllers ensuring that no other plane gets within a quarter of a mile of them and massive international cooperation on standards and procedures.
If self-driving cars just had to follow the road and choose the correct gear we'd have had them 20 years ago. The problem with driving is maintaining an adequate speed while avoiding pedestrians, cyclists and other cars (some of them suicidally stupid) passing within inches of you at speed and simultaneously observing a rat's nest of badly-designed signage and (in the US) laws that change every time you cross a county line. Plus, a car-maker has to assume that the driver is a moron (because a percentage of them will be) and, as soon as you tell them to take their hands off the wheel, they will kick back, crack open a beer and start updating their Facebook page. Heck, too many already do that, even without the opportunity to blame the consequences on faulty software.
I'm sure we'll get there in 10-20 years (It'll take 5 years to get the legislation through), but I'm not holding my breath.
Yup, and there's the difference between Tesla and Apple.
Tesla is a carmaker, already selling high-end EVs that are already pretty popular, and they've put a lot of shoe leather in undermining the dealer model and building infrastructure. Short-term - they have the Model 3. In 10 years' time, when self-driving on real roads becomes a reality, they hope to have hundreds of thousands of cars already on the road, which will become self-driving at the flick of a switch the moment the legislation is signed, making them the instant market leader in autonomous cars. Plenty that could go wrong (including running out of cash, talking-up self-driving too soon or taking the eye of the Model 3 ball), but its still one heck of a plan.
Apple makes phones, watch straps, onanistic coffee-table books and (occasionally) computers. The computer market has reached saturation now, the phone market has reached saturation now and it looks like they've backed the wrong horse on the smartwatch (the killer app is fitness and, surprise, people want cheap, light Fitbit-style bands on their wrists when doing sports, not huge $600 do-it-all bricks). Unless they want to downsize, sit back, pack the kids off to college and enjoy the long third age of the Mac and iPhone, they need a sexy new product now - preferably in the personal electronics or music market where they have a reputation. A self-driving car in 5, 10 years time from a company with no history in the car market (up against a competitor that is more Apple-like than Apple) isn't going to cut it.
If Apple really want a self driving car - wait: pretty soon, Tesla are gonna have to announce how many of those hundreds of thousands or $1000 deposits have matured into firm, $30,000+ orders... and its bound to be a lot less than 100%... which shouldn't be a problem because 30% of that will still be a darned healthy order book (and easier to deliver). However, there is bound to be some stupid negative press and investor wobbles, so it could be a good time for Apple to use some of their Scrooge McDuck golden swimming pool to snap up a bargain.
So you don't have any studies to quote then, it's more just a feeling you have?
Enivronmental impact is about more than just emissions. Nor are you considering the impact of manufacturing and disposal. It strikes me that assuming your electricity is from renewable resources is gullible. 8% of the US supply is renewable.
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energy_in_the_United_States
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I just came up with another idea... the cams could be mounted inside the car on the dashboard and not be exposed to the weather at all. I am going to patent the idea.
I'm not talking about vision, I'm talking about the here an now. Tesla zero emission cars are here, and they are now, and they're increasing in presence. I see them increase every month on the road. "Assisted driving" is not autonomous, it's less safe than autonomous. GM assisted driving is a completely low bar. From what I see on the road, most people don't need trucks. Tesla is here. That clean energy day is here. Embrace it, it will be worth it.
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Not a feeling. Honest facts. Buring oil is complete pollution. It's indisputable. Don't need a link for that basic building block of a fact.
Most people here who question his new role wouldn't understand in any profound way what he does anyway. They are the smartest people in the world and actively being recruited for fields they no nothing about.
It isn't exactly like Steve Jobs took a job at Mcdonald's. If there was no synergy or match this marriage of convenience simply wouldn't have happened. Let's all hope for the best. It pains me to tune into a tech site like Macrumors only to be confronted with the most confrontational opinions to oppose the newest technologies.
The amount of negativity on just like things such as airpods is disturbing. The day we will have wireless charging, self driving cars, and codes that will write and compile themselves is nearly here.
I do not get the negativity towards new technologies on a tech site such as this. It is an exciting time in the world today and the naysayers with no vision are dinosaurs.
LOL. Hmmm.... okay. So you obviously can't build a case because you are wilfully ignoring the manufacturing and disposal impact and the fact most of your electricity is produced by 'dirty' methods. Good job. /s
Yes there are obstacles I just no longer understand why on a tech site people give all the reasons things can't be done rather than unleash their imaginations about how it could work. @GrumpyMom
You could have said that about Apple Maps in 2012. Yet in just four short, perhaps painful at times, years it now leads the world in maps. Leads it right off a cliff but still...
