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Huawei's Founder Says He Would 'Protest' if China Retaliates Against Apple Over U.S. Trade Ban
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Silly Americans
China has been banning American tech companies in the name of 'national security' for the past forever. US did not retaliate on the ban of Google or Facebook or Amazon. The US didn't retaliate because 2 reasons: 1. US - China import/export/manufacturing relations were too important to jeopardize. 2. The US government upholds the notion a country has the right to protect themselves in the name of national security (I'm not going to go over issues in the Middle East etc etc that's a very different animal compared to US-China relations).
US should have banned Huawei when China banned American tech companies but didn't due to above reasons. China has been taking advantage over different countries and companies for a very long time few examples are: the tech that companies bring into China to use for mass production tools (and other means to produce tech goods) turns into Chinese asset when they are done with it (its their law). You ever hear why Trump keep saying that China must stop stealing tech? This is one of MANY tactics they use to acquire other country's R&D for free. It goes beyond stealing trade secrets from within like Qualcomm, Microsoft, Dell, and other American tech companies and also not paying for royalties or going through proper licensing procedures to using other companies' tech among others. Not only this, the Chinese government provides rewards and even cash payouts for people/organizations to bring secrets or company plans/blueprints/R&D to the Chinese government. They are rewarded and therefore this type of practice is encouraged.
China has been and still riding on the fact that they mass produce for the world and using this not as negotiation piece but rather a weapon to coerce companies and countries to follow their way or else the supply line would be destroyed. What can companies do but to listen when their profits are going to be effected. Not to mention there are heavy sacrifices companies must make in order to have their goods produced in China and not only stealing assets but unfair trade agreement that favours China heavily. This is what initially got Trump to start the trade war due to the unfairness that China has been practicing for a very long time.
Samsung knew this would happen and moved most of their manufacturing to Vietnam where no such ridiculous laws exist and have been doing it for the last 5 years. It took them 10 years in total to set up in Vietnam so they have the production power as similar to China. Foxconn is also about to leave among many other companies because of this coercion and relentless stealing and unfair bargaining chips for China when international supply chains are concerned.
This goes deeper than just Huawei and America. The US has had enough and are now just pushing back when an alternative approach should have been a backup plan since the 70s but nothing happened as China was not seen as a threat like how they saw the Soviet Union way back in history. This pushback should have happened several decades ago and now it is happening and what the US is doing is they are slowly finding equilibrium in power balance between them and China. China wants to be the number 1 super power and that is their objective and will try as long as they have the coercion powers (manufacturing advantage) and will die trying. If this happens the US will no longer be the super power and the dollar will be deemed worthless and must bow to China's demands and coercion. Seeing this happening in the next 50 years if nothing is done about it is a high probability.
The hypocrisy is this, when China banned all the American tech companies it was because of their national security and was accepted by the US. But when US does it to 1 of their companies all hell breaks loose and suddenly America is a tyrant, a bully, an unfair trading partner and China is a victim. US is banning Huawei (for the most part) because of national security same reason as China when they banned Google. This is 1 to 1 fairness and SHOULD be this way. American is just looking after its security and China must accept and back away without taking a shot at Apple (???? how does this make sense).
Samsung has far superior 5G technology than Huawei and the reason Huawei is known for being the global distributor for 5G is because they are significantly cheaper (due to lower tech, government subsidies, and to be competitive) and they force other countries to use (in some cases) by threatening their import/export operations just like how Huawei "demanded" South Korea to use their 5G network and if they don't they will stop importing from them. Yes this actually happened please look it up. This type of thing is sadly extremely common in the Chinese government as a strategy. Irony is that South Korea is practically number 1 in terms of networking tech, internet speeds, and 5G in the world but the Chinese government is still trying to coerce them by threatening Korea's export business.
Samsung right now is in talks with American companies and the government to bring about them the 5G infrastructure. This is million miles better since Samsung is not owned and subsidized by the Korean government there is far lower risk of espionage. For those who don't know, Huawei is essentially owned and dictated by the Chinese government so all the data they obtain can and will be used by their government. Imagine that? All of US military security networking equipment can be spied on and remotely controlled by the Chinese at desperate times? America will not come out on top.
Want to be patriotic this is the right time to do so if you don't want America to become a foot stool for China starting early as 2050. The Chinese media and government can victimize themselves and try to draw sympathy all they want but their plans are incredibly transparent that in the long term they want to overthrow the US and become the sole and leading super power. A country that steals, use coercion as a tactic, invade weaker nations (still doing this look it up), bring no aid or relief programs for other countries...this is a terrifying country to hold the number one global position don't you think?
