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Archie,

What has this to do with the iPhone vs. BlackBerry? Common trick to shift the true nature of the conversation. Mac growth over PC growth has nothing to do with RIM.

Alex

If you followed the thread of the conversation you would have seen where it comes from.

Arisobrat gave a good example of how RIM chases the market by providing cheap devices, like the blackberry for $50.

Apple likes its high margins. If they dropped their margins they could actually be a competitor in the market, with a worldwide market share of more than 3%

To really gain market share they are going to have to get a lot cheaper. Is Apple up to that? They have not shown that willingness in the PC market.
 
Also, dont confuse shipment growth in a growing market with market share growth, which is clearly much lower.

Absolutely but the industry is only growing by 10% Year-on-year and Apple is outpacing it.

To really gain market share they are going to have to get a lot cheaper.

But they don't in the PC market, not when their computer sales are growing 5x faster than the rest of the industry.

Anyway the iPhone *has* dropped in price a lot, it was $599 at launch.

You know, I have not even heard of those apps before. If an app is in low demand, the development cost of moving it to another platform may never be met.

I'm not going any further with this argument, but this is too good a point to miss. Wil Shipley certainly isn't poor from Delicious Library.

Wil Shipley's Blog said:
But SOME people are going to say, "Damn it, this is cool software, I don't want to keep screwing with using pirated keys that will get shut down all the time," and they're going to go ahead and purchase Delicious Library.

What makes me so sure? Last time we did a minor release, which ONLY fixed one minor bug (focussing control for external iSights on Mac Pros), we did an EXTRA $12,000 of business that day and the next. Cash money business. Not $12,000 total, an EXTRA $12,000 above our normal business.

(source)
 
But they don't in the PC market, not when their computer sales are growing 5x faster than the rest of the industry.

While the market may have only grown 14%, Apple's 40% growth is not that spectacular when compared to the much larger HP's 25% growth. While Apple sold 1/2 million more year on year, HP, at 3 million more PC's sold, sold 6 times more year on year.

pcmarketsharezp7.gif


Anyway the iPhone *has* dropped in price a lot, it was $599 at launch.

Yes, its true that Apple is abandoning their previous approach to the market, even going so far as having their phones subsidised. This can only be a good thing.
 
For the record, I'm not a RIM guy.

I do work for a decently-large company (within 35 of being on the Fortune 500), and one of my job responsibilities is to maintain our small BlackBerry Enterprise Server. We have roughly 300 users, 99% of whom have Verizon BlackBerrys, and we're a Lotus Notes shop (out of legacy).

Having said that, I carry two devices with me. My work-issued BlackBerry and my personal iPhone.

I'm behind you 100% on everything you've said about the differences between the two devices from a users perspective. I personally hate using my BB for anything (other than as a tethered modem).

But when I think about the whole workflow of "managed mobile devices" (from a large business perspective), the end-user experience (as long as it's acceptable), is one of the last ones to be considered.

Here are some of my thoughts why Apple won't have replaced RIM as #1 by 05/25/2009.

RIM offers devices through all US carriers. Apple offers the iPhone only through AT&T. I don't see companies wholesale switching wireless carriers (which means negotiating rates, changes in billing procedures, etc) just to offer their users a better UI.

RIM supports Exchange (49%), Lotus Notes (37%), and Groupwise (8%). The bracketed numbers are Gartner's estimate of that platforms marketshare of corporate email. Apple offers no full-PIM sync solution for 45% of corporate email platforms.

Device cost. My company can get a new RIM device for $49. Apple current offers no discounts.

Insurance. If one of our users breaks or loses his RIM device, we can get it replaced for a $50 co-pay. AT&T offers no insurance on the iPhone.

Remains to be seen how through Apple implements iPhone "security management" and "device configuration".

Remains to be see how Apple will offer business support for the iPhone. Does it go into the same queue of calls as consumers that can't sync?

The pace of business doesn't work nearly as fast as you think it does. I think it's realistic to see betas and even pilots of the iPhone in corporations within the first year, but I can't think of a single business that would do a wholesale migration from RIM to iPhone (which is what would be required for Apple to displace RIM as #1 in a years time) simply because the iPhone gives the user a "next generation" experience.

How do you put a ROI on a "next generation" experience? Again, as a user of both platforms, I personally prefer the iPhone, but I've given too many BlackBerrys to users that have never used one before and have seen them figure it out on their own to know that as "previous generation" as it is, it's still a useful tool.

