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Where is the mic? Now embedded in the earpod via bone conduction? With the controls so low below the Y, I can't imagine it would be effective there and didn't notice it in the video on the control pad..
Not sure if this video is even legit. Regardless, I'm hoping that since these earbuds can now be powered, that they will include noise canceling on the mic. That would be a huge benefit for lightning earbuds. That's the main reason I don't use my current 3.5mm earbuds for phone calls.
 
I think they are getting it as right as they can. Plus, I believe part of the reason for this timing is that Apple is laying the groundwork for radical formfactor changes to upcoming iPhones that will be predicated on not having that extra port (e.g. eliminating the "forehead" and the "chin" in order to have the entire front face of the phone be screen).

It takes balls to push things forward, and Apple takes a lot of flack for it. Thank god someone is willing to do it.

I can absolutely respect this, but I have to ask, why not give us this when the design actually does call for it? Why not dump one industry standard for another? We are at s point where literally all proprietary connectors are gone from smartphones, except with Apple.

Seems to me that taking something away while giving them something in return is better than taking it away today with the assumption we might get something for it in return next year.

I also realize there is some level of precedent. As a consumer it's just frustrating. And I think most people are just speaking in their frustration.
 
Of course it is large connector that's where the DAC and amp go. Any adapter will also have the DAC and amp in it and have some sort of larger plug or inline body to house these components. That's the parts along with the 3.5 plug itself that are removed from the iPhone 7.

We've discussed this many times now. DAC and amplifier are NOT removed from the phone because the phone still needs them to drive internal speakers (which means that the setup as you see it in this video includes at least two DACs and two amplifiers which in itself is the argument against removing 3.5mm plug).

The size of the connector is just gross (especially compared to the external part of the 3.5mm jack) which makes me think this might be a fake (as in not Apple device). Why not put DAC and amplifier into the control unit? The size of this unit makes little difference.
 
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We've discussed this many times now. DAC and amplifier are NOT removed from the phone because the phone still needs them to drive internal speakers (which means that the setup as you see it in this video includes at least two DACs and two amplifiers which in itself is the argument against removing 3.5mm plug).

The size of the connector is just gross (especially compared to the external part of the 3.5mm jack) which makes me think this might be a fake (as in not Apple device). Why not put DAC and amplifier into the control unit? The size of this unit makes little difference.
These threads get tiring as you have to repeat yourself over and over and over.
 
I can absolutely respect this, but I have to ask, why not give us this when the design actually does call for it? Why not dump one industry standard for another? We are at s point where literally all proprietary connectors are gone from smartphones, except with Apple.

Seems to me that taking something away while giving them something in return is better than taking it away today with the assumption we might get something for it in return next year.

I also realize there is some level of precedent. As a consumer it's just frustrating. And I think most people are just speaking in their frustration.
From an engineering, as well as an ecosystem standpoint, changing everything at once would be even more difficult and disruptive. Every case, screen protector, car mount, arm sleeve, etc. will all need to change. Plus, the sooner they eliminate the 3.5 mm audio jack, the sooner other accessory makers will innovate and come up with new/improved/cheaper wireless solutions, which will be better for everyone. Waiting a year delays the whole process. Also, I believe Apple is making the change to the new audio connector now because they also have a slew of new MacBooks & iPads coming out soon so it makes sense to make the transition across the board.

I personally don't think of it as having anything "taken away", so I'm not looking for anything "in return". If my new iPhone 7 is faster and has better voice recognition and more storage, I'll be happy.
 
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The transition between the lightning plug and the cable looks very sharp, boxy, and un-Apple like.
 
I'm not an Apple fanboi that believes everything that comes out of Cupertino is beyond reproach. But in this case, I think they are getting it as right as they can.