China needs to be dismantled in terms of their bargaining and coercion power just a little bit. This NEEDS to happen right now. This is a good thing.
China has been banning American tech companies in the name of 'national security' for the past forever. US did not retaliate on the ban of Google or Facebook or Amazon. The US didn't retaliate because 2 reasons: 1. US - China import/export/manufacturing relations were too important to jeopardize. 2. The US government upholds the notion a country has the right to protect themselves in the name of national security (I'm not going to go over issues in the Middle East etc etc that's a very different animal compared to US-China relations).
US should have banned Huawei when China banned American tech companies but didn't due to above reasons. China has been taking advantage over different countries and companies for a very long time few examples are: the tech that companies bring into China to use for mass production tools (and other means to produce tech goods) turns into Chinese asset when they are done with it (its their law). You ever hear why Trump keep saying that China must stop stealing tech? This is one of MANY tactics they use to acquire other country's R&D for free. It goes beyond stealing trade secrets from within like Qualcomm, Microsoft, Dell, and other American tech companies and also not paying for royalties or going through proper licensing procedures to using other companies' tech among others. Not only this, the Chinese government provides rewards and even cash payouts for people/organizations to bring secrets or company plans/blueprints/R&D to the Chinese government. They are rewarded and therefore this type of practice is encouraged.
China has been and still riding on the fact that they mass produce for the world and using this not as negotiation piece but rather a weapon to coerce companies and countries to follow their way or else the supply line would be destroyed. What can companies do but to listen when their profits are going to be effected. Not to mention there are heavy sacrifices companies must make in order to have their goods produced in China and not only stealing assets but unfair trade agreement that favours China heavily. This is what initially got Trump to start the trade war due to the unfairness that China has been practicing for a very long time.
Samsung knew this would happen and moved most of their manufacturing to Vietnam where no such ridiculous laws exist and have been doing it for the last 5 years. It took them 10 years in total to set up in Vietnam so they have the production power as similar to China. Foxconn is also about to leave among many other companies because of this coercion and relentless stealing and unfair bargaining chips for China when international supply chains are concerned.
This goes deeper than just Huawei and America. The US has had enough and are now just pushing back when an alternative approach should have been a backup plan since the 70s but nothing happened as China was not seen as a threat like how they saw the Soviet Union way back in history. This pushback should have happened several decades ago and now it is happening and what the US is doing is they are slowly finding equilibrium in power balance between them and China. China wants to be the number 1 super power and that is their objective and will try as long as they have the coercion powers (manufacturing advantage) and will die trying. If this happens the US will no longer be the super power and the dollar will be deemed worthless and must bow to China's demands and coercion. Seeing this happening in the next 50 years if nothing is done about it is a high probability.
The hypocrisy is this, when China banned all the American tech companies it was because of their national security and was accepted by the US. But when US does it to 1 of their companies all hell breaks loose and suddenly America is a tyrant, a bully, an unfair trading partner and China is a victim. US is banning Huawei (for the most part) because of national security same reason as China when they banned Google. This is 1 to 1 fairness and SHOULD be this way. American is just looking after its security and China must accept and back away without taking a shot at Apple (???? how does this make sense).
Samsung has far superior 5G technology than Huawei and the reason Huawei is known for being the global distributor for 5G is because they are significantly cheaper (due to lower tech, government subsidies, and to be competitive) and they force other countries to use (in some cases) by threatening their import/export operations just like how Huawei "demanded" South Korea to use their 5G network and if they don't they will stop importing from them. Yes this actually happened please look it up. This type of thing is sadly extremely common in the Chinese government as a strategy. Irony is that South Korea is practically number 1 in terms of networking tech, internet speeds, and 5G in the world but the Chinese government is still trying to coerce them by threatening Korea's export business.
Samsung right now is in talks with American companies and the government to bring about them the 5G infrastructure. This is million miles better since Samsung is not owned and subsidized by the Korean government there is far lower risk of espionage. For those who don't know, Huawei is essentially owned and dictated by the Chinese government so all the data they obtain can and will be used by their government. Imagine that? All of US military security networking equipment can be spied on and remotely controlled by the Chinese at desperate times? America will not come out on top.
Want to be patriotic this is the right time to do so if you don't want America to become a foot stool for China starting early as 2050. The Chinese media and government can victimize themselves and try to draw sympathy all they want but their plans are incredibly transparent that in the long term they want to overthrow the US and become the sole and leading super power. A country that steals, use coercion as a tactic, invade weaker nations (still doing this look it up), bring no aid or relief programs for other countries...this is a terrifying country to hold the number one global position don't you think?
China needs to be dismantled in terms of their bargaining and coercion power just a little bit. This NEEDS to happen right now. This is a good thing.
