iFixit Lauds Apple's New Self Service Repair Program, Calls It a 'Remarkable Concession'

[Aoligei]

1. remember to back-up or use iCloud. board level is not easy, and no benefit to repair unless for the valuable data inside. board level repairs always take shortcut and it will never as complete as the new one.

2. you don't understand the display screen component. you think you get cheap alternative, but in fact you purchased lower grade glass. Please do your google to understand what is the glass replacement for your phone OLED/LCD screen. For the battery replace, aside from lower grade battery pack, workmanship & repair job liability is the main cost.

1. I don’t want back up to iCloud, because I don’t want iCloud backup eat up my iCloud storage. Even if you backup everyday, there are chances you still have some valuable data didn’t get backup.

2. Lots of people who choose board level repair are desperate for their data. It never meant to be same as new one.

3. I understand there are different tire of screen. But if I have an iPhone 8, it makes no sense to spend 200 plus Canadian Dollars for screen replacement when the phone itself worth less than this. I rather take crappy screen so the phone function probably. This also true for older generation iPhone, like iPhone X.

 

[Xiaojohn]

1. I don’t want back up to iCloud, because I don’t want iCloud backup eat up my iCloud storage. Even if you backup everyday, there are chances you still have some valuable data didn’t get backup.

2. Lots of people who choose board level repair are desperate for their data. It never meant to be same as new one.

3. I understand there are different tire of screen. But if I have an iPhone 8, it makes no sense to spend 200 plus Canadian Dollars for screen replacement when the phone itself worth less than this. I rather take crappy screen so the phone function probably. This also true for older generation iPhone, like iPhone X.

1/ not true, iCloud is sync solution across devices, it will back-up all your data. probably you misunderstood the iCloud & what is the backup about. but nothing wrong if you don't like to use iCloud.

2/ the logic behind & the education is important, but still remember to back up either in your PC or external HDD.

3/ there are many third-party solution for it. but it is weird to ask an original manufacturer to consider this solutions. they built the product with the parts and you can fix/modify it as what you like without their permission. but no point to blame Apple on this.

 

[spazzcat]

No ones telling you to fix your phone. Weak point.

I have fixed several iPhones and the average person will try and fail they are not the easiest thing to fix.

 

[kingtj1971]

I thought he was famously pro-counterfeit goods... I just don't understand the cult around this guy...

Yeah... I've said it several times before. Not a fan of Rossman at all, myself. From the start, I got the impression the guy was just an attention-seeker, looking for some YouTube fame, vs just focusing on doing the best job he could at providing repair service for machines. (I mean, the guy was setting up outdoor tables on the street and "teaching" repair to passers-by. What serious repair shop engages in any of that? It's not a tech school....)

The one time I gave him a chance at fixing a practically new, high-end Macbook Pro with water damage, he utterly dropped the ball. Had to call in multiple times to find out why it hadn't been worked on yet and got a list of excuses (which might have been perfectly valid -- but it's the lack of proactive communication that was the real problem). Ultimately, I'm told they can't do the repair on it and they suggest they "might have another working, comparable notebook to swap me" ... but that never materialized either. Eventually, I just had to ask for the broken Mac to be shipped back to me again. Dropped it off at the local Apple Store after that where it was fully repaired for me in a week's time. (They noted that someone had "messed around" with the main board though, with evidence of some soldering that had gone on. So in other words, Rossman actually TRIED to do something to repair it and failed.)

He emailed me a 2 page long email ranting about Apple's poor engineering design on the board though.... Again, probably not wrong, but it's hard to care about his analysis when he proved to be unable to repair the machine.

 

[TOM1211]

So does this mean if you can get the free battery replacement I can just have it sent haven’t got round to going in yet

 

[l.a.rossmann]

He’s a businessman selling second rate repairs for a high fee.

I always ask the question: would you get surgery done by a YouTube doctor who complains loudly about the competition being expensive and unfair?

