HP Claims Innovation Over Apple With 'World's Thinnest Laptop'

[NT1440]

Well, I hope you are right, and will delighted if you are. You can come back and shake your finger at me if you like, if they do release something good. But what I need is to replace my 2009 MBP. I'm not sure I really can do that with a 128GB SSD butterfly keyboard, 1 port contraption. I hope they keep the Pro, Pro.

I guess I should recognize that I don't even see the Apple watch. It doesn't even exist to me, so last year was a big yawner.

Last year was huge in terms of roadmap. I'm excited for the new MBPs, I'm thinking Apple will be the first to take advantage of the wireless charging ability built into the Skylake processors. That said, it may be a bit early for that because they are working on a comprehensive charging ecosystem so it may not be released piecemeal.

All I'm saying is the last event, in my eyes, was housekeeping to prepare for a consequential June. We'll see though.

 

[cyberlocke]

yeah, weird hinge. oh wait, it runs Windows, too. (blech)

 

[uid15]

Any sane designer also wouldn't hover one's arm mid air to touch a wobbly screen, lol. Seriously, you can't operate that laptop sitting 3 feet away from it with your arms outstretched. I'm sitting here enjoying my breakfast with my SP4 in front of me, I'm typing and in order to use the touchscreen I simply lift my hand and slide forward a couple of inches, and my elbow stays on the table if I want it to, although I must say I'm strong enough to be able to momentarily lift my arm if I needed to (maybe time to go to the gym or get rid of that heavy metallic hook?). No, the ergonomics argument is NOT a compelling argument, I agree. As they say in Apple land "you're holding it wrong".

Argue what you like, poor ergonomics is poor ergonomics. You'll forgive me if I take the path of common sense and listen to Apple over you - they're kinda king of input methods, what with them perfecting the mouse and Trackpad, and defining the smartphone. Yeah, sorry, but I'll listen to them and see if it ciicks with instinctive common sense, and it does.

Any sensible person can see that having touch for the sake of it is a poor design.

 

[8692574]

yeah, weird hinge. oh wait, it runs Windows, too. (blech)

It can run also Linux, BSD, Solaris ..... and Mac OS (hackintosh), it's not HP's fault Apple does not allow their os to run "natively"..... their machine would be capable of it.

 

[uid15]

Liberace would have loved it.

[doublepost=1460121557][/doublepost]I'd love to see how HP can qualify the assertion that Apple aren't innovating any more, as Apple are constantly designing ways to monitor health and well being with Apple watch, are building a gigantic campus 2, etc etc... they have an incredible amount of irons in the fire, and yet they're "not innovating"? Sounds like marketing speak, and all that nonsense just to sell one model of Liberace laptop. Lol

 

[dwaltwhit]

I don't mind the aesthetics; not my cup of tea but to each his own. My issue is with the rampant misuse of the word artisanal. Artisanal is made by hand in small batches. Are they conceding that so few people will want this that it will be short runs? Are they really handmade?

 

[147798]

Any sensible person can see that having touch for the sake of it is a poor design.

Because only people who agree with you are sensible?

I can more quickly tap a screen to, e.g. launch an app than to mouse over it. Anybody sensible person could understand that /s

edit >> I notice now your post was in response to someone else claiming "any sensible person" so perhaps you meant it sarcastically anyway. Sorry I missed that first go-round.

More seriously, this is really preference. I do not think this is at all based on some sort of Platonist appeal to design absolutes. And btw, the ergo advances by Apple that you listed were pre-Cook. Cook is more interested in size variants, color variants, SKU proliferation and watch bands (at least based on what I've seen so far).

 

[uid15]

I don't mind the aesthetics; not my cup of tea but to each his own. My issue is with the rampant misuse of the word artisanal. Artisanal is made by hand in small batches. Are they conceding that so few people will want this that it will be short runs? Are they really handmade?

That word... oh wow, ugh.

Come on HP - if you're really that innovative, design and build your own, equally functional, beautiful and usable OS to go on your machine. You could have called it "Chrome OS", but I think that's been taken.