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Oh yeah because Apple has a periscope lens in their phone, we can tell Huawei stole it
So ****ing ridiculous, stop riding Apple’s ass and realise they’re not always leading the way
Give credit where credit is due. It's either using Israeli CorePhotonics camera module IP or reverse engineered from it.
http://corephotonics.com/inventions/tele-camera-optics/
The irony of your post is that I would pay $3k for an iPhone if it were entirely made in the USA. And no, I'm not joking.
[doublepost=1559000908][/doublepost]
Who said anything about working for $2 per hour? - You're incorrectly assuming that I want an American-made iPhone made with cheap labor.
[doublepost=1559000994][/doublepost]
You are not allowed to be pro-USA these days and heaven forbid you say something negative about China.
If you think I'm expecting Apple to move iPhone production to the US because of these tariffs, you are more delusional.
[doublepost=1559001465][/doublepost]
lol I don't care who's to blame. How is that relevant?
Let's assume that Apple and other big companies are to blame. What does that have to do with wanting more manufacturing jobs from China to come to US?
But as Steve Jobs of Apple spoke, Obama interrupted with an inquiry of his own: What would it take to make iPhones in the United States? Not long ago, Apple boasted that its products were made in America. Today, few are. Almost all of the 70 million iPhones, 30 million iPads and 59 million other products Apple sold last year were manufactured overseas.
Why can’t that work come home? Obama asked.
Jobs’ reply was unambiguous. “Those jobs aren’t coming back,” he said, according to another dinner guest.
The president’s question touched upon a central conviction at Apple. It isn’t just that workers are cheaper abroad. Rather, Apple’s executives believe the vast scale of overseas factories as well as the flexibility, diligence and industrial skills of foreign workers have so outpaced their U.S. counterparts that “Made in the USA” is no longer a viable option for most Apple products.
https://www.heraldtribune.com/article/LK/20120123/News/605191697/SH/
I think that every American President of the last 50 years wanted those jobs here. But business saw a problem or they felt greed and we have what we have now.
Why can’t that work come home? Obama asked.
Jobs’ reply was unambiguous. “Those jobs aren’t coming back,” he said, according to another dinner guest.
The president’s question touched upon a central conviction at Apple. It isn’t just that workers are cheaper abroad. Rather, Apple’s executives believe the vast scale of overseas factories as well as the flexibility, diligence and industrial skills of foreign workers have so outpaced their U.S. counterparts that “Made in the USA” is no longer a viable option for most Apple products.
https://www.heraldtribune.com/article/LK/20120123/News/605191697/SH/
I think that every American President of the last 50 years wanted those jobs here. But business saw a problem or they felt greed and we have what we have now.
Again, I don't care who shipped the jobs or why. That's irrelevant. Obviously companies profit from cheap labor.
I want those jobs back in the US. Tariffs can discourage shipping of jobs abroad.
This makes sense. But I don't see why it couldn't be fixed. Of course it wouldn't happen overnight. Slow and steady wins the race.
US is outpaced in many areas, including infrastructure. So many countries nowadays make US bridges, highways, and rail systems look prehistoric. Same applies to housing, malls, and other buildings.
Yes if we focus on making the pie bigger instead of wasting resources fighting for a bigger cut of it.
short answer: stem graduates, asian countries like china have 4x the stem graduates, such as physics, science, engineering, chem. than the u.s. here in the states we focus alot on the virtue of things and freedom of individualism, not necessary a bad thing, but that produced alot of liberal arts degrees and non tech related grads like business or law school. where in china its heavily focused STEM.
If there was no China, how could we get these technology ready to be sold.
Take care usa, if china get pissed off you’ll run into a dead end. Without these countries you’ll never be able to satisfy the worlds tech demand. Btw. as if USA doesn’t do the same. Industry espionage is common in all countries around the world. But finger pointing is easier.
Wow, what a compliment.
"Apple is my teacher -- it's advancing in front of us. As a student, why should I oppose my teacher? I would never do that."
Shame the PoTUS isn't as gracious and kind.
"Apple is my teacher -- it's advancing in front of us. As a student, why should I oppose my teacher? I would never do that."
Shame the PoTUS isn't as gracious and kind.
It isn’t industry espionage in China. It is a law that says that someone from the Chinese government gets to copy everything off the company server whenever they want. Espionage is hidden. This isn’t hidden. Being required to hand over data like that is a law that the US would like changed. And apparently the initial negotiators of the trade deal agreed that China should end this practice.
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Manufacturing is getting automated. Those jobs ain’t coming back and they won’t be in China for very long either.
Let me agree first of all to most of your response...
I will add the following:
* You NEVER TRUST ANYTHING A *** COMMUNIST *** SAYS. PERIOD.
