Sidebar Sidebar
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.

Fully SIM Unlocked iPhones

An epidemic of myopia?

I don't get it. A lot of people seem to be ignoring one of the main advantages/features of the iPhone--it's not a static device. For several reasons (including hack workarounds, IMO) Apple set up the iPhone as a 24 month subscription with the sale on 24 month subscription accounting. You're not buying a phone, but the equivalent of a 2 year "looseleaf service." You can hack it, or cancel contract (paying $175), or use pickyourplan prepay and decide to drop service, but in all of those cases your iPhone will be stuck without further updates (and possibly completely nonfunctional unless you get a hack). And while I'm sure some hackers will figure out some ways to keep the phone functioning with some of the features, I doubt it will function that well, and it won't have any of the goodies coming along over the remainder of the subscription period. The only thing I really see coming from this hack is that it may allow someone who travels to Europe to pop out their "active" AT&T SIM and pop in a cheap European SIM while there. But it will cost, and probably will void the warranty (and AT&T by then probably will offer a reasonably priced SIM for Europe by then). JMO
 
This is great! 499 $ comes down to 366 € with the current exchange rate. A friend of mine is visiting NYC next week so maybe I should ask him to buy one for me. Here in Finland most of the iPhones are used at Nokia headquarters at the moment ;)

Oh, and the charges here in Finland are usually something like this:

500 min + 100 sms = 19,90 €
25 Mb of data = 4 €

Unlimited data (using EDGE):
384 kbit/s = 9,80 € per month
512 kbit/s = 14,80 € per month
1M kbit/s = 19,80 € per month

(3G packages are even cheaper: unlimited voice, sms, mms, video calling and data (limited to max 1Mbit speed with HSDPA) totals 49,95 € / month)
 
Just a thought for the barrack room lawyers amongst us.

I understand that it is legal in the US to unlock your handset and that software for this purpose is excluded from the DCMA. This would seem to imply that the phone's user has "jurisdiction" (for want of a better term) over the conditions that the handset operates under. Given that an unlocked phone is operating entirely legally, how legal would it be for Apple or AT&T to re-lock the phone, by firmware update or otherwise, without the user's consent?
 
after reading a lot of these responses, and several of the news stories that have appeared in the last 24hrs, i can honestly say that the fact that this is getting so much press is probably the best thing about it.
i will not be running out to get an iphone just to unlock it using any of the methods, however it does give me hope for the future.
if so many people are this interested in having an iphone, but don't want to or can't use at&t because of the area they live in, then perhaps apple will begin to understand that dealing solely with at&t wasn't the best plan.
i'm sure there were some incentives in the deal that made it sweet for both parties, but in the end, it will be the consumer that makes or breaks the iphone. from what i've heard and read, people love the phone but aren't so happy about the service.
a lot of people cannot or don't want to use at&t, but they really want an iphone.
i'm sure there's some sort of exclusive deal that at&t and apple have for x number of years, i forget how long i heard it was for (5 years maybe?), but hopefully apple will come up with a solution for all these people.

i for one would love to have an iphone, but verizon is the only reliable carrier in my area. i had at&t when i first moved here, but could only make/receive calls when i walked out to the street. i missed calls on a daily basis, and at&t told me they had no plans of upgrading the towers or coverage, and actually suggested to me that i use another provider.

so i applaud all these people who are hacking the phones for use on other providers, but i will either wait until i see how reliably it works for them, or i'll hold out for the verizon compatible iphone, which will probably not be seen for a very long time, if ever.
 
Frankly I don’t understand, why everyone is so upset that this phone is locked down to a carrier. Every company on the planet no matter what there business is, tries to provide features that another does not have. This is how competition works.

What would you guys purpose happen? Perhaps the government should FORCE Apple to allow other carriers to carry it.

I don’t like Toyota, Best Buy so I don’t buy there products its that SIMPLE.
 
Rot'nApple said:
I am always curious when I hear about 'customer dealings' of one mobile provider being better then that of another. Maybe for those individuals that utilize their plan, both voice and/or data, to the maximum and may go over and therefore have a billing issue or the like... I have NEVER encountered a situation that required me to deal with a mobile provider's customer service with any regards other than to sign-up for my initial plan, get my phone and maybe make an in-store monthly bill payment.

I had been with Altell for about 5 years before moving on to T-Mobile for the past 4 years and outside of going to a local altell or t-mob shop to make a monthly bill payment that would have been late had I put it in the mail or to stop by the shop every 6 months or so to see the new phones that might be out, I have had virtually no contact with either company's customer service regarding any issues to be resovled in order to judge one way or the other how great or bad their customer service is. I'd image AT&T would be the same way, and that is, as long as I have no discrepancy with billing (ie. utilizing my plan both voice and/or data to the maximum and go over and therefore have a billing issue), I doubt if I'll ever need an AT&T customer service rep, especially now that billing is no longer 300 pages, except to see the iPhone 2 when it comes out or change to a higher rate $$$ plan with more minutes.

