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iOS 7.1.2 might coming this month

Dented said:
To be fair, 90% of IOS users neither know nor care about these issues..
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And you are %90 of the users? Even if you are, do you know how many users %10 corresponds to?

I don't know what lock screen bug he's talking about but I can consistently reproduce a bug by rotating the device when sliding to unlock. It leaves me in the lock screen where it is no longer possible to slide the slider to unlock it. I had to turn the device off and on again every time this happened. Now I'm paying attention to rotating the device first, and unlocking later.

And this was one of the several annoying bugs not everyone experiences. I could understand these in Android but I don't really know how Apple manages to introduce "device specific" bugs like these in an OS that only runs on specific devices all of which are produced by the same company. Hell, there are even some bugs that happen in someones iPad 4 for example, but not in someone elses. For an OS that's basically a closed box with zero chance for a user corrupting it, this is just stupid.
 
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That's not the lockscreen bug he's referring to. And... meh. I'm not apple.
 
CutterSlade said:
And you are %90 of the users? Even if you are, do you know how many users %10 corresponds to?

I don't know what lock screen bug he's talking about but I can consistently reproduce a bug by rotating the device when sliding to unlock. It leaves me in the lock screen where it is no longer possible to slide the slider to unlock it. I had to turn the device off and on again every time this happened. Now I'm paying attention to rotating the device first, and unlocking later.

And this was one of the several annoying bugs not everyone experiences. I could understand these in Android but I don't really know how Apple manages to introduce "device specific" bugs like these in an OS that only runs on specific devices all of which are produced by the same company. Hell, there are even some bugs that happen in someones iPad 4 for example, but not in someone elses. For an OS that's basically a closed box with zero chance for a user corrupting it, this is just stupid.
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I have no clue what bug you are referring to rotating to unlock. My iPhone does not exhibit this issue? Are you jailbroken? On 7.1.1?
 
Dented said:
To be fair, 90% of IOS users neither know nor care about these issues..
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Well, to be fair, when it comes to security/exploit type of issues, it really doesn't matter how many users care or even know about them when it comes to measuring the importance of those issues.
 
C DM said:
Well, to be fair, when it comes to security/exploit type of issues, it really doesn't matter how many users care or even know about them when it comes to measuring the importance of those issues.
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The importance lies in the mitigation and how easy it is for users to perform the mitigation action.

Disabling the control center, for example, from lock screen is easy and effective.
 
I7guy said:
The importance lies in the mitigation and how easy it is for users to perform the mitigation action.

Disabling the control center, for example, from lock screen is easy and effective.
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And again, those 90% of iOS users doesn't know how to protect from those security issues ;) The problem is that Apple fixed those issues on iOS 8 while iOS 7 is in risk.
 
I7guy said:
I have no clue what bug you are referring to rotating to unlock. My iPhone does not exhibit this issue? Are you jailbroken? On 7.1.1?
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Now you see my point. Not everyone experiences those bugs. I'm not an iPhone user so all the bugs I refer to happen on my iPad running 7.1.1. I've never jailbroken my device so there isn't anything wrong on my end.

This isn't a major issue, it just happens sometimes when I'm taking my iPad from my desk and quickly trying to unlock it while rotating the device at the same time to the orientation I'm gonna use. Depending on my timing, it sometimes gets stuck on the lock screen.
 
CutterSlade said:
Now you see my point. Not everyone experiences those bugs. I'm not an iPhone user so all the bugs I refer to happen on my iPad running 7.1.1. I've never jailbroken my device so there isn't anything wrong on my end.

This isn't a major issue, it just happens sometimes when I'm taking my iPad from my desk and quickly trying to unlock it while rotating the device at the same time to the orientation I'm gonna use. Depending on my timing, it sometimes gets stuck on the lock screen.
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Same issue with iPad air. It does not affect iPhone because it doesn't rotate at lockscreen
 
CutterSlade said:
Now you see my point. Not everyone experiences those bugs. I'm not an iPhone user so all the bugs I refer to happen on my iPad running 7.1.1. I've never jailbroken my device so there isn't anything wrong on my end.

This isn't a major issue, it just happens sometimes when I'm taking my iPad from my desk and quickly trying to unlock it while rotating the device at the same time to the orientation I'm gonna use. Depending on my timing, it sometimes gets stuck on the lock screen.
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The same can be said for windows for example, where one user sees a bug but the next user doesn't. It clearly helps to say on my iPad Air on 7.1.1 here is the bug I've experienced vs I experienced "a bug".

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karstas said:
And again, those 90% of iOS users doesn't know how to protect from those security issues ;) The problem is that Apple fixed those issues on iOS 8 while iOS 7 is in risk.
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Of course no one really knows. A corollary is just because apple fixed it didn't mean it will get fixed on an end users Idevices.
 
I7guy said:
The same can be said for windows for example, where one user sees a bug but the next user doesn't. It clearly helps to say on my iPad Air on 7.1.1 here is the bug I've experienced vs I experienced "a bug".
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Yes, and that's normal for Windows because it can run on any hardware produced by any vendor. That's not the case for iOS. It's ok to have problems that are phone specific, tablet specific, OS version specific and even region or language specific, but how can the same version of the OS behave different on two devices that have the exact same hardware and regional settings, that I don't understand.
 
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I7guy said:
The importance lies in the mitigation and how easy it is for users to perform the mitigation action.

