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I can tell you that with the information we now have access to, we're putting far more pedophiles in jail than before. The current belief is that the number of them hasn't necessarily grown with the internet (though it has made access easier) but we can now identify them with greater ease (before it was an even more underground network used to exchange pictures and other material).

Global terrorism has certainly grown in the past 10+ years. Technology has allowed us to track many terrorist, understand their movements, gain insights into their operations, and stop many attacks before they happen. Without it, it's 100% certain that we would have seen far more lives lost and terrorist cells would be far larger than they are now.

So we must weigh things. Are we better off with or without such tech? It can certainly be used for bad but it's most frequently used for good. Is the loss of thousands of additional lives worth some additional privacy (which is silly to believe as the bad guys will still have access to these tools even if we block ourselves from using them)? Is it worth additional kids being molested, raped, and killed in turn for some additional privacy?

Sadly, we only see reporting on such tools when they're used for bad. We don't ever see reports touting how an iOS forensics tool was used to find a little boy who had been kidnapped and raped for the past 2 years by a pedophile. We don't see reports of how a forensic tool was used to help uncover information that lead to a terrorist training camp in Afghanistan which was preparing for an attack on a sports stadium in the UK. It's much bigger headlines (read: dollars) to report on when these tools are used for bad, as that sparks outrage which drives more traffic to these sites and more money for them.
Hmmm, why is it that literally EVERY time there are calls for the next round of building the infrastructure of a police state we ALWAYS hear first and foremost about pedophiles, kidnappers, and terrorists?

It's an old canard dating back decades.

You don't happen to work for an intelligence agency contractor do you? Because it sounds an awful lot like certain tools you've been describing are directly from the likes of Cellebrite.
 
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The way we go about extracting the data is the same now as it was back then. They haven't changed it.

Same deal on the macOS side. We sell a flash drive that can be plugged into a Mac (actually works on Windows and Linux too) and it'll pull out all your Keychain passwords, browsing history, contacts, wifi network history, location data, and a ton more, in addition to copying and analyzing files the investigator specifies ahead fo time (the idea is you configure it ahead of time to carry out the tasks you want and then can give it to anyone in the field to run and bring the data back to you). It doesn't even leave a trace that it was run (it's forensically sound). Apple hasn't done anything to prevent it (other than a couple minor changes needed which took an afternoon of adjustment and testing to work around with some of the major OS updates).
And you can be sure that these tools haven't been found elsewhere?
 
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Only fake to the Fake President and his hating & blind supporters.
Don't forget Fake News too. Trump supporters think everything against what they believe in is now "fake".

So convenient for them.
Uh... Last I checked, they sabotaged both Hilary and Trump at different points throughout their election campaigns. No sane person, of either party, should be supporting the FBI. They've shown themselves to be a political entity, with no integrity.
 
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Two months is still pretty short for gaining access to a phone. I was thinking it would be more like years but I guess there is still room to grow.

Just use a strong alphanumeric password.
I have to enter mine once every other day, so inconvenience during daily life isn't an issue.
 
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Nobody here ever wondered what will be the next step if phones are too complicated to crack? How about making sure they control the ways data gets into your phone?
It's all very easy, calls and text and browser history and whatnot is just data, data that is cheap and easy to store en masse.
All they have to do is require all networks to store all data that has passed to every unit, for a long enough time. At this moment, they mostly store what devices talked to which device, it's not complicated to store the actual data.

Good luck defending your "privacy", if every conversation you ever had is on file.

I'd rather phones were easy enough to get into, than every bit transferred stored.
 
Uh... Last I checked, they sabotaged both Hilary and Trump at different points throughout their election campaigns. No sane person, of either party, should be supporting the FBI. They've shown themselves to be a political entity, with no integrity.
It's very hard to support their current behavior (like what Steve Jobs used to say about Sculley, "Isn't it funny, a ship that leaks from the top."). I seriously don't like it when investigators -- especially someone in charge of an investigation -- drops hints about who or what they're investigating. It smears the targets' names in public before judgments can be passed.