Mike
@GrumpyMom
Everyone, maybe you missed the video in the article. Here. And. Now. It. Is. Today.
Despite BMW, GM, Mercedes, Ford, VW etc etc being in the game for decades, NONE can do this. NONE can do without burning oil.
Tesla blows them all away.
Here in the western USA driving from city to city can take hours on desolate roads. AP would be great for that.
No one else in the tech space is building their own car because it's incredibly risky. Cars are one of, if not the most, complicated consumer products available right now. A laptop or phone is peanuts compared to developing, testing, and producing a road vehicle. Even with all the hype around Tesla, I think people are still shorting the company. Personally, I would buy one in a second if I had the cash. That's why I'm waiting for the Model 3.
Yep. I love driving, always have. But there are two times when it would be fantastic to let the car do all the work - one is long distance highway driving and the other is congested urban driving.
Definitely not, but Tesla is definitely doing some pretty interesting stuff. With the Gigafactory they're increasing world wide battery production significantly, and that's the trail I'd follow. With what production is left outside of Tesla, I don't think there's enough to have mass adoption of electric cars.
Besides them controlling their own battery supply, they're shifting themselves to a top to bottom renewable energy company. Solar panels, Powerwalls, cars. Cars are simply a piece of the overall puzzle.
And further, this may be a serious indictment of Apple's internal secrecy. Lattner may have been interested in moving to Apple's own similar project, but was unable to find out anything about it, or whether it even exists at all. Alternately, Lattner may simply have wanted a change, but was unable to find out about any other Apple projects.
When I was a school kid - which was before time began, actually! We were told of the dream of house cleaning robots and automatons that would reduce workload and increase leisure time manyfold. Half a century later. Er. No. In another 50 years they'll guffaw in similar fashion when the dream of Amazon delivery drones and self drivng cars was spouted then. It ain't gonna happen. But it's a nice concept. Good. That's that answered then! 
It's not weird at all. Tesla's Autopilot system is controlled via software. They're using NVIDIA's DRIVE PX 2 platform and software stack. It's all artificial intelligence through deep neural network learning. Very compelling indeed for a computer guy like Chris.
When I was a school kid - which was before time began, actually! We were told of the dream of house cleaning robots and automatons that would reduce workload and increase leisure time manyfold. Half a century later. Er. No. In another 50 years they'll guffaw in similar fashion when the dream of Amazon delivery drones and self drivng cars was spouted then. It ain't gonna happen. But it's a nice concept. Good. That's that answered then!
The problem with moving to a work-free / leisure society is that we're not set up to value people for anything other than work. It is a huge societal problem that we're going to have to deal with at some point in the near future. Luckily there are some things that still require humans to do, but there will not be enough jobs (that either pay enough or provide enough satisfaction) and we may have already hit that point.
Again, I am an Tesla enthusiast, but some friendly advice as to where to place your future. Apple has almost a quarter trillion dollars in the bank and is the most profitable company in the world. Tesla, not so much, they have had only two profitable quarters in their history, have billions in cumulative losses and with the introduction of the Chevy Bolt and other competitors coming on line, their survival is still very much a question mark. Indeed, they been largely surviving on the trading of mpg credits.
Apple is researching and developing many more technologies than Tesla ever will, simply because Tesla is a much smaller and more narrowly focused company. That doesn't mean Tesla isn't doing some great things with electric vehicles, etc. It may surprise you though, that Tesla's hope isn't with some exotic new technology they developed, but rather whether they can develop the production capability with their vehicles and batteries to bring the costs down. For example, their car batteries "breakthrough" is not some new battery chemistry, etc., but combining a large number of what is, in essence, "dated" laptop batteries.
With the new Chevy Bolt being cheaper and having greater range, Tesla may be running out of time as their hopes have always hinged on getting an affordable Model 3 which we still don't have a meaningful production date. The Bolt went on sale in December, has gotten a lot of positive reviews and is scheduled to be on sale in all 50 states by July. Yes, the Bolt doesn't yet have all the autonomous driving capabilities of the current Tesla's for sale, but it is over $30K less than any current Tesla and with greater range and similar performance, it is but one example of the ongoing threats to Tesla's future. Here's a good write up of a comparison between the Bolt and the lowest Tesla currently for sale.
http://www.motortrend.com/cars/chev...7-chevrolet-bolt-ev-vs-2016-tesla-model-s-60/
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Well, I'll forward your post to Apple HQ so they know that despite producing products and services that hundreds of millions of people purchased last year alone, to not forget that there are some that can't wait to buy even more and want them to hurry out of development new stuff to buy. I have to warn you though, that Apple is different than most companies and usually waits until they think a product is ready to sell even if people are going crazy waiting, such as with their latest hit, the Airpods.