Thank you again for your reply. It shows that there are so many things to take into consideration.
What really does not convince me is that they're going for their own proprietary connector. If they had gone the length of forming a consortium in which google, sony, jvc and the other players played a role then I could see it.
I think that they're creating a paradoxical situation in which a very common device (earbuds) that is used for a very basic function (listening to stuff) is going to be incompatible with half of their line of products (computers) without adding a real functionality. I can see the Apple Pencil being incompatible with the MBP, but I can't see earbuds.
Now, one argument is that they are pushing BT. I understand that it is already available, so I don't see the need for it. However, let's suppose that they're making a statement with this move: BT is the near future and they want to push the tech envelope (although they still sell 5400rpm HDDs....).
I can see only one way that they can pull it through without harming Apple: pull out the earbuds from the iPhone's box, and give the customers two options: free (but limited) Lightning earbuds or a very cheap ($10/$15) upgrade to BT earbuds. I don't think that anything else would work.

Let me add one thing. Right now I fear the worst; the latest ad together with this news makes me fear for the Mac. I can't see them adding the lightning port to the Mac, especially the Air or the Macbook. I can't see them requiring an adapter to use iPhone's earbuds with their own Mac products.
What if they're ready to destroy the portable Mac line? I fear that they see the Macbooks as a dead product and that they see the iMac as the new professional device (at home, never moves, powerful) which would work as a non-iOS device, while keeping all the iOS devices for mobility.
 
From an engineering, as well as an ecosystem standpoint, changing everything at once would be even more difficult and disruptive. Also, I believe Apple is making the change to the new audio connector now because they also have a slew of new MacBooks coming out soon so it makes sense to make the transition across the board.

Also, I personally don't think of it as having anything "taken away", so I'm not looking for anything in return. If my new iPhone 7 is faster and has better voice recognition and more storage, I'll be happy.
It would actually be less of a problem for me if the MBPs lost their headphone jack, due to the fact that I use an external 1 U DAC and amp.
 
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My point was that complaining about a $20 adaptor but not complaining about the premium Apple charges for extra storage seems, cost-wise, out of proportion.
I'm OK with 32, better with 64. 16 is a joke, with 4K video recording. I've paid to go up 1 level of storage in the past, because it fit my usage. If I had to walk around with and lose, an external adapter to add more storage, I would have been equally upset about it. But since it was built in, it was a meh decision. But now we DO have to walk around with and lose adapters, so it's a not a meh decision, it's a customer hostile decision*.






* not to everyone, obviously. The smug, and those who have transitioned to charging bluetooth headphones every night, either don't care, or are excited at the thought of others being upset.
 
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If this is real, it's hilarious that they're shown using an iPhone 6S. Any Lightning device is compatible with Lightning headphones and current devices also have Bluetooth already. Removing the 3.5 jack has zero benefits for anyone.

Essentially, we're being told that Apple must remove the jack to move toward wireless and Lightning headphones, which still work regardless of the 3.5 jack being there.

And don't tell me they need the space to fit high-tech engineering into the phone. Our flagships used to be 3/4 the size while having Bluetooth and a headphone jack on top of their small size, AND they were competitive with larger Android phones. Better specs are inevitable for any size of phone without compromise, it just depends on time.
 
I'm OK with 32, better with 64. 16 is a joke, with 4K video recording. I've paid to go up 1 level of storage in the past, because it fit my usage. If I had to walk around with and lose, an external adapter to add more storage, I would have been equally upset about it. But since it was built in, it was a meh decision. But not we DO have to walk around with and lose adapters, so it's a not a meh decision, it's a customer hostile decision*.






* not to everyone, obviously. The smug, and those who have transitioned to charging bluetooth headphones every night, either don't care, or are excited at the thought of others being upset.
I think, perhaps, you are assuming that these people aren't complaining. They're certainly not complaint here, but why would they? The topic is (supposed to be) about lightning headphones and the Lightning to 3.5mm adapter.

I see plenty of lively threads regarding the 16gb base storage amount, upgrade costs, Apple being called crooks and scammers (admittedly too extreme), particularly when MR makes a news post about it.

