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A few companies pulled back players they were going to introduce over the Holiday season. Not sure why. A few of those were Dual Format players and higher end Blu Ray players.

You do know 78% of statistics are made up on the spot! ;) :p

As far as the $99 specials, they were closeout items. Great deal, but they took a bath on those things.
 
Surely, the winner will be the one with the most movies people want to see? If that's the case, Blu-ray has it in the bag.

How the hell can HD-DVD survive without James Bond, Pirates Of The Caribbean, Spider-Man, Star Wars, X-Men, Ghostbusters....etc??

I do own a PS3 and a small collection of Blu-rays, but I am no means a BR fanboy. In fact, I kinda prefer HD-DVD in some ways, but it just doesn't have the movies I want to see (except Transformers).

The winner will be the one who sells the most players and when we start seeing sub $200 HD DVD players hit the market in bulk that will be what convinces the studios to dump Blu Ray once and for all. Even Sony will have to release the properties they own on HD DVD just like they released their movies on VHS after Betamax lost and their music on CD after mini disc went into the dumper.

I think, though, that for many people upscaling DVD players will be good enough for a while as you can buy those for $59, which is a far cry from $199 for a cheap HD DVD player or $399 for a 40gb PS3. Until cheap DVD players and cheap DVD movies go away, the next gen format war is going to stay on the sidelines and DVD will remain king.

piloterror,

Toshiba may have taken a bath on those $99 specials, but they moved over 100,000 of them the weekend they were on sale at Best Buy and Wal Mart which is going to make a difference in movie sales where they will get that money back as those homes are now unlikely to be buying a Blu Ray in the future. HD DVD players are cheaper to produce than Blu Ray players, anyway, so the loss probably isn't as big as you might think. Toshiba has a bigger warchest to fight this battle with than Sony does because Sony has been racking up huge losses and is now having to sell off assets to keep fighting their petty little wars.

monkeytap,

The 50gb triple layer HD DVD was an experiment in stretching the capacity of a single layer of an HD DVD beyond 15gb. If they decided to release it instead of a 45gb version, older machines would not be able to read it, that's true, but I find it unlikely that Toshiba would dump all their surplus HD-A2's onto the market cheap and then release a disc format that they can't read. That would kill HD DVD for sure. If Toshiba does release a triple layer disc, it will most likely be in the 45gb format that all players would be able to read. They have sold too many players to change the specification now.
 
Toshiba may have taken a bath on those $99 specials, but they moved over 100,000 of them the weekend they were on sale at Best Buy and Wal Mart which is going to make a difference

I have a surprise for you.... It didn't make any difference. BD sales are still substantially higher than HD DVD sales in the US/EU/JP. Both hardware and software sales. In fact Spiderman 3 surpassed transformers HD DVD sales, and that is without the PS3 bundle numbers in it http://www.blu-ray.com/news/?id=655 ;)

BD still has more players in the wild, even with another 100k added on to the HD DVD camp its a pretty miniscule dent in the BD camp and probably a rather hard one to swallow for Toshiba, which is why I'll assume they only did it once and with outdated stock.

Wow, that $98 player made such a difference!
16nov2007.jpg

16nov2007b.jpg


Ed

Edit: for that one person that was getting on MRU... 51GB HD DVD media http://www.engadget.com/2007/11/15/dvd-forum-approves-51gb-triple-layer-hd-dvd-spec/
 
I have a surprise for you.... It didn't make any difference. BD sales are still substantially higher than HD DVD sales in the US/EU/JP. Both hardware and software sales. In fact Spiderman 3 surpassed transformers HD DVD sales, and that is without the PS3 bundle numbers in it http://www.blu-ray.com/news/?id=655 ;)

BD still has more players in the wild, even with another 100k added on to the HD DVD camp its a pretty miniscule dent in the BD camp and probably a rather hard one to swallow for Toshiba, which is why I'll assume they only did it once and with outdated stock.

Wow, that $98 player made such a difference!
16nov2007.jpg

16nov2007b.jpg


Ed

Edit: for that one person that was getting on MRU... 51GB HD DVD media http://www.engadget.com/2007/11/15/dvd-forum-approves-51gb-triple-layer-hd-dvd-spec/

You still haven't factored in the $199 HD DVD players that will be coming this Christmas. Those are going to demolish the PS3 in sales and the tables will really turn. And the 100,000 I mentioned was just for a single weekend at those two retailers. Specials on HD DVD players have been appearing since then and they have to be convincing a lot of people to buy. Another big retailer, KMart, won't even stock Blu Ray players because they are too expensive. So HD DVD is not dead yet.
 
DVD for the WIN! :p

I can tell you one thing, I wouldn't buy a HD DVD even if it was under $50. If its development software didn't have MS's goo all over it I would have no issues with that drive, but as is, MS can take their Universal loving ways and stay out of my entertainment and my work.