We have a higher google places & yelp rating than our local Apple store, provide longer warranty coverage on many repairs than the Apple store, and have zero logged complaints for over 9 years on the department of consumer affairs website for our public-facing business license number. Further, we demonstrate how we do everything for free, so you can judge whether the reputation we have is earned or based on fluff.

Our reputation, ratings, and licensing status is based on the quality of our work. Your post insulting the quality of work our team does here is based on nothing.

 

[l.a.rossmann]

Stop speaking like fighting for consumers! It is only benefit the repair shop, not consumers.

Every piece of consumer electronics Right to Repair legislation that I have supported has made no distinction between the repair shop and the consumer. There have been drafts that leave out the consumer, and only make parts available to those with business licenses. I have not supported these bills, publicly or privately, nor have I ever supported any such compromise legislation that makes this a requirement.

If it's made available to me, it should be made available to you. Fair is fair. In each bill I testify in favor of, or lobby on behalf of, I ask they make available to consumers the same that is made available to me. I do not advocate for a world where I am able to buy a manual/schematic/part/tool/chip as a repair shop that you cannot buy as an end user of that device.

For my own business, I do the same. The parts I use I make available, and the knowledge I have I make available, via repair.wiki, 600+ educational videos, or our 150+ page instructional guide on board repair.

 

[l.a.rossmann]

Note the people standing up for this right loudly are independent repairers who were on the brink of losing their business, not consumers as a whole.

Do note that when Right to Repair went to a vote in MA, it won - 2,599,182 yes to 867,674 no. These were consumers voting, as I imagine there are not 2.5 million independent repair technicians who all voted in this election.

Here's something interesting. That ballot initiative did NOT make parts available to the consumer - you had to be a business/repair shop to get access. And consumers still voted in favor of it by a landslide!

Imagine the popularity of a Right to Repair where consumers are included alongside technicians as people who get access to manuals, parts, and tools?

Every one of our customers who has paid 20% what the manufacturer said would be necessary to spend, and got their repair back in a day or two instead of two weeks is someone who is benefitted by Right to Repair. But, even when the bill is written in a manner that solely targets repair shops and not consumers, consumers as a whole stood up. Loudly. In large numbers.

We do not need to speculate here, there is actual hard data & evidence to prove who is standing up for this issue & in what numbers.

 

[l.a.rossmann]

(I mean, the guy was setting up outdoor tables on the street and "teaching" repair to passers-by. What serious repair shop engages in any of that? It's not a tech school....)

I would love to see a citation for this. I have not done this; but it sounds like a great idea. I do have 4 tables in my office with stations where people can, when I schedule workshops, come by for free and try their hand at fixing their own stuff, with supervision and help if they mess up. These workshops are done in my office though, not on the street, since I have no method to plug a soldering iron into the pavement, and getting hit by a car in Manhattan traffic while looking into a microscope isn't my idea of a good time.

Let's go over what's making you mad though... Are you implying that teaching people who want to fix things how to fix things for free is... BAD? As in, if I did what I do in my office outside, that would be bad?

How? Why? What is wrong with teaching people how to fix something for free? In what world is this a bad thing? I love what I do - and I had to figure out most of it on my own. I want to share the fun of doing what I do with the world, because that's what it is. Fun. Seeing a fan spin. Seeing an Apple logo on something that was dead. Best feeling on Earth, and who wouldn't want to share that with as many people as possible?

From the start, I got the impression the guy was just an attention-seeker, looking for some YouTube fame, vs just focusing on doing the best job he could at providing repair service for machines.

The first video I did criticizing Apple's policies was in 2013 - I had about 20 subscribers and the video got 3 views. Done from an android phone, no script, no editing. Can you with a straight face say that this is a plan to get famous, vs. share one's ideas/rants on youtube? If your plan was to get famous, this is the first thing you'd do? Really?

You seem mad that people agree with my points - and I get that, but stop making things up.