I think one can be upset about the costs involved in one change without excluding themselves about costs involved in other aspects. If you cared to look at my post history (seriously. Don't. I spend too much time in here and most of my posts are inconsequential lol) you'd see that I've personally spent s great deal of toe speaking out against the 16gb base, and to some extent the giant $100 leap for memory that should cost the end user half that. But that really doesn't have too much of s place in this thread.
[doublepost=1470431877][/doublepost]
From an engineering, as well as an ecosystem standpoint, changing everything at once would be even more difficult and disruptive. Every case, screen protector, car mount, arm sleeve, etc. will all need to change. Plus, the sooner they eliminate the 3.5 mm audio jack, the sooner other accessory makers will innovate and come up with new/improved/cheaper wireless solutions, which will be better for everyone. Waiting a year delays the whole process. Also, I believe Apple is making the change to the new audio connector now because they also have a slew of new MacBooks & iPads coming out soon so it makes sense to make the transition across the board.

I personally don't think of it as having anything "taken away", so I'm not looking for anything "in return". If my new iPhone 7 is faster and has better voice recognition and more storage, I'll be happy.
Unless they go a fourth year with the same physically design, cases will change regardless. Hell they might already need s change. Previously the timeline was two years. Screen covers may or may not change. CsR mounts I don't think have changed for years. Most mounts work just fine with virtually any phone in the market and I imagine they'll continue to do so.

These adapters could easily work with existing hardware. Perhaps your right. Maybe this phone design is the sacrificial lamb getting us ready for the next big release. It's just a shame that the customer has to suffer for that. I've never felt like I was giving something up in an upgrade and not getting down thing in return.

Plus, the same was said about third parties and lightning nearly four years ago. I'm still waiting for that killer peripheral that was made possible by the lightning cable that we couldn't have with the 30 pin.
 
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Thank you again for your reply. It shows that there are so many things to take into consideration.
What really does not convince me is that they're going for their own proprietary connector. If they had gone the length of forming a consortium in which google, sony, jvc and the other players played a role then I could see it.
I think that they're creating a paradoxical situation in which a very common device (earbuds) that is used for a very basic function (listening to stuff) is going to be incompatible with half of their line of products (computers) without adding a real functionality. I can see the Apple Pencil being incompatible with the MBP, but I can't see earbuds.
Now, one argument is that they are pushing BT. I understand that it is already available, so I don't see the need for it. However, let's suppose that they're making a statement with this move: BT is the near future and they want to push the tech envelope (although they still sell 5400rpm HDDs....).
I can see only one way that they can pull it through without harming Apple: pull out the earbuds from the iPhone's box, and give the customers two options: free (but limited) Lightning earbuds or a very cheap ($10/$15) upgrade to BT earbuds. I don't think that anything else would work.

Let me add one thing. Right now I fear the worst; the latest ad together with this news makes me fear for the Mac. I can't see them adding the lightning port to the Mac, especially the Air or the Macbook. I can't see them requiring an adapter to use iPhone's earbuds with their own Mac products.
What if they're ready to destroy the portable Mac line? I fear that they see the Macbooks as a dead product and that they see the iMac as the new professional device (at home, never moves, powerful) which would work as a non-iOS device, while keeping all the iOS devices for mobility.
Apple sometimes does participate in consortiums that create ubiquitous standards. Sometimes, that doesn't work, so they come out with their own technology. Lightning is a great example of that. People bitched up a storm, and assigned so many unflattering motives to Apple that you would have thought they made coats out of puppies. But in the end, I could not be happier with my lightning cables. It is absolutely the best connector I've ever used, and vastly superior to any form of USB. It has smooth, rounded corners, is strong as hell, can be inserted upside down/right side up and without looking/in the dark. And as a result of Apple's innovation and leadership, the new USB standard is finally adapting a similar form factor.

I would be willing to bet serious money that Apple will be including lightning earbuds in the box with new iPhone 7s, and eventually offering a new kind of wireless EarPods as an additional paid accessory.

