Epic Games Accuses Samsung and Google of Colluding to Prevent Sideloading on Galaxy Devices

[Seoras]

I've always suspected that the security services have dirt on Sweeny as they were the ones who pissed and moaned the most about giving mobile phone users security and privacy.
He's just the tea boy sent on an errand to crack open iOS and Android to our detriment letting our govs and politicians avoid the blame.
It seems to be all he's about, cracking open our mobile devices.
Not to Epics benefit, they've undoubtedly suffered in revenue in being locked out of iOS for years.
So why else?

 

[trusso]

Say what you want about Tim Sweeney, but Apple and Google are not above suing the **** out of people to get their own way. So spare me the self-righteous Apple sword-swallowing.

Also, shame on MacRumors for editorializing this piece of news. “Epic Games is looking out for its own interests” is true, but so is the fact that such lawsuits will work to improve the playing field for all developers. They are not mutually exclusive, no matter the self-interest of one party or another.

 

[PowerButton]

If Epic Games were a public company, it’s likely that the board would have replaced Sweeney long ago. The legal battles he’s pursuing seem misguided at best, and one has to wonder how much money is being wasted on lawsuits that could instead be invested in innovation. It’s hard to understand his legal reasoning. He comes across as someone who thinks every distributer is out to get him and that they should cater to him rather than their own interests and profits. 🤦‍♂️

On a side note, I’ve seen crackheads make a better argument than this. 😵‍💫

 

[PowerButton]

Say what you want about Tim Sweeney, but Apple and Google are not above suing the **** out of people to get their own way. So spare me the self-righteous Apple sword-swallowing.

Also, shame on MacRumors for editorializing this piece of news. “Epic Games is looking out for its own interests” is true, but so is the fact that such lawsuits will work to improve the playing field for all developers. They are not mutually exclusive, no matter the self-interest of one party or another.

Sweeney started a lawsuit based on no evidence, not sure how that’s good for anyone 🤨

 

[EM2013]

”Fortnite has made over $26 billion in revenue in the span of 5 years (2017-2022)”

Just look at how these anticompetitive practices are hurting fortnite.

 

[mdw1]

Hardly, the next stage of their case with Epic kicks off today after the judge rejected an extension request from Apple https://www.theverge.com/2024/9/28/24256684/apple-epic-lawsuit-document-production-delay-denied

Apple requests anti-steering injunction in Epic case be tossed given new precedent

Another major twist has occurred in the Epic vs Apple case that may end with everything getting thrown out thanks to new precedents and a lack of evidence from Epic.

appleinsider.com

 

[HMI]

Tim Sweeny is utterly exhausting.

If I were his mom, I’d be very disappointed!

 

[WilliApple]

I would love for Apple to troll Epic and make "App Store" the default setting on macOS.

Although I know this will piss off a lot of developers (myself included)

 

[Earendil]

Sure, he may be looking out for Epic's interests, but that doesn't change the fact that these lawsuits Epic has been filing have been and will be benefiting all developers.

All companies just optimize for themselves, but Epic is currently the only real counterbalance to the Apple and Google duopoly, so regardless of what the motivation is, a side effect of it is that it benefits all customers and developers.

It benefits all developers, even the shady af ones. And No, it doesn’t benefit “all customers”. He wants to trade user safety for corporate profit. That’s fine for the CEO of a for profit company, but let’s not pretend he’s Robin Hood.

 

[gigapocket1]

Next, he’s going to file a complaint on Microsoft for windows defender bring on by default and not having access to apples kernel during Mac OS boot

 

[goobot]

Honestly, nobody is buying that security pretense for a second. What absolute BS.

Allowing alternatives to Apple's and Google's app stores doesn't make anything any less safe. Nobody is forced to use those alternatives. Whoever feels uncomfortable downloading apps from alternative sources can simply opt to not do that, simple as that, isn't it? But the rest of the users can enjoy more freedom and more competition.

I can't believe people are still drinking Apple's and Google's Koolaid. This bogus security argument never made any sense.

People accuse Tim Sweeny and Epic of corporate greed, but Apple's and Google's hypocritical reasons for wanting to keep their app stores the only source for third-party apps are not rooted in greed? Are people really this naive?

You literally are forced tho if apps that would be on the App Store are now not

 

[Earendil]

Honestly, nobody is buying that security pretense for a second. What absolute BS.

Allowing alternatives to Apple's and Google's app stores doesn't make anything any less safe.

Of course allowing users access to dangerous software is less safe! We restrict access to dangerous things ALL THE TIME, and yes, sometimes people that can handle the drugs, or handle the riptide, or handle eating tide pods are swept up in the warning and restrictions.

Allowing other stores? Sure. Taking down the warning that other stores may be dangerous (which is what Epic is asking for)? Silly. Absolutely silly. I’m a millennial AND an SE, and am a pretty good judge (yet not perfect) of what is and isn’t dangerous on the internet. But I’m surrounded by people who aren’t. I bet you are surrounded too, or are too young to know you are.

 

[harmonthe3rd]

Sure, he may be looking out for Epic's interests, but that doesn't change the fact that these lawsuits Epic has been filing have been and will be benefiting all developers.

All companies just optimize for themselves, but Epic is currently the only real counterbalance to the Apple and Google duopoly, so regardless of what the motivation is, a side effect of it is that it benefits all customers and developers.