The iPhone is a new platform. And it was obviously thought of as a consumer device. I think sheer demand caused Apple to re-consider it for the enterprise. But it's clear they didn't even consider that in their release. They likely thought of just going after their core iPod market and their pro-customer markets. That being said here is what I think, and it's merely speculation...

I think Apple now realizes the potential of going after the enterprise. I think when Apple does see a true opportunity to dominate a market, they do go after it. I don't think Apple sees an opportunity to go after the entire PC market as they would have to sacrifice margins, and certainly have more enterprise applications in the works, which they don't appear willing to do. That's a situation which describes not going after a market. Let me give you the opposite example now.

Somewhere in 1999 or perhaps slightly before that, Apple lost Avid as a vendor of Digital Non-linear Editing software for the Mac platform. Steve Jobs felt this was a real blow to the pro-sumer Mac customer. At the time, Macromedia was just finishing a new Non-Linear Editing platform called Razor, and later named Final Cut. They showed this to Avid, offering to sell it. Avid turned them down. They showed it to Apple, and Apple bought it. Apple renamed it Final Cut Pro.

A lot of editors in the smallest of catagory bought Final Cut Pro, but all it did was DV editing. DV means Digital Video, and it's a codec. A very specific low end codec at that. Pretty soon some crazy people wanted to edit actual film on Final Cut Pro. But FCP wasn't capable of this. Film editing requires a database to be created which compares digital edits to film frames and then issues what is known as an EDL, or Edit Decision List to be given to an actual film cutter who then cuts the film print. Film is very expensive to develop, and telecine, and then edit and cut. So this is a big deal.

Now Avid, the 800 pound gorilla in this example, (like RIM) had been doing true film editing for the company's lifetime. Most felt Avid in absolutely no danger of Apple what so ever. But pretty soon a company called Film Logic was created which made this database and EDL management system for FCP. Apple later bought this company and renamed the product, CinemaTools. FCP could now do film editing. And in fact, later on Apple bought two different DVD authoring companies, Astaré and DVD Maestro. They started to create a suite of applications that would put the Mac back on the map where Avid had left a giant hole. With FCP, CinemaTools, and DVD Studio Pro they started to build momentum. They bought Nothing Real, the makers of Shake which is a Node Based compositor using in the Lord of The Rings Trilogy. They bought a text effects company which paved the way to LiveType. They hired the ex-team of developers at Autodesk's Descreet devision and created Motion, and Aperture. Apple teamed with AJA and BlackMagic Design to allow editors ingest all kinds of various codecs. Soon Apple wasn't just a DV editor anymore. They had grown to become HD/SD, Film, and on and on. And they are the premiere editor for the new RED camera which does 2k and 4k resolution. Apple is a master with codecs and soon developed ProRES, and many other lossless codecs. They bought a company that makes a color processing application similiar to a $100,000 Da Vinci colorist station.

Apple pretty much dominates editing at this point. While Avid is still large in broadcast, they are losing a lot of ground to Apple. They are starting to show losses in their quarterlies now. And Avid, the once 800 pound gorilla is now undergoing massive pricing restructuring in an effort to compete with Apple. But Apple's suite is so much more for the money. It's like Avid hasn't got a chance now. The time for Avid to change was many years ago, but they (Avid) believed their own you-know-what, and did nothing.

Now this market over Enterprise Smart Phones can be taken away from RIM. And if you look at the market data, without even going after Enterprise at all Apple has gained a lot of attention from that very market. They are basically begging Apple to make something that allows them to use an iPhone in their corporation. They want it, they have said so.

Will Apple rise to this demand? I think the answer is yes because I think Apple knows that RIM can be defeated. Where there is a way, they will create the will. The 2.0 release speaks loudly to Apple putting on the boxing gloves and preparing to enter the ring.

I think the 2.0 is just the very beginning. It's the Film Logic. And in time, they will add more and more of the tools you need in the enterprise so long as they believe this is winnable. All of these areas you mention of lacking capability are likely going to be dealt with. Think about this for a second. Look what they did from 1.0 to 2.0 and look how quickly they are doing it. Honestly remind yourself of one important fact. Since when has RIM worked so quickly to change course? They take a year just to release a minor upgrade. 4.1 to 4.2 to 4.5 is taking a very long time. Apple going from a full 1.0 to 2.0 is taking place in mere months.

So it gos back to a willingness. Apple has the talent, the money, and the desire at this point. They have a better platform to start with, and a better UI. So in my opinion, they just stepped into the ring, wearing gloves, and let the robe reveal what they truly are. Which is the 800 pound gorilla. RIM was never that gorilla. They just thought they were. But in my estimation, they're about to get their lights punched out.

