Intel Core 2 Duo Chips Announced

[Val-kyrie]

Core 3

Gee, talk about getting ahead of yourself.

Core 3 will be out before Vista is. I'm going to call it now.

Everybody, be my witness, Core 3 (any processor that goes beyond Core 2 because I don't know if they'll call it "Core 3") will be out before a consumer version of Vista is shipped.

You don't think Vista will be out before the revision to the Core 2 Duo due in Q1 2007 with the Santa Rosa chipset??? I bet Vista will ship by the time the Santa Rosa chipset is ready, especially because MS is suggesting Vista systems use harddrives or Mobos with flash RAM to speed up the boot process.

 

[Multimedia]

Core 3 Begins At The END Of 2008 And Reigns 2009-2010

Gee, talk about getting ahead of yourself.

Core 3 will be out before Vista is. I'm going to call it now.

Everybody, be my witness, Core 3 (any processor that goes beyond Core 2 because I don't know if they'll call it "Core 3") will be out before a consumer version of Vista is shipped.

Here's an example of a post based in fantasy instead of fact. Core 3 is a distinct next generation set of processors based on a 45nm manufacturing process that will not begin before LATE 2008 and reign all of 2009 and 2010. 🙄

We are your witness. And what we are witnessing is that you have not studied the Intel Roadmap at all.

You don't think Vista will be out before the revision to the Core 2 Duo due in Q1 2007 with the Santa Rosa chipset??? I bet Vista will ship by the time the Santa Rosa chipset is ready, especially because MS is suggesting Vista systems use harddrives or Mobos with flash RAM to speed up the boot process.

Vista ships early 2007 and way preceeds the Core 3 launch. 🙄

Core 2 is with us for the next two years, all of 2007 and most of 2008.🙂

 

[ChickenSwartz]

...The Merom chips will not be shipped until the end of Aug...

I don't think this is correct. The Merom chips were introduced last Thursday, but have been shipping for a while now, a month ahead of schedule.

Intel said that you could expect to see this chip in a laptop by the end of August. Does that mean custom built or in Best Buy (or wherever)?

It seems to me that if one was going to introduce a so called "Mac Pro" with the newest 64-bit processor, one would also choose introduce its mobile "Pro" counterpart.

 

[Val-kyrie]

I don't think this is correct. The Merom chips were introduced last Thursday, but have been shipping for a while now, a month ahead of schedule.

Intel said that you could expect to see this chip in a laptop by the end of August. Does that mean custom built or in Best Buy (or wherever)?

It seems to me that if one was going to introduce a so called "Mac Pro" with the newest 64-bit processor, one would also choose introduce its mobile "Pro" counterpart.

Perhaps I have overstated my case. Intel is shipping Merom chips, but laptops with Merom inside are not expected in retail channels until the end of August--perhaps because of limited supply?

 

[MacinDoc]

Vista ships early 2007 and way preceeds the Core 3 launch. 🙄

That is, Bill Gates has stated that there is an 80% chance that Vista will ship in early 2007, which, when multiplied by the 80% probability that his estimate is something smelly that comes out of the backside of a bull (and only 20% chance that it is actually true), gives a 16% chance that Vista will REALLY ship in early 2007. 😉

 

[macaddicted]

Perhaps I have overstated my case. Intel is shipping Merom chips, but laptops with Merom inside are not expected in retail channels until the end of August--perhaps because of limited supply?

I hope not. Visions of Motorola hauntingly return.

 

[Frobozz]

Gaming Rig

I've built a gaming PC around the Core 2 Duo E6700. I'd like to be able to install OS X on it, because the only reason why I'd ever use Windows is for the latest games. Here are the spec's, think this would run OS X nicely? ;-)

Intel 975XBX Motherboard
Intel Core 2 Duo E6700 (should overclock to around 3.2 to 3.5 GHz with my Zalman CNPS9500 AT air cooler)
ATI Crossfire x1900 (crossfire master card)
Sapphire ATI x1900xt (in crossfire)
1GB Crucial Ballistix DDR2 800 Memory
2 x 320GB Seagate Perpendicular Recording SATA2 HD's in RAID 1
Antec Trupower II 550 watt power supply
Antec P180 case in black

... keep in mind I am a diehard Mac fan, but I've always wanted to build a gaming rig since I'm a hardcore gamer. After all, I'm writing this entry on my MacBook Pro. Mmmmm.

 

[Eidorian]

I'd like to be able to install OS X on it, because the only reason why I'd ever use Windows is for the latest games. Here are the spec's, think this would run OS X nicely? ;-)

This is a joke...right?