 

[jakeuten]

@Xiaojohn You're being quite dishonest about the implications of this. I am a third party technician based in the United States. Currently for iPhone 12 you can get incell, hard OLED, soft OLED, and OEM refurb / pull. The amount of shops around the US using incell LCD based screens on iPhone X, Xs, Xs Max, 11 Pro, and 12 is in my opinion completely wrong. Very rarely are you getting a "good" soft OLED or OEM refurb for a good price unless you're stopping at a very reputable store. Being able to know you'll get the parts, manual, and any programming tools needed is a step in the right direction.

 

[scaramoosh]

It's only worthwhile if their stuff is easy to repair, but it's not and so I just opt to buying a new one. I do not bother even selling stuff anymore as so many scammers on eBay have put me off that for life. I would never buy a used or repaired product as I've had nothing but bad experiences there too, people lie and do bad repair jobs.

I would find it far more compelling if Apple were just more friendly with their customer service. If I buy a £3000 MacBook, how about offering a 3 year warranty at the very least? How about making repairs through Apple being priced so it makes economic sense?

This doesn't solve a problem for me, and the other thing I want is the ability to send my products to Apple to get upgraded. I want to buy a 16GB MacBook now, and have the option to upgrade to 32GB if I need it.

As for repairs? If a new back to my iPhone is £500 or whatever it is, why would I bother? Why would I send it to a random repair guy who will do a bad job? Cause they always do.

 

[Nicole1980]

Just speaking the truth.

I have done my fair share of independent repairs myself for people. And a lot of them were repairing things other independent repairers has entirely shafted.

It was fun trying to open that Sony android phone the repairer had used two part epoxy on and the screen was bent and so low quality that half of it stopped working after a week.

Your truth. Not necessarily any objective truth

 

[taotien]

Your truth. Not necessarily any objective truth

Read a dictionary. Truth means fact. Someone can claim to speak the truth. There is no such thing as subjective truth; the definition of truth only allows it to be objective. If their claim is false, then what they have said is untrue. There is no subjectivity, nor degree of objectivity other than 100%.

Now, if you want to claim they are lying, then make an attempt to prove it by bringing to the table facts you claim to be true. As it stands, the claims they are making are more believable as they have provided compelling reasons, by explaining details that can be easily proven (if privacy is of no matter). You, however, are implying they are lying, with simply the incorrect usage of the word "truth". If you cannot prove your statement, you are lying. That is the correct word to use here. I'm not saying they aren't lying, but there's no explanation as to why they would, or have any reason to, be lying.

Explain to everyone here why that would convince anybody.

Edit: grammar, and to further clarify

 

[HughRR]

Your truth. Not necessarily any objective truth

I would on the basis of my engineering background, particularly designing bits of things that tend to get put places where you can’t possibly fix them, suggest that my objectivity is perfectly sound on this matter thanks.

The rationale, broken down for the weary types who bought the hype on right to repair is simply:

The only reason right to repair is popular is because someone said it is to be.

Objectivity here is solving the real problems which are low quality disposable items, lack of environmental concern once a product is sold and poor consumer regulation. Make the manufacturer support the product properly through its entire lifecycle and if that’s too short punish them. That’s all.

If you fix those we end up with a better outcome for the consumers and the planet.

The box of shame at work is a fine example of that. Over 100 android handsets that are under two years old which are either broken and not possible to repair, compromised or the software is abandoned by the manufacturer.

On that basis I don’t give a monkeys ass what independent repairers say nor the utterances of the rabid hordes of mindless zombies chanting their unconditional support for a self sacrificing ideology. Aka you.

 

[taotien]

I would on the basis of my engineering background, particularly designing bits of things that tend to get put places where you can’t possibly fix them, suggest that my objectivity is perfectly sound on this matter thanks.

The rationale, broken down for the weary types who bought the hype on right to repair is simply:

The only reason right to repair is popular is because someone said it is to be.