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MacRumors getting the scoop! Nice.
I think one of two things happened here: Either Apple shelved their autonomous driving plans alongside the car plans and Lattner decided there was no more reason to stick around at Apple, or he already applied to be in a leadership role in that division and was refused—or was lowballed on salary and so he went to Tesla. If I had my pick right now where to start off my career, I'd pick Tesla over Apple. I don't even own anything Tesla, but I hope to one day (a car and their solar roof). They're doing much more exciting things that actually have a positive impact on the environment. Technology and nature are two of my biggest passions.
As for autonomous cars themselves—I have really mixed emotions. A lot of driving is boring and repetitive. I'd love to sit back and relax on the boring drive to see family across the state, or the drive home. And I also like the safety benefit that it brings But sometimes I like to get away and just drive wherever the wind takes me. Take random turns, discover something new. Maybe go down a light off-road trail in my Outback because it's fun. Or wind through the mountains on a road trip. I'm just worried about manual driving becoming illegal. Especially since I think autonomous cars will probably become commonplace a decade from now when I'm in my 40s and have the disposable income to get those fancy cars I've always wanted.
I think one of the biggest challenges for autonomous driving will be adverse weather conditions. We had some freezing rain in late December that surprised everyone. It glazed everything really fast. A lot of people got stuck and couldn't make it home. I have an Outback with winter tires and barely made it home. I called upon my years of experience as I put the Outback into manual and teased my way home. I had the music off and was listening to the wheels, paying attention to the physics going on to know if my car was slightly drifting or loosing grip so I could gear down. My street is on a little bit of a slope, so to get into my driveway I had to rub my right wheel into the edge of the curb to create enough friction to slow down. I then kicked away from the curb, then turned right back in on the corner of the curb on the edge of my driveway and used that like a pivot to rotate the back of my Outback so that it was aligned with the driveway. Gear down and go up the right side of the driveway and as I did it slid into the left side of the driveway and into the slot on the left inside my garage door perfectly. When a machine can pull that off I'll be impressed! One of the most harrowing experiences of my life trying to avoid so many near collisions on the way home.
I think one of two things happened here: Either Apple shelved their autonomous driving plans alongside the car plans and Lattner decided there was no more reason to stick around at Apple, or he already applied to be in a leadership role in that division and was refused—or was lowballed on salary and so he went to Tesla. If I had my pick right now where to start off my career, I'd pick Tesla over Apple. I don't even own anything Tesla, but I hope to one day (a car and their solar roof). They're doing much more exciting things that actually have a positive impact on the environment. Technology and nature are two of my biggest passions.
As for autonomous cars themselves—I have really mixed emotions. A lot of driving is boring and repetitive. I'd love to sit back and relax on the boring drive to see family across the state, or the drive home. And I also like the safety benefit that it brings But sometimes I like to get away and just drive wherever the wind takes me. Take random turns, discover something new. Maybe go down a light off-road trail in my Outback because it's fun. Or wind through the mountains on a road trip. I'm just worried about manual driving becoming illegal. Especially since I think autonomous cars will probably become commonplace a decade from now when I'm in my 40s and have the disposable income to get those fancy cars I've always wanted.
I think one of the biggest challenges for autonomous driving will be adverse weather conditions. We had some freezing rain in late December that surprised everyone. It glazed everything really fast. A lot of people got stuck and couldn't make it home. I have an Outback with winter tires and barely made it home. I called upon my years of experience as I put the Outback into manual and teased my way home. I had the music off and was listening to the wheels, paying attention to the physics going on to know if my car was slightly drifting or loosing grip so I could gear down. My street is on a little bit of a slope, so to get into my driveway I had to rub my right wheel into the edge of the curb to create enough friction to slow down. I then kicked away from the curb, then turned right back in on the corner of the curb on the edge of my driveway and used that like a pivot to rotate the back of my Outback so that it was aligned with the driveway. Gear down and go up the right side of the driveway and as I did it slid into the left side of the driveway and into the slot on the left inside my garage door perfectly. When a machine can pull that off I'll be impressed! One of the most harrowing experiences of my life trying to avoid so many near collisions on the way home.