FCP X Demo: 'Nowhere Near' Final Version, More on Final Cut Studio Apps Coming

[marmotmammal]

Sorry, Bruce. Maybe ya' got rich while you could.

Where's that Adobe rep who was on the FCP threads a few days ago promoting Premiere? Oh, he's with Bruce Sharp talking about buying Singular Software?

I will not buy PluralEyes. Audio sync is built into FCP X.

 

[davidgrimm]

I locked my jaw from the constant jaw-dropping.

I was skeptical at first of it being dumbed down but once I saw the demo, it has a lot of things under the hood. Things just get out of the way and lets you focus on editing. It may look like iMovie but this is even better than the current Final Cut Pro and iMovie combined. Just look at how powerful the timeline is.

Oh crap, now I gotta watch the demo video. I'm an amateur editor who is frustrated with the new versions of iMovie, so I was thinking about FCe. I find the timeline in the current iMovie harder to work than some of the older versions. The older versions had other problems, so I don't want to go back. I was really hoping they would come out with a really nice (and cheap) version of FCE for users like myself in the sub $100 price range. This appears to be doubtful now.

 

[charlituna]

I think they meant the build they showed last night, which is the same build they showed in Feb, is an old version that's no where near what the final version in terms of features.

All reports are that this was the February version.

And it makes sense, Apple likes to keep things secret. Sure they showed sone features but really nothing that was a huge surprise. Not even the whole Mac App Store and dropping FCE was all that shocking. That they did all of it at once perhaps was. But I bet they have something wild they are revealing until later. If I was a crazy betting person I would say something related to blu-ray(but still without internal drives)

 

[wonderspark]

It looks great! I'll be adding this to my arsenal of editing tools for sure.

 

[charlituna]

In other words, what we saw tonight was nowhere near the final form of the application.

This statement has me a bit puzzled. FCP is supposed to be out in around 2 months. Are they going to rush the rest into FCP in this amount of time, or get the basics in there, then drag onto multiple updates?

Not at all. They wanted to give folks a taste. Back in February they had enough to do that and 'locked' the current form (with perhaps some things left out on purpose) as the demo. Showed it to a select group and then saved it for last night,

Then kept working on FCP and everything else (which has been under work for a while)

 

[chirpie]

By the way, just to be sure... this runs on 10.6, yes? I didn't see any mention of requiring Lion but I may have missed it.

(That'd be key, as there's some apps that are still Rosetta that we use, and 10.7 drops PPC application support.)

 

[TheBMill]

Why isn’t anyone talking about how ugly this interface looks? White on Dark backgrounds = not fun on the eyes. Please tell me this isn’t how it will look. The background rendering and all that stuff is great, but I HOPE this interface is customizable and has the ability to look a little like the final cut of yesteryear.

 

[stabsteer]

No clue. I bet it would run but not all that well. I hope these comments on the rest of the Studio will calm some of the "sky is falling" pessimists. I'm not saying that FCPX is a home run yet but I'm more than happy to leave my torch and pitchfork in the shed based on what's been demoed so far.

Don't know what these people are talking about. It will run fine on a maxed out 13" air. It's not nearly the same as a maxed out Mac Pro, but it will work fine. These people are just blowing steam without a clue. No one really knows but you should be fine. That's what I have after all!

 

[See Flat]

Why isn’t anyone talking about how ugly this interface looks? White on Dark backgrounds = not fun on the eyes. Please tell me this isn’t how it will look. The background rendering and all that stuff is great, but I HOPE this interface is customizable and has the ability to look a little like the final cut of yesteryear.

Dont agree. Not ugly. I've heard of people not liking white text on black backgrounds. I have no problem at all with that, and in fact prefer that in darker rooms. Blasting white screens tire me more in a dimly lit room.

 

[anim8or]

Spoken like a 12 year old

Owning software /= professional. Skill and natural talent for editing make you a professional. A real pro can cut footage on any system, any piece of software and doesn't rely on apps to do it for them. It's a tool that they use to do what they do faster and more efficiently so they can maximize their time/profits.

To certain degree I see what he is saying...

If I am correct then the point is that this new way of editing will open up more time for novice editors to spend more time developing editing techniques and styles rather then getting to grips with the software needed to do the job.

