DigiTimes: 16-Inch MacBook Pro to Launch by End of October With Ultra-Slim Bezels and Scissor Keyboard

[BigBoy2018]

I've owned more than 10 bits of expensive consumer electronics in my time, and I can't think of any of them that I've seriously damaged in the first 3 years. Sure, my MBP took a dirt nap - but by then it was over 3 years old and I'd done some internal mods that would have voided any insurance. I've had GPU faults fixed under Apple's repair program - no insurance required. Now I've temped fate, my iPad Pro will probably get trampled by a herd of wildebeest but that still leaves me ahead of the game.

Thats also ignoring the possibility that your home insurance either already covers (or could cheaply be extended to) your devices, or people who get insurance via their credit card.

There's a very simple rule - never pay to insure what you can afford to replace - based on very simple math: insurance is a for-profit business - and it's not profitable to sell a policy for $X if a significant proportion of customers claim more than $X.

Insurance is for things like house fires and third-party liability that would cause you major financial distress.

Extended warranties are also a con: they're basically covering your device for the middle part of its lifetime where it is least likely to fail. See bathtub curve. That goes double if you are outside the USA in a jurisdiction with stronger consumer rights laws.

+1. Thank you for the thorough debunking of this applecare myth. I’ve owned tons of apple stuff for three decades. Never had problems that applecare would have helped with.

Had I spent money on applecare all those years I’d probably have wasted a good $10,000 by now.

@PastaPrimav

 

[PickUrPoison]

<snip>
The laptop is not a work tool for me; it is a personal object. I will not buy a professional laptop, nor a consumer laptop, as I usually despise this kind of classification (which Apple seldom used in the Steve Jobs era). I will buy a laptop which serves my personal needs. And a 16-inch laptop may be a welcome addition to this, but not if it costs north of $3,000, which is something I cannot justify paying.

For pros who are more productive due to the extra screen real estate, an extra $300-500 is nothing. It pays for itself in a day, week or month. That’s why this is aimed at those who use their Mac to generate money.

Feel free to despise the classifications but you’re wrong about them being seldom used in the Jobs era. Along with Desktop and Portable, the two categories he used to describe Apple’s lineup were Professional and Consumer. Those were the “four quadrants” he used to simply and focus the lineup when he returned in 1997.

I’m really not sure whether you think you’re agreeing or disagreeing with me, but you seem to perfectly represent my conclusion: “Sure if you’ve got the money why not, but I see the demand mostly for pro/business use not consumer/home”. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

[skaertus]

For pros who are more productive due to the extra screen real estate, an extra $300-500 is nothing. It pays for itself in a day, week or month. That’s why this is aimed at those who use their Mac to generate money.

Feel free to despise the classifications but you’re wrong about them being seldom used in the Jobs era. Along with Desktop and Portable, the two categories he used to describe Apple’s lineup were Professional and Consumer.

I’m not sure whether you think you agree or disagree with me, but you seem to perfectly represent my conclusion: “Sure if you’ve got the money why not, but I see the demand mostly for pro/business use not consumer/home”. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Yes, if Apple launches this laptop with a $3,000 or $4,000 price tag, and with these powerful specifications, it will be targeted at professionals that work with photos and videos. It may indeed be a useful tool for such professionals, who will more than welcome it and pay as much as they can to have the added benefit.

But it will be just a pity if Apple restricts those large screens to such small audience, neglecting other potential buyers. And there are business professionals, prosumers and consumers who would definitely need or want such large screens without all this power being tagged along.

 

[Pro7913]

There's no established definition of what constitutes "a whole new product" in Apple's eyes. The 6/8-core iMacs, MBPs with Vega graphics, the new low end MBPs (now with touchbars) - were major upgrades all released without an event - probably had more significant improvements than some versions of the 16" rumour. The leaked image shows the exact same "design language" as the current range.

We still don't know if this is a new 16" line that will run alongside the 15" or if it is a replacement - and since Apple might continue to sell the 15" "while stocks last" before discontinuing it we might not know that for a while.

