No, Adobe made Flash a negative point for Apple through years of offering a sun-par version for OS X.
Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
"Full" internet, really?
- Thread starter BobHail
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
That's interesting to note. Personal experience I haven't seen a lick of difference at least in the websites I surf and the videos I play. But then again I personally don't care if it's in flash or HTML5, as long as it works, and flash works just fine on my samsung captivate without any doomsday prophecy coming true as many are clamoring about.
The funny thing is the high moralistic ground we see Apple and the anti Flash loyalists, as if Flash were truly propietary and HTML5 was truly benevolent and open source, both of which are actually misnomers. It's interesting to research who developed HTML5, who presides over it, and who holds the intellectual property, yes Apple is quite entrenched in these functions. The only time you really run into proprietary issues with Flash is if you need to use any codecs, and that's not really Adobe's fault, in contrast to run HTML5 you need a license from guess who (and guess who makes money off h.264). Once again this is stuff that the non technical vast majority of iphone/ipad consumers could care less about, but it is interesting to note behind the scenes that both of these formats are much more similar than they are different, and neither provides us that make believe high moralistic ground that just doesn't exist. Just because the W3C standardizes something doesn't mean there isn't a company behind it pushing their agenda, as altruistic as we would all love the W3C to be.
In the end it is really just about the 2 companies (and really more than 2 if you start to add silverlight and others) fighting for their piece of the pie. It's not about Apple riding in on a white horse in shining armor to save the day, it's about them profiting more from HTML5, and I'm not saying anything against that, I'm an apple shareholder and think that's great. But it's more conducive to the discussion to not moralize too much about these standards and their motives.
So Windows has a "less than full" Internet experience because Apple decided to use a new streaming format for their keynotes?
Listen, I love the iPad, but to consider what Apple does with keynote streaming is ridiculous. Explorer and Firefox own 80% of the market. So if I can do it in one of THOSE, yes, that's what I would call FULL. Not whatever Apple comes up with.
So I went to MSNBC.com and saw a video for the new "Star Wars Unleashed" game. Clicked on it, started playing, crashed mobile Safari. (sigh). Had to pivot to my trusty old Compaq Presario running Windows XP and Firefox to get the "FULL" internet experience. (double sigh).
No one is denying that the iPad is a fantastic device, but geez louise some people here like to ignore its obvious deficiencies. If that makes people happy, fine. Sometimes I NEED flash (like Weight Watchers Points Tracker), and the iPad just doesn't cut it. Period.
Loving my iPad (but living in the real world surfing the "full internet.
)Many site detect your browser and will display flash for some, HTLM5 for others. They look the same but work on both devices. The majority of video on the site I visit work today, whereas 6 months ago very few did.
Standards are not necessarily the same as open. W3C is collaboration of several entities which, as a group decide the direction of web standards. These are published and anybody can obtain the complete specs and required licenses to create a browser with any optimizations they desire. This competition is what drove the rapid HTML and JS optimizations over the years.
On the other hand Flash is synonymous with Adobe. They have the final and only say for Flash specifications. By withholding necessary information for video playback, they are and continue to be the only viable option for Flash players. the open screen project is a bit of an empty gesture if you can't implement video playback. There isn't a single flash alternative project that is past the pre-alpha stage. Of those, none are attempting to support Flash 10 or video playback.
It's not about "Motives". I don't believe the Adobe has any interest in intentional harming another company; however they have demonstrated a lack of commitment to Apple OS's in the past. I understand that is was a financial decision based on the Mac market share, but this model in practice locks out upstarts until Adobe grants them a blessed client.
As for H.264... yeah it's not a great option and I would like to see WebM gain some ground.
Listen, I love the iPad, but to consider what Apple does with keynote streaming is ridiculous. Explorer and Firefox own 80% of the market. So if I can do it in one of THOSE, yes, that's what I would call FULL. Not whatever Apple comes up with.
So I went to MSNBC.com and saw a video for the new "Star Wars Unleashed" game. Clicked on it, started playing, crashed mobile Safari. (sigh). Had to pivot to my trusty old Compaq Presario running Windows XP and Firefox to get the "FULL" internet experience. (double sigh).
No one is denying that the iPad is a fantastic device, but geez louise some people here like to ignore its obvious deficiencies. If that makes people happy, fine. Sometimes I NEED flash (like Weight Watchers Points Tracker), and the iPad just doesn't cut it. Period.
Loving my iPad (but living in the real world surfing the "full internet.
Well I just viewed a bunch of videos on msnbc including the Star Wars one. No Safari crash.
No one is denying anything, I just don't care about flash or the flash sites. It seams y'all are looking for problems instead of just enjoying the device. As the iPad is beginning to dominate, more and more websites are starting to 'get it' and build compliant sites that don't require 3rd party add ons.
Sometimes I need to interface with PLCs and PACs, and of course the iPad doesn't cut it. But I am not dewelling on that. Until weight watchers changes, you will need to use your desktop/ laptop. But that is just one thing. You also might try rebooting your iPad every once in a while.
Edit: There's an app for that (free). It is only for iPhone, but you might want to give it a try. Does points and everything.
One more edit: The real disappoint with the iPad is Excel compatibility. Does anyone know of an app that does cell merge and graphic insertions ?
I have never gone to CNN, but evidently they don't get it, but Fox does. There is over 8 million of these devices out there, let's make our website useful to them.
Again, if you quit supporting websites that are dependent on flash, they will have to change.
CNN has an app for the iPhone, but not the iPad. I wonder when they will figure it out ? NPR app works great, and it's free.