 

[fastlane1588]

why not just upgrade a new macpro w/ ur hard drives and all that stuff, and then just bootcamp into windows....ud have a pretty sweet pc if the mac pros have all the goodies that people keep saying they will have

 

[gnasher729]

I've built a gaming PC around the Core 2 Duo E6700. I'd like to be able to install OS X on it, because the only reason why I'd ever use Windows is for the latest games. Here are the spec's, think this would run OS X nicely? ;-)

For $599 you can buy a MacMini with a Core Solo processor. That is currently the cheapest way to get a legal copy of MacOS X for Intel. It is clearly illegal to install that copy of MacOS X on your home-built computer while it is still on the Macintosh, it is unclear whether it is legal or illegal to install it if you removed it from the Macintosh (seems legal in many european countries). If it is legal, then obviously you can also salvage parts for the MacMini, like DVD drive, harddisk, a bit of memory and save a bit of money that way. Unfortunately an unmodified MacOS X will refuse to run on anything that is not a Macintosh.

You may be able to get MacOS X slightly cheaper by buying a refurbished MacMini, or by buying one on eBay. And sometimes people sell broken computers on eBay.

 

[Dan==]

I think that the bigger issue with Dan=='s design (full credit and kudos for the idea!) is that the Mac Mini is so small that it only uses laptop components. If you want to have a full-size optical drive or a full-size hard drive, you need to use a larger form factor. This is part of the reason for the size of my design.

Here's a comparison in sizes (I've also changed the floor because my wife thought that the reflection was confusing...)

Cheers!

Now you've got some skills. I especially like the shadowing, reflections and detail on the back side. Very nice.

I agree with your size assessment.

Actually, our designs are quite close, differing primarily in cosmetics. What I'm refering to is my earlier design, (which I suspect you missed) not boncellis'. boncellis wished to see a wider, flatter version for use in home entertainment, so I conjured that 2nd one up for visualization. While that form factor has grown on me somewhat, I still like the taller version, as I had done earlier, and you've shown here, as well.

Here's my initial design, from earlier in this thread.

The size of mine is a little smaller (narrower) - I wanted the whole thing less than 8" wide, though it could go back a little deeper, i.e. not necessarily square.

Also, see possible/hoped for product specs earlier in the thread.

Personally, I think I still prefer the smoother Mini-like skin than the perforated look of the Pro, but I'm just quibbling.

Thanks for the imagery.

-Dan​

 

[milo]

I respectfully disagree. I say take it back and be ready for a much faster iMac Core 2 Duo. You want the latest, take it back. It won't be the latest for many more weeks. Core 2 Duo will be the latest for two more years.

Much faster? Benchmarks so far only say about 20% faster at the same clock speed. You just have to decide if paying a 10% restocking fee and being without your computer for who knows how long (I REALLY doubt new iMacs at the show, probably just towers and maybe MBP's) is worth that speed boost. And core 2 duo won't be "the latest for two years". Supposedly intel is going to ship quad cores by the end of this year! Not sure why you think that intel is suddenly going to stop making improvements.

Personally, at this point if I hadn't bought I'd wait, but if did I'd keep it.

Of course, the problem with waiting until Paris for consumer upgrades like MacBook is that Apple will entirely miss the educational buying season, losing one of the largest markets for its consumer products...

The educational buying season already happened...and apple was just in time with the macbook. They just came out a couple months ago and are still selling like hotcakes, they didn't miss anything.

And Snowy...love that design, that would be perfect. And it would have WAY better bang for buck compared to the cube, they need to make it simple, not a shiny work of art.

You don't think Vista will be out before the revision to the Core 2 Duo due in Q1 2007 with the Santa Rosa chipset??? I bet Vista will ship by the time the Santa Rosa chipset is ready, especially because MS is suggesting Vista systems use harddrives or Mobos with flash RAM to speed up the boot process.

The next update to Core isn't the new chipset, it's the four core versions, cloverton and kentsfield. And those are supposed to ship before the end of this year, which would beat Vista handily.

Here's an example of a post based in fantasy instead of fact. Core 3 is a distinct next generation set of processors based on a 45nm manufacturing process that will not begin before LATE 2008 and reign all of 2009 and 2010. 🙄

Did you read his post? He said he meant the next update to Core, whether that's called Core 3 or not (any processor that goes beyond Core 2 because I don't know if they'll call it "Core 3"). He just used "core 3" because he didn't know what the real name for the next gen is.

I hope not. Visions of Motorola hauntingly return.

Possible initial supply constraints...because they decided to ship the chip a month EARLY? That's not remotely like moto.