Alex Alexzander

If you followed the thread of the conversation you would have seen where it comes from.

Arisobrat gave a good example of how RIM chases the market by providing cheap devices, like the blackberry for $50.

Apple likes its high margins. If they dropped their margins they could actually be a competitor in the market, with a worldwide market share of more than 3%

To really gain market share they are going to have to get a lot cheaper. Is Apple up to that? They have not shown that willingness in the PC market.

What you are not considering, obviously, is that this argument fails to compare to the PC and Mac argument. Apple just gained a 25% marketshare in the smartphone market in mere months. As you can see, that differs greatly from the market conditions of the PC and the Mac. So please, realize how foolish and incomparable this argument is.

Alex
 
What you are not considering, obviously, is that this argument fails to compare to the PC and Mac argument. Apple just gained a 25% marketshare in the smartphone market in mere months. As you can see, that differs greatly from the market conditions of the PC and the Mac. So please, realize how foolish and incomparable this argument is.

Alex

25% in USA, 6% in the world, a much smaller percentage of the enterprise market where RIM is strong. Also dont confuse marketshare and installed base.

So please, realize how foolish and incomparable this argument is.
 
25% in USA, 6% in the world, a much smaller percentage of the enterprise market where RIM is strong.

So please, realize how foolish and incomparable this argument is.

Lol.. This is pretty much the only market they have been in for any length of time.

You'll see. Hope you love crow.

Alex
 
What you are not considering, obviously, is that this argument fails to compare to the PC and Mac argument. Apple just gained a 25% marketshare in the smartphone market in mere months. As you can see, that differs greatly from the market conditions of the PC and the Mac. So please, realize how foolish and incomparable this argument is.

Alex

You know the thing about statistics --- lie and damn lies.

First of all, it's only for the US smartphone market.

But the BIG BIG BIG problem is that they based it on "shipment" numbers, not AT&T's iphone activation number.

It's not 25% of the US smartphone market when 1/2 of the US iphones ended up in China and Russia. If you use the activation number as a guide, the iphone smartphone market share didn't even beat windows mobile.
 
Exchange is fully supported with iPhone 2.0
Yes, I know. That's why I said the iPhone doesn't offer PIM-sync for 45% of email platforms instead of saying the iPhone doesn't offer PIM-sinc for 99% of email platforms. ;)

Lotus Notes almost certainly will be supported with iPhone 2.0 (source).
Last I read, it was through a web interface, not syncing natively with the iPhones built-in apps. Once the iPhone can natively sync with Notes, then I think it's only other big barrier (in the US, anyways) that would stop it from being at least considered is the AT&T exclusivity.

Have you seen the SDK introduction?
Yes, I have. Did I miss where Apple gave specifics to how the iPhone 2.0 could be configured and managed by policies? :?
 
You know the thing about statistics --- lie and damn lies.

First of all, it's only for the US smartphone market.

But the BIG BIG BIG problem is that they based it on "shipment" numbers, not AT&T's iphone activation number.

It's not 25% of the US smartphone market when 1/2 of the US iphones ended up in China and Russia. If you use the activation number as a guide, the iphone smartphone market share didn't even beat windows mobile.

Did or didn't Apple sell 5.4 million phones as of last count?

Who cares where they go.

Look at BlackBerry. I have 4 of their devices. Does it matter? None are in use. Say it anyway you like. At the end of the day, Apple sold 5.4 million phones. Many are jailbroken. Many are in china. Maybe are in a toilet. Who cares. They are sold phones. You think RIM didn't count the 4 phones I own? Of course they did. Even though none are in use, they still got paid didn't they? It all counts bud.

Alex

Yes, I know. That's why I said the iPhone doesn't offer PIM-sync for 45% of email platforms instead of saying the iPhone doesn't offer PIM-sinc for 99% of email platforms. ;)


Last I read, it was through a web interface, not syncing natively with the iPhones built-in apps. Once the iPhone can natively sync with Notes, then I think it's only other big barrier (in the US, anyways) that would stop it from being at least considered is the AT&T exclusivity.


Yes, I have. Did I miss where Apple gave specifics to how the iPhone 2.0 could be configured and managed by policies? :?

You'll see LotusSync. Don't you think you are going to see a ton of Sync apps for virtually everything. Let me explain something to you. You have 200,000 developers signed on. Do you think not a one of them is thinking about Lotus Sync? Pa leeeze.