<]=)
 
You still haven't factored in the $199 HD DVD players that will be coming this Christmas. Those are going to demolish the PS3 in sales and the tables will really turn. And the 100,000 I mentioned was just for a single weekend at those two retailers. Specials on HD DVD players have been appearing since then and they have to be convincing a lot of people to buy. Another big retailer, KMart, won't even stock Blu Ray players because they are too expensive. So HD DVD is not dead yet.

The reality is that a good number of those players went to Avid AV community members. The gadget folks knew for a few weeks these were coming and ran out and bought one just to be format neutral. Overall, I don't see it having a big impact over the long run.

In the big scheme of things, I don't think either format is doing well. These numbers are just a drop in the bucket compared to regular DVD sales. It has made DVD's prices drop through the floor though!
 
In the big scheme of things, I don't think either format is doing well. These numbers are just a drop in the bucket compared to regular DVD sales. It has made DVD's prices drop through the floor though!

and i'm quite thankful for those fast dropping DVD prices.. and looking at dvd sales i'm not the only one (sales are still going up)
 
You still haven't factored in the $199 HD DVD players that will be coming this Christmas. Those are going to demolish the PS3 in sales and the tables will really turn. And the 100,000 I mentioned was just for a single weekend at those two retailers. Specials on HD DVD players have been appearing since then and they have to be convincing a lot of people to buy. Another big retailer, KMart, won't even stock Blu Ray players because they are too expensive. So HD DVD is not dead yet.

demolish ps3 sales? psssh.
 
kmart won't sell blu-ray players because their demographic is people who live in trailer parks
 
ˆˆ Hypocrite. :p :p :p :D

SPeaking of DVDs, I mUsT bUy thE nEW Futurama movie today. :)

<]=)


DONT GET YOUR HOPES UP!!! Your going to be bitterly disappointed. I can recite every futurama episode worse than comic book guy, and the new feature length is a travesty to the series.



Take 1 joke, that was already done in a 30 second sketch when family guy returned, and stretch it over 90 minutes.

Just have all the characters make an appearance for no particular reason.

Have no discernible story, and seem to just hover from one thing to the next.

Just plain god damn awful.

There may have been enough material here for a good 25 minute episode at best, but certainly not for a full film.

Instead you are treated to a very diluted and poorly written feature, which simply has not enough re-deemable qualities to appease true fans or create new ones.

Bad move... very very bad move.
 
I posted a mini review of it on the film thread. Wasn't keen either. Don't know why, plotwise, they had to throw in ALL the characters like that. Hopefully the next one will be better since they don't have to "prove we're back!" again.

Oh and if you didn't spot the twist as soon as the foundations were presented, then you suck.
 
I have a surprise for you.... It didn't make any difference. BD sales are still substantially higher than HD DVD sales in the US/EU/JP. Both hardware and software sales. In fact Spiderman 3 surpassed transformers HD DVD sales, and that is without the PS3 bundle numbers in it http://www.blu-ray.com/news/?id=655 ;)

BD still has more players in the wild, even with another 100k added on to the HD DVD camp its a pretty miniscule dent in the BD camp and probably a rather hard one to swallow for Toshiba, which is why I'll assume they only did it once and with outdated stock.

Wow, that $98 player made such a difference!
16nov2007.jpg

16nov2007b.jpg


Ed

Edit: for that one person that was getting on MRU... 51GB HD DVD media http://www.engadget.com/2007/11/15/dvd-forum-approves-51gb-triple-layer-hd-dvd-spec/

Thanks for the stats. Proves an old article I read.

It said that the porn industry settled the VHS-Beta format war since videocassettes were the first medium to take video home to the consumer.

It is different this round, and they said that Disney will settle the high-def disc format war...

Looks like it's going to be true...
 
Thanks for the stats. Proves an old article I read.

It said that the porn industry settled the VHS-Beta format war since videocassettes were the first medium to take video home to the consumer.

It is different this round, and they said that Disney will settle the high-def disc format war...

Looks like it's going to be true...

yeah, who really wants porn on their 60'' plasma with excruciating detail anyways? :p :D

disney is huge, but....when warner brothers goes blu exclusive it will be the final blow.
 
But, I have seen the future...

yeah, who really wants porn on their 60'' plasma with excruciating detail anyways? :p :D

disney is huge, but....when warner brothers goes blu exclusive it will be the final blow.


But, what is WAY cool is the LG Super Multi-Blu player (the 2nd gen model). I saw one at Best Buy - man, these things are neat. Who cares what the format is, just put the disc in. I think it may even play VideoCD's!

Watch the copy of "King Kong" you got with the XB360 HD DVD Drive. Hey, it's still early in the evening, pop in "Casino Royale" on Blu-ray.

I really don't know what the argument is. It REALLY depends on how the movie was (re)mastered for HD, and the HD video codec on the disc.

I remember back when people were telling me, "What? A DVD-RW drive? You won't be able to get blanks for it pretty soon as the +RW will win out..."

Now, everyone's got a +-RW drive..

If Toshiba "looses", they'll just make a Combo HD Disc player, then Sony will have to follow suit just to keep up... I'll still be able to play all my HD DVD discs...
 
