Dell Digital Jukebox and Dell Music Store

[centauratlas]

What Apple needs to design...

I have one of the Nokia 3650 phones (and soon a 6600). It includes camera, bluetooth, calendar, contacts etc. With iSync it does great with my Macs.

Apple needs to use their iPhone name and do something like this:
1. Similar to the 3650/6600 in terms of phone features, camera etc.
2. It needs to have a larger memory card (e.g. XD, or MMS). I know XD can go at least 8GB, perhaps larger. I don't know about MMS's limits.
--> so far with #1 and #2 it is a standard cell phone with just a higher capacity memory card so it isn't an engineering hurdle.
3. Add iPod like software to it to stream from the XD/MMS/whatever card.
4. Get iTunes to talk sync with it. Make sure iTunes for Windows does it too. Add one additional output to the Nokia phone and you can have the audio out. Synch via Bluetooth.

All of that is relatively easy to do, there are examples of #1 and #2 out there. A bigger card isn't a huge problem. iTunes isn't either.

They reason why I believe they need to do this is the following: I (and plenty of people I know) always carry our cell phones with us. I don't always carry my 30GB iPod or my 10GB iPod. If Apple combines the two (even if it is initially lower capacity), they will sell even more units. They'll get lots of advertising - what kind of phone is that. Don't stop selling the original of course, but make this another version of it. This is a great way to expand market share, particularly if they use their design expertise.

And as an extra bonus, it would also be a *great* slap at Motorola (don't let them near it of course) since the cell phone is a big part of their business.

In the future they should:
1. Add a way to stream via bluetooth
2. Increase the resolution of the camera
3. Integrate the iSight software (the 3650 and 6600 can already save 15-20 seconds of video, just allow it to stream via bluetooth or firewire or ... eventually allow it to stream over the air)
4. Allow recording of phone conversations (with appropriate warnings (e.g. the beeps or whatever).)


Generally improve it as they do with their designs.

 

[.a]

remember about one year ago, ipods were sold in the dell online store! then they got rid of them and then they sold'em again.
i did not checked it for quite a long time but i bet, now they do not sell ipods anymore
.a

 

[Judo]

"We are revolutionizing technology for our customers -- again,"

Yep, just keep telling yourself that Michael.

 

[Mr.Hey]

Originally posted by magitekkn
That video can be watched on the iTunes music store under the 50 cent artist page.

some how I don't think 50 is going to be using that thing in his next video and still claim that he's a P-I-M-P

 

[centauratlas]

Re: What Apple needs to design...

p.s. Right now I have 9892 songs in my iTunes library (*none* downloaded, btw). I'd gladly settle for having 1000 or 500 or whatever on this type of integrated phone. The 3650 also has a built-in speaker phone, so you could *also* play songs right over it, assuming the speaker quality was high enough.

There are going to be two digital hubs initially - one in your house with ReplayTV type features (e.g. TiVo/ReplayTV) - and one that you carry with you. And I think it will be the one with your phone (vs one with a PDA) that you carry. Apple has a *great* product with the iPod, but they need to extend their design expertise (things like the one-button mouse...had to say that! <haha>) into the cell phone arena because

The Denon (aka DNNA) owners bought SonicBlue who makes the ReplayTV, makers of the Rio recorder. Rio's design is nothing compared to the iPod.

However, the ReplayTV has a pretty nice design (I've had a 3080 for 4 years and am going to get a new one). DNNA wants to get into the digital hub type thing in the hosue. So does Apple. DNNA will want to outside too, with its Rio.

Eventually you'll be able to carry all your data/information with you and if you are near a keyboard and screen it will allow you to access it from wherever you are.

The company that gets a lot of these cell phone combo devices out there will do really well. Apple has a great opportunity because with a hybrid iPod people know it is great and want it with them all the time.

 

[robodweeb]

Originally posted by MoparShaha
That music player is such a blatant rip-off of the iPod.