What we KNOW (bold, caps and italics beats your bold caps) is that a lot of analysts have said that there's a 16" in development (enough that its likely to be true - but the least reliable part of that is the possible launch date) and that there's a 16" MBP icon in the beta of MacOS 15.1 - that suggests that either:

(a) Apple deliberately included the icon because they expect to launch the 16" MBP with/shortly after 15.1 - or they wouldn't have risked 'leaking' it until 15.2 or later - and in that case the icon is probably a fairly accurate rendition.

(b) Apple included the icon in 15.1 beta by mistake - in which case all bets are off as the image could just be some prototype design concept that has since changed and/or won't be launched until next year.

It would be slightly odd to suddenly launch a 16" out of the blue without updating the 13" as well - but that doesn't rule it out - what that really says is "this is not a typical launch so don't expect it to follow the usual pattern". I'd speculate that they are rushing forward one model using a new design that was probably scheduled for 2020/21 in response to the keyboard problems with the current model: Even from this site you can tell that a lot of the interest is in the new keyboard (that and extra ports which probably won't happen) - and I don't see Cook standing up on stage saying "The new Mac Book Pro - the keyboard sucks 37.5% less!"

There is. It's been almost 4 years since MBP with a touch bar released and 16 inch is a whole new product with different sizes. What makes you think it's not worth enough to be announced from a special event?
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Using caps or bold (or bold caps) doesn’t change anything.

There are no special events scheduled, but as I already stated, they’re only announced shortly before they’re held. Apple can hold a November or December event, as they’ve done in the past, or announce the update via a press release. Which they’ve also done in the past.

It’s not a “whole new product” any more than the 10.5” iPad Air 3 was compared to the 9.7” Air 2. The Air 3 was announced via press release earlier this year, if you recall.

Have you considered that announcing an updated screen size isn’t quite as big a deal as you seem to think it is? To me, that doesn’t seem particularly worthy of a special event.

Was 15”, now 16”. That’s like a two minute event, isn’t it?

There are no events in Nov and Dec cause they never did before! You just making something which doesnt even exist.

It is a whole new product. Were there any 16 inch MBP? NO. How come it has a 96W power adapter?

Apple NEVER announced a whole new product without a special event and that's a fact.

 

[Brammy]

There is. It's been almost 4 years since MBP with a touch bar released and 16 inch is a whole new product with different sizes. What makes you think it's not worth enough to be announced from a special event?

Obviously we don't know anything about the product other than the render in the OS X beta. If it's the existing 15" footprint (or close enough) with the same ports, touch bar, etc., and the only difference is the bezel, I don't consider it a new product. Even with a new keyboard. Also, if it's at the expected price point, it's a niche audience. Most of us, we fall into that niche, even if we aren't the pros they built it for. I don't really see Apple doing a big presser for an expensive 16" laptop.

A slightly-scaled up 15", for me this is a press briefing with an embargoed review date. Now, if Apple had a whole bunch of new stuff, and they could just have an event for the fall line-up, maybe.

Gruber had an interesting theory about the 16" and an event here.

 

[NJRonbo]

+1. Thank you for the thorough debunking of this applecare myth. I’ve owned tons of apple stuff for three decades. Never had problems that applecare would have helped with.

Had I spent money on applecare all those years I’d probably have wasted a good $10,000 by now.

@PastaPrimav

The general rule of thumb is that if a device is going to go bad it will do so within the first 90 days. Mind you, that's not a given, but defects usually surface pretty quickly.

I have bought dozens and dozens of Apple products over the years and never needed Apple Care. Then again, I generally only keep products for a year then sell it for trade-in on an upgrade.

 

[PickUrPoison]

Yes, if Apple launches this laptop with a $3,000 or $4,000 price tag, and with these powerful specifications, it will be targeted at professionals that work with photos and videos. It may indeed be a useful tool for such professionals, who will more than welcome it and pay as much as they can to have the added benefit.

But it will be just a pity if Apple restricts those large screens to such small audience, neglecting other potential buyers. And there are business professionals, prosumers and consumers who would definitely need or want such large screens without all this power being tagged along.

