Flash Player 10.2 is out, do you want the optimized Flash Player on iPad?

[TheWheelMan]

anyway, using flash still drains battery life. so if i had flash on my iphone or ipad now, a flash ad will be running draining my battery more than it would without flash being installed on that same site cos it's still a drain on resources

A lot of IOS apps have running ads anyway. Not sure Flash would be any worse on resources than they are. I know this discussion is about Flash, but I've found Java problematic at times. Seems to work better these days than in the past, but that may be because computers have enough power to handle it.

 

[shandyman]

Thing is, only the geeks have complained about the lack of flash. Joe public don't notice or care. I maintain 10 computers/laptops, a few of them moaned about them being slow. Removed flash and they all commented how much it's improved. Not one of them has encountered a problem online without flash.

 

[erpx]

I've not had a use for Flash on the iPad so I'm glad it's not available to crash my device. Further, just bought a new MacBook Pro and it doesn't have Flash installed either so I've been using it for about a month and have only come across one site that has asked for me to install it (Mint.com). I declined so that has now made that site have limited use for me but so I'm okay with it. My MBP zips really fast on the web and I prefer it that way.

 

[MrMac'n'Cheese]

If the option is able to toggle on/off, and when it's off it does not affect the quoted 9-10 hours of battery, then yes, otherwise no.....

 

[nippyjun]

Enough of the flash nonsense.

Whenever my browser crashes on my mac or pc its from flash. Flash needs to die.

end of rant...

 

[Funkymonk]

anyway, using flash still drains battery life. so if i had flash on my iphone or ipad now, a flash ad will be running draining my battery more than it would without flash being installed on that same site cos it's still a drain on resources

I have an android phone with flash and it averages 25-28hrs battery life even when I occasionally watch flash videos.

 

[silroc]

So you're asking me if I want CHOICE?


Well he'll yes I do!

It's irrelevant if my choice is for good or bad, I still want it.

These sheep who want NO CHOICE are making me sick , and do nothing but prove their blind fanboyisn..

Choice does not mean right or wrong..... It just means freedom to choose...

 

[flexengineer]

wrong, right now on this site, the tesco ad at the top of the page is playing. the video ad on aintitcool.com is playing without me even clicking it and if i mouseover accidentally it plays automatically.

And how is that relevant to Flash on iPad and iPhone? I never talked about your personal experience on computers and nobody care about it (I think I said that already), I am talking about a click to play scenario. If Flash was on the iPhone and iPad with touch to play then those ads would not run by themselves. On computers and on mobile there is nothing to stop HTML5 and they are all being converted from Flash to HTML5. So basically, unless you have something to add, you have no solid argument against the option to have Flash on iOS after how many posts? Jeez.

but then again, you're totally biased since flash is your occupation

You can blame me for knowing what I am talking about it will not make your ignorance look any better.

Thing is, only the geeks have complained about the lack of flash.

The lack of Flash is #1 complain from iPad users, just google it.

I've not had a use for Flash on the iPad so I'm glad it's not available to crash my device. Further, just bought a new MacBook Pro and it doesn't have Flash installed either so I've been using it for about a month and have only come across one site that has asked for me to install it (Mint.com). I declined so that has now made that site have limited use for me but so I'm okay with it. My MBP zips really fast on the web and I prefer it that way.

I am glad that you share your personal preferences with us but this thread is about the choice to have Flash if we want to, nothing refrain you from leaving it off. I believe Apple is up to no good with this ban on Flash and it has nothing to do with security or performance, at the end Apple's very own consumers are the victims of the scam more than anyone else.

 

[shandyman]

And how is that relevant to Flash on iPad and iPhone? I never talked about your personal experience on computers and nobody care about it (I think I said that already), I am talking about a click to play scenario. If Flash was on the iPhone and iPad with touch to play then those ads would not run by themselves. On computers and on mobile there is nothing to stop HTML5 and they are all being converted from Flash to HTML5. So basically, unless you have something to add, you have no solid argument against the option to have Flash on iOS after how many posts? Jeez.

you missed my point, i was responding to you saying that flash is click to play, but i was pointing its not. alot of it is already playing, therefore using resources even though i've not clicked it, so if flash was installed on my iOS device, these same ad's etc will already be draining resources, since they are running by themselves without me clicking to play. that is a solid enough argument in its own place since as can be seen, they're playing without being clicked.

You can blame me for knowing what I am talking about it will not make your ignorance look any better.

lol i know what i'm talking about too, i just don't show off my credentials.

The lack of Flash is #1 complain from iPad users, just google it.

Yes it is, for geeks and hardcore technologists. not joe public.