Well, exccept for the one feature that would convince me to buy an iPod ... the ability to do voice recording ... Apple has chosen not to support this feature, so I am giving the Dell offering serious consideration to replace my aging Olympus DM-1 ...

I'd prefer to buy an iPod, but I guess I'm not part of Apple's target market ...

 

[lewdvig]

Originally posted by lmalave
Yeah, Dell doesn't seem to be setting the PDA world on fire with their Axims. Just 'cause it has the Dell name on it doesn't mean instant domination. It's just another little revenue stream for Dell.

They are taking PDA share away from HP. That is good and proves that they can not grow markets, just take over.

It won't work in music.

 

[twinturbo]

I personally feel that while everyone else tries to ape apple, Apple's gonna come out with another innovation that'll blow everyone's socks off. It's plainly simple cause the thinking's so different

Apple -> "How can I out-innovate everbody else, what is the wave of the future, how can I change the world . . ."

Everybody else -> "How can I copy Apple and make it really cheap to make some cash"

So basically the competition will always be behind the curve with this type of thinking. As long as Apple has vision and the money to spend on R&D, they're going to out-innovate and crush everybody else with products that change our notions of the norm.

While Dell's trying to get into music, probably Apple's gonna figure out some way to securely rip a DVD (from iDVD) and record that on your video iPod in MPEG-2 or 4 (so you basically can't play back or upload the MPEG-4 or MPEG-2 stream onto anything else, only the iPod. This would prevent Apple from getting sued by the MPAA). With the newer 20-40GB iPods, you could have a ton of songs and a couple movies! Tuff luck Dell . . .

 

[Moz]

I have a thousand obscenities I'd like to shout at the top of my lungs at Dell corporation.

Since this is a forum, and there are rules, I'll refrain. But you all get my drift.


Matt.

 

[jettredmont]

Originally posted by e2chris
99% Windows users use Kazaa anyway so I dont think it is that important... It would be nice if Apple had the ITMs for Windows but I just dont see it making much money. Anyone know how that other music store is doing(windows)?? I forgot the webaddress. The one that had the same commercials as Apples.

They're doing so well that they refuse to tell anyone how much they've sold.

In other words, fizzle.

 

[shadowfax]

Originally posted by Moz
I have a thousand obscenities I'd like to shout at the top of my lungs at Dell corporation.

Since this is a forum, and there are rules, I'll refrain. But you all get my drift.


Matt.

here's one for you. what the hell is your problem? don't take it personally--any more than i should take your comment about the company my dad works for. he does a good job, and Dell is good at plenty of things. if they have some issues, well, such is life. steve jobs pisses me and a lot of other people off with very matched frequency.

again, how can you call this an iPod rip? isn't that like saying, oh god, look at that
Audi TT! it's a complete copy of the VW beetle. they took the arching roof, and, jeez, they even used wheels! what is the world coming to?

this is not some iPod rip. they are making their own brand of innovation. the control system is perfectly unique. and it's shaped like a 1.8 inch hard drive. big surprise.

 

[lewdvig]

Re: What Apple needs to design...

Originally posted by centauratlas
I have one of the Nokia 3650 phones (and soon a 6600). It includes camera, bluetooth, calendar, contacts etc. With iSync it does great with my Macs.
Generally improve it as they do with their designs.

I think they would be smart to team with Nokia, and do a private label phone. Buy the guts from Nokia, use Symbian 7 with an Aqua look. Have Ive come up with a gorgeous shell. The jr version of the 7650 - I forget the model number - would be a great place to start.

Have iTunes recognize it, sync PIM stuff with iSync.

iTMS could have ring tones for sale too.

Take the Sun approach and create the entire stack. Nokia would be one heck of a partner too. So would SE.

Samsung are cool, but the are platform agnostic - they will build whatever they can sell (smart). MOT is in bed with MS now, so I hope they sink.

I would buy this.

 

[Shadey]

I just registered for this news bite.