Complaining to customer service about coverage and EDGE is a non issue, by that I mean, I have read the posts and hear the news and read the articles concerning EDGE and phone coverage so I'm not walking into something blind. Sure I can call AT&T to tell them I wish phone coverage was better in my area or data transfer speeds were faster but with all respect, I could have done the same with Altell and T-Mobile regarding coverage and/or data plans.

As I said, I am curious about what problems cropped up for other people (such as the poster I quoted - bdj21ya or others with similar experiences) that required customer service and when they got bad customer service, what happened. I'd like to know, just so I know what may be in store for me if I get an iPhone and switch from T-Mobile to AT&T (not going to use a hack software just to maintain a T-Mobile account)? - thanks
Click to expand...

But mightn't you be a tad bit frustrated if, when you called to increase your minutes, they extended your contract without even mentioning it? Moreover, since such a thing isn't listed on any of the correspondence they send you, you may not find out about the change until more than a year later when you went to cancel the contract?

I'm sorry, but there's a simple fact here. Assuming you believe that a company that by policy extends contracts with it's customers without consent or notice is evil. AT&T is evil. T-mobile does not do this, and therefore I think them if anything, a bit less evil, possibly even a force for good.

Why does AT&T do this? I assume they have some clause in the original contract which covers contract extensions (which wouldn't hold up in court because of the difference in bargaining power between the parties and the abuse it smacks of without notifying customers of this policy). But more importantly, there is the obvious reason why they do it. Because most customer won't go through the crap they have to go through to get this contract extension later removed.

When they did it to us, I called them 5 times before they finally changed it back. Interestingly, on each call, they told me they were changing it right then, however, every time I would call back (with days in between) it would still list the extended date as the date the contract would end. This indicates to me that either AT&T really skimps on employee training, or on wages so they are unable to hire competent individuals, OR that they have a policy in place for employees to "forget" little details like actually changing the date back until the customer has called a number of times.
 
jarednt1 said:
Frankly I don’t understand, why everyone is so upset that this phone is locked down to a carrier. Every company on the planet no matter what there business is, tries to provide features that another does not have. This is how competition works.

What would you guys purpose happen? Perhaps the government should FORCE Apple to allow other carriers to carry it.

I don’t like Toyota, Best Buy so I don’t buy there products its that SIMPLE.
Click to expand...



well for me it's simple. i really really really want an iphone-i've wanted since well before they came out.. but at&t blows in my area. it's terrible. the coverage on my street is literally nonexistant. i had an at&t when i moved here, but had to switch to verizon just so i could make and get calls at my house.
and i would literally NOT ever purchase whatever phone "that does everything the iphone does" that verizon or whoever comes out with. i want the real deal apple. but i cannot use at&t.
good enough reason?
i don't expect apple or at&t to really care or do anything about it, i just hope that in the future the iphone becomes available to other carriers so that it might be possible for me to get one.
 
cal6n said:
Just a thought for the barrack room lawyers amongst us.

I understand that it is legal in the US to unlock your handset and that software for this purpose is excluded from the DCMA. This would seem to imply that the phone's user has "jurisdiction" (for want of a better term) over the conditions that the handset operates under. Given that an unlocked phone is operating entirely legally, how legal would it be for Apple or AT&T to re-lock the phone, by firmware update or otherwise, without the user's consent?
Click to expand...

Look at it this way - no one is forcing the user to update the phone and accepting Apple's new software. If they do choose to accept Apple's new software, the user cannot complain that the voluntary free update that they themselves chose to apply happens to contain as one of its components software that broke a program not part of Apple's device.
 
cameronjpu said:
Look at it this way - no one is forcing the user to update the phone and accepting Apple's new software. If they do choose to accept Apple's new software, the user cannot complain that the voluntary free update that they themselves chose to apply happens to contain as one of its components software that broke a program not part of Apple's device.
Click to expand...

well if apple eventually sues them, they will prob go to court, and it will last for months arguing about this and that. its arguable that this is legal, its also arguable that it is illegal. only the supreme court can truely decide that
 
DanB91 said:
well if apple eventually sues them, they will prob go to court, and it will last for months arguing about this and that. its arguable that this is legal, its also arguable that it is illegal. only the supreme court can truely decide that
Click to expand...

A simple popup warning saying that "this update may cause third party software to malfunction. Do not proceed if your iPhone contains third party software" seems like it would get around any legality issue.

