Horizontal Lines in New Powerbooks

[jeffcorbets]

Okay, so I sat down with my new PowerBook and spent a good thirty minutes trying to determine would could be wrong with the display.

The things I noticed on my display after further inspection:

* The infamous grey lines on every other row of pixels. These are kinda similar to the Trinitron lines in Trinitron CRTs, though they don't show up on white.

* The lower corners of the screen are darker. On the left side of the PowerBook the screen backlighting is noticably darker than on the right.

* There is no place that I can view the display from in which the colors at every location on the display are true. If I sit directly in front of the left side of the display, the colors are decent, same on the right. If I sit in the middle (which, I think, is normal), then colors at the edges are not even close to what they should be. A quick measurement showed a view angle of about 10-15 degrees for true color.

So, I ended up calling Apple and asking about mainly the horizontal lines. The two people I spoke to did not indicate in any way that this is a known problem, but a box is being sent to me for me to ship the new PowerBook back to them for diagnosis and repair.

~Jeff Corbets

 

[Wombert]

* The infamous grey lines on every other row of pixels. These are kinda similar to the Trinitron lines in Trinitron CRTs, though they don't show up on white.

Nope. This doesn't have anything to do with Trinitron lines. Trinitron monitors only have two lines, one in the upper and another one in the lower third of the screen, and they are thin wires to keep the mask stable. Not like the 15" PB scanlines, neither technically nor in the result.

 

[VogonPoet]

More on this issue here...

http://discussions.info.apple.com/webx?14@592.B8JdaxarTMp.332486@.68bd725d

and here...

http://discussions.info.apple.com/webx?14@592.B8JdaxarTMp.332486@.68bd0112

This 'horizontal scan line' issue seems to be affecting pretty much ALL of the new PowerBooks.

 

[VisualForces]

Update on my repair:

They began repair around 1pm today. My status just now (5:15pm) was changed to "Hold - Engineering". I was expecting this as the tech said he wanted the engineering group to see it. It's better than them calling me and saying "this display is just fine."

The wait begins...

 

[g0gie]

good luck on the "hold - engineering" my friggen powerbok has bene on hold for over a week with that same messege. I just contacted applecare to send me a whole new one.

 

[VisualForces]

good luck on the "hold - engineering" my friggen powerbok has bene on hold for over a week with that same messege. I just contacted applecare to send me a whole new one.

yeah...when I was talking to the tech before I sent it, he told me that the engineering department could be working on a solution and my laptop could be in their hands for more than a week. Honestly, I'm willing to go a while without it if they fix the screen...I loved everything else about it and would rather have it than a previous model. And I'm scared to simply get it replaced in fear of having the same screen issues.

We'll see how long my patience lasts.

 

[VogonPoet]

... Honestly, I'm willing to go a while without it if they FIX the screen...

Well, I hope for your (our) part that they can fix it, but since this seems to be affecting ALL of the new 15" PB's, I think they'll have to replace the LCD screen with a different model.

I visited my local Apple Store today and ALL of the new 15" Powerbooks on display had exactly the same horizontal line issue with their display. I had a long discussion with the tech (genius) and he documented the whole thing and filed a 'ticket' with Apple Engineering. Maybe if enough people make a fuss about this and let Apple know that it is simply not acceptable, they might do a large recall-and-replace on these units. Who knows... but I'm not holding my breath.

 

[mactim]

I took mine back....

I decided last night that I couldn't live with the issue on my new PB. I took it back to the London store and got a full refund. I noticed that the 15" display models ALL had this issue too (hence I refused a replacement).
So now I'm PowerBook-less
I have to decide whether to get a 17" (I prefer the size of the 15), or play the waiting game again for a 'fixed' 15".

Well, I hope for your (our) part that they can fix it, but since this seems to be affecting ALL of the new 15" PB's, I think they'll have to replace the LCD screen with a different model.

I visited my local Apple Store today and ALL of the new 15" Powerbooks on display had exactly the same horizontal line issue with their display. I had a long discussion with the tech (genius) and he documented the whole thing and filed a 'ticket' with Apple Engineering. Maybe if enough people make a fuss about this and let Apple know that it is simply not acceptable, they might do a large recall-and-replace on these units. Who knows... but I'm not holding my breath.

 

[rickeym]

Does this only effect the 15" model

I've heard conflicting reports on which models are effected. Does the horizontal lines issue only effect the 15" model or does the 17" model also have this problem?

 

[lieb39]

Jeeze, I was planning to buy a brand new 15" PB on Monday but now I'm not so sure I want to get it. I'll go to the store and check out the models, I may just get it and wait for a fix I suppose..

-lieb39

 

[nesbitt_a]

Are all the 15" models affected?

Andrew.

 

[Melkor]

Are all the 15" models affected?

Andrew.

Ya I wonder that aswell. Mine is supposed to arrive today and now im getting nervous lol

 

[nesbitt_a]

I would really appreciate some photos of the new machine, the new screen etc.
I'm starting to consider the 17" model..

