Discontinued AirPort Extreme and 2TB Time Capsule Finally Disappear From Apple Online Store

[tromboneaholic]

Nice straw man attempt


...

Tim Cook said the iPad can replace "a notebook or a desktop for many, many people." That is true. I am one of them. He didn't say "for everyone" as the post I replied to asserted.

Everything the kid does, can be done on an iPad.

Not everyone requires an antiquated workflow. Not everyone has a myopic view of what computing looks like.

 

[IG88]

Everything the kid does, can be done on an iPad.

Not everyone requires an antiquated workflow.

I was at a friends house out of town and we wanted to watch a movie I had on my NAS back home. So I downloaded it to my iPad Pro from my NAS and then the real fun began, trying to figure out how to get the damn movie to him.

Luckily I had my "antiquated" MacBook Air with me, that actually has ports and a thing called a file system. So I had to Airdrop the movie over to my antiquated "computer" just so I could actually get the movie onto his home theater system.

So yeah, I guess watching movies not on the iPad screen itself must be an antiquated workflow according to you.

 

[UnfetteredMind]

This is critical for anyone with multiple laptops in a home network. My TC still lives, but I’ve looked into options for when it dies. A NAS is one option, though not officially supported. Another, if you have an iMac or Mac Mini that’s always on, is to start Time Machine Server (High Sierra or Mojave), with a shared folder (local or an external drive) for multiple network backups. That’s my plan. It seems to be a stable set and forget option.

It would be great to hear from others who have actually done this, as networked backups were a key feature of the TC.

I just attached a spare disk to my Airport Extreme (tower) and also have a separate disk under Mojave that's serving as a Time Machine backup target. You can actually backup to more than one Time Machine target (not sure when that option came into macos / OS X, but it's certainly there under High Sierra and Mojave). It will alternate between them for the backups (so if one dies, you still have the other).

That said, most of my data is on the server and not the Macs that are generally used and I haven't actually used Time Machine to do a restore in ... forever, but it's nice to know it's there if I were to need it to quickly restore from a failed drive.

 

[tromboneaholic]

I was at a friends house out of town and we wanted to watch a movie I had on my NAS back home. So I downloaded it to my iPad Pro from my NAS and then the real fun began, trying to figure out how to get the damn movie to him.

Luckily I had my "antiquated" MacBook Air with me, that actually has ports and a thing called a file system. So I had to Airdrop the movie over to my antiquated "computer" just so I could actually get the movie onto his home theater system.

So yeah, I guess watching movies not on the iPad screen itself must be an antiquated workflow according to you.

If you played it from your laptop to the TV using a cable, you could have done that from the iPad using a cable. I personally do it wirelessly using AirPlay to my Apple TV, but I won't blame your friend for not having one.

You could have used MailDrop on your iPad to send him the movie as an email attachment up to 5 GB in size, assuming your movie was within this size.

You could have also used DropBox on your iPad to get it to him.

Etc...

Your laptop works for you, great. Stick to what you know.

 

[jazz1]

Recently had one die. Replaced it with a Netgear Orbi mesh system. Works great, no complaints.

I went ahead in another location and did the same even though the Airport hadn't yet died. Also works great.

Still, I wish Apple would make a mesh system of its own.

Several months ago I replaced my Apple Wifi system (base station and two extensions) with the Orbing system. Better speeds throughout the house, and it "leaks" quite a distance into the field behind my house. I haven't needed support yet, so I cannot comment on that.

I am sorry to see Apple get out of offering this type of device, and wished they would have gone "Mesh" a long time ago.

I owned the first and second flying saucer version. I even set one up at my university office many years ago, before the university even had Wifi. I used the orange "toilet seat" laptop back then

Still got the grey flying saucer hanging in the basement for old times sake .

 

[allan]

And afaik software like Pages for examples keeps multiple edits of your documents. Every time you edit a file in Pages it saves it as a new copy and keeps the old copy. I believe this applies to the cloud as well.

That's cool! I didn't know iCloud kept different versions of documents like this. But does that only apply to Apple applications like Pages, or does it also work with non-Apple apps?

Also, if you delete a file and then six months later want to get it back, with Time Machine you can (hence the name "Time Machine"). Can you do this with iCloud?

Also, with Time Machine, one can backup data on external hard drives in addition to data on the Mac's internal drive. Can iCloud do that?