MacBook Pros are relatively expensive in any case. It all depends on the config, but entry level pricing for 13/15/16 of 1,799/2,399/2,799 wouldn’t surprise me in the least. It also wouldn’t surprise me if the 16” were $2,999, 3,499 or 3,999. It just depends on the base config.

There’s a big difference between want and need. A college student or home user may want a 16” but they don’t need one. But they still might buy one.

However, to a video or audio pro, or a software developer or an accountant who are more productive with a larger screen, $10 or $20 a month over a 3-5 year lifespan makes it a no-brainer.

Anyone who uses their Mac to generate money can typically benefit from more power, so the minimum config for the 16” may well be an 8-core CPU with Vega GPU for $3,499. Who knows.

 

[Pro7913]

I guess there wont be any special event to announce and reveal 16 inch MBP for this year since nobody get invitations from Apple today.

 

[PickUrPoison]

There are no events in Nov and Dec cause they never did before! You just making something which doesnt even exist.

It is a whole new product. Were there any 16 inch MBP? NO. How come it has a 96W power adapter? You have no idea what you are saying.

Apple NEVER announced a whole new product without a special event and that's a fact.

Yeah no special event in Nov/Dec before, but product launches/releases. iMac Pro launched with a press briefing in New York in December 2017. With the quarterly earnings call on October 30th and Apple TV+ launch on November 1, an event on November 5 would hardly be shocking (to me—ymmv).

It has a 96W power adapter because the bigger screen will draw more power. Maybe it’s you who doesn’t know what they’re talking about?

It’s not a whole new product, MacBook Pro has been around for many years. Adding a half inch or inch to the display size doesn’t seem to be particularly special event worthy. It’s a one or two minute announcement. Do you really think that’s necessary? I don’t, and I don’t think Apple does either. Time will tell.

 

[turbineseaplane]

I guess there wont be any special event to announce and reveal 16 inch MBP for this year since nobody get invitations from Apple today.

Don't need an event, particularly if one of the key things is a "new" keyboard that fixes the problems that Apple claims "only impacts a small group of users" (epic amount of BS, even for Apple).

They may want to downplay this and simply release online and perhaps are hosting a small group of press to get hands on with things, etc.

The Mac isn't mainstream in the way it was a decade ago and it doesn't really warrant an event for Mac Pro orders, updated MBP, etc

 

[Pro7913]

Don't need an event, particularly if one of the key things is a "new" keyboard that fixes the problems that Apple claims "only impacts a small group of users" (epic amount of BS, even for Apple).

They may want to downplay this and simply release online and perhaps are hosting a small group of press to get hands on with things, etc.

The Mac isn't mainstream in the way it was a decade ago and it doesn't really warrant an event for Mac Pro orders, updated MBP, etc

There is no record that Apple announce a whole new product WITHOUT a special event.
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Yeah no special event in Nov/Dec before, but product launches/releases. With the quarterly earnings call on October 30th and Apple TV+ launch on November 1, an event on November 5 would hardly be shocking (to me—ymmv).

It has a 96W power adapter because the bigger screen will draw more power. Maybe it’s you who doesn’t know what they’re talking about?

It’s not a whole new product, MacBook Pro has been around for many years. Adding a half inch or inch to the display size doesn’t seem to be particularly special event worthy. It’s a one or two minute announcement. Do you really think that’s necessary? I don’t, and I don’t think Apple does either. Time will tell.

It is a whole new product cause it has the first 16 inch display. This is the first 5th gen MBP.

 

[turbineseaplane]

There is no record that Apple announce a whole new product WITHOUT a special event.

You couldn't be more wrong with that statement my friend..

This last Spring they released

- New iMacs
- New iPad Mini
- New AirPods (v2) with Wireless Charging Case
- New Accesorries
- New iPad Air

All released online, with press releases and NO special event for them.

The event was the following week and not about those products -- in fact they released them in advance to clear the decks *for* that event and not distract it's focus.