I hope they do add a Lightning port to the new MacBooks and MacBook Pros. I don't believe they will be eliminating their line of laptops anytime soon. THAT would be a disaster.
 
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First one to shim an ESS Sabre into a lightning to 3.5 adapter for $39.95 will sell me one. Reality tells me it will cost $199.95.
 
I think, perhaps, you are assuming that these people aren't complaining. They're certainly not complaint here, but why would they? The topic is (supposed to be) about lightning headphones and the Lightning to 3.5mm adapter.

I see plenty of lively threads regarding the 16gb base storage amount, upgrade costs, Apple being called crooks and scammers (admittedly too extreme), particularly when MR makes a news post about it.

I think one can be upset about the costs involved in one change without excluding themselves about costs involved in other aspects. If you cared to look at my post history (seriously. Don't. I spend too much time in here and most of my posts are inconsequential lol) you'd see that I've personally spent s great deal of toe speaking out against the 16gb base, and to some extent the giant $100 leap for memory that should cost the end user half that. But that really doesn't have too much of s place in this thread.
[doublepost=1470431877][/doublepost]
Unless they go a fourth year with the same physically design, cases will change regardless. Hell they might already need s change. Previously the timeline was two years. Screen covers may or may not change. CsR mounts I don't think have changed for years. Most mounts work just fine with virtually any phone in the market and I imagine they'll continue to do so.

These adapters could easily work with existing hardware. Perhaps your right. Maybe this phone design is the sacrificial lamb getting us ready for the next big release. It's just a shame that the customer has to suffer for that. I've never felt like I was giving something up in an upgrade and not getting down thing in return.

Plus, the same was said about third parties and lightning nearly four years ago. I'm still waiting for that killer peripheral that was made possible by the lightning cable that we couldn't have with the 30 pin.
I couldn't be happier with my various Lightning cables. Best connector I've ever used. Hands down. 30 pin was hot garbage. Good riddance to bad rubbish.
 
I couldn't be happier with my various Lightning cables. Best connector I've ever used. Hands down. 30 pin was hot garbage. Good riddance to bad rubbish.
Fair enough. What did you hate about them. From an end user perspective I notice nothing other than it being easier to plug in. That alone isn't something I generally get excited about.

I was promised amazing peripherals (from folks in forums, not Apple, to be fair) that wouldn't have been possible without the change. I've yet to see examples of these peripherals.

As far as a physical design I can concede its superior (even though I've had more trouble with these than 30 pins, starting with corrosion issues, but that's another discussion entirely). I just don't see what end user benefits I've supposedly been granted aside from what I mentioned.
 
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This is so irrational that it can't be true.

  • Giant connector
  • moving DAC to connector leaving phone without?
  • hacing two DACs?
the only way this could make sense is if this would be just the charging cable for airpods and you could unplug it from the audio controller/microphone
 
Thank you again for your reply. It shows that there are so many things to take into consideration.
What really does not convince me is that they're going for their own proprietary connector. If they had gone the length of forming a consortium in which google, sony, jvc and the other players played a role then I could see it.
I think that they're creating a paradoxical situation in which a very common device (earbuds) that is used for a very basic function (listening to stuff) is going to be incompatible with half of their line of products (computers) without adding a real functionality. I can see the Apple Pencil being incompatible with the MBP, but I can't see earbuds.
Now, one argument is that they are pushing BT. I understand that it is already available, so I don't see the need for it. However, let's suppose that they're making a statement with this move: BT is the near future and they want to push the tech envelope (although they still sell 5400rpm HDDs....).
I can see only one way that they can pull it through without harming Apple: pull out the earbuds from the iPhone's box, and give the customers two options: free (but limited) Lightning earbuds or a very cheap ($10/$15) upgrade to BT earbuds. I don't think that anything else would work.

Let me add one thing. Right now I fear the worst; the latest ad together with this news makes me fear for the Mac. I can't see them adding the lightning port to the Mac, especially the Air or the Macbook. I can't see them requiring an adapter to use iPhone's earbuds with their own Mac products.
What if they're ready to destroy the portable Mac line? I fear that they see the Macbooks as a dead product and that they see the iMac as the new professional device (at home, never moves, powerful) which would work as a non-iOS device, while keeping all the iOS devices for mobility.