 

[147798]

Come on HP - if you're really that innovative, design and build your own, equally functional, beautiful and usable OS to go on your machine. You could have called it "Chrome OS", but I think that's been taken.

They have tried: HP-UX, HP WebOS, and then there's The Machine http://www.labs.hpe.com/research/themachine/

 

[TimSHB]

Real world: we need to promote normal shapes, very thin = very bad!
Tech world: we must make it thinner! All the time! It is never too thin!

This laptop looks unhealthy. Geez, eat a cheeseburger.

 

[uid15]

Because only people who agree with you are sensible. I can more quickly tap a screen to, e.g. launch an app than to mouse over it. Anybody who isn't a total mouth-breather could understand that /s

More seriously, this is really preference. I do not think this is at all based on some sort of Platonist appeal to design absolutes. And btw, the ergo advances by Apple that you listed were pre-Cook. Cook is more interested in size variants, color variants, SKU proliferation and watch bands (at least based on what I've seen so far).

Apple is Apple, let's not split hairs over which person designed what, they're king and defining design year after year, on a long roll. Success is measured by how much people want, use and adore your products, and the level to which they defend them and wouldn't part from them - anyone who retorts with a semi sarcastic reply, with a defensive example of how poor ergonomics is defendable, is not worth wasting time on - not because I don't like you, but because your point doesn't hold up.



Let me ask you these things:

#1 If touchscreen input is such a sensible, amazing methodology for input, why are ALL Windows laptops not touchscreen yet?

#2 If Apple have got laptop design wrong, why does almost every mfr in existence, fall over themselves to emulate the MacBook design, bordering on infringement, in many cases? (side note - the exact same is seen in smartphones, too.)

I rest my case, and my fingers.

 

[happycadaver]

Thinness is a design flaw, not a feature. It's a shame that everybody just wants to emulate Apple instead of designing real alternatives. Apple doesn't represent the pinnacle of hardware design anymore. It is getting hilarious, not better.

 

[147798]

Apple is Apple, let's not split hairs over which person designed what, they're king and defining design year after year, on a long roll. Success is measured by how much people want, use and adore your products, and the level to which they defend them and wouldn't part from them - anyone who retorts with a semi sarcastic reply, with a defensive example of how poor ergonomics is defendable, is not worth wasting time on - not because I don't like you, but because your point doesn't hold up.

The "splitting hairs" is highly relevant, because there was a leadership change, which impacts a company's direction.

I have a buggy-as-crap iPhone 6. I have a 2009 MacBook Pro which I haven't upgraded yet mostly because the options are poor. Over the last several months, as I have been reading up on options, I have heard from many others that are contemplating leaving Apple.

I don't care about the past laurels. I care about what I need now and where they are going, and whether I want to drop $2K on a company that at least a) has gone in a different direction than what I need (i.e. watches and not computers), or b) has lost the plot.

Again, look to the future -- phone sales have curtailed, it seems mac sales are off (though all PC sales are off), they are trying to get people to buy iPads again, and the watch reception was not "cultural defining."

The next year will be interesting, but I don't care who invented the best track pad. I care about a company that sells me products I need today. I am very interested to hear what they have to say going into WWDC.

 

[uid15]

The "splitting hairs" is highly relevant, because there was a leadership change, which impacts a company's direction.

I have a buggy-as-crap iPhone 6. I have a 2009 MacBook Pro which I haven't upgraded yet mostly because the options are poor. Over the last several months, as I have been reading up on options, I have heard from many others that are contemplating leaving Apple.

I don't care about the past laurels. I care about what I need now and where they are going, and whether I want to drop $2K on a company that at least a) has gone in a different direction than what I need (i.e. watches and not computers), or b) has lost the plot.

Again, look to the future -- phone sales have curtailed, it seems mac sales are off (though all PC sales are off), they are trying to get people to buy iPads again, and the watch reception was not "cultural defining."