 

[Snowy_River]

Now you've got some skills. I especially like the shadowing, reflections and detail on the back side. Very nice.

I agree with your size assessment.

Actually, our designs are quite close, differing primarily in cosmetics. What I'm refering to is my earlier design, (which I suspect you missed) not boncellis'. boncellis wished to see a wider, flatter version for use in home entertainment, so I conjured that 2nd one up for visualization. While that form factor has grown on me somewhat, I still like the taller version, as I had done earlier, and you've shown here, as well.

Here's my initial design, from earlier in this thread.

The size of mine is a little smaller (narrower) - I wanted the whole thing less than 8" wide, though it could go back a little deeper, i.e. not necessarily square.

Also, see possible/hoped for product specs earlier in the thread.

Personally, I think I still prefer the smoother Mini-like skin than the perforated look of the Pro, but I'm just quibbling.

Thanks for the imagery.

-Dan​

Thank you. I had fun doing it. Although I realized later that my MP is missing the Apple Logo on the side. Oh well.

I did see your earlier design, actually. I had though that it was meant to be the same footprint as the Mac Mini. Seeing it again, I can see that I was mistaken. By comparison, my design is 10"W x 11"D x 4"H. I think to bring it down to the MP 8.1"W, it would have to be made taller, to be reasonable.

Also, in the vein of quibbling, I think that the perforated look of the MP allows for much better cooling, and therefore hotter components, such as extra boards, faster processors, higher-end GPU, etc. That's the reason I went with it... 🙂

Maybe now I should draw a scene with the Mac++, a keyboard, a mouse, and an ACD. What do you think?

 

[Orange-DE]

Snowy_River:

You Do Dat!

 

[cozart]

so i'm having a difficult time deciding what to do.

North Carolina's sales tax holiday is this coming weekend, just a couple of days before WWDC (of course!). i had every intention of buying a MacBook Pro during the holiday, but now i have no idea what to do.

assuming there's not a silent release of an updated MBP tomorrow...

will waiting be worth losing the 7.5% (somewhere between $150 and $200 depending on how i customize it) that i'll have to pay if i don't get it during the holiday?

should i go ahead and get it during tax free weekend in case there's not even an announcement at WWDC? or, if there is an announcement, should i go ahead and get it and then return it within the 14-day window, losing the 10% restocking fee.

so many options and this first-time mac buyer doesn't know what to do!

 

[greenstork]

Multimedia, Snowy and Grokgod,

Thanks for the continued thoughts. A store manager said she would be flexible with the 14 day return date, as lnog as I understand that I would pay the restock fee of 10%. What that means to me is I will hold on to this machine until the WWDC and if new model is announced I will return and repurchase, eating the restock fee.( Kind of a pay for usage plan I look at it as.) If no new enhancements are announced with the iMac i guess I will keep mine.

However, there is the thought as one of you have brought up to just reetuen and wait until Sept. when it may be more likely to arrive. A slippery slop0e I know but I am leaning mroe toward a return and repurchase, as a sort of insruance policy of sorts.

I know I can't have my cake and eat it...., but I was looking for insight into how likely an improvement in the iMac is this August.

Thanks again!

Merk850

That's an accommodating manager that you found. The lesson learned here I suppose, and it's been said time and time again, is never buy a new computer before a major Mac conference (Macworld SF & Paris, and WWDC).

 

[greenstork]

Update this august... not likely. It will be all pro. Any consumer will be Paris Expo. The imac G5 was launched there. why not a Core 2 Duo iMac?

Why not? Cost...

The prices of the Yonahs just dropped precipitously, thereby increasing Apple's margins on their line of computers in mid product cycle. They'll be selling fewer iMacs anyway because everyone will want the fanciest MB Pros and Mac Pros with the super fast Intel chips. To make up for selling fewer iMacs, they'll be raking in higher margins on each computer.

Look for consumer model speed bumps ahead of the holiday season.

 

[uv23]

Apple will never ship a desktop machine so close in size to the mini. Impractical and too much market confusion. I'm expecting a ~25% decrease in size of the current G5 tower, making it more mid-tower sized. This would still be an improvement to the current behemoths.

 

[greenstork]

Of course, the problem with waiting until Paris for consumer upgrades like MacBook is that Apple will entirely miss the educational buying season, losing one of the largest markets for its consumer products...

Why would Apple miss the educational buying season? They just released a brand new educational iMac this month. eMacs don't need or want the latest and greatest, fastest chips, they need the most bang for their buck. I believe that the $899 educational iMac fits that description to the letter.