I don't think the pro software makes the editor a pro, but it will be a lot more of a smooth transition when using the new FCPX.

 

[kiwi_the_iwik]

Even though I've worked in the broadcast industry for over 25 years, as a cameraman I don't consider myself to be a professional editor at all. In fact, I probably know how to use only about 1% of the full potential of Final Cut Pro.

However, we as operators are sometimes required to send either edited track and rushes or complete edited packages from locations either locally or abroad, and in broadcast quality.

The ease of use in acquiring footage using a tapeless medium via Log & Transfer (in our case, P2 @ DVCPRO HD), editing on a native timeline and then transferring back to a card with no loss from transcoding is phenomenal. But FCP 6 & 7 had some caveats which I'd hoped would be addressed - especially with our codec of choice.

Our network decided to go with P2 because it was the most solid and diverse codec available for news, current affairs, sports and documentary use - being MPEG-4 native with an Intra-base (with no GOP). Metadata is an important aspect of our workflow, and older versions of FCP relied on third party applications in order to import metadata fields along with our clips.

So far, there's not been much noise as to whether Apple have addressed further P2 support for:

a) metadata,
b) native AVC-Intra 100, and
c) compression and FTP options directly from the timeline.

I'm also wondering whether the option to provide a Viewer window still exists - I'm not a fan of the iMovie-style transition to a single window (aka. Premiere), but would rather see the Player/Recorder-style remain, which AVID still adopts.

 

[orangerizzla]

While I can understand the iMovie Pro sentiments I'm personally not so bothered about the interface re-design. I've been using FCP since it came out and Premiere before that and to me the biggest sell is the speed ramp (64bit.) I'm curious as to what people might have thought if a new look FCP had come out before iMovie had even been released? It's likely it would have looked similar anyway since that is obviously the approach (visual and UI) that Apple is now adopting.

Personally I'm quite excited but I would like to be able to upgrade my whole FCP suite though (at a discount.) These days I use Motion as much as FCP and I'd seriously like to see the render bar 'disappear' from that... ;-)

 

[SimonMW]

All I care about right now is if this will run on a Mac pro 1,1. And if so, and it is using all cores finally, will there be a big performance increase on my system over my current FCP6.

If the answer is yes to both I'm in. I won't be impressed however if they artificially lock out older Macs.

 

[nick9191]

I'm unbelievably excited and I don't even edit video

Just a penchant for good software.

 

[nick9191]

Nope. Probably not even close. The Air doesn't have the processors or graphics required for even the current version

1GB of RAM, 2GB recommended, 4GB for uncompressed HD.
ATI or Nvidia graphics processor.

http://www.apple.com/finalcutstudio/specs/

Maxed out Air matches that, hell, low end Air matches that. I'm not saying it will be fast, because it will be deathly slow. But it'll run.

 

[reel2reel]

But...but...but...this is only "iMovie Pro"! Apple's dumbing it down! No "professional" would spit on this if it was on fire! A buncha internet blowhards said so, so it must be true!

Can you elaborate? What features make it dumbed down? Do you even know? Or are you just repeating what other ignorant people are saying cause it sounds cool?

Or are you actually employing sarcasm?

It's nice to see the generally positive comments on this forum, other forums for "professionals" are not so happy!

Personally I can't wait to start working with it.

I can't wait, either. I definitely won't use it professionally for quite a while but I'm excited to jump right in and start exploring. I'm guessing none of my 3rd party plugins will work and existing projects won't be compatible, but I'm so glad they're rebuilding FCP and moving into the future.

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If you think about it, it's not all too surprising that some of these "professionals" are getting so worked up and sulky over this release. The notion that "pro editing" can belong to just about anyone, rather than an exclusive circle of elites, poses an existential crisis. Apple's re-thinking of editing is also a re-thinking of what it means to be "professional". The announcement sheds light on a future in which their "advanced", learned techniques are no longer advantageous. The "industry pros" are facing the plight of impending impotence. It's not something anyone would really openly admit, but I think they're feeling a bit naked, stripped of their status.

Who can blame them for being pissy?