I would've bought Trump's claim that he fired Comey because of how he mishandled the Clinton email investigation. (that is, if he hadn't already told so many people that he wanted Comey off his back about Russia)
 
Nobody here ever wondered what will be the next step if phones are too complicated to crack? How about making sure they control the ways data gets into your phone?
It's all very easy, calls and text and browser history and whatnot is just data, data that is cheap and easy to store en masse.
All they have to do is require all networks to store all data that has passed to every unit, for a long enough time. At this moment, they mostly store what devices talked to which device, it's not complicated to store the actual data.

Good luck defending your "privacy", if every conversation you ever had is on file.

I'd rather phones were easy enough to get into, than every bit transferred stored.
This has been the case for well over a decade. Every major telecom has had a top secret room in their data centers for years that siphons off all data being passed through. It’s all stored, and you don’t even need to look that hard to find the reporting on it.

https://arstechnica.com/uncategorized/2006/04/6585-2/?amp=1

https://www.wired.com/2013/06/nsa-whistleblower-klein/amp

https://theintercept.com/2016/11/16/the-nsas-spy-hub-in-new-york-hidden-in-plain-sight/
 
Hmmm, why is it that literally EVERY time there are calls for the next round of building the infrastructure of a police state we ALWAYS hear first and foremost about pedophiles, kidnappers, and terrorists?

It's an old canard dating back decades.

You don't happen to work for an intelligence agency contractor do you? Because it sounds an awful lot like certain tools you've been describing are directly from the likes of Cellebrite.

Cellebrite is someone in our industry. I've hung out with their folks many times over the years at conferences like the HTCIA and DoD CyberCrime Conference. No, I'm not a government contract or and don't work for Cellebrite.

It's pretty cuts how so many think Cellebrite is doing something special because they're the only name they know in this field thanks to these reports. They're far from the leader in the industry and there are many tools that do a LOT more. But it's nice they take all the attention as if people were aware of many of the other tools there would be far more outrage.
 
Cellebrite is someone in our industry. I've hung out with their folks many times over the years at conferences like the HTCIA and DoD CyberCrime Conference. No, I'm not a government contract or and don't work for Cellebrite.

It's pretty cuts how so many think Cellebrite is doing something special because they're the only name they know in this field thanks to these reports. They're far from the leader in the industry and there are many tools that do a LOT more. But it's nice they take all the attention as if people were aware of many of the other tools there would be far more outrage.
I’m well aware it’s a multibillion dollar industry with hundreds of companies doing this exact type of work. Most of the general public, however, are blissfully unaware.
 
The FBI is not known for following the rules anyway. They probably want to get into the phones of people who have done nothing more than walk on their grass. When your government turns into a tyranny, they have to know everything about you, probably including when was the last time you pooped. They are definitely not to be trusted, especially when the DOJ is running amok and getting worse. Hitler's Gestapo would be so jealous of all the surveillance tools that are available now due to new technology. Himmler would be drooling.
 
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It's very hard to support their current behavior (like what Steve Jobs used to say about Sculley, "Isn't it funny, a ship that leaks from the top."). I seriously don't like it when investigators -- especially someone in charge of an investigation -- drops hints about who or what they're investigating. It smears the targets' names in public before judgments can be passed.

I would've bought Trump's claim that he fired Comey because of how he mishandled the Clinton email investigation. (that is, if he hadn't already told so many people that he wanted Comey off his back about Russia)
It's tough to draw too many conclusions about anything in politics. There are just too many things we don't know, and likely never will. I tend towards centrist views on most things, because of that. Did he want Comey off his back because the constant Russia thing was detracting from his agenda? Did he want Comey off his back because Trump actually had some sort of Russian support, and didn't want anyone looking into it? As with most things, it's more of a question of motivation than anything else. In truth, we may never know his true motivation behind most of what he does.

Putting that aside, Comey definitely deserved to be fired, for a number of reasons. Trump may have had bad motives, but in this case, that's largely irrelevant. The man had to go. If Hilary had won, I would have hoped that she would have done the same thing.
 
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What kind of idiotic attempt-to-evade question is that?