The way I think Apple will get around this is the same way MS tried to do it with Windows updates - those who want the updates have to have a valid software system. There are lots of "must have" features that Apple could be planning for the iPhone, so if you hack yours and want to keep using it, you don't get those updates. Which definitely will suck.

Frankly, I think the fact that MS has never been taken to court over the WGA process tells me that Apple won't be either.
 
galganog said:
There is a law called the Digital Millienium Copyright Act that was signed into law and it states that:
Click to expand...

You are completely misunderstanding this law. It is about circumventing technical obstacles in order to commit copyright infringement. Whose copyright is infringed here? To be more precise: An absolute necessity for any copyright infringement is _copying_. What exactly is copied here? If nothing is copied, copyright law doesn't apply, and DMCA doesn't apply.
 
Consultant said:
Why is Edge fees ridiculous? No other carries provides unlimited data access for a smart phone for under $40/month. $20/month is a pretty good deal in comparison.
Click to expand...

Edge fees while you are in the USA are very reasonable. Edge fees when you leave the USA are beyond ridiculous. They are so ridiculous, I would suggest that you turn your iPhone off when you leave the USA.
 
gnasher729 said:
Edge fees while you are in the USA are very reasonable. Edge fees when you leave the USA are beyond ridiculous. They are so ridiculous, I would suggest that you turn your iPhone off when you leave the USA.
Click to expand...

Actually, EDGE fees in many countries outside the USA are reasonable. For example, in the UK t-mobile do unlimited data for £7.50 a month (that's less than $15). It's roaming charges that are ridiculous. That is, if I use my phone in the UK then I pay very little for data. However, if I take my phone to the USA and use it for data there then the charges will be astronomical. Same for you guys in the USA coming to the UK.

It's the roaming data charges that are high.
 
mccldwll said:
I don't get it. A lot of people seem to be ignoring one of the main advantages/features of the iPhone--it's not a static device. For several reasons (including hack workarounds, IMO) Apple set up the iPhone as a 24 month subscription with the sale on 24 month subscription accounting. You're not buying a phone, but the equivalent of a 2 year "looseleaf service." You can hack it, or cancel contract (paying $175), or use pickyourplan prepay and decide to drop service, but in all of those cases your iPhone will be stuck without further updates (and possibly completely nonfunctional unless you get a hack). And while I'm sure some hackers will figure out some ways to keep the phone functioning with some of the features, I doubt it will function that well, and it won't have any of the goodies coming along over the remainder of the subscription period. The only thing I really see coming from this hack is that it may allow someone who travels to Europe to pop out their "active" AT&T SIM and pop in a cheap European SIM while there. But it will cost, and probably will void the warranty (and AT&T by then probably will offer a reasonably priced SIM for Europe by then). JMO
Click to expand...

You missed the part where they said that restoring the phone didn't break the hack. Also, I've hacked my phone several times and still receive updates without problems. At least for now (which doesn't mean too much considering how new this all still is), Apple hasn't done anything to prevent you from hacking the phone again after applying new updates. We'll see though!
 
bigandy said:
*drools*

.......
I predict disaster for my finances, due to iPhone-ness. I may have to tell the girlfriend to hide my cards. :eek:
Click to expand...

That's a great idea, especially if your girlfriend is thinking the same, to use you credit card for her iPhone..:D
 
maverick808 said:
Actually, EDGE fees in many countries outside the USA are reasonable. For example, in the UK t-mobile do unlimited data for £7.50 a month (that's less than $15). It's roaming charges that are ridiculous. That is, if I use my phone in the UK then I pay very little for data. However, if I take my phone to the USA and use it for data there then the charges will be astronomical. Same for you guys in the USA coming to the UK.

It's the roaming data charges that are high.
Click to expand...

I think that's actually the same thing he was saying, just without stating explicitly that he meant roaming EDGE.
 
all this waiting for the release is driving me nuts - so i've decided to spend the night with Jack Bauer and watch back to back episodes :D i wonder if i finish the whole of series 6 before the release comes ?
 
cal6n said:
Just a thought for the barrack room lawyers amongst us.

I understand that it is legal in the US to unlock your handset and that software for this purpose is excluded from the DCMA. This would seem to imply that the phone's user has "jurisdiction" (for want of a better term) over the conditions that the handset operates under. Given that an unlocked phone is operating entirely legally, how legal would it be for Apple or AT&T to re-lock the phone, by firmware update or otherwise, without the user's consent?
Click to expand...

I think updates cannot be applied without the user's consent. Like MacOS X Software Update; you can always refuse to update your software. On the other hand, Apple's updates for the iPhones will likely install exactly the same software on every iPhone, and they are under no obligation to keep the unlocking software intact.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.
Top Bottom
Back