Try a reboot every once and a while.
Overl 150 posts, and here's what we've got....some sites work, some don't, and some are in between. This bothers some, and not others. The important thing is we've been BobHailed! I think the "discussion" has gone as the OP wanted and expected, and as in other threads I don't really think he cares one way or another.
But since I'm here I'll say I don't find the lack of flash a problem and do most of my web surfing on my iPad now instead of my 17" MBP.
But since I'm here I'll say I don't find the lack of flash a problem and do most of my web surfing on my iPad now instead of my 17" MBP.
The trouble with an argument like that is it's a relatively small number...
There are millions more dumbphones still with WAP browsers, and millions more Blackberrys with extremely simple browsers.
If the idea is to cater to majorities, then such logic argues that they should make their websites available to those larger groups first.
Figure the odds on that, of course
The trouble with an argument like that is it's a relatively small number...
There are millions more dumbphones still with WAP browsers, and millions more Blackberrys with extremely simple browsers.
If the idea is to cater to majorities, then such logic argues that they should make their websites available to those larger groups first.
Figure the odds on that, of course
Yep 8 million is a small percentage when you look at the big picture. However, if I build my site to work on the iPad, it will do them all, except the wap people. Then I won't leave out 8 million plus devices.
I remember the wap from my PDA days, if you want to include them, you will have to make a separate WAP site.
I don't purchase products from online sites if I can't access the site from my iPad. I don't have a problem with my banks website (teche.com), my 401k website, and I use the TD Ameritrade app for stocks. (I use to use their WAP site years ago). Other than updating podcast for my Nano, ripping my PURCHASED CDs and DVDs, and work related crap that can't be done on the iPad, I don't use my laptop or desktop anymore.
I fixed the "are" and changed it to "our". (Yes, even after you quoted me).
Exactly this. Couldn´t have it said better myself.
(Then it could be the "best browsing experience".)
If you're having trouble with YouTube ( a black screen ) just send a link to someone of a video go to you're mail box and press the link once youve done that it will say YouTube nOt available exit that. Video and go on to it again and you should be fine
The thing that annoys me about the iPad browsing experience is the fact that tons of websites automatically redirect me to the MOBILE version of the site... Which looks f'd up on a 10" iPad screen, with all the super narrow elements stretched out like there's no tomorrow. And even when you request the desktop site, some sites STILL give you the mobile version!
It's about time that web servers learned to tell the difference between a PHONE and a TABLET.
It's about time that web servers learned to tell the difference between a PHONE and a TABLET.
Necroposting at its best ...
But interesting to look at the thread. Complaints that 8 million iPhones can't see Flash sites. So how many iPhones (and iPads, which didn't exist back then) are there now? Plus all the other phones that don't ship with Flash anymore?
I think this 8m figure is drastically wrong. Lol
There were 84 million iPads sold upto sept 2012
And 400 million iOS devices in total to that date.
I gather that this complaint no longer holds true anyway as many of the sites mentioned in this thread have moved away from flash and work fine with the iPad now. How times have changed...
It's so ironic that back in the day the argument was "lack of flash will kill the iPad" when it turned out to be that lack of flash on iPad killed flash.
It's so ironic that back in the day the argument was "lack of flash will kill the iPad" when it turned out to be that lack of flash on iPad killed flash.
While I'm with you that that's annoying - don't blame the server, blame the site's web developers. It's quite simple to serve a mobile version to phones and the full version to tablets. Some developers just don't bother to make the effort.
I couldn't disagree with you more. I prefer browsing the internet on my iPad over doing it on a computer (mac or pc), partially because of the portability, partially because of the apps that are available.
There are literally 0 websites I visit daily that I can't do on my iPad, Flash is dying and I hated it while it was still a success I hate it now.
In addition to all this, there are many websites which have better apps than the website itself. For example Reddit, the website is terrible, Alien Blue is fantastic.
EDIT
Just now I realized this topic is super old, who has been digging around?!
I agree with you. Sure iPad and inherently iOS doesn't have Flash and many sites will serve the mobile version. That isn't ideal. Some sites can't be accessed such as CBS.com to watch Big Bang Theory or South Park's site. But there's something good about being able to "touch" the Internet. Being able to resize without a need to think about which menu setting to navigate to. Being able to open another tab. Or playing a quick game. Etc.
Uhh, this thread is specifically about the iPad. The iPad was most assuredly out when this thread was started.
It's funny to see this comment cause now 3 years after after the launch of the iPad, most sites are bending over to be iPad friendly, having a great app is the new thing, even porn is getting away from Flash and Adobe gave up on all mobile versions etc
It is true that tablets offer a cramped experience of internet. In fact, even laptop isn't enough. Desktop is by far my favorite medium to browse internet. The freedom to open 20 tabs, especially when you are hunting for info, on a large screen- That's the optimum browsing experience.
However, i dont really see the point of blaming tablets for doing what they do. In my case, im really liking phablets more and more. A phablet is all that i need for consuming media and occasionally surfing the web. No need anymore for tablet.
However, i dont really see the point of blaming tablets for doing what they do. In my case, im really liking phablets more and more. A phablet is all that i need for consuming media and occasionally surfing the web. No need anymore for tablet.
Webservers do know. It's a web developer's choice to use the mobile version... on a tablet.
Actually that happen with the iPhone but not with the iPad. I can see desktop websites almost everywhere ...
----------
Flash is dead ... Unfortunately is dead also the man who told that us several years ago ...