You guys seriously need to wake up and smell the rotten apple.

While Dell's MP3 player may look like Apple's, Apple certainly didn't blaze any trails in creating theirs.

Anyone ever heard of Diamond? They had the first MP3 player on the market. Creative? First hard drive based MP3 player. All Apple did is make it smaller. Dell did the same thing. They took Apple's idea and made it cheaper.

Apple is a great innovator, don't get me wrong, but they certainly aren't everything you guys seem to think they are.

Silicon graphics had a computer much like the Apple Cube in the early nineties, but I bet you guys thought Apple's was so great, until it died just as quick as SG's did.

I don't mean to piss anyone off, but I see this more and more within the Apple community. Mac-Heads are so shut up in their own little world that they forget there is more than one way to do business.

 

[jettredmont]

Originally posted by lmalave
Size and Price point will be the key here.

But, you see, that's the problem. Dell can either cheapen the device to commodity levels, or it can compete on features/performance/design. IMHO, Dell USED to be pretty good at competing on features and performance, but have in the past couple of years gone way downhill quality-wise, especially in their "consumer" lines. I suspect the dPod will be the same: commodity, cheap, bottom-of-market to drive out all competition. However, as Dell, HP, and Compaq have all found out in the consumer PC space: once you've made the market commodity-driven, your profits generally sink big time (yes, Dell makes a healthy profit in computers overall, but not in low-end commodity PCs ... it takes a loss on those to drive out competition).

IMHO, we've seen "commodity" MP3 players (you can pick a dozen different models up at your local WalMart, and at least three different ones at Walgreens or CVS). They're crap; I wouldn't want one. And no one is really getting rich selling them.

What would surprise me is if Dell decided to actually mimic Apple's approach, meaning: provide a high-end device that people would pay a little extra for. That would afford Dell the opportunity to innovate in the marketplace, which is next to impossible in a commodity-driven market. On the other hand, Dell has repeatedly shown its inability to really innovate in any market, so maybe not.

I actually like the Dell scrolly thingy and button layout. The iPod's scroll wheel is actually harder to control. It's a really unnatural motion to have to move your thumb in circles. Straight up and down is much more efficient.

You think so? Personally, I find that it is far easier to do a circular-ish movement on a flat surface with my thumb than a "rowing" scrolling motion (which is also of course circular, but one half of the circle is done unsupported in mid air). The drawback to the circular motion is that it takes up a healthy bit of space on the device (which is why you don't see it everywhere still).

Note of course that this is for a thumb (or for a vertically opposed finger), which is NOT anything like a mouse scroll wheel (which is typically operated with a horizontal, tangential finger ... fingers have a very hard time making tangential circles, but are designed to make vertically opposed or perpendicular circles ...)

On the other hand, it is mechanically hard to create a good iPod-like wheel (and covered by patents) and also fairly hard to simulate on a touch-screen as Apple's done without spending a little extra in processing for it. This makes me believe that Dell is going for the bottom of the barrel here, not the high-end users.

 

[porovaara]

Originally posted by Shadey
Anyone ever heard of Diamond? They had the first MP3 player on the market. Creative? First hard drive based MP3 player.

Silicon graphics had a computer much like the Apple Cube in the early nineties, but I bet you guys thought Apple's was so great, until it died just as quick as SG's did.

Every single statement there was wrong. Do a google and you will find the first mp3 player on the market.

Handango had the first HD based mp3 player, it was out when Diamond was just pushing their 64meg players. Yes, years before anyone else. It was actually a Compaq designed with production licensed to another company.

No SGI was every even remotely like the cube, are you thinking of the o2?

There is no real innovation much anymore, instead it is all evolution and whats wrong with that?

 

[gotohamish]

Re: Dell Digital Jukebox and Dell Music Store

Anyone else notice on the hi-res photo that the little Home button isn't straight?

****ty Dull.

 

[SiliconAddict]

Re: Re: And yet no Windows iTunes.....