Objectivity here is solving the real problems which are low quality disposable items, lack of environmental concern once a product is sold and poor consumer regulation. Make the manufacturer support the product properly through its entire lifecycle and if that’s too short punish them. That’s all.

If you fix those we end up with a better outcome for the consumers and the planet.

The box of shame at work is a fine example of that. Over 100 android handsets that are under two years old which are either broken and not possible to repair, compromised or the software is abandoned by the manufacturer.

On that basis I don’t give a monkeys ass what independent repairers say nor the utterances of the rabid hordes of mindless zombies chanting their unconditional support for a self sacrificing ideology. Aka you.

Honestly, I support it for the slight amount of momentum it is giving towards educating consumers to demand these products be better designed, and demand for access to parts (not even in requiring parts be further manufactured, but rather those that are manufactured not be monopolized).

It's kind of a chicken and egg thing, where consumers don't know they want better stuff until better stuff is made available cheaply, and companies won't make better stuff because it's not demanded and costly for shareholders.

Fortunately, knowledge is free. Unfortunately, the other side also knows this and will try to pollute the knowledge pool. We as consumers of knowledge need to learn what's right and what's wrong, think for ourselves and others, and not blindly follow what some random guy like me says online.

 

[l.a.rossmann]

I would on the basis of my engineering background, particularly designing bits of things that tend to get put places where you can’t possibly fix them, suggest that my objectivity is perfectly sound on this matter thanks.

Engineering background or not doesn't change that anecdotal experience isn't objective truth, simply your anecdotal experience. You saw devices people messed up. That's great. Cool story.

The rationale, broken down for the weary types who bought the hype on right to repair is simply:

The only reason right to repair is popular is because someone said it is to be.

It is popular because people wish to choose who repairs their device. When a manufacturer gives someone a $1200 bill to repair a $1599 product, and someone else says $250 and gets it done in half the time, that does tend to make the issue popular. You can tell people something is popular until you're blue in the face, it doesn't result in landslide votes in favor of a particular piece of legislation unless it actually is popular.

Objectivity here is solving the real problems which are low quality disposable items, lack of environmental concern once a product is sold and poor consumer regulation. Make the manufacturer support the product properly through its entire lifecycle and if that’s too short punish them. That’s all.

This is hardly a full solution. The manufacturer "supports" the device through its lifecycle right now, with repairs that often cost 75%-90% the resale value of the device. Extending the timeframe of the unviable option isn't the solution.

On that basis I don’t give a monkeys ass what independent repairers say nor the utterances of the rabid hordes of mindless zombies chanting their unconditional support for a self sacrificing ideology. Aka you.

Of course you don't, because I pointed out why your post was slanderous nonsense without citation. It is of no surprise that you ignore my points, while focusing on the low hanging fruit of what Nicole had to say. It's also of no surprise that you finish your post off with nonsensical insults while calling the ability to repair what you own a "self sacrificing ideology."

What is being self sacrificed when someone fixes their own stuff? Who knows, but you're an engineer for things that get put places, so I guess we don't have to ask.

 

[IllinoisCorn]

Do note that when Right to Repair went to a vote in MA, it won - 2,599,182 yes to 867,674 no. These were consumers voting, as I imagine there are not 2.5 million independent repair technicians who all voted in this election.

Here's something interesting. That ballot initiative did NOT make parts available to the consumer - you had to be a business/repair shop to get access. And consumers still voted in favor of it by a landslide!

Imagine the popularity of a Right to Repair where consumers are included alongside technicians as people who get access to manuals, parts, and tools?

Every one of our customers who has paid 20% what the manufacturer said would be necessary to spend, and got their repair back in a day or two instead of two weeks is someone who is benefitted by Right to Repair. But, even when the bill is written in a manner that solely targets repair shops and not consumers, consumers as a whole stood up. Loudly. In large numbers.

We do not need to speculate here, there is actual hard data & evidence to prove who is standing up for this issue & in what numbers.

I imagine MOST consumers have no desire to open their iPhones and never will. I get you have a business to run, but for most iPhone owners, this is a non-issue. It's certainly not the civil right it's being made out to be by Blue Checkmarks on Twitter or YouTube.

"Consumers stood up." Because they were passionate, or because they looked down at the ballot they were already there to mark, saw the title of the bill, and thought, "hmm....right to repair? who can be against THAT?? I'll vote for it!"?

That's like voting for a bill granting you the "RIGHT TO TASTY ICE CREAM!" Who's going to say no?

I'm happy Right to Repair people got what they want. Truly. Now we don't have to complain about this issue anymore.

 

[HughRR]

Hey Mr Rossman

when someone gets charged $1200 for a repair on a $1599 device that’s because of one of two things:

1. The end user didn’t have insurance cover when they broke it.

2. The crappy consumer protection laws didn’t protect them when it broke.

Your entire business runs on the basis that you get a 1 year warranty with most stuff in the US. This is the problem. You are only leveraging the niche of misfortune and lack of foresight of your customers.

And you make a lot of money out of it.

If you cared you’d be promoting better consumer protection laws but you’re only bolstering your industry Intentionally or otherwise.

I‘d like to throw in an epic rant about this all being a fault of rapid product cycles and six sigma driven anti waste metric driven initiatives run on shareholder income outcomes only but that’s another thread.

As for self sacrifice I speak for the folk who vastly overestimate their own capabilities for repairing things and end up with a dead phone, a dead screen and a bill for a new phone to boot. Because that’s the average person. Same as if you let me anywhere near plumbing.

Edit: just to prove this point I managed to pour a glass of water in a maxed out 15” retina MBP that was 2 months old once. That burned and I learned, the hard way. If the insurance had covered it any notion of repair would have been moot.

 

[Jubadub]

Read a dictionary. Truth means fact. Someone can claim to speak the truth. There is no such thing as subjective truth; the definition of truth only allows it to be objective. If their claim is false, then what they have said is untrue. There is no subjectivity, nor degree of objectivity other than 100%.

Now, if you want to claim they are lying, then make an attempt to prove it by bringing to the table facts you claim to be true. As it stands, the claims they are making are more believable as they have provided compelling reasons, by explaining details that can be easily proven (if privacy is of no matter). You, however, are implying they are lying, with simply the incorrect usage of the word "truth". If you cannot prove your statement, you are lying. That is the correct word to use here. I'm not saying they aren't lying, but there's no explanation as to why they would, or have any reason to, be lying.

Explain to everyone here why that would convince anybody.

Edit: grammar, and to further clarify

None of this addresses the point of Nicole's message, which is the demonstrable fact that @HughRR was wrong in his assertions which she quoted.

It's not like you lack the ability to parse her message. It's just that you chose to be pedantic over terminology without addressing the main discussion at hand. What is also true is that makes you absolutely pathetic.

 

[MowgliWolf]

Really good news! Obviously it’s also price dependent and the cynic in me reckons the parts will be more expensive than authorised repair programs but still. Now to get the same for MacBooks
I’d love to see that, with the possible inclusion of replaceable ssd or ssd expansion a la PS5, a man can dream lol

 

[Jubadub]

As for self sacrifice I speak for the folk who vastly overestimate their own capabilities for repairing things and end up with a dead phone, a dead screen and a bill for a new phone to boot. Because that’s the average person. Same as if you let me anywhere near plumbing.

"Because that’s the average person."

The average person takes his/her broken device to a repair shop for repair. With due legislation, such as Right to Repair legislation, which we still need even if Apple or any other company further embraces repair, there will be simultaneously more parts availability (which yields cheaper repairs) and less e-waste.

I would on the basis of my engineering background, particularly designing bits of things that tend to get put places where you can’t possibly fix them, suggest that my objectivity is perfectly sound on this matter thanks.

You having an engineering background does not automatically make you competent at it, nor does it imply you know everything there is to know about engineering, nor that you understand the full implications of Right to Repair legislation.