I'm genuinely asking because I don't really use iCloud for my backups, just Time Machine, Carbon Copy Cloner and CrashPlan (as well as storing physical backups offsite). I might consider adding iCloud to my arsenal of backup strategies if it allows me to go back in time to retrieve a file I deleted months or even years ago.

 

[Mr. Heckles]

Which model?

I got this one

https://amplifi.com/

 

[gsurf123]

Why are they ending this popular product?
Don't Apple enjoy making money?

Nobody knows what recent or long term sales are on these. The competition has rapidly moved into this market and delivering top notch products from multiple companies. I'd like Apple to continue making networking products, but if they can't or won't allocate resources to lead the pack then those employees will be better utilized somewhere else in the company.

 

[trip1ex]

That's cool! I didn't know iCloud kept different versions of documents like this. But does that only apply to Apple applications like Pages, or does it also work with non-Apple apps?

Also, if you delete a file and then six months later want to get it back, with Time Machine you can (hence the name "Time Machine"). Can you do this with iCloud?

Also, with Time Machine, one can backup data on external hard drives in addition to data on the Mac's internal drive. Can iCloud do that?

I'm genuinely asking because I don't really use iCloud for my backups, just Time Machine, Carbon Copy Cloner and CrashPlan (as well as storing physical backups offsite). I might consider adding iCloud to my arsenal of backup strategies if it allows me to go back in time to retrieve a file I deleted months or even years ago.

I think you've mistaken me for someone that cares as well as someone that works for free.

I don't think I advertised myself as a free consulting service. I'm just a guy arguing that iCloud is a replacement for Time Machine.

to answer your question though, I don't think a replacement means it literally has to be a 100% replacement in every single way imaginable for 100% of the people. I think replacement means it has to do things better than the old way while doing the vast majority of things the vast majority used the old product for.

Just like Time Machine is a backup service but does it do everything 3rd party backup services do? No it doesn't.

 

[ignatius345]

No. It is definitely a replacement. And you even realize that yourself. You don't need it for your laptops. You only need it to back up some media collection on your iMac and in today's world that sort of usage case is an outlier

IN this day and age no need to have lots of media. My music collection is pretty much redundant in the streaming age. I mean I"m not big on music streaming but I'm on my 2nd free trial of Apple Music and I see my kid uses Spotify when we're not on Apple Music. So not only am I slowly becoming a convert but the kids are already there. So no need to backup music media in the future.

My collection of movies is mostly redundant as well in the age of Netflix etc because on one hand most of those shows pop up on on-demand streaming services all the time and on the other hand there is way too much content to watch that there is little reason to store so many movies on my computer. No time to watch them. Plus you purchase a digital movie anytime on iTunes or Amazon etc if you really really need to watch it. So why store a movie collection any more?!?!? I stopped doing so ....maybe 5 years ago. Times change.

I've got 15 years worth of music that is carefully tagged and curated and there's a bunch of it that's not available on Spotify or Apple Music. So I guess in your logic, I should just... throw it away because it's "obsolete"? Pardon my French, but **** that.

You own nothing and you rent access. What you listen to and what you watch can disappear or change at the whim of some lawyer somewhere. You don't care that much about the music you listen to. And that's fine. You don't have to. But I think we all hear quite enough from you "it's the future, get used to it!" tools, thanks.

The reality is Time Machine was introduced 10 years ago. It's ancient in computer years. Meanwhile storageon the cloud has gotten cheaper and cheaper while our need for more storage space hasn't increased at nearly the same rate and perhaps has even decreased overall.

Time Machine was introduced 10 years ago, but... you realize it's been updated since then, right? Mac trackpads were introduced like 25 years ago. Ancient in computer years. You see how ****ed up your logic is?

But thanks for telling us about "reality". Let me tell you about another reality: some people produce things with their Macs instead of consuming them. For some people using a Mac for their livelihood or to run a business, it's crucial to keep viable, versioned copies of their files, and need a way to quickly restore a computer if it should go out of service or need to be replaced. We get it, your computer usage consists of grazing at your streaming entertainment trough, but don't assume everyone's needs are the same as yours.
[doublepost=1542415542][/doublepost]

I don't think I advertised myself as a free consulting service. I'm just a guy arguing that iCloud is a replacement for Time Machine.