Decisions decisions...

 

[Fireburst]

I've ordered a new 15" today so when it arrives early next week I will let you all know if this issue is present in this one. Are all these PB's with the issue US based or worldwide? (I am in the UK).

 

[mactim]

The 17" has the occasional screen jumping, but this issue has (supposedly) been fixed with the 10.4.3 update. When I took my 15" back to the Apple store, all the 15s on display had the 'scan lines' issue, but the 17" LCD models looked fine.

I've heard conflicting reports on which models are effected. Does the horizontal lines issue only effect the 15" model or does the 17" model also have this problem?

 

[cplusd]

Well it seems Apple's engineers are actually taking a look at this issue. After talking with some friends around the US and reading a few different forums I honestly feel this is a widespread problem. I've seen post from people in other countries (other than US) claiming to see this problem as well. Every Apple store in Michigan has this issue (display models as well). This includes a few other retailers that sell Apple products as well. And those ones didn't recieve new PowerBooks for at least a week or so after annoucement.

One thing we have to remember, not everyone is going to post. Heck alot of people don't even surf forums. So again I feel this is going to be a long and dreadful fix, because Apple's going to have to possibly halt production and fix the screen issues. Or this will haunt them for a very looooooong time...

On a side note, there's a few people at the office I had take a look at my PowerBook. Some at first didn't see the problem at first. So I can see where some claim to not have lines and may just be overlooking them...

 

[revisionA]

If its hard to notice...

If its hard to notice the lines, but easy to notice the upgraded components... is it really worth the hassle of replacement?

We put up with ghosting on lcds... but I wont pay this much for a portable PC.

$

 

[maverick808]

If its hard to notice the lines, but easy to notice the upgraded components... is it really worth the hassle of replacement?

We put up with ghosting on lcds... but I wont pay this much for a portable PC.

$

Apart from the screen then what components have been upgraded since the previous revision? If you are happy to accept a substandard screen then that's your choice. Enjoy your substandard laptop.

 

[cplusd]

Yeah Apple neglected to update the processor or video card, well they gave us the 128mb ati standard (15/17) and DL superdrives (which in 3 years owning/using a PowerBook I've never burned one DVD). The biggest update IMO is the freaking screen and they failed to deliver. Heck if they would of put in 7448's and maybe sata drives or something then I can see dealing with the screen(not really); it'd make it easier to deal with.

is it really worth the hassle of replacement?

Again considering the display is the big update, yes I'm livid at this point, I WANT MY SCREEN FIXED...

 

[revisionA]

Upgrade list for D to E

ddr2 instead of ddr
longer battery life
factory installed 7200rpm drive
pay nothing more for 128mb vram
pay nothing more for superdrive

and then...

22% brighter screen on 15 inch, 46% on 17s
more resolution and support for 30 inch ACD

the cpu and bus speed is unchanged, but the system is still very solid.

I know this, Apple customers are pickier than Mercedes Benz customers.

$

 

[VisualForces]

It doesn't matter what the system has in it if the display isn't as good. I could have the fastest supercomputer in the world and still have a difficult time doing my job with lines on my screen. Notice I said difficult...I didn't say impossible. I just don't see the fault in wanting an upgraded panel to look as "solid" as the older models. If they slapped an older model screen on mine, I'd honestly be happy.

Oh...and the 15" screens aren't 22% brighter...they have more pixels. Apple's advertising is a bit misleading about that...but that's a whole other topic

 

[motherduce]

I know this, Apple customers are pickier than Mercedes Benz customers.

And rightfully so, seeing as how they spend about twice as much for Apple products. For $2000, I sure as hell better have a VERY nice screen to look at.

 

[emw]

I wonder how noticeable these lines are. I went to the Apple Store last week (before paying much attention to this issue) and played with a 15" PB there for about 5 minutes. I was looking closely at the screen since I was interested in the brightness/resolution improvement, and never once noticed any lines on the screen.

Maybe they were there, maybe they weren't, but I sure didn't notice them. I'll have my new PB in a couple of weeks (well, I guess pending any "recall" issued by Apple) and I'll see what happens.

 

[cplusd]

ddr2 instead of ddr

What was the point if it can't use the speed of ddr2? Help battery life?

longer battery life

Ok this was a nice small perk

factory installed 7200rpm drive

At a premium price

pay nothing more for 128mb vram

Apple had to cut prices

pay nothing more for superdrive

Again Apple had to cut prices, they didn't really give much to this update. And the main update has a major flaw in the 15's.

Maybe I'm picky, but as someone mentioned that when you pay a PREMIUM for an Apple PowerBook, you better believe we want top notch. If I wanted an HP for 999.00 I would of taken the cheap route, but I opted for a Pro machine.

 

[Fireburst]

If I was a gambling man I would say the fault was probably interference with the signal from the graphics card to the LCD as I remember seeing something similar a few years ago. Perhaps it's just a matter of something needs better shielding.