* Huawei is run by china govt. If you don't believe that, then you are just ignorant. Don't come back and ask for "evidence"; same as if you need "evidence" NSA has hacking/spying tools available.
* China is after the $$$$ - nothing more. Therefore they only care for the welfare of their own people as long as the $$$$ keeps rolling in. They will not harm their partners as long as they have the "upper hand" in the deal. China is all about money and that's about sums it up. Anything that affects their wealth, they will change.
* The current president appointed himself dictator forever. Changed the rules so he can govern
perpetually. That says alot about how China does business.
* Apple is not technologically superior to anything Huawei currently has. Don't pretend that Apple is dominant in china because they aren't. It is true if manufacturing goes away from china, China's $ bottom-line gets affected.
* Look up solar energy deals that china has ripped off amercian inventors backs, businesses that failed in china because they believed they were getting fair contract deals until they realized everything was just stolen from them and sold back to the USA. Look up Africa. Look at the "investments" made by China in africa. How about networking hardware given for "free" to nations of Africa? Do some homework and you will see how China operates.
All this "talk" is typical chinese ying-yang BS because he really thinks apple is his "teacher". Nonsense - Huawei is a copy-cat and there is no doubt they also stole IP/tech from apple and everyone else who has contracts within china. The worse is Boeing who's airplane designs is being stolen by greedy treasonous/international employees. All for a buck or two and passing IP to China so they can build their fleet of planes to sell. Boeing is also run by bean counters who just look at $ oppurtunities in china and fail to realize you are working with a real smart business sharks over there. China will never let you get an advantage in a deal if they do not have the upper-hand.
I cannot even begin to express the anger I have for americans that rally against the white house/USA and side with Huawei as if they are a "victim". There is so much more behind the scenes you do not hear or see because MSM doesn't show you or care to steer your minds in that direction. There are years and years of IP theft from china and nothing was ever done about it until now. I don't have to love trump but I can't argue he is the only one that is doing what presidents a decade ago should've done but didn't because they had their greedy arse $ agendas as well.
You do not F with China now because they have so much more wealth but you don't be stupid and do nothing and those that are siding with this Chinese company, you are dumber than a bag of rocks.
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Asian countries especially China have better STEM education than any other country bar none. They just have that drive to survive - success is another story when you are competing against a billion or so other chinese STEM driven students. Their instinct to survive is just crazy...it's the culture and you can't compare that to the USA at all.
But the USA is superior in free thinking. Chinese students do not learn anything they aren't taught directly. Sure they can build anything you give them a schematic to but their minds do not work like americans because they aren't free. Too strict of education and too little freedom to explore. It' snot to say there isn't any great innovations from china because that would be stupid to say after all they have billions of people and talent is everywhere.
The point is with all this technology who the F cares because at the end of the day if you decide to shut off your smartphone - nothing would exist. These apps, internet, nothing. It's not as if you can't do your business without the internet (it is getting far harder that is for sure) - but life isn't about all these gadgets because look at social media nowadays a complete waste of life. Everyone so vain and narcissistic with the "look at me" attitude trying to one-up one another. Competing against who has the better life/material things. Terrible, just terrible.
even when they have so much talent over in china, they are always competing for that ONE SPOT. Failure is not an option or it's back to working 12 hour shifts at the local boba-tea shop.
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You do realize that in America and Israel if they ask you to give them your password for your smartphone,tablet or laptop at the border you are required to give them your password and allow them to copy all of your data don’t you..?
Also, in the US the government can get a search warrant and raid facilities of a company at any times and go through your computers and records. They just need a valid reason to do so. Those places that grow marijuana these days need to install security cameras that the government has access to and can monitor as well. I agree.. China is not perfect and no angel but neither is the US.
There are other countries that have similar policies in place and we consider them good allies.
First of all — Huawei is a larger company than Apple. Huawei sells more phones than Apple and this only makes up half of their revenue. And only 17% of Apple's business is in China. For Huawei the number is around 50%.
Between those two companies, even ignoring politics, Huawei is clearly far more more important to the Chinese economy.
Also, Apple is clearly a target. I'm pretty sure there are only two US companies that do billions of dollars worth of of business in China — and the other one is Boeing. Which do you think China would rather mess with? Their transport infrastructure or fancy consumer electronics?
Keep in mind Airbus does not have enough manufacturing capacity to replace Boeing in China. There are dozens of companies chomping at the bit to replace the iPhone — especially Huawei who are about to find themselves unable to compete in western markets where customers expect to buy apps on Google's store.
iPhone changed mobile internet, from data plans to which connected apps we use everyday. Sure Blackberry has emails...
