iPad Pro - Buyer's Remorse Anyone?

[FrozenDarkness]

So we should expect everything any company releases to remain at a fixed price point ad infinitum?

Why? Because it suits us? Because we deserve it? Because they have no right to charge whatever they want? Because it's not 1000X more powerful than the last one? Because we spent billions of dollars developing it and spend billions more providing year-round support for it?

Really, I'm genuinely curious, what right do we have to expect any company to charge what we want them to charge for any product, rather than what they deem to be the appropriate price point? I'd sure love for my energy bills to have not increased by over 100% in the past three years, but I don't exactly get a choice.

At the end of the day, if we deem a product to be beyond that which we consider value for money. The singular thing we can do is not buy it. Kind of how consumerism has worked since the days when people exchanged bits of wood with notches carved into them to represent the exