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Google Stands Behind HTC in Patent Dispute With Apple

ChazUK said:
Everybody I know who own iPhones have been so impressed with my Nexus One that they want one.
There are far better choices in the smartphone arena. :p

(In fact, a few who have seen them are going to import one like I did) :cool:
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everybody? like who? give us the full name and cell. no. we want to ask them and verify your claim.
 
i think your the only one that has come to the perception. If apple felt Nokia infringed why not bring that to their attention first. Perception is they got caught and the best defense is a good offense.

kobewankenobi said:
read again

In dealing with Apple, Nokia has sought to gain an unjust competitive advantage over Apple by charging unwarranted fees to use patents that allegedly cover industry compatibility standards and by seeking to obtain access to Apple's intellectual property," the suit reads. "Nokia needs access to Apple's intellectual property because Nokia has copied and is now using that patented technology."
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kobewankenobi said:
read again

In dealing with Apple, Nokia has sought to gain an unjust competitive advantage over Apple by charging unwarranted fees to use patents that allegedly cover industry compatibility standards and by seeking to obtain access to Apple's intellectual property," the suit reads. "Nokia needs access to Apple's intellectual property because Nokia has copied and is now using that patented technology."
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Let's take this slowly.

"Nokia has sought to gain an unjust competitive advantage over Apple by charging unwarranted fees"

This is Apple saying they disagree with how much Nokia charges for the GSM patents.

"to use patents that allegedly cover industry compatibility standards"

This is Apple saying that the patents that Nokia owns that everyone else in the GSM standards body agreed on before Apple even had a phone, are up for debate.

"and by seeking to obtain access to Apple's intellectual property"

This is Apple calling Nokia the bad guys for suggesting a patent cross license instead of straight fees.

"Nokia needs access to Apple's intellectual property because Nokia has copied and is now using that patented technology."

But, but, but, we've got nebulous software patents from Taligent and when we bought NeXT that anyone writing any computer software on anything can't get around.

Nowhere in Apple's counter-claim do they ever claim Nokia were asking for more than they have from anyone else.
 
DaveSW said:
everybody? like who? give us the full name and cell. no. we want to ask them and verify your claim.
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Once the comment about 99% of iPhone owners not using Google maps is verified, the data will be supplied (if the owners of that data agree to release it). :D
 
xIGmanIx said:
On another note, seeing as google's apps were some of the better early on apps, and that they dominate the PC world, i think they will be alright. Plus with RIM, Android and Symbian out there as alternative OS's i think google could sustain a complete embargo of apple's media phone aka iphone
Click to expand...

It probably could and it'd not do Apple any favours if you couldn't get Google Search, gMail, Maps etc on the iPhone. Apple have no mapping facility either so they'd have to buy in maps from Navteq (owned by Nokia) or TeleAtlas.

On Symbian though you've got Ovi Maps for free which is way better if you live outside the USA. Google Maps doesn't offer navigation outside the USA unlike Ovi. Ovi also does offline mapping since you can store entire maps on your SD card. I've got all of the UK and Spain on my SD card - takes up a few GB IIRC. You also got Ovi Mail which does free push email on Symbian. Google isn't so important on Symbian as it is on Apple. Arguably you're a little worse off using Google's services than Ovi unless you're a big gMail user on the desktop too.
 
aegisdesign said:
Nowhere in Apple's counter-claim do they ever claim Nokia were asking for more than they have from anyone else.
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They say the following:

Page 9 - "Nokia has ... breached licensing commitments it made to license on F/RAND terms all patents that it claimed were necessary for a party to practice standards. Nokia has also violated those licensing commitments by demanding unjustifiable royalties and reciprocal licenses to Apple's patents..."

Page 21 - "Nokia's breach of those commitments by demanding that Apple pay non-F/RAND terms for Nokia's claimed standards-essential patents..."

Page 22 - "Nokia departed from ... its own prior ackowledgements of the meaning of F/RAND, and demanded unfair, unreasonable, and discrimanatory licensing terms from Apple. In particular, Nokia insisted on both exorbitant royalties and "grantbacks" of licenses to Apple's patented technology..."

And, of course, there's the bit on page 41 about tripling the monetary demand.

So, Apple isn't saying "they charged us more than everyone else" (monetarily, at least). However, it's fair to assume that nokia's initial offer wasn't 1/3 what they charge everyone else, meaning that when they tripled their demand it probably was asking for more than they ask from others.
 
ChazUK said:
Most popular device... Maybe (in a singular sense)
Most popular smartphone OS? No way.
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Jeez, allow me a little bit of hyperbole to drive home my point, which was that Google would only be hurting itself, even if just a small amount to some people's thinking, by removing itself from an exceedingly popular and growing in popularity platform.

ArrowSmith said:
Yeah keep believing that Apple will completely monopolize the smart phone profit share.
Click to expand...