Apple Event: All the New Hardware Apple Released Last Week

Apple stock got a boost from a series of new releases this week before Monday's Apple event, including new iPads, Macs and AirPods.

investorplace.com

 

[Brammy]

We are talking about a whole new product with a different design for the first 5th gen. Those products that you mentioned got minor updates and that's all.

Is a new design decreased bezels, and a keyboard that doesn't suck, no really, we mean it doesn't suck this time, but is still the same touch bar, track pad, no FaceID, same ports, and same (rough) footprint?

If they took this laptop and did what they did with the iMac Pro, then yes, I would say it's a new product. This is more of a new SKU than a product.

Maybe Apple will hold a early November event. I think Apple now wants the message to be focused on the TV stuff launching soon, and an event could be a close follower to that launch.

 

[turbineseaplane]

Is a new design decreased bezels, and a keyboard that doesn't suck, no really, we mean it doesn't suck this time, but is still the same touch bar, track pad, no FaceID, same ports, and same (rough) footprint?

No - It's a small refresh and one I think they don't want to talk about excessively given how much time they've spent claiming that Butterfly Keyboard issues "only impacted a small amount of users"

uh-huh - sure Apple. Whatever.. lol

 

[Pro7913]

Is a new design decreased bezels, and a keyboard that doesn't suck, no really, we mean it doesn't suck this time, but is still the same touch bar, track pad, no FaceID, same ports, and same (rough) footprint?

If they took this laptop and did what they did with the iMac Pro, then yes, I would say it's a new product. This is more of a new SKU than a product.

Maybe Apple will hold a early November event. I think Apple now wants the message to be focused on the TV stuff launching soon, and an event could be a close follower to that launch.

Apple never had a special event on Nov.

 

[Brammy]

Apple never had a special event on Nov.

A few years ago, you could set your calendars by Apple iOS beta releases. The second one always was two weeks after beta 1. Then iOS 10 happened and beta 2 came out 22 days after b1. The forums were full of people saying Apple never, ever, ever released a b2 more than 14-15 days after b1. They cited 18 days for iOS b2 as a statistical outlier.

Until this year, Apple has never put a .1 release beta out before the iOS x.0 GM was out (or it was released).

In 2012, Apple demoed Mountain Lion via press briefing in New York. Until that date, Mac OS was always previewed at keynote.

Apple has never, ever talked about future Mac products, especially in their lab, until they held a press briefing in April a few years ago to talk about the Mac Pro.

Apple has never, ever, done something until they do it. I wouldn't bet on Apple going, "Damn, just missed October on this one, oh well, the March event then?"

I wouldn't assume because Apple has never done x, they won't continue to do X.

 

[Pro7913]

A few years ago, you could set your calendars by Apple iOS beta releases. The second one always was two weeks after beta 1. Then iOS 10 happened and beta 2 came out 22 days after b1. The forums were full of people saying Apple never, ever, ever released a b2 more than 14-15 days after b1. They cited 18 days for iOS b2 as a statistical outlier.

Until this year, Apple has never put a .1 release beta out before the iOS x.0 GM was out (or it was released).

In 2012, Apple demoed Mountain Lion via press briefing in New York. Until that date, Mac OS was always previewed at keynote.

Apple has never, ever talked about future Mac products, especially in their lab, until they held a press briefing in April a few years ago to talk about the Mac Pro.

Apple has never, ever, done something until they do it. I wouldn't bet on Apple going, "Damn, just missed October on this one, oh well, the March event then?"

I wouldn't assume because Apple has never done x, they won't continue to do X.

And your example is not even related to product announcements. As long as they dont change, it wont happen easily.

 

[Flabasha]

If they took this laptop and did what they did with the iMac Pro, then yes, I would say it's a new product. This is more of a new SKU than a product.

Yeah, the more I think about it, it's in their best interest to NOT have an event for a laptop we all had to squint at (and measure), to figure out if it was the old one If you have an event, expectations soar, and if all you have is a marginally bigger screen and an "improved" keyboard, they'd get raked across the coals by the internet... "THIS IS THE REDESIGN?!!"