And your argument is crap, to be honest, and when someone here asks you to back up your quarter-baked opinion you seem intent on trolling us with, you bitch about not being a "consulting service"?

iCloud on a Mac doesn't even come close to what iCloud Backup does on an iOS device. In fact, there isn't a feature called "iCloud Backup" for Mac at all. There's iCloud Drive, but that does nothing to preserve settings or installed app configurations, just syncs files. So what you're half-assedly arguing for is replacing an existing backup system with a file sync system and saying "eh, that's good enough". Try doing a little thinking before you go trolling with this garbage, mate.

 

[BigBoy2018]

Eero says, hello.

Orbi and Velop and a few others also say hello. Seems like those decrying the end of Apples airport line haven’t taken a good look at the many awesome alternatives that are out there now
[doublepost=1542418860][/doublepost]

I've got 15 years worth of music that is carefully tagged and curated and there's a bunch of it that's not available on Spotify or Apple Music. So I guess in your logic, I should just... throw it away because it's "obsolete"? Pardon my French, but **** that.

You own nothing and you rent access. What you listen to and what you watch can disappear or change at the whim of some lawyer somewhere. You don't care that much about the music you listen to. And that's fine. You don't have to. But I think we all hear quite enough from you "it's the future, get used to it!" tools, thanks.



Thanks for telling us about "reality". Let me tell you about another reality: some people produce things with their Macs instead of consuming them. For some people using a Mac for their livelihood or to run a business, it's crucial to keep viable, versioned copies of their files, and need a way to quickly restore a computer if it should go out of service or need to be replaced. We get it, your computer usage consists of grazing at your streaming entertainment trough, but don't assume everyone's needs are the same as yours.
[doublepost=1542415542][/doublepost]

And your argument is crap, to be honest, and when someone here asks you to back up your quarter-baked opinion you seem intent on trolling us with, you bitch about not being a "consulting service"?

iCloud on a Mac doesn't even come close to what iCloud Backup does on an iOS device. In fact, you'll notice there isn't an "iCloud Backup" for Mac at all. There's iCloud Drive, but that does nothing to preserve settings or installed app configurations. So what you're half-assedly arguing for is replacing an existing backup system with a file sync system and saying "eh, that's good enough!" All I can say is, whatever you spend your day doing, I'm very glad you don't work for Apple.

Forget iCloud and time machine. All you need is a big hard drive (or SSD in my case) and Carbon Copy Cloner or some other good backup tool, along with a little bit of discipline to run a backup every once in a while

 

[LanTao]

Yes, and Samba does now provide very good and effective time machine settings. So any router with the newer versions of Samba should provide it without problems.

Have you actually tried this? I ran into tons of issues with Samba running out of "SMB2 credits" (which means that macOS kept sending commands without permission from the server), making initial backups take multiple days instead of hours.

On the one hand, yeah, the Time Capsules weren't bad. On the other hand, the competition offers so much more on the WiFi front that help users at home with their WiFi, like mesh, parental controls, integration with talking home assistants. Storage sharing options were always limited with few options on limiting access to different shares. Competitors like Synology did this better and cheaper. Plus, the market for routers is diminished as ISPs lock customers into their own CPE hardware more and more.

On the other hand, I'll miss the option for easy AirPlay 2 even with all its limitations, but you can get plenty receivers with AirPlay built in nowadays. And the Express remains for sale for the time being.

 

[MacsRuleOthersDrool]

my replacement router has 3 antennas that point in random directions after the cat finishes chewing them each day.

LOL!!!!

You win the Internets today!!!
[doublepost=1542424103][/doublepost]

Seems like those decrying the end of Apples airport line

I don't think that word means what you think it means...
[doublepost=1542426660][/doublepost]

I got this one

https://amplifi.com/

Well, any MESH system has at least the POTENTIAL to mop the floor with a single-source Router, and if the reliability, range, configurability, security, and STABILITY are there, then it COULD give the Apple Routers a run for the money.