Haha, that sounds funny but it's not real-world. Film/Video production is actually hard work and requires skill and talent. Just because you can buy Final Cut Pro and learn where the buttons are doesn't mean you know the first thing about what you're doing. I see proof of this all the time. It's very hard to fill positions because a lot of up-and-comers these days can talk the talk but are actually dumb as feces. Call it "professional" or "elitist" or whatever you want but talk to me after you stare down the barrel of 200 hours of video and make a show out of it. Until then, you're all talk.

 

[bearcatrp]

I find the timeline in the current iMovie harder to work than some of the older versions. now.

Are you aware you can change the timeline to look like imovie6 HD? My biggest gripe about iMovie 11 is no third party plugins. iMovie 6 can use them though. I'm hoping the next FCE (if there will be one) has the same power as FCP. Yeah, it will be dumbed down but I want a semi pro editor for home use.

 

[reel2reel]

"Randy Ubillos, who did the demo, added more features ..."

Great, That's the guy who "redesigned" iMovie and screwed it up. I'll bet he was partially responsible for the "improved" (sic) iPhoto 11 as well.

I'll reserve judgement until this hits the streets.

Wow, we went a whole hour without this old one popping up again. I feel embarrassed for you.

More likely editing houses will be angry because of the new price point... $299 is much more affordable and makes rental booths seem unnecessary for many productions. Of course there will still be much more intense productions that will keep them in business for a while still.

I don't know, to me Final Cut Suite was always a steal. The 'revolution' started over 10 years ago. Unfortunately, broadcasters still require HDCAM/SR deliveries so rentals aren't necessarily a thing of the past yet. I can't wait for the day we can just deliver a quicktime file.

 

[nickmilitello]

Professional Editors

I am a professional editor. I get paid to edit. I just don't edit giant films. I think there is a little discrediting going on for what makes a professional editor.
I was in a discussion a year ago about all the new features that just got released. In the days of yesteryear, editors (film wise) would cut the film, then once they had a locked picture, they would add audio, color the film, sound effects and score. Those days are long gone.
A year ago during a project, I found myself very angry at the way FCP was functioning given the way editors have to edit today. I have been a big FCP user for years and consider myself very experienced with the software. I refer to the editing style of today (which is also being done in feature film editorial) that you are no longer just the film/video editor. YOU ARE the sound designer, the colorist, the composer, and the technician, at least a basic level.
I feel that 10 years ago you would show a "rough" cut that was 50% done, no audio effects, color, or score, just the cuts and clients were able to get it. However, today I feel that a rough cut needs to look more like 95% done. Many times when I show a client a piece of footage that doesnt look like an almost finished product, they get concerned about the final piece, even when you explain that it is a rough cut.
So now that a lot of editors are having to show cuts that are almost done to get notes, the actual act of editing has become a nightmare to me. I have show basically a finished cut (sounds, scores, titles, overlays, graphics) and then when there is a change, I have to move all of the sounds, scores, titles, overlays, graphics out of the way to make the simplest edit. Half the time, something gets moved that isnt supposed to causing extra work. And I will be honest, sometimes, (which I know we all do....) I say "good enough," because the actual act of moving a giant timeline around is just too painful.
Well not anymore! (hopefully)
I want the freedom that FCPX will hopefully provide.
And of course one final thought. A good editor is a good editor, it is an art. Just because someone is an "expert" on AVID, PP, FCP doesnt mean they are a good editor. Same as someone who knows how to put paint on canvas isn't necessarily Van Gogh.
I think this version will help us tell stories easily and more efficiently. It is still up to the editor what he/she will do with the tool.

 

[Digital Skunk]

Agreed, at this price point, I can't see that there would be any market for FCE.

I honestly think that's the point. Apple had iMovie, FCE and FCP (within Studio suite) so I think Apple is going to sell the standalone, fully unlocked version of their software for dirt cheap and discount it for students.

FCE was just missing a few minor features from the pro version, a UI tweak here to adjust for those missing features, and that was about it. Now, they can sell FCPX stand alone for $299 and bundled with the rest of the UBER UPDATED SUITE APPS for $999 maybe.

 

[See Flat]

I am professional editor. I get paid to edit. I just dont edit giant films. I think there is a little discrediting going on for what makes a professional editor.......A good editor is a good editor, it is an art. Just because someone is an "expert" on AVID, PP, FCP doesnt mean they are an good editor. Same as someone who knows how to put paint on canvas isnt necessarily Van Gogh.
I think this version will help us tell stories easier and more efficient. It is still up to the editor what he/she will do with the tool.