Disabling the control center, for example, from lock screen is easy and effective.
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That is a factor, but often might not be a large one given that most companies don't rely on typical users to understand even the simplest things or do those things even if they understand them. To get in line with securing an existing exploit or security concern the primary way for a company to address it is to actually patch it or remove it in some way, not rely on the end user to do anything about it, no matter how simple and straightforward it might be.
 
pretty much dont think this is happening now.

even though we had seen logs of apple employees running iOS 7.1.2 on 9to5mac.com

:confused:
 
C DM said:
That is a factor, but often might not be a large one given that most companies don't rely on typical users to understand even the simplest things or do those things even if they understand them. To get in line with securing an existing exploit or security concern the primary way for a company to address it is to actually patch it or remove it in some way, not rely on the end user to do anything about it, no matter how simple and straightforward it might be.
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Patching in iOS is not automatic as it is in windows. Patching in iOS requires a user to download a new version. That has always been the case. Disabling the control panel or downloading a new version of iOS, both require a user to take a proactive action.

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CutterSlade said:
Yes, and that's normal for Windows because it can run on any hardware produced by any vendor. That's not the case for iOS. It's ok to have problems that are phone specific, tablet specific, OS version specific and even region or language specific, but how can the same version of the OS behave different on two devices that have the exact same hardware and regional settings, that I don't understand.
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Two devices are not necessarily exactly the same. Hardware may be different, software configuration may be different.
 
I7guy said:
Patching in iOS is not automatic as it is in windows. Patching in iOS requires a user to download a new version. That has always been the case. Disabling the control panel or downloading a new version of iOS, both require a user to take a proactive action.

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Two devices are not necessarily exactly the same. Hardware may be different, software configuration may be different.
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Sure, both are things that require user action. In one case though the company didn't do anything to address an existing issue aside from telling users to do something, in the other case the company actually fixed the issue, even if it's still up to the user to get that fix. So, from the user perspective similar amount of work might be involved, while from the company perspective, in one case they fixed the issue, in the other case they didn't even if they provided some workaround.
 
I7guy said:
Two devices are not necessarily exactly the same. Hardware may be different, software configuration may be different.
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Not if you bought them from the same place in the same country. The software is also exactly the same. Whatever differences are there between the behaviors, they're probably caused by some problem in the OS that gets triggered indirectly by the users actions.
 
So you need a missed call. Until then you can just disable notification center from the lock screen or missed calls from notification center so you can still get to it.
 
CutterSlade said:
Not if you bought them from the same place in the same country. The software is also exactly the same. Whatever differences are there between the behaviors, they're probably caused by some problem in the OS that gets triggered indirectly by the users actions.
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Two iphones bought in the same store at the same time, doesn't mean that under the covers they are identical. Since IOS is a bare metal operating system, some variation in hardware could cause software to react unpredictitably in certain circumstances.
 
I7guy said:
Two iphones bought in the same store at the same time, doesn't mean that under the covers they are identical. Since IOS is a bare metal operating system, some variation in hardware could cause software to react unpredictitably in certain circumstances.
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These aren't analog devices, so variations in its minor components cannot have a visible effect. Major components (CPU, GPU, RAM etc.) are always the same in the same batch of devices. These problems are all caused by the defects in the software, not by the changes in the hardware.
 
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CutterSlade said:
These aren't analog devices, so variations in its minor components cannot have a visible effect. Major components (CPU, GPU, RAM etc.) are always the same in the same batch of devices. These problems are all caused by the defects in the software, not by the changes in the hardware.
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A unexpected variation in a hardware component that's not properly programmed into a software component can cause a crash. I know because I used to write embedded operating systems.
 
I7guy said:
A unexpected variation in a hardware component that's not properly programmed into a software component can cause a crash. I know because I used to write embedded operating systems.
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What unexpected variation? I used to develop both hardware and software for embedded systems but one doesn't need to do that in order to know that digital components are either defective, or not. There is no such thing as varying functionality that can lead to results visible by the users. If such a thing were possible, then it would be impossible to develop a system that works properly on all devices.

What you said would be possible if we were talking about, for example, a small number of devices that contain manually programmed FPGAs in them. Otherwise, it's just buggy software that can't handle some variations that are known to exist by design during the development process, or more likely, a buggy software that corrupts some data it's relying on over time.
 
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CutterSlade said:
What unexpected variation? I used to develop both hardware and software for embedded systems but one doesn't need to do that in order to know that digital components are either defective, or not. There is no such thing as varying functionality that can lead to results visible by the users. If such a thing were possible, then it would be impossible to develop a system that works properly on all devices.

What you said would be possible if we were talking about, for example, a small number of devices that contain manually programmed FPGAs in them. Otherwise, it's just buggy software that can't handle some variations that are known to exist by design during the development process, or more likely, a buggy software that corrupts some data it's relying on over time.
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Ok, we're getting a little off-topic and I'll agree to disagree with you as sometimes hardware fails to perform exactly due to specs due to edge components; i.e. pink or yellow screens as one example that doesn't bring the phone down. As far as buggy software, every piece of software written has a bug or two in them. Apple is not immune.
 
I7guy said:
Ok, we're getting a little off-topic and I'll agree to disagree with you as sometimes hardware fails to perform exactly due to specs due to edge components; i.e. pink or yellow screens as one example that doesn't bring the phone down. As far as buggy software, every piece of software written has a bug or two in them. Apple is not immune.
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We aren't really disagreeing on anything:)

The operating ranges of everything are known beforehand, so problems can occur but only if the design wasn't done according to those, or some components fail to work according to their specs, which is the definition of faulty.

Of course all software have bugs, the thing we were talking about was the inconsistencies between two identical devices. If I understood correctly, what you're saying is that some of them might contain faulty components, or their hardware design might have been done without considering some border cases, and yes that might be the case. Or it might be entirely a software issue. Only they can know for sure.
 
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