-->

There are TONS of these types of tools. There are numerous conferences devoted to them. The fact people are ignorant to their existence is hilarious. It's an industry that makes billions and continues growing.

We were the first live forensic tool on the market. Traditionally the method was to shut the computer down and take it back to the lab (usually pull the plug as shutting it down causes the computer to write additional data which could overwrite important information). Live forensics allowed us to capture data on a suspects computer while it was running. Items that may have been lost with the old style of investigation could now be captured and we could return valuable data in minutes instead of hours. In many cases this meant the difference between life and death for the people involved (such as child abductions or kidnappings).

Now many of the things we've pioneered are industry standards. We were the first to build in skin-tone detection. It allowed invistigators to narrow their search for images of interest. One example was that the US Treasury had a drive with more than 600,000 images. They were able to narrow their search to just 60,000 of those images. That means a LOT of time saved when someone has to go through every single one looking for evidence relevant to the case.
 
Dear Mr. Flatley, speaking of "jerks", lets talk about the FBI forensic investigators who for DECADES
overstated the results of their hair analysis in sworn testimony, resulting in numerous false criminal convictions.
"Of 28 examiners with the FBI Laboratory’s microscopic hair comparison unit, 26 overstated forensic matches in ways that favored prosecutors in more than 95 percent of the 268 trials reviewed so far, according to the National Association of Criminal Defense Lawyers (NACDL) and the Innocence Project"
https://www.washingtonpost.com/loca...62fcfabc310_story.html?utm_term=.2c7bb7374afe

Lets also talk about the FBI's forensic pseudo-science technique which claimed to be able to match a bullet recovered at a crime scene to a particular box of ammunition found in a suspect's home. Anyone with even a basic understanding of manufacturing processes and quality control knew this was total BS but the FBI continued to testify with this junk science in the courtroom until late 2005 (years after it was thoroughly discredited by the National Academy of Science).
http://archive.boston.com/news/nati...llet_science_flawed_independent_review_warns/

I used to respect your agency but multiple forensic scandals and the BLATANT politicization of your senior leadership have destroyed my trust in your agency. I trust Apple with my data & privacy 100X more than I trust your agency today.
 
The truth is the FBI doesn't care about you or what you're doing. Unless you're committing crimes, a pedophile, or a terrorist, they really don't care about you. You're not worth a minute of their time. Downloading some movies isn't their interest at all. You are nobody to them. Don't flatter yourself by thinking they care about you even one bit.

We want them to protect us but don't want them to have any of the tools to do so.
 
You have no idea the setup they and others have. It's FAR beyond what your typical hacker has access to. There's no comparison.

The FBI isn't full of themselves at all. Show me another group that has a system capable of cracking something like FileVault in under an hour. Please, enlighten us.

Source on FBI being able to crack Filevault2 under an hour?
 
Source on FBI being able to crack Filevault2 under an hour?
The thing about industry standard encryption is that the NSA and others have had people embedded in the standards bodies for decades...one has to wonder why :rolleyes:
 
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Integrity is a dirty word for all. government agencies.
Government naturally corrupts itself. It's unfortunate, but natural. Government tends to attract people who love power. The only thing those types of people love more than power, is more power, and that's how we got where we are. Limited government is a great idea, but nearly impossible to maintain in the long run. Governments are formed, corrupt themselves, die, and are formed again. History has shown that cycle countless times. The only difference is how much time the various governments throughout history have needed to complete the cycle.
 
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Source on FBI being able to crack Filevault2 under an hour?
https://nakedsecurity.sophos.com/2012/02/02/filevault-encryption-broken/

You might be talking to an employee of a firm like Passware or Cellebrite (there are hundreds of companies in this vein).
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Government naturally corrupts itself. It's unfortunate, but natural. Government tends to attract people who love power. The only thing those types of people love more than power, is more power, and that's how we got where we are. Limited government is a great idea, but nearly impossible to maintain in the long run. Governments are formed, corrupt themselves, die, and are formed again. History has shown that cycle countless times. The only difference is how much time the various governments throughout history have needed to complete the cycle.
Substitute Capital for government if you want the real story....
 
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