The next year will be interesting, but I don't care who invented the best track pad. I care about a company that sells me products I need today. I am very interested to hear what they have to say going into WWDC.

Clearly you're not their target market - that doesn't mean they're failing, it means their products don't do what YOU need, that's not indication they're "losing the plot" - nothing could be further from the truth. Another armchair analyst, eh?

Never mind, enjoy whatever you end up using, take care

 

[H2SO4]

Argue what you like, poor ergonomics is poor ergonomics. You'll forgive me if I take the path of common sense and listen to Apple over you - they're kinda king of input methods, what with them perfecting the mouse and Trackpad, and defining the smartphone. Yeah, sorry, but I'll listen to them and see if it ciicks with instinctive common sense, and it does.

Any sensible person can see that having touch for the sake of it is a poor design.

What with them perfecting the mouse……..????
[doublepost=1460123670][/doublepost]

Argue what you like, poor ergonomics is poor ergonomics. You'll forgive me if I take the path of common sense and listen to Apple over you - they're kinda king of input methods, what with them perfecting the mouse and Trackpad, and defining the smartphone. Yeah, sorry, but I'll listen to them and see if it ciicks with instinctive common sense, and it does.

Any sensible person can see that having touch for the sake of it is a poor design.

What with them perfecting the mouse……..????

What you said reminds me of something a friend said to me when we were talking financials.
He said, ‘Well I think I’d rather take the word of hundreds of economists over someone who has never worked in finance at all. Ever.”
Then. Credit crunch………...

 

[uid15]

What with them perfecting the mouse……..????
[doublepost=1460123670][/doublepost]
What with them perfecting the mouse……..????

What you said reminds me of something a friend said to me when we were talking financials.
He said, ‘Well I think I’d rather take the word of hundreds of economists over someone who has never worked in finance at all. Ever.”
Then. Credit crunch………...

You're too tetchy, calm down to with the excessive punctuation and ad-hominem, then try again.

Apple created and manufactured the mouse as you know it - they all but invented it. They took a primitive concept from PARC, refined it so it was usable, built the complimentary GUI OS, and brought the mouse to market. Anyone knows that.

 

[147798]

Clearly you're not their target market - that doesn't mean they're failing, it means their products don't do what YOU need, that's not indication they're "losing the plot"

-isn't that exactly what I just said?

Never mind, enjoy whatever you end up using, take care

You are a funny one, in that you speak as if you are above the fray, yet cannot resist posting, lol. Well, I'm sure you'll want the last word here, too

 

[uid15]

-isn't that exactly what I just said?



You are a funny one, in that you speak as if you are above the fray, yet cannot resist posting, lol. Well, I'm sure you'll want the last word here, too

^ Irony. Are you insecure about not getting the last word, so make your attempted last word hypocritically ironic? This, by the way, is not a "last word", this is me highlighting the hypocrisy which you couldn't help but exhibit.

Oh well, enjoy your last-last word, it's meaningless to me who says the last thing, sheesh, that's playground talk.

 

[DEMinSoCAL]

Great decision!

I got the Samsung 840 Pro 512GB — it runs super-fast in my 2012 15" MacBook Pro!
Installation was very, very easy.
Samsung has since replaced the 840 Pro with the 860 Pro. The Samsung Evo line is also good.

SSDs have become rather cheap these days - and the performance improvement you will experience is simply incredible.
Go! (And remember to do a clean install - no 'restore from a backup/TimeMachine'-stuff, please)

Do you mean the 850 PRO? I couldn't find anything about a 860 PRO.

 

[bk3318]

Lol typical, pathetic Apple fanboy comments in here. Isn't competition good so that Apple that step up its game and make the stuff you all like so much better? Core M processor in a Macbook and 1 Port, PATHETIC!!
[doublepost=1460124446][/doublepost]

I'm confused as hell about what you are saying. USB C is USB C. The USB C port on the Apple Macbook is the same USB C port used on the Dell XPS 13 and XPS 15, and the same USB C port used on this HP Spectre.