I, too, have a bachelor's degree at software engineering, am certified with pieces of paper that assert I'm very knowledgeable about 4 foreign languages besides my own mother tongue (English being among them), and have many years of experience in software development. That doesn't mean I'm automatically competent in any of those. So you bringing up your background in and of itself is no substitute for citations nor argumentation.

 

[l.a.rossmann]

Your entire business runs on the basis that you get a 1 year warranty with most stuff in the US. This is the problem. You are only leveraging the niche of misfortune and lack of foresight of your customers.

This is silly. Most of our business comes from accidental damage, and many people do not insure against accidental damage because insurance is often a poor option. You often get a used or refurbished device expensively with a long turnaround. Further, many of our repairs are on 4-7 year old devices, way outside even a 3 year warranty you are suggesting should be standard.

If you cared you’d be promoting better consumer protection laws but you’re only bolstering your industry Intentionally or otherwise.

There is no law I can think of that would fairly require a manufacturer to repair a product that a consumer dropped, spilled liquid into, stepped on, ran over with their car, or a device over 5 years old. The idea that I do not care about consumers or consumer protection law because I do not advocate for legislation that requires manufacturers to repair accidental damage by consumers is ridiculous on its face.

Your post asserts that if consumers do not have insurance and accidentally damage their product, there should be no option. Many of them disagree with you. That is why this is popular.

 

[sideshowuniqueuser]

Isn't this kind of contradictory though? If you can replace/repair wouldn't you be buying less products less often as a result?

It might seem that way, but no. Total cost of ownership has a big effect on people's purchasing decisions. Apple's greed makes me delay purchases for a long time, and simply hold onto older tech, or seek other brands. For example, I did buy some AirPods, but it will be the last time. I know these will become landfill when the batteries die, and that really annoys me. I also know I can buy some Sennheiser, over ear wireless headphones, with replaceable batteries, with much higher sound quality, much better noise isolation, that will last for many years, all for much cheaper than AirPods. The profit margin on AirPods must be insanely high. They got me once, but never again. However, if the batteries could be changed out, and they lasted for years, I'd consider another set down the track.

 

[Heat_Fan89]

Speaking as a former Mac Genius, this is awesome news, but people without electronic repair experience should be careful what they wish for. Fixing some of these mobile devices is very tricky, much more so than a Mac where the space to work is comparably "luxurious."

If you're not comfortable with nylon probe tools (spudger or what Apple calls a "black stick"), ZIF connectors, pentalobe screws and really small, fragile ribbon cables... have someone else fix your expensive Apple product for the same money. Much less headache.

Very true. This will only work if and when Apple decides to design and engineer their devices for easy repair. So I also agree with iFixit that it's a step in the right direction.

 

[l.a.rossmann]

I imagine MOST consumers have no desire to open their iPhones and never will.

Strawman of the point. It isn't about having a desire to open your device. It's about having the option/choice to have someone besides the manufacturer do the work - whether that is you, or someone else. You don't have to want to do it right now, to appreciate having the ability to do it.

"Consumers stood up." Because they were passionate, or because they looked down at the ballot they were already there to mark, saw the title of the bill, and thought, "hmm....right to repair? who can be against THAT?? I'll vote for it!"?

That's like voting for a bill granting you the "RIGHT TO TASTY ICE CREAM!" Who's going to say no?

It's not popular. But, if data and evidence proves it is, it's because the voters are stupid.

You're moving the goalposts man. If you dislike that this is an issue that people are for, that's fine, but going to these lengths to argue that people don't care about having the ability to choose who services what they own when the data disproves your argument is absurd. There was 25 million dollars spent on television ads to tell them why they shouldn't vote for it. They knew what they were voting for. You're grasping at straws here.

I'm happy Right to Repair people got what they want. Truly. Now we don't have to complain about this issue anymore.

It shouldn't offend you this much when people point out problems that affect them and provide the framework for basic solutions to them.