How many BlackBerry developers? 200,000? I doubt you have 50,000.

Alex
 
Did or didn't Apple sell 5.4 million phones as of last count?

Who cares where they go.

Look at BlackBerry. I have 4 of their devices. Does it matter? None are in use. Say it anyway you like. At the end of the day, Apple sold 5.4 million phones. Many are jailbroken. Many are in china. Maybe are in a toilet. Who cares. They are sold phones. You think RIM didn't count the 4 phones I own? Of course they did. Even though none are in use, they still got paid didn't they? It all counts bud.

Alex

I don't care where all the iphones are.

If you count the whole world --- then there are 1.25 billion cell phones out there. So 5.4 million iphones is less than 1/2 a percent.

80-90% of the blackberry users are in the US.
 
I don't care where all the iphones are.

If you count the whole world --- then there are 1.25 billion cell phones out there. So 5.4 million iphones is less than 1/2 a percent.

The vast vast majority of which aren't smart-phones. Would you count type-writers in the market for the number of computers sold?
 
The vast vast majority of which aren't smart-phones. Would you count type-writers in the market for the number of computers sold?

And the vast majority of the nokia smartphones aren't really used as a smartphone at all.

People think that they can rip a dvd movie, put it in 3gp format and then load it into their Nokia smartphones --- that's what smartphone is all about.

Quote:

"Note to US readers: many people buy smartphones in Europe because they're Nokia's or high-end SonyEricssons and have nice design / camera / music functions - but neither know nor care that they're "smart". Many Nokia N95 owners would rather eat their own shoes than look for and downloads apps to their phone."

http://disruptivewireless.blogspot.com/2008/05/flattening-symbian-shipments-user.html

There are all kinds of holes in all of these statistics talks.
 
I don't care where all the iphones are.

If you count the whole world --- then there are 1.25 billion cell phones out there. So 5.4 million iphones is less than 1/2 a percent.

80-90% of the blackberry users are in the US.

LOLLOLLOLOL

Okay, so count BlackBerry with all the cheap knock offs too. And you'll see just about the same numbers. BlackBerry is not so far ahead of Apple you know. And they've been around for 13 years specifically in this market. Apple's in their first year and they are #2 in the smart-phone market. Consider that they just started in many other markets and you can guess where this is going and what it will do to RIMs marketshare.

So now we have to clean up your sloppy logic too. Comparing smart phone sales to all sales. Are you going to stick with comparable arguments or just keep blurting out things that have nothing to do with anything?

Alex
 
LOLLOLLOLOL

Okay, so count BlackBerry with all the cheap knock offs too. And you'll see just about the same numbers. BlackBerry is not so far ahead of Apple you know. And they've been around for 13 years specifically in this market. Apple's in their first year and they are #2 in the smart-phone market. Consider that they just started in many other markets and you can guess where this is going and what it will do to RIMs marketshare.

So now we have to clean up your sloppy logic too. Comparing smart phone sales to all sales. Are you going to stick with comparable arguments or just keep blurting out things that have nothing to do with anything?

Alex

First of all, Apple isn't #2 in the smartphone market.

It's not sloppy logic. The market share study was based on one country --- in which the majority of the iphones are exported outside that country.

Second of all, most of these smartphones aren't used as smartphones --- whether they be the iphone or a symbian phone. The analysis is full of holes when people just buy these Nokia smartphones because it's there and it's heavily subsidized.

58% of Verizon subscribers have a 3G phone --- doesn't mean that they actually care it's a 3G phone.

http://telephonyonline.com/wireless/commentary/devices-data-usage-0429/
 
First of all, Apple isn't #2 in the smartphone market.

It's not sloppy logic. The market share study was based on one country --- in which the majority of the iphones are exported outside that country.

Second of all, most of these smartphones aren't used as smartphones --- whether they be the iphone or a symbian phone. The analysis is full of holes when people just buy these Nokia smartphones because it's there and it's heavily subsidized.

58% of Verizon subscribers have a 3G phone --- doesn't mean that they actually care it's a 3G phone.

http://telephonyonline.com/wireless/commentary/devices-data-usage-0429/

First of all, I can buy into the argument that not all the phones sold are actually used in the United States. That's perfectly fine. However, a lot of the jailbroken phones are simply used on TMobile, or some other carrier in the US. They still count even if AT&T doesn't show an activation. The number I believe that is suspect in use in China was about 400,000. Not a huge number.