Originally posted by bertagert
Maybe you should stop injecting so much silicon into your viens. You have NO IDEA if this music player is either 1. any good, 2. If the music store is any good.

I'll bet it'll use MS's DRM. If thats the case, you have nothing to worry about as not a single other company has pulled it off using MS's DRM. The only, and one and only company that has pulled this off is Apple. And that might not be so true. There is no way Apple has recouped its investment on ITMS yet. And they probably woun't for some time.

As soon as ITMS for windows is released, you'll see Apple get HUGE advertising (free advertising from the news,etc.) because it will be so easy to use.

Look at it this way. BuyMusic.com opens their music store on May 1st 2003. Lets say Apple had nothing but finally put ITMS out Dec. 15th 2003. Which one would you be using and why?

You guys worry way too much about this stuff. Dell has been working on a music store for at least a year. Its not something they came up with yesterday. Apple knows this and thats why their store is and will be that much better.

The battle is AAC vs. MS. Not Apple vs. Dell. I wish you guys would get that.

Give me a break. First off your insult doesn’t even make any sense. Its siliCON not siliCONE as in computer parts? As in I can’t get enough of them. As in I couldn’t care less if it has an Apple logo on it or a Dell logo, or a Amiga logo.

If it’s any good? Define good? Most of Dell’s products are “good” in fact there are more then a few that could be defined as “great” AND undercut their competition in price by a landslide. That alone should cause Apple to be highly concerned if not panicked.

DRM in WMA can be used in a number of ways. Anything from highly restrictive to relatively loose to nonexistent. It depends on what Dell can negotiate with the RIAA. If they wanted to they could allow burning to as many CD's as a person wants. They could allow sharing across multiple devices. It depends on how they implement the security.
As for broad spectrum compatibility look up the specs for most MP3 players other then the iPod. Just about everything supports WMA. Find me another player that supports AAC. MS has done a good job at sneaking support for WMA into the market place even though no one uses it. It’s a Trojan horse on a massive scale.
If you aren’t concerned they you don’t know Dell. You don’t understand how they do business and how they are kicking the snot out of their competition in the PC world. Do you have any idea how many computers they sell within a week, month, year? Neither do I but it’s a lot. Now imagine that during the purchase process you have that nice little dropdown menu to purchase your MP3 player for $XXX. All those potential customers ARE a concern for Apple because unless they are going to be supporting WMA in iTunes for Windows there is little to no chance that anyone who purchases one of these devices will use the iTMS. Why purchase music if you can’t play it on your device? Everything ties into everything else. If for some reason the iPod’s market share starts to slip because of this it can and will effect how well iTMS performs on the PC. Like it or not this IS a battle between PC and Apple. Not Dell and Apple. If the iPod market shares doesn’t hold or grow neither will the use of iTMS on the PC.
Like it or not the iPod isn’t godlike. Its can be dethroned.

 

[Moz]

Originally posted by shadowfax
here's one for you. what the hell is your problem? don't take it personally--any more than i should take your comment about the company my dad works for. he does a good job, and Dell is good at plenty of things. if they have some issues, well, such is life. steve jobs pisses me and a lot of other people off with very matched frequency.

again, how can you call this an iPod rip? isn't that like saying, oh god, look at that
Audi TT! it's a complete copy of the VW beetle. they took the arching roof, and, jeez, they even used wheels! what is the world coming to?

this is not some iPod rip. they are making their own brand of innovation. the control system is perfectly unique. and it's shaped like a 1.8 inch hard drive. big surprise.

How can you possibly say that this is not a complete iPod rip? It's a peecee branded iPod! If dull, oh, I mean Dell, was really, truly making their own brand of innovation, then they'd show the world something that Apple hasn't already.