I am glad that you share your personal preferences with us but this thread is about the choice to have Flash if we want to, nothing refrain you from leaving it off. I believe Apple is up to no good with this ban on Flash and it has nothing to do with security or performance, at the end Apple's very own consumers are the victims of the scam more than anyone else.

if the consumers are the victims, why hasn't the general public kicked up an uproar? do you see flash getting the same attention as antennagate did? no it does not, it's not been on the evening news like antennagate did for the iPhone 4, therefore it's really an issue for a select demographic, sales are blatantly not affected by lack of flash. as for apple's supposed ulterior motives, your just showing your flash fanboism with your tinfoil hat.... in a few years flash will be in the minority of web technology.

 

[BaldiMac]

The lack of Flash is #1 complain from iPad users, just google it.

Actually, the numbers that you posted yourself claimed that it is the number one complaint for 11% of iPad users. It is tied with screen smudges and connectivity issues when you consider margin of error for the survey. It doesn't prove what you think it proves.

 

[MrWillie]

Ikea's website sucks without flash

No, it doesn't. The only Flash is when you click on a category, and there is a Flash window. But all the products from that category are still to the left of the window. Ikea's website would be even better if they didn't use Flash, but it doesn't suck on the iPad.

I have flash 10.2 on a android phone. it works very smooth and I like it.

would be really nice to have it on my iphone4


edit: for people voting no, why would you not even want the choice?

Ok fine then, so tell me again why having Flash on iOS turned off by default is a problem?

Because then the thousands (yes, that it is a figure that I pulled from my ass, but every day, Flash is less of an issue than the day before. Anyone have precise numbers ?) of websites, like ESPN, (which doesn't work on yalls dearly beloved Xoom) would not be motivated to make non flash versions of their site.

So you're asking me if I want CHOICE?

Well he'll yes I do!

It's irrelevant if my choice is for good or bad, I still want it.

These sheep who want NO CHOICE are making me sick , and do nothing but prove their blind fanboyisn..

Choice does not mean right or wrong..... It just means freedom to choose...

Yes, but most people are not smart enough to make the right choice. I suggest you make the Android choice, and then complain on the Android forums.

 

[ForumViewer]

At this point, I'm not interested in Flash. Website incompatibility issues with the iPad are few and very far between in my regular, daily usage. I just don't need it. Plus, I value battery life way more. No thanks, Adobe. You're a relic of the post-pc era.

 

[flexengineer]

Because then the thousands (yes, that it is a figure that I pulled from my ass, but every day, Flash is less of an issue than the day before. Anyone have precise numbers ?) of websites, like ESPN, (which doesn't work on yalls dearly beloved Xoom) would not be motivated to make non flash versions of their site.

And you really think it's ok for Apple to use its dominance to dictate what the company's CEO and other ideologists believe is good? You can't beat Flash so you just find tricks to hurt it and you want to refrain anyone from having it on iOS.

Well, that is the kind of tricks that Apple has been using for a long time, that is actually probably why Steve Jobs was ordered last week to bring his ass to court:

Apple’s Jobs Must Answer Questions in ITunes Antitrust Suit.
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-...er-questions-in-itunes-antitrust-dispute.html

When I started to read the court papers I had a "deja vu" experience, it will probably look like this:

Bill Gates - Deposition (partial)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xHQxr2uOoKY&feature=related

Apple banned Flash to protect iTunes and AppStore monopoly and use Apple dominance to maintain iTunes and AppStore dominance.

This is the actual initial case all the way back 6 years ago with all filling history all the way to current day, Apple ran that scam for years, there was the Real episode, there was the Flash episode and now it is court time:
http://dockets.justia.com/docket/california/candce/5:2005cv00037/26768/

Adobe was smarter and did not sue, they just got FTC and EU involved to force Apple to open to other development platform for iOS and they won, this month with the release of AIR 2.6 it is the first time the following has ever been possible:

Comb Over Charlie - an AIR 2.6 multiscreen game
AIR 2.6 game running on numerous Android and iOS devices.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5rp7UNCWbyc

It is the direct result of European Commission preliminary investigation which started in May 2010 and during which Apple was constrained to reverse its change of TOS aimed at forcing developers to buy a Mac to develop for iOS and use only Apple approved tool to develop, once that was taken care of the commission closed the case and the commissioner came on record saying Apple complied.

Actually, the numbers that you posted yourself claimed that it is the number one complaint for 11% of iPad users.

Yep it is "only" 11% and it is the #1 reason of complain. Keep dissolving the issues, that comment was absolutely irrelevant. 11% or 99% if there is no reason with a higher percentage then it is the #1 reason, and those numbers are from 2010 while Apple's consumers become more aware by the day.

Also, watch the poll on this thread, 55% want the option of Flash on iPad and this website is the mecca of Apple's supporters so that speaks for itself.