It DID make SmallNetBuilder's Top 10 MESH Router Systems of 2018; but there are others that maybe even look better (at least on paper) :

https://wiki.ezvid.com/best-home-wi...MIy6i8sb3a3gIVu__jBx24lgDTEAAYASAAEgITffD_BwE

Although I DO feel it my duty to point out that Apple Routers CLEAR BACK TO THE FLYING SAUCER have supported "Mesh" Networking! Yes, that's right: Multiple Airport Routers have ALWAYS been able to provide a kind of "cellular" WiFi network over however-many "hops", with (theoretically) seamless hand-offs as you roam around inside the coverage-area...

https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT202056

 

[Stephen.R]

Although I DO feel it my duty to point out that Apple Routers CLEAR BACK TO THE FLYING SAUCER have supported "Mesh" Networking!

I've used this (it doesn't necessarily need to be Apple APs, juse use the same SSID and passphrase, and the devices should 'roam') but, the key difference is that those devices will connect to the upstream device over regular wifi, whereas the newer 'mesh' ones as I understand it, do their 'backhaul' to the upstream router over separate frequencies.

If you use ethernet for the backhaul part, then they're effectively equivalent to the newer 'mesh ones' when they operate over ethernet.

 

[mpainesyd]

So what do people recommend for Time Machine backups in a multi-Mac household? When I google the suggestions other users have posted the setup process looks complicated and there are lots of threads of people complaining. I just want the straightforward simplicity and consistent functionality that the Time Capsule provided.

I tried out Western Digital's My Home ethernet (NAS) hard drive the other day because my Time Capsule disk access was becoming painfully slow (there are no utilities to fix it - the hard drive needs to be removed and plugged directly into a computer (i.e. USB) to run repairs, other than the basic checks it does when the TC powers up).
I took the the My Home HD back after 3 hours of frustration. I should have done some more research as, in trying to get it to work with Mac, I found I was not alone. it is advertised as supporting Time Machine but those people who managed to get it to work often experienced data corruption later.
I had similar experiences trying to replace the TC wifi with an Orbi "mesh" wifi and took that back.
I do wish Apple had updated the Time Capsule for an easy, compatible home network experience.

So... for now I am keeping the TC for home wifi and have ordered a fast Thunderbolt desktop hard drive that will become my main Time Machine server and general network storage device, plugged into a "spare" Mac. Several other Macs will also use this drive for Time Machine. I also use several portable drives for TM backups of these Macs - I like Time Machine's ability to automatically alternate between these drives.

 

[BigBoy2018]

I don't think that word means what you think it means...

Decrying: denounce, condemn, criticize, censure, attack

I'm talking about people who are against and/or criticizing Apple for cancelling the Airport line of routers.

So yes, it means exactly what I think it means, and what I meant it to mean

Care to discuss what YOU think I meant?

 

[AtomicDusk]

I’ll never understand why they didn’t integrate Ethernet in/wifi out abilities into HomePod...

 

[OLDGUYWITHAHIFI]

So I keep getting prompted to back up my computer via Time Machine but Apple no longer sells a product that I can use to do back ups?

 

[Stephen.R]

So I keep getting prompted to back up my computer via Time Machine but Apple no longer sells a product that I can use to do back ups?

The only time I'm aware of Time Machine 'prompting' is to ask if you want to use the plugged in external drive, to do backups.

So, you're seeing the prompt literally because you've plugged in something you can use to do backups with.

 

[MacsRuleOthersDrool]

I've used this (it doesn't necessarily need to be Apple APs, juse use the same SSID and passphrase, and the devices should 'roam') but, the key difference is that those devices will connect to the upstream device over regular wifi, whereas the newer 'mesh' ones as I understand it, do their 'backhaul' to the upstream router over separate frequencies.

If you use ethernet for the backhaul part, then they're effectively equivalent to the newer 'mesh ones' when they operate over ethernet.

Right. I thought it was part of the original 802.11 spec to allow this "cellular" operation. Apple just made the setup very simple.

Interesting that there really is a difference in these new MESH routers, thanks!
[doublepost=1542440760][/doublepost]

Decrying: denounce, condemn, criticize, censure, attack

I'm talking about people who are against and/or criticizing Apple for cancelling the Airport line of routers.

So yes, it means exactly what I think it means, and what I meant it to mean

Care to discuss what YOU think I meant?

I KNOW what "decry" meant.

I think you meant "bemoan". Because their comments were more often those of remorse or regret, rather than of criticism or anger.

But to be fair, there are comments of both mindsets.

 

[Stephen.R]

Interesting that there really is a difference in these new MESH routers, thanks!