The peecee makers out there will continually copy Apple forever. Apple has always been the leader, and the one company that actually innovates new technologies, and new hardware, etc. Sometimes Apple's offerings miss the mark (Cube), but most of the time, after Apple's big success in a market, the peecee makers then try to copy. For christ's sake, this iPod by Dell is even white. I thought dell's color was black...???

Again, immitation is the sincerest form of flattery. Thank you dell, for showing us that Apple is the leader yet again, and you're bound to follow.

 

[mvc]

Originally posted by dho
The D-pod?

Welcome to the iDud

Or maybe the iSore

What about the iDull

C'mon people work with me here!

 

[digitalbiker]

shadey is right!

What is all the frenzy about? Apple neither invented nor created the first mp3 player. Apple was not the first to sell online music.

Apple did design a really nice product (ipod) that commanded an equally nice price. Apple also worked a nice deal with a few music industry giants and made an easy to access, simple music download site, that satisfied copyright holders.

So whats wrong with competition? If Dell does build a nice cheap mp3 player and they design a nice music site to compete with Apple, so much the better for Dell and the average consumer.

If Apple stays the leader and continues to innovate Dell's player and music store go down the drain and the consumer is still the winner.

Where's the beef?

Apple is obviously is control of their own fate as is Dell.

 

[jettredmont]

Re: regarding competition

Originally posted by Photorun
Doubtful Apple will lower their prices so nobody get their hopes up. Apple has spent it's entire existance pretty clueless that in some cases a lower price means more volume and more adoption of product. It's never occured them before so probably wont ever. Then again remember Apple is profitable as a company perhaps thanks to the mark-up, as opposed to most other computer makers, excepting Dell, who basically is just a poor man's Apple... a VERY poor man's Apple.

I disagree.

Apple has been known to lower its prices to counter competition. It is just not Apple's prefered strategy. Apple's prefered strategy is always to innovate their products, to make them stand out in the crowd, to make them worth the markup.

When Apple can't innovate in a reasonable fashion, it cuts prices. We've seen this a few times in the last two years.

IMHO, what is good about this is not necessarily that Apple will start selling its iPods for $200 less, but that Apple will be pressured to bring their iPods to "the next level" ... a price cut is the booby prize, IMHO.

 

[Fukui]

Originally posted by Shadey
Silicon graphics had a computer much like the Apple Cube in the early nineties, but I bet you guys thought Apple's was so great, until it died just as quick as SG's did.

Actually, thats wrong. NeXT was making cubes back in the mid-eighties. NeXT was a company that Steve Jobs put together before he came back to Apple. When Steve came back to apple, he just made another one...and uh charged too much.
And it was very very great...I know, I got one.

 

[Shadey]

Originally posted by porovaara
Every single statement there was wrong. Do a google and you will find the first mp3 player on the market.

Handango had the first HD based mp3 player, it was out when Diamond was just pushing their 64meg players. Yes, years before anyone else. It was actually a Compaq designed with production licensed to another company.

No SGI was every even remotely like the cube, are you thinking of the o2?

There is no real innovation much anymore, instead it is all evolution and whats wrong with that?

Well, if Diamond wasn't the first, then whoever they were did some ****ty marketing to get their product out. I just remember hearing Diamond had to go to court over the sale of theirs, for obvious reasons.

I know SGI had a smaller computer, and I can't find it now.

I was saying exactly what you said, evolution, not revolution.

EDIT: really, Fukui? Oh, sorry, didn't know next did that. I do know who next is tho...

 

[sXe]

wow, that player looks like crap. glad i have my iPod. if i ever see someone who owns one, i'm going to laugh at them and shove my iPod in their face. just to prove that mine is so much better...

this is just a move by dell to try to become the apple of the PC industry...wait, macs are PCs...a failed attempt if i must say by dell.

 

[Shadey]

As a question that kind of relates to this, what do you people use your iPod's for anyway? I really don't see the practicality of it. I have a CD player in my car, so it's not like I would get the same quality with an RF transmitter.

I'm just looking for a real reason to buy one.