But, what is WAY cool is the LG Super Multi-Blu player (the 2nd gen model). I saw one at Best Buy - man, these things are neat. Who cares what the format is, just put the disc in. I think it may even play VideoCD's!

Watch the copy of "King Kong" you got with the XB360 HD DVD Drive. Hey, it's still early in the evening, pop in "Casino Royale" on Blu-ray.

I really don't know what the argument is. It REALLY depends on how the movie was (re)mastered for HD, and the HD video codec on the disc.

I remember back when people were telling me, "What? A DVD-RW drive? You won't be able to get blanks for it pretty soon as the +RW will win out..."

Now, everyone's got a +-RW drive..

If Toshiba "looses", they'll just make a Combo HD Disc player, then Sony will have to follow suit just to keep up... I'll still be able to play all my HD DVD discs...

although dual format discs are "neat" they are more expensive then buying a single player of each format (esp. with hd-dvds prices being practically nothing after huge price cuts and free movies) also, warner brothers suspended development of TotalHD (discs containing both hd-dvd and blu-ray) presumablely because they are choosing a side soon.

when the format war is over, toshiba will quietly release a dual format player to play blu-rays, but Sony will never do the same (you forgot they own a huge studio and will never release on hd-dvd) , and hd-dvd backing studios will switch.
 
I will never understand why people seem to bicker about which is better... just shut up and get both :cool:
 
Yeah, well, when they release one of those with a vhs slot, then I'll be interested.... :D

and a Beta... :D

yeah yeah...the point is its cheaper/same price to get a ps3 and one of the cheap toshiba hd-dvd players (+ the free movies that come with both)

and a lot better of a deal with the ps3.

I hear, though, that the PS3 doesn't play the certain discs with uncompressed audio, but the stand alone players do...
 
I hear, though, that the PS3 doesn't play the certain discs with uncompressed audio, but the stand alone players do...

Lets not forget it's uncertain alot of blu-ray players will be able to play V1.1 of the new blu-ray standard, and certainly early units won't be able to.

At least the PS3 should be able to via a firmware/software upgrade though.

Blu-ray 1.1: a lawsuit waiting to happen?
Owners of old players could be spurred into class action


Rob Mead
13 Nov 2007 08:05 GMT

Early adopters of Blu-ray Disc could be so incensed by changes being made to 'their' movie format that they could sue Hollywood studios and hardware makers alike.

This is because many Blu-ray movies being launched next year have interactive menus and other features that take advantage of BD-Video Final Standard Profile 1.1 - a new hardware standard that mandates technology like persistent memory, BD Java and internet connections (optional) that older Blu-ray decks do not have.

Blu-ray: accident or design?
If you've ponied up in excess of £1,000 for a Blu-ray deck in that last couple of years that can't play or won't play these new features, you're gonna feel pretty miffed.

So says Olivier Van Wynendaele, spokesman for the European arm of the HD DVD Promotion Group. To be honest, he has a point, and it's a very good one:

"You some have hardware limitations. Persistent memory, for instance, mandates that you have flash memory inside the player, which is what HD DVD players have."

"You can't upgrade the hardware"

"Take a Samsung or a Sony player - they have no flash memory. How will you introduce flash memory into a player which has already been designed and introduced? It's not a PC, you can't change the board, you can't upgrade it," Van Wynendaele told Tech.co.uk.

Wynendaele then cites the Blu-ray release of sci-fi actioner Sunshine as an example of how this could be a problem. Sunshine is the first Blu-ray from any Hollywood studio that includes a Picture-in-Picture function so you can see, rather than just hear, movie-makers comments.

"This feature won't work on any Blu-ray player available today. Even on the PS3...
", he says. The PS3's saving grace, however, is that it can be upgraded to the Profile 1.1 specification with a firmware update.


Blu-ray: So who's to blame?

"So consumers will buy a title and find it does not work. The problem is then do they go back to the hardware manufacturer or the software manufacturer? Consumer lawsuits are quite common these days. I'm not sure that studios will take a big risk putting on features that won't work with some players."

Van Wynendaele also warns that the change in the Blu-ray standard could seal the fate of the format as it's reputation is damaged by the format's earliest adopters:

"The first people who will buy your Blu-ray player are early adopters, the tech guys and so on. The ones who love new technology and features. They want the best. They are the ones who make the reputation of the format, of the product... those people are very important from the start.

"You'd better have those people on your side, for you rather than against you, because a small pool can make a large noise. And if those people make too much noise then the majority won't buy your product.

"It's a rip off!"

"If those people start writing on the internet 'I bought this movie from Fox and it won't play. it's a rip-off, but nobody will take any responsibility - retailers are blaming the studios, studios are blaming the playback device' - then it could get nasty very quickly."

Van Wynendaele, of course, points out that features such as persistent memory, picture-in-picture, interactivity and internet connections have been compulsory on HD DVD since its launch.

The trouble doesn't end there for Blu-ray, however. While the new Profile 1.1 specification makes persistent memory mandatory (256MB of it), Internet connectivity remains optional. In fact, Internet connectivity won't be declared mandatory until the next specification, Profile 2.0, aka BD-Live.
 
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