 

[greenstork]

I've built a gaming PC around the Core 2 Duo E6700. I'd like to be able to install OS X on it, because the only reason why I'd ever use Windows is for the latest games. Here are the spec's, think this would run OS X nicely? ;-)

Intel 975XBX Motherboard
Intel Core 2 Duo E6700 (should overclock to around 3.2 to 3.5 GHz with my Zalman CNPS9500 AT air cooler)
ATI Crossfire x1900 (crossfire master card)
Sapphire ATI x1900xt (in crossfire)
1GB Crucial Ballistix DDR2 800 Memory
2 x 320GB Seagate Perpendicular Recording SATA2 HD's in RAID 1
Antec Trupower II 550 watt power supply
Antec P180 case in black

... keep in mind I am a diehard Mac fan, but I've always wanted to build a gaming rig since I'm a hardcore gamer. After all, I'm writing this entry on my MacBook Pro. Mmmmm.

You should have waited for a Mac Pro. By hacking OS X to run on your custom built machine, you're constantly going to have to deal with a buggy Mac OS. There's no doubt that with every OS update, Apple will try to disable your hacked copy, if not fry your OS X installation. Make sure you partition...

I'm a gamer too and I'm just sitting on my hands waiting for a Mac Pro. Sure, it may be more expensive than a custom-built Intel machine, but it will run OS X like a charm, and that's ultimately the most important factor in my computer purchase. But access to Windows games and Mac OS X, that's a dream come true for this mac fanatic. I'm just keeping my fingers crossed that virtualization makes big enough strides that I never have to leave OS X to play Windows-based games.

 

[greenstork]

Apple will never ship a desktop machine so close in size to the mini. Impractical and too much market confusion. I'm expecting a ~25% decrease in size of the current G5 tower, making it more mid-tower sized. This would still be an improvement to the current behemoths.

Wow, you're pulling out my deep cuts with your sig. They never did fit a G5 in a notebook, I guess that was my intention with that quote. The G4 was never a great chip. It ran hot and the only way to make it faster was to make it run hotter, Apple needed a new chip and they knew it. Because they couldn't find a producer of efficient PPC chips, they switched to Intel, and I don't think anyone saw that coming.

Sometimes, chip makers move backwards to an architecture that works. Look at Intel's latest chips, they're an evolution of the Pentium M architecture and a departure from what previously was their "best" and fastest, the Pentium 4.

 

[iFry]

Sure, it may be more expensive than a custom-built Intel machine, but it will run OS X like a charm, and that's ultimately the most important factor in my computer purchase. But access to Windows games and Mac OS X, that's a dream come true for this mac fanatic. I'm just keeping my fingers crossed that virtualization makes big enough strides that I never have to leave OS X to play Windows-based games.

my thoughts exactly... MacBook Pro in two weeks 😀

wish i had that Core 2 goin in it...

 

[Eidorian]

What I'd like to know is the upgrade options in a new tower. We're running on EFI instead of Open Firmware now.

 

[Dan==]

I did see your earlier design, actually. I had though that it was meant to be the same footprint as the Mac Mini. Seeing it again, I can see that I was mistaken. By comparison, my design is 10"W x 11"D x 4"H. I think to bring it down to the MP 8.1"W, it would have to be made taller, to be reasonable.

Yes, mine's about 5" high, which is tall enough so it would probably need some low hand grips or something. I'm not an engineer for these things, so I'm not even sure it would fit everything, but it looks like it might.

Also, in the vein of quibbling, I think that the perforated look of the MP allows for much better cooling, and therefore hotter components, such as extra boards, faster processors, higher-end GPU, etc. That's the reason I went with it... 🙂

Perforation only might help cooling. I've heard getting cool air on the parts in question is the most important, and internal flow may actually be better served with a mostly (obviously not completely) closed case design. (I'm probably wrong though in my recollection.)

Maybe now I should draw a scene with the Mac++, a keyboard, a mouse, and an ACD. What do you think?

Sure, I'd love to see some more pretty pictures of what we're dreaming about. It's a little like holding a lottery ticket in your hand, waiting for the numbers to be drawn, visualizing what you're going to buy with the winnings. 🙂

-Dan​

 

[greenstork]

With the possible introduction of the iPhone, movie downloads, Leopard preview, and true video iPods, in addition to new Mac Pros and possibly other updated Macs with the Core 2 Duos, I'm putting my money on a product announcement tomorrow.

Steve's going to spend the keynote telling developers about what they'll be able to do with Leopard, it is a developers conference after all. I'll go out on a limb and say Mac Pros tomorrow or perhaps at the very least, new Xserves. There is every reason to just wait until August 7, but I'll chance my prediction for an update tomorrow. Who's with me!