I don't' believe that all, nowhere did I say anything about monopoly. Check some of my posts, perhaps even in this thread where I've pointed out that I have moved off the iPhone platform and on to Android with a Nexus One, and am recommending to all I know to do the same. I'm not a big market maker by any wild stretch of the imagination, but I wouldn't assume a product that I and other geek friends are moving away from is monopoly bound. On the other hand, I'd be an idiot if I thought the iPhone isn't going to continue to grow in popularity and market share.
 
distortedloop said:
Jeez, allow me a little bit of hyperbole to drive home my point, which was that Google would only be hurting itself, even if just a small amount to some people's thinking, by removing itself from an exceedingly popular and growing in popularity platform.
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Iphone IS a SMALL amount of googles presences... 1 phone/3 iterations/1 Cell Network...
 
dgree03 said:
Ha do you really thing google cares if they have there products on a iphone?! its pennies compared to there desktop search and internet advertising! Get a clue!

Not to mention you act as if the iphone is the ONLY PHONE that implements google products...
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I absolutely believe that Google cares if they have products on the iPhone. I don't believe they think they'll go out of business without their products on the iPhone, but your comment suggests you don't understand Google at all.

Google wants to be everywhere. They want to be on every device possible. They want to have their products and search on every thing that lets you do anything on the internet, because that's how they make their money.

I don't have a clue about what percentage of Google's market is iPhone driven, obviously a rather small portion, but it's still a necessary part of their global network domination plan.

Don't forget that Google cared enough about being on the iPhone that they bothered to make an HTML5 Safari based version of Google Voice specifically for the iPhone users since Apple wouldn't approve a native Google Voice application. That doesn't seem like the move of someone who doesn't care about being on the platform.

What do you think?
 
dgree03 said:
Iphone IS a SMALL amount of googles presences... 1 phone/3 iterations/1 Cell Network...
Click to expand...

You understand hyperbole, right?

Small or not (see my post just above), Google would rather be on the iPhone, than not be.

Any one who thinks Google just doesn't care, doesn't understand Google.
 
lilo777 said:
Factually incorrect. iPhone is not the most popular mobile device. Nokia and BlackBerry phones are m ore popular (not to mention dumb phones).
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It's called hyperbole.

And forget about all those dumb phones as part of the phone market as far as Google is concerned. If the phone can't serve up ads, or gather information about you and your habits in some way for Google to serve up better ads or services to you and others they don't care about that device beyond trying to get you onto a device that lets them serve you up ads or gather data about you.
 
distortedloop said:
I absolutely believe that Google cares if they have products on the iPhone. I don't believe they think they'll go out of business without their products on the iPhone, but your comment suggests you don't understand Google at all.

Google wants to be everywhere. They want to be on every device possible. They want to have their products and search on every thing that lets you do anything on the internet, because that's how they make their money.

I don't have a clue about what percentage of Google's market is iPhone driven, obviously a rather small portion, but it's still a necessary part of their global network domination plan.

Don't forget that Google cared enough about being on the iPhone that they bothered to make an HTML5 Safari based version of Google Voice specifically for the iPhone users since Apple wouldn't approve a native Google Voice application. That doesn't seem like the move of someone who doesn't care about being on the platform.

What do you think?
Click to expand...

in the GRAND SCHEME of things... google would not be affected by removing google product from the iphone... google made that Google Voice app BEFORE apple threw a hissy fit about google being in the mobile market.

Iphone/Ipod Touch is insignficant to Googles market domainance.... blackberry, andriod, palm, symbian all have access to googles services...
 
dgree03 said:
in the GRAND SCHEME of things... google would not be affected by removing google product from the iphone... google made that Google Voice app BEFORE apple threw a hissy fit about google being in the mobile market.

Iphone/Ipod Touch is insignficant to Googles market domainance.... blackberry, andriod, palm, symbian all have access to googles services...
Click to expand...

Wrong. And no. i'm not going to spend time to explain why you're wrong.
 
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (Linux; U; Android 2.1-update1; en-gb; Nexus One Build/ERE27) AppleWebKit/530.17 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/4.0 Mobile Safari/530.17)

distortedloop said:
ChazUK said:
Most popular device... Maybe (in a singular sense)
Most popular smartphone OS? No way.
Click to expand...

Jeez, allow me a little bit of hyperbole to drive home my point, which was that Google would only be hurting itself, even if just a small amount to some people's thinking, by removing itself from an exceedingly popular and growing in popularity platform.
Click to expand...

I agree with you that Google gains bugger all by ditching the iPhone platform (I even posted this later on in the thread and think it would be damaging to them) but Google have many other platforms, partners and software that use their services as a default in the mobile realm.

The iPhone isn't the be all and end all of Google's mobile plans but it does fit I'm lovely with them.
 
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (Linux; U; Android 2.1-update1; en-gb; Nexus One Build/ERE27) AppleWebKit/530.17 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/4.0 Mobile Safari/530.17)

If I see that video again I think ill pull the last strands of hair from my head. :(

We all know what he said and it can be misconstrued in many different ways.
 
Dae said:
I think the patent system should be reformed. Most of those IT patents, such as interface solutions, are utter bs and should not allowed.
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+1,000,000

The problem with reforming the patent system is that every company would probably have to resubmit.
 
Stridder44 said:
+1,000,000

The problem with reforming the patent system is that every company would probably have to resubmit.
Click to expand...

Sorry but the Engineering Ergonomics investment that goes into GUI design is serious work. It's the derivative hack work that duplicates this research by a Graphics Designer that is not serious work.
 
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