What Apple is doing is moving toward wireless, which likely involves a non-proprietary standard called BlueTooth.

In the interim, they have over half-a-billion customers presently using Lightning cables and accessories they've been investing in over the last 4 years. Why on Earth would Apple try to create a new wired standard for a mobile device, when their customers already have a significant investment in Lightning, and the entire industry is moving toward wireless? So instead of buying an adapter to use my old headphones, I have to replace every Lightning cable and accessory I own, AND buy an adapter to use my old headphones?

Also, what makes you think Apple won't add Lightning ports to their Macs? Do you really think Apple is going to sell a customer a new iPhone, a new pair of Lightning headphones, and a new Mac for which they will also need an adapter in order to simply switch their new headphones back and forth between them? It's unlikely, as even those wireless headphones will need to be plugged in to be charged, or to keep listening when they run out of power. Even if Apple plans to kill the Mac (highly unlikely as it is the only computer product showing any growth at the moment), adding a Lightning port in the short term is a PR move designed to encourage adoption of Lightning. The more obstacles Apple throws in front of a customer to prevent them from adopting BT & Lightning audio, the more likely they are going think about switching to another platform.
 
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Can't Innovate my....
Guys, the Microsoft Surface Book and Surface Pro 4 are available to buy, for nearly a year already.
Samsung Note 7 has been announced with more features than anything Apple could ever throw at the iPhone 7 would ever be (audio jack AND waterproofing? Iris scanning?).
Say what you want with the competition but you can't say there aren't beautiful and functional products that aren't Apple out there. Sad to say, but they just aren't product leaders anymore.
 
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Also, what makes you think Apple won't add Lightning ports to their Macs? Do you really think Apple is going to sell a customer a new iPhone, a new pair of Lightning headphones, and a new Mac for which they will also need an adapter in order to simply switch their new headphones back and forth between them?

I realize you weren't asking me, but I just don't know what to expect. They basically did exactly this with the MBP and USBC. Maybe they sell some sort of charger like they do for the pencil? It's tough to say, but I do feel your scenario (adding lightning to the Mac lineup) would make the most sense.
 
Fair enough. What did you hate about them. From an end user perspective I notice nothing other than it being easier to plug in. That alone isn't something I generally get excited about.

I was promised amazing peripherals (from folks in forums, not Apple, to be fair) that wouldn't have been possible without the change. I've yet to see examples of these peripherals.

As far as a physical design I can concede its superior (even though I've had more trouble with these than 30 pins, starting with corrosion issues, but that's another discussion entirely). I just don't see what end user benefits I've supposedly been granted aside from what I mentioned.
I have probably 15 Apple lightning cables and have had no issues, so it's hard for me to comment. But if they were still making phones with the 30 pin connector I would be absolutely horrified. The improved connector is enough for me.

One peripheral that uses Lighning well is the Apple Pencil. And lightning earbuds will have a built-in power supply, so they can finally add noise cancellation to the mic. I imagine that there could be some other interesting possibilities down the road if they add a Lightning port to Macs, which could use a Lightning to lightning cable, but that's pure speculation.
 
Can't Innovate my....
Guys, the Microsoft Surface Book and Surface Pro 4 are available to buy, for nearly a year already.
Samsung Note 7 has been announced with more features than anything Apple could ever throw at the iPhone 7 would ever be (audio jack AND waterproofing? Iris scanning?).
Say what you want with the competition but you can't say there aren't beautiful and functional products that aren't Apple out there. Sad to say, but they just aren't product leaders anymore.
I've been looking for s reason to justify a surface. It's just too expensive for what would ultimately be a hobby device for me. But I agree with you. First few iterations left a lot to be desired but I think it's a solid product now. If and when my Macbook goes a surface will be a consideration.
 
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