I haven't tried it, but from what I've read, the downside is that apparently every manufacturer's equipment will be vendor-locked (i.e. unable to mix and match units), and, if you notice the comparisons on e.g the Amplifi Instant page (comparing it against the AmplifiHD setup from the same manufacturer) - they give no indication that different 'series' of their own equipment is even compatible with each other.

So, if you want a 'core' router with multiple LAN ports, and wired ethernet 'satellite' access points, or a reverse-access point, to provide an ethernet outlet with a wifi link back to the 'core' router, it's not clear at all if their own equipment will work together.

Like I said earlier, it looks like I'll be going back to the likes of traditional Netgear or Linksys equipment whenever I need to replace/expand. They don't have apps to configure stuff but they also are actually interoperable, and from what I've seen Netgear stuff at least, does support Time Machine.
[doublepost=1542443459][/doublepost]Update: I asked this specific question to the Aplifi "chat" support

could I use the AmpliFi HD Mesh Router as a router - as the 'core' of the network, and then run ethernet to 'mesh point' devices shown on the AmpliFi "Instant" page, to extend the network. They're shown as being alternatives on the 'comprison', there's no real indication they work together.

And their response was

The instant mesh point which is a part of the instant kit will connect only to its own kit router.

To which my response (to them, literally, and in general) is:

Sure, thats understandable. Ethernet has only been standardised for 30 years, why would we expect two products from the same company to be compatible.

 

[H2SO4]

Which Draytek? It looks like the most recent model is from 2011...

2832. Airports are lovely if you want something simple and straight forward with minimal features. But that’s it.

As for rock solid you must mean software those expiring capacitors on the time capsules were quite a problem on the hardware side.

 

[ksec]

Wrong.

I have used other Router brands, too.

And, BTW, when the notoriously ANTI-Apple tech site, Slashdot.org, published an article a few months back when Apple announced their withdrawal from the Router market, there were a TRULY ASTONISHING number of posters that were singing the praises of Apple Routers, particularly with regards to STABILITY. And, quite frankly, most of those posters had tried several other brand routers, and were typically quite knowledgeable regarding same.

Because Apple Router was never designed with performance in mind. Nor was it designed to offer the best coverage. It was designed to be Stable, an Appliance that you didn't even know it exists. It wasn't based on Linux, it was NetBSD. The WAN Port was kept at 300Mbps, despite it is a 1Gbps Port. Port to Port LAN speed wasn't top notch either, it didn't do 900Mbps as other router tries to do. It did that so the CPU and overall system won't push to the limit and overheat or what other edge case happened.

I think only Eero comes close to ease of use and stability. Apple could have made its own Apple router. The thing about an Apple Router is that it is tested against all of Apple devices. You don't get this something silly mistake Router and devices not working in perfect harmony and requires a firmware upgrade.

I really wanted an Apple router. The mesh Router market offer the margin that Apple is happy to operate in, and not a race to the bottom. And yet Apple decide to quit.

I still think it make sense to have an Apple TV with Router function. That way the Apple TV streaming services get the QoS it needs. It will be like an Airport Express with Apple TV built in.

 

[RobbieTT]

Still seems a shame. I use 4 of the final Gen 6 AirPort Extremes as access points. All purchased secondhand or for free. They are the epitome of reliability and pass the essential wife-test with their simple and elegant design.

I still get a 1300 Mbps link to my AC capable devices and a enjoy a seamless transition from one AP to the next when roaming around the house; not too shabby, even when compared to much more modern units.

As I already have a Ubiquiti router and Ubiquiti switch I will move to their APs at some point but I am in no hurry to do so. The level of enduring firmware support for the Apple AirPorts will need to be monitored but I nearly fell over with shock when Apple recently upgraded my old but musically excellent AirPort Express units to the new AirPlay 2 standard. I guess someone at Apple had a soft spot for them, even at the very end.

I hope the gloss white monolith of the Gen 6 does not become the final tombstone of the 'It just works" mantra.

 

[Chytin]

This product was truly a 'it just works' device.
I had both, the flat one and vertical one. They were stable, fast and with great range. I have replaced mine with 2 Netgear Orbi's RBK50 (Base + Satellite) and have to admit, they blow any Airport out of the water. If you planning to replace your airport, these are not cheap but highly recommend devices. You will have greater stability, incredible long range with minimal drop in speed. If you love Apple design, the Orbi will please you with his minimal and high quality finish.