 

[BigBoy2018]

There is. It's been almost 4 years since MBP with a touch bar released and 16 inch is a whole new product with different sizes. What makes you think it's not worth enough to be announced from a special event?
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There are no events in Nov and Dec cause they never did before! You just making something which doesnt even exist.

It is a whole new product. Were there any 16 inch MBP? NO. How come it has a 96W power adapter? You have no idea what you are saying.

Apple NEVER announced a whole new product without a special event and that's a fact.

This event that you’re envisioning would last about 5 mins. Unless they have a hell of a lot more to announce they’ll just release this with a press release.

 

[turbineseaplane]

This event that you’re envisioning would last about 5 mins. Unless they have a hell of a lot more to announce they’ll just release this with a press release.

Correct
There's no need for an event here, to your point.
There would need to be more content for a full blown event.

I could see a town hall type of thing with a small group of select press, but that's about it.

 

[pier]

Surely this a joke.

Face ID is meant for the Mac.

It has a camera pointing directly at is user at all times. It has a relatively large bezel area that can house multiple sensors. It is an expensive product that justifies the additional hardware. Authenticating on the Mac has become increasingly obnoxious over time and with each new release of macOS it gets worse.

They've attempted to fix this with Touch ID, but instead took 20 steps back and made a terrible user experience. It is not like Touch ID on iPhone where your thumb was already naturally positioned on the Home Button to wake the phone (and simultaneously authenticating). You have to reach for Touch ID in an awkward spot that means taking your hands off the keyboard. It quickly becomes a tiresome reptition that does not feel natural; it feels like a chore. It has also led to some of the worst UX decisions ever made in macOS, like the current state of Autofill with Touch ID.

Right now the only saving grace is Unlock with Apple Watch, which is good, but not nearly good enough. I'm still required to enter my Mac's password for numerous things and I have no idea why. If it's me, I shouldn't have to. Obviously Apple doesn't feel that Apple Watch authentication is secure enough for a personal Mac in someone's home (which is, frankly, absurd).

Face ID is last hope that Apple can bring some form of actual convenient authentication to the Mac.

I'd rather write a password than add a whole new infrastructure (3d camera, T2 chip, etc) to be able to to have Touch ID or Face ID on a pro machine.

These gimmicks like the touchbar are points of failure and only make the machines more expensive, less reliable, and less repairable. We've already seen the T2 chips causing havoc on USB audio interfaces.

 

[PastaPrimav]

I'd rather write a password than add a whole new infrastructure (3d camera, T2 chip, etc) to be able to to have Touch ID or Face ID on a pro machine.

These gimmicks like the touchbar are points of failure and only make the machines more expensive, less reliable, and less repairable. We've already seen the T2 chips causing havoc on USB audio interfaces.

Oh yeah Face ID is a real gimmick, running flawlessly on those 600 million or so X-series phones.

 

[Brammy]

I think the deciding factor for whether Apple will hold an event (either a full keynote or small briefings) is if they think the announcements are for products they think are holiday sales items.

The new MacBook Pro, obviously isn't. New Airpods and the tile thing are. I am not sure all three of these are event worthy. However, I could see them doing a late-year, Pro-focused event. They did one in NYC in December to show off the iMac Pro release. I could see Apple doing a similar event to show off the Mac Pro, new MacBook Pro, and maybe a different monitor before the end of the year.

Who knows. The new MacBook Pro may be a 2020 product now. A lot of supply chain rumors are wrong about release dates.

 

[turbineseaplane]

New Airpods and the tile thing are

The latter perhaps, the former I'm not sure.

The rumors are these are "additional" AirPods in the lineup that are in-ear and noise cancelling and even higher end (pricing in particular). I don't know how much that moves the mainstream needle honestly.

 

[wayoutwest5505]

I may buy one. Still using my 2011 MBP 17 in. 16 gigs, 1 TB SSD, i7 chip. Working just fine, but, would like a faster machine. Utah