Now, whether the phone is used as a smart phone or not makes absolutely no difference. It was bought as a smart phone, period. Apple made a smart phone and if someone bought it to be an iPod, or a movie player, or a dart board, it makes absolutely no difference. It's a sale. It was sold.

Alex
 
First of all, I can buy into the argument that not all the phones sold are actually used in the United States. That's perfectly fine. However, a lot of the jailbroken phones are simply used on TMobile, or some other carrier in the US. They still count even if AT&T doesn't show an activation. The number I believe that is suspect in use in China was about 400,000. Not a huge number.

Now, whether the phone is used as a smart phone or not makes absolutely no difference. It was bought as a smart phone, period. Apple made a smart phone and if someone bought it to be an iPod, or a movie player, or a dart board, it makes absolutely no difference. It's a sale. It was sold.

Alex

If T-Mobile USA has massive iphone subscribers --- they would have said it as a PR stunt.

There is a huge difference between something like 2 million iphone shipped in the US in the christmas quarter and AT&T activating 900K iphones in the same period. How many of these missing iphones are jailbroken to be used in the US? It may be a couple of hundred thousand iphones --- but that will still kill the market share analysis by 1/2.

No --- there were a lot of discussions on that (i.e. the iphone is "smarter" than a smartphone). As I said, lies and damned lies. People kept on talking about symbian this and symbian that and how they rule the smartphone market in the world --- well if none of them are used as a "smartphone", then all this talk is useless.

Americans use smartphone for a specific function --- they actually use these phones as a tool --- that's why it's RIM and Windows Mobile.
 
Actually, since I own Apple and RIM stock I am putting my money where my mouth is.

I would point out that the iPhone's 28% wasn't at the expense of RIM whose market share increased over the same period. Most of the iPhone's sales were to first time smartphone buyers - individual customers not corporate.

RIM will continue to dominate for the reasons outlined in aristobrat's post. Frankly, IT and purchasing departments don't care about a nice UI, they just care about cost. A lot of talk has been made about Mail for Exchange but I'd point out that Symbian phones have been able to do this for years and RIM still dominate the corporate marketplace.
 
You'll see LotusSync. Don't you think you are going to see a ton of Sync apps for virtually everything. Let me explain something to you. You have 200,000 developers signed on. Do you think not a one of them is thinking about Lotus Sync? Pa leeeze.
Great, a third-party syncing solution that adds not only to the overall cost of the device, but also adds extra complexity in troubleshooting syncing issues (Apple saying the recurring calendar event issue isn't with their application, it's the syncing vendors issue, and vice-versa). Been down that road before. No thank you. Our experiences from piloting Windows Mobile (well, Pocket PC Phone Edition back then) + [IntelliSync, Commontime, and various other 3rd party Notes sync solutions] is exactly how we ended up with a RIM solution for our Notes environment.

I only hope that Apple will partner with IBM and include a NATIVE method of syncing the iPhone with Notes, like they did with Microsoft Exchange.

You really don't have any experience supporting quantities of mobile devices, do you? :confused:
 
Actually, since I own Apple and RIM stock I am putting my money where my mouth is.

I would point out that the iPhone's 28% wasn't at the expense of RIM whose market share increased over the same period. Most of the iPhone's sales were to first time smartphone buyers - individual customers not corporate.

RIM will continue to dominate for the reasons outlined in aristobrat's post. Frankly, IT and purchasing departments don't care about a nice UI, they just care about cost.

The problem is that they based the 28% market share analysis on the 2 million iphone shipment in the US in the christmas quarter of 2007 --- whereas only 900K iphones were activated by AT&T in the same period.

Even if you are generous and give a couple of hundred thousand iphones to be jailbroken to the T-Mobile column --- there is still 900K "missing" iphones that were exported overseas.

So that 28% market share --- becomes 15% in real life (which is less than RIM and windows mobile).
 
In fairness a number of those additional iPhones stayed in the US on other networks so it'll be higher than 15%.

As for Nokia users, I download third party apps for my N95 so I'm not sure your previous statement is correct.
 
Most of the iPhone's sales were to first time smartphone buyers - individual customers not corporate.

RIM will continue to dominate for the reasons outlined in aristobrat's post. Frankly, IT and purchasing departments don't care about a nice UI, they just care about cost. A lot of talk has been made about Mail for Exchange but I'd point out that Symbian phones have been able to do this for years and RIM still dominate the corporate marketplace.

That as maybe, but if the phone is easy to use a) the training is cheaper, and b) the employees are happier, its not all about lowering the IT divisions costs.