Amen!

 

[H. Flower]

I am professional editor. I get paid to edit. I just dont edit giant films. I think there is a little discrediting going on for what makes a professional editor.
I was in a discussion a year ago about all the new features that just got released. In the days of yesteryear, editor (film wise) would cut the film, then once they had a locked picture, they would add audio, color the film, sound effects and score.
However, a year ago during a project I found myself very angry at the way FCP was functioning given the way editors have to edit today. I have been a big FCP user for years and consider myself very experience on the software. I refer to the editing style of today, which is also being done in feature film editorial, that you are no longer just the film/video editor. YOU ARE the sound designer, the colorist, the composer, and the technician, at least at a basic level.
I feel that 10 years ago you would show a "rough" cut that was 50% done, no audio effects, color, or score, just the cuts and clients were possible able to get it. However today I feel that a rough cut needs to look more like 95% done. Many times when I show a client a piece of footage that doesnt look like an almost finished product, they get concerned on the final piece, even when you explain that is a rough cut.
So now that a lot of editor are having to show cuts that are almost done to get notes, the actual act of editing has become a nightmare to me. I have to move sounds, scores, titles, overlays, graphics all out of the way to make the simplest edit. Half the time, something gets moved that isnt supposed to. causing extra work. And I will be honest, sometimes, (which I know we all do....) I say good enough, because the actual act of moving a giant timeline around is just too painful.
well not anymore (hopefully)
I want the freedom that this FCPX with hopefully provide. It seems to be changing with how many of us are going to have to start editing.
And of course one final thought. A good editor is a good editor, it is an art. Just because someone is an "expert" on AVID, PP, FCP doesnt mean they are an good editor. Same as someone who knows how to put paint on canvas isnt necessarily Van Gogh.
I think this version will help us tell stories easier and more efficient. It is still up to the editor what he/she will do with the tool.

Nicely put.

 

[H. Flower]

I'm really excited for the new features, many of which sound great, but I wonder why they couldn't just implement them into the current FCP interface? I'm a heavy Final Cut Pro user and really fast with the current application. I hate to have to learn an entirely new interface.

I would be shocked if the keystrokes were different, so you'll have that going for you.

 

[milo]

And who, exactly, are you talking about?

All I've seen are a few anonymous comments on this message board. Who are those people? Are they pros? I don't know who they are. Do you know?

Funny how you've developed a whole theory about "professionals" and yet you haven't proved in any way that any pros said what you claimed they said. I've read that the crowd at the show seemed to really love it.

Looks like you totally misread his post - he didn't say professionals, he said "professionals". Meaning people who claimed to be pros.

And it's funny, yesterday those "pros" were all ranting that tons of features were removed and the rest of the suite killed, now that that has been debunked they're off in hiding.

Because you made a post that claimed our editing skills have nothing to do with creativiy or experience, but simply that 'knowing the software' is the only advangate we have.

Good try, but no. Because you misread his post and assumed something he didn't actually say. I know, sometimes sarcasm can be tricky, but it seemed pretty obvious to me.

There ARE "pros" who get mad because software gets cheaper and easier to use. If they are truly talented they should have nothing to worry about, but I'm sure there are guys out there who aren't especially great editors who are getting work because they could afford the cost of entry.

 

[Soura2112]

Have both

Hopefully when you download FCX from the App store it does not mess with FCP 7, so then you will have everything FCP 7 has and also FCX, best of both worlds.
Yes I know the "pros" want more, always will. I don't consider myself a pro, I commented before on my projects only 30% are paid jobs, while 70% is fun or free jobs I do for friends hoping for some word of mouth to spread. For what I do FCX new power will take advantage of my 8 Core Pro, while hopefully making all my projects look even better. So for an amuture this is great especially the price tag.
Like almost everyone here I dislike iMovie 11 and rarely use it, not even sure I used it for a simple project since iMovie 10 since I disliked that also, though I played with it enough to use it fully if needed.
I'm most curious about the learning curve, I know both iMovie and FCP so I just hope this is an easy transition so my work keeps moving and I want that paid % to go up.