Yeah because Apple on its way to bankruptcy, sued its way to the top right? They didn’t create any products that consumers wanted right? Microsoft has pockets just as deep as Apple, Google annd Samsung yet what happened to the Windows phones? What happened to the Zune? Epic isn’t a counterbalance to Apple. Apple is in a different stratosphere than Epic. Funny how complaints about unreal engine are always left out of these conversations. How does a feature that and by definition an unknown case of colluding equate to better for customer and developers? I’ve been developing for iOS for well over 10 years and never once cared to develop for android, I’ve been developing for windows since the early 00’s and have had little interest in developing for macOS. Developers go where the idea makes sense and they have tools to implement them. Consumers go where they go. I know people that still use flip phones and couldn’t care less about an iPhone. Some consumers buy based on price, status, technology, rebates, promotions, luxury, etc. The list goes on. So your assumption that the side effects of Epics lawsuits will benefits others is predicated on no basis in fact, but on a perceived outcome of an unknowable conclusion of events. That seems to me to be a bite naïve and cliché. When you get a chance look at the complaints about how Apple deals with its ecosystem and see how those same complaints echo for Epic.

 

[Sergio The One]

Allowing alternatives to Apple's and Google's app stores doesn't make anything any less safe. Nobody is forced to use those alternatives. Whoever feels uncomfortable downloading apps from alternative sources can simply opt to not do that, simple as that, isn't it? But the rest of the users can enjoy more freedom and more competition.

In a perfect world I would agree with you, but the past 30 years of the Internet have proven that it would make everything less safe.

Nobody is forced to use those alternatives.

What happens when there's an exclusive partnership between one of these alternative app stores and say... my banking institution, or the messaging app everyone around me uses? Am I not forced to get it then?

It's not difficult to see someone like Meta making their own app store and forcing you to get them for things like WhatsApp, Waze, etc., so either I get it, or I'm locked out of interacting with everyone around me.

nobody is buying that security pretense for a second.

What if I get a 3rd party App Store that I believe is reputable, and then it turns out they get hacked themselves? My device could be immediately vulnerable to malware and it's possible I wouldn't even know until they disclose it, which history has shown us is rarely immediately.

Or something as simple as them storing my credit card in plain text on a file somewhere.

Less restrictions will always make things less safe. It's unfortunate but these things happen all the time. It's not even hypothetical at this point.

 

[I7guy]

Good luck with this lawsuit. It may end up as the last one.

 

[ellpee]

It’s YOUR phone, you should be able to do whatever you want with it including turning it into an aquarium.

 

[I7guy]

Epic Games: Committed to making the mobile app ecosystem as unsafe as possible, for one simple reason...micro-transactions in Fortnite.

The sheer greed...the staggering lack of recognition that they are deliberately making the digital world more unsafe simply to rake in a few more bucks...it boggles the mind.

And "they" say apple is greedy. Right?

 

[frenchcamp49er]

Epic will lose the war

 

[iBluetooth]

When is this guy finally going to **** off?

When he gets enough money!

 

[surferfb]

It’s YOUR phone, you should be able to do whatever you want with it including turning it into an aquarium.

And you still can with this feature - you just have to turn it off in settings!

Anyone who doesn’t think this feature is a good one, or that it shouldn’t be turned on by default, is falling to the “all users are as competent as me, a power user who posts on tech forums” fallacy. Most users should not be sideloading apps from websites.

 

[Plutonius]

When he gets enough money!

For corporations, there is never enough money

 

[Earendil]

Next, he’s going to file a complaint on Microsoft for windows defender bring on by default and not having access to apples kernel during Mac OS boot

Why stop there? Let’s remove all warnings from everything! Surely all humans are smart enough to accurately determine risk for themselves and others, right?

It’s YOUR phone, you should be able to do whatever you want with it including turning it into an aquarium.

I think if you extend that logic to other things you own, you’ll find that you can’t live in a civilized society.
But that’s not what’s happening here. Samsung phones can access their store. The complaint is over having to read a warning that it *might* not be safe and giving the phone permission (temporary or permanently) to access that store.

If no warning is allowed, I believe Samsung should be able to either:

A. Perma ban their store the first time there exists any harm from the store (data leaks, malware, undisclosed data sharing, etc)

B. Submit to having the code of their store and apps analyzed by Samsung.

Now, those seem rediculois right? Right. It’s far simpler (and not as safe) for Samsung to simply warn THEIR customers that using alternate stores carries risk, and to make that choice of increased risk explicit.

 

[Victor Mortimer]

Why stop there? Let’s remove all warnings from everything! Surely all humans are smart enough to accurately determine risk for themselves and others, right?



I think if you extend that logic to other things you own, you’ll find that you can’t live in a civilized society.
But that’s not what’s happening here. Samsung phones can access their store. The complaint is over having to read a warning that it *might* not be safe and giving the phone permission (temporary or permanently) to access that store.

If no warning is allowed, I believe Samsung should be able to either:

A. Perma ban their store the first time there exists any harm from the store (data leaks, malware, undisclosed data sharing, etc)

B. Submit to having the code of their store and apps analyzed by Samsung.

Now, those seem rediculois right? Right. It’s far simpler (and not as safe) for Samsung to simply warn THEIR customers that using alternate stores carries risk, and to make that choice of increased risk explicit.

There should either be a warning on ALL apps, no matter the source, or a warning on NO apps, no matter the source.

The idiotic app stores are no indication of quality, no indication that an app is not malware, they serve no useful function other than unjustly enriching giant corporations like Google and Apple.

 

[TAJones99]

What all the kids that are stealing from their parents to buy the Fortnite crap.

 

[currocj]

Epic Games: Committed to making the mobile app ecosystem as unsafe as possible, for one simple reason...micro-transactions in Fortnite.

The sheer greed...the staggering lack of recognition that they are deliberately making the digital world more unsafe simply to rake in a few more bucks...it boggles the mind.

The sheer (Epic) greed? And you are defending Apple/google? You’ve got to be kidding me