And in fact over in the "real world" 1/3 of the Fortune 500 have already contacted Apple about the iPhone.

So that 28% market share --- becomes 15% in real life (which is less than RIM and windows mobile).

Microsoft aren't doing so well against Apple when they have a 25x marketshare lead, how they are going to against the iPhone when they are barely ahead I truly don't know.

I download third party apps for my N95 so I'm not sure your previous statement is correct.

Members of online tech forums are not the general population, and this is definitely only anecdotal.
 
Great, a third-party syncing solution that adds not only to the overall cost of the device, but also adds extra complexity in troubleshooting syncing issues (Apple saying the recurring calendar event issue isn't with their application, it's the syncing vendors issue, and vice-versa). Been down that road before. No thank you. Our experiences from piloting Windows Mobile (well, Pocket PC Phone Edition back then) + [IntelliSync, Commontime, and various other 3rd party Notes sync solutions] is exactly how we ended up with a RIM solution for our Notes environment.

I only hope that Apple will partner with IBM and include a NATIVE method of syncing the iPhone with Notes, like they did with Microsoft Exchange.

You really don't have any experience supporting quantities of mobile devices, do you? :confused:

I was the North-western regional director of engineering for Winstar Broadband Services. Prior to that I was a consulting engineer for Vanstar, the largest value added reseller in the world. Do I have to start scanning my various diplomas from InfoImage for my Certified Lotus Professional days, my MCSE ID badge from Microsoft, and my CNE, and CNI diplomas where I taught Novell NetWare from 1994/95?

I also have an HP-Star for work with ProCurve switches, and so on. I'm also a published author in the area of DVD authoring, published Designing Menus with DVD Studio Pro published in 2005 with CMPBooks. So please, don't start to tell me you have a better background in technology than I do. I seriously doubt you do.

I can tell you I supported tons of Palm Pilots that used various sync tools from 3rd party providers in the enterprise, including law firms, financial institutions and so on. It all worked quite well, and believe me only techs care. The users just want a device that does what they need it to do easily. They don't care about what you go through. You're a tech. It's expected you can sync their PDA with Notes or Exchange.

And now you are trying to bring up issues you believe in theory will happen that have not happened at all. No doubt from your experience with other devices. The Missing Sync for the BlackBerry comes to mind immediately as being a poor device sync tool. But what can you do when RIM doesn't even directly support the Machintosh in any meaningful way.

You can waste time theorizing all you like about how many iPhones are jailbroken and how many are in other countries as a jailbroken phone. It truly doesn't matter. If you like, we can add up all BlackBerry phone sales world wide, and all iPhone sales, world wide, and see who gains faster and who starts to lose marketshare.

Now someone else mentioned that BlackBerry has not lost due to iPhone. Absolutely true. So far RIM has enjoyed 3 million new subscribers for the last two quarters. But hear me, and understand something. Apple has no enterprise market to lose. Only to gain. And with a so many enterprises in the trial right now, it's clear they have to come from somewhere. It isn't going to be just Palm and Windows Mobile that lose. It's going to be RIM as well.

The SalesForce.com app was just the beginning. And when companies see how much more sense it makes to have their employees using such software and hardware, they won't think twice about dropping the BlackBerry. Time is money. Not these meaningless $50 difference you think are so important.

Alex
 
Not these meaningless $50 difference you think are so important.

Remember that the biggest cost for any company is the people. The average person in the US earns $40000/year, compared to that $50 is completely meaningless.
 
In fairness a number of those additional iPhones stayed in the US on other networks so it'll be higher than 15%.

As for Nokia users, I download third party apps for my N95 so I'm not sure your previous statement is correct.

It wouldn't even "move the needle" unless T-Mobile USA has 400-500 thousand iphones in the christmas quarter when AT&T only activated 900K iphones. A 500K iphone for the TMO USA in the christmas quarter would move the market share for the iphone in the US to about 21% which is what windows mobile have.

Very few people actually use Nokia smartphones as a smartphone --- which is why windows mobile, RIM and palm are very low in the world smartphone market share studies.
 
Very few people actually use Nokia smartphones as a smartphone --- which is why windows mobile, RIM and palm are very low in the world smartphone market share studies.

I think this is relevant here:

London Financial Times said:
Google on Wednesday said it had seen 50 times more searches on Apple‘s iPhone than any other mobile handset, adding weight to the group’s confidence at being able to generate significant revenues from the mobile internet.

(source)
 
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