 

[koruki]

And you really think it's ok for Apple to use its dominance to dictate what the company's CEO and other ideologists believe is good? You can't beat Flash so you just find tricks to hurt it and you want to refrain anyone from having it on iOS.

Well, that is the kind of tricks that Apple has been using for a long time, that is actually probably why Steve Jobs was ordered last week to bring his ass to court:

Apple banned Flash to protect iTunes and AppStore monopoly and use Apple dominance to maintain iTunes and AppStore dominance.

This is the actual initial case all the way back 6 years ago with all filling history all the way to current day, Apple ran that scam for years, there was the Real episode, there was the Flash episode and now it is court time:
http://dockets.justia.com/docket/cal...cv00037/26768/

Adobe was smarter and did not sue, they just got FTC and EU involved to force Apple to open to other development platform for iOS and they won, this month with the release od AIR 2.6 it iss the first time the following has ever been possible:

Comb Over Charlie - an AIR 2.6 multiscreen game
AIR 2.6 game running on numerous Android and iOS devices.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5rp7UNCWbyc

It is the direct result of European Commission preliminary investigation during which Apple was constrained to reverse its change of TOS aimed at forcing developers to buy a Mac to developer for iOS and use only Apple approved tool to develop.

Yep it is "only" 11% and it is the #1 reason of complain. Keep dissolving the issues, that comment was absolutely irrelevant. 11% or 99% if there is no reason with a higher percentage then it is the #1 reason, and those numbers are from 2010 while Apple's consumers become more aware by the day.

Also, watch the poll on this thread, 55% want the option of Flash on iPad and this website is the mecca of Apple users and supporters so that speaks for itself.

I think anyone whos been on MacRumors for a while knows this place is a pretty sorry excuse for mecca, its loaded with trolls 24/7.

As for the blocking flash to benefit the Appstore, I think Apple wanted apps that actually made use of the multitouch hardware(instead of mousedown mouseup, mouseover), kept battery power reasonable and didn't just want apps that were one directional since a huge portion of the flash content on the web is just banners/videos or click to action advertising. Can you actually point out any useful Applications built in flash?

 

[BaldiMac]

Yep it is "only" 11% and it is the #1 reason of complain. Keep dissolving the issues, that comment was absolutely irrelevant. 11% or 99% if there is no reason with a higher percentage then it is the #1 reason, and those numbers are from 2010 while Apple's consumers become more aware by the day.

Please read more carefully. It is not the number one complaint. It is the number one complaint for 11% of users. 89% do not consider it the top complaint.

Also, watch the poll on this thread, 55% want the option of Flash on iPad and

Why watch the poll? What does it show? Absolutely nothing. Heck if you want to take it on it's face, than Apple still has a whole heck of a lot room to grow. I'm sure they'd be happy with 45% of the market. But that's a ridiculous assumption.

What it means is that 55% of the people in this forum who care enough about flash to click on the thread AND submit a response to the poll would prefer to have the option to turn Flash on and off. So?

But because the poll was not conducted scientifically, it doesn't speak at all to anyone outside of the 214 people that responded.

this website is the mecca of Apple users and supporters so that speaks for itself.

And this forum is also a place for people to gather to complain about Apple. What's your point?

 

[flexengineer]

Can you actually point out any useful Applications built in flash?

Sure, Hulu.com, Amazon new streaming offering (they take on Netflix, Apple TV and iTunes with this), the new Amazon Music Cloud (they beat Apple on cloud music), the Amazon AppStore (yep, they dared), the entire trading platform from Morgan Stanley that is the interface used by clients and brokers around the world, same with UBS and probably half of Wall Street investment banks, the Wall Street Journal application, the BBC player, Flash is also turned into an industry standard by VMware for cloud computing and virtualization interfaces, the new web tv show from Simon (producer of American Idol) last year was entirely in Flash and entirely inaccessible to iPhone or iPad users, the Youtube player is also one, you think you get it all with HTML5 but you do not, and you especially do not get the millions of embed that will take years to convert and any of the premium videos, and I could keep going for hours, thousands and thousands of anything from stupid games to Fortune 100 business critical applications, the whole spectrum.

Looking forward, with what Adobe just accomplished by delivering Flash 10.2 and AIR 2.6 the Flash Platform is on its way to take over the entire mobile applications market this year. Those applications will work like native apps everywhere including iPad and iPhones but they work directly in the browser too, just not on iOS... so just sit and watch how much stuff will work on your friends Android browser but not on your fancy Apple device, unless you buy it from Apple. Ching ching, 30% tax on the sale or advertising revenue of something that is free for anyone else on Flash enabled devices. Meanwhile, watch Apple's market share start to go down now that they can't use trick to maintain artificial dominance anymore because of all the regulators and courts scrutiny. Then, get some popcorn to watch the affect that is going to have on the stock. I have been consistent since December 2010, I said I believe that is what will happen and so far it is happening, let's see how much of it will happen, we are only going to have to wait a few months.