How is Apple's USB C port "smoother to plug it into devices"???

No point arguing with a fanboy like this guy. "I wish they would have used the design of apple for usb type c. Its much smoother to plug it into devices."

One of the most ignorant comments I have read on this forum.

 

[GeneralChang]

Who's going to clean all that blood up once the bleeding edge has sliced its way through endless victims of early adoption syndrome? Apple. They come along, clean up the mess, hold onto the bits that are left which are worthwhile, whilst the casualties are slid into coffins, nailed up and dumped into the grounds of impatience, to begin their gradual decay into the soil of irrelevant gimmickry.

That metaphor though.

 

[lowkey]

I have a 2009 MacBook Pro which I haven't upgraded yet mostly because the options are poor. Over the last several months, as I have been reading up on options, I have heard from many others that are contemplating leaving Apple.

The fact you're on a 7 year old laptop is a credit to Apple. But the current MacBook Pro (or any refurb from 2013 onwards) is a massive improvement over the 2009 model.

Lighter, thinner, better CPU, faster ram, SSD better screen, better track pad.

I don't think the current model is worth upgrading to from a 2013 model personally and really hope the next update is a significant re design. But definitely from any model with the CD burner...those things are bricks

 

[147798]

The fact you're on a 7 year old laptop is a credit to Apple. But the current MacBook Pro (or any refurb from 2013 onwards) is a massive improvement over the 2009 model.

Agree 100% on that! This has been really great.

 

[uid15]

That metaphor though.

Yeah I know - a bit gory for me, I can't stand anything gory - maybe I'll refine it and do better next time, but I think it conveyed the point, LOL.
[doublepost=1460126548][/doublepost]

Lol typical, pathetic Apple fanboy comments in here. Isn't competition good so that Apple that step up its game and make the stuff you all like so much better? Core M processor in a Macbook and 1 Port, PATHETIC!!
[doublepost=1460124446][/doublepost]

No point arguing with a fanboy like this guy. "I wish they would have used the design of apple for usb type c. Its much smoother to plug it into devices."

One of the most ignorant comments I have read on this forum.

Predictable, "anti-fanboy" text book reaction, no surprise. Take a sedative, or some herbal tea, no one is angry with you, but you seem angry with everyone.

Why DO many people who dislike Apple products, tend to have this air of aggression about them - an inner jealousy that they're too insecure to face up to? I think they feel threatened by what they don't understand, as is often the case in life, and cannot see a way to calmly process and rationalise things, so explode in a fit of perceived rage or contempt. Chill out, no one hates you, and no one minds what you use.

 

[spinedoc77]

Argue what you like, poor ergonomics is poor ergonomics. You'll forgive me if I take the path of common sense and listen to Apple over you - they're kinda king of input methods, what with them perfecting the mouse and Trackpad, and defining the smartphone. Yeah, sorry, but I'll listen to them and see if it ciicks with instinctive common sense, and it does.

Any sensible person can see that having touch for the sake of it is a poor design.

Oh I completely agree, poor ergonomics is poor ergonomics. Stretching out your arms 3 feet to use your laptop, hovering your arms out in space to use the touchscreen, these things just don't seem like "common sense", and I don't think even Apple is telling you to do those things. You are trying to make using a laptop seem like using a desktop, where a desktop has a larger screen and due to that and a detached keyboard is usually farther away from the person. A laptop by definition will be close if you are using the keyboard, close enough to not have to hover your arm to use as you imply. Additionally there are other use case scenarios which make the touchscreen superior to the trackpad, such as being in cramped quarters like an airline seat, or having the laptop on your lap (who would have thought).


FYI as Apple users say "you're holding it wrong"

"Having touch for the sake of it" is just a nonsense statement, you can say that about anything. "Having a trackpad for the sake of it" for example sounds equally inane. No, a touchscreen serves a purpose. It may not serve YOUR purpose, but you shouldn't pigeon hole the entire laptop using world because you don't see any utility in it.