This is just a few of the big companies actively recruiting Flash, Flex and AIR developers by the dozens, just based on the offers that passed through my desk within the last 60 days:
CNN, ATT, T-Mobile, Sysco, HP, Motorola, Intuit, Hitachi, Google, VMware, Disney, Warner Brothers Studios, Nokia, Morgan Stanley, UBS, Dun & Bradstreet, Roundarch, Lab49, Cynergy Systems ...

 

[Carouser]

And you really think it's ok for Apple to use its dominance to dictate what the company's CEO and other ideologists believe is good?

I think it's ok for Apple to be free to offer the products it sees fit. If there's anything more worth being said, it's not obvious in this thread. I remain open to the possibility, however.

 

[goMac]

No thanks, I'll pass:
http://smarthouse.com.au/Home_Office/Security_And_Support/N4X4V9L5

 

[flexengineer]

No thanks, I'll pass:
http://smarthouse.com.au/Home_Office/Security_And_Support/N4X4V9L5

Your choice, you just dont turn it on or dont install it and let everyone else decide for themselves.

 

[goMac]

Your choice, you just dont turn it on or dont install it and let everyone else decide for themselves.

It's not as simple as that. As an application developer, do I trust devices that run Flash after this?

 

[MrWillie]

Apple’s Jobs Must Answer Questions in ITunes Antitrust Suit.
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-0...t-dispute.html

This is the actual initial case all the way back 6 years ago with all filling history all the way to current day, Apple ran that scam for years, there was the Real episode, there was the Flash episode and now it is court time:
http://dockets.justia.com/docket/cal...cv00037/26768/

Two busted links. I didn't waste my time with the YouTube links. I know from previous threads you are a Flash developer. You might want to consider some training in a different field.

 

[flexengineer]

It's not as simple as that. As an application developer, do I trust devices that run Flash after this?

As an application developer you should be worried about the privacy of users and be as concerned about iPhone giving away individual device identification among other security issues for which they are being sued, which is something application developers conveniently forget about since we are among those making the money out of it, right? Nobody ever sued Adobe for any privacy or security issue as far as I know.

Apple sued over privacy in iPhone, iPad apps
http://news.cnet.com/8301-13579_3-20026677-37.html

Just google "iOS security" to see that it is an universal problem. Also, get yourself Chrome:

Flash Security Update in Chrome at the Forefront of Browser Security
http://www.thechromesource.com/flash-security-update-in-chrome-at-the-forefront-of-browser-security/

Adobe clearly focus on Chrome first when it get to security fix and that is because unlike Apple doing everything it can to make Flash as unstable as possible on Mac and Safari, Google decided to bake it in Chrome and sandbox it for security, there is a tight relationship in place between Adobe's and Google's engineers. Always up to date, security fixes and update build in the browser. Nothing refrain Apple from doing the same.

For everything you will bring against Flash, I will have an answer showing Apple is no better or worst so keep trying. I went around the block quite a few times over the past years. There is no doubt Apple is screwing its own customers by banning Flash and does so for corporate interest and financial gain, certainly not security or user experience or anything else for that matter.

 

[asleep]

No, I don't watch porn.

 

[TuffLuffJimmy]

Of course I would appreciate Flash on iOS, especially with something like click-to-flash. However, a lot of unoptimized Flash content wouldn't work on iOS products considering the lack of keyboard and mouse.

 

[flexengineer]

Two busted links

Thanks for pointing that out, I fixed the links in the original post, here they are:

Apple’s Jobs Must Answer Questions in ITunes Antitrust Suit.
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-...er-questions-in-itunes-antitrust-dispute.html

"The Apple iPod iTunes Anti-Trust Litigation"
http://dockets.justia.com/docket/california/candce/5:2005cv00037/26768/

It might end up looking like this: Bill Gates - Deposition (partial)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xHQxr2uOoKY

Nobody is above the law and the more popular, arrogant and confident the CEO, the easier it is to get the big guy in court. Steve Jobs said a LOT of crap over the years to trash competition so much he could not remember himself, probably the same applies to emails, corporate documents and other forms of communication. Apple's lawyers did everything they could to avoid having Steve testify using his health condition as an excuse, until he showed up surprisingly vigorous to launch the iPad 2 at which point the judge considered that if Jobs is healthy enough to give a show for the iPad 2 then the CEO is certainly healthy enough to testify in court.

On top of this, there is now also all the information that came out of the European Commission and FTC joint investigations triggered by Adobe around May 2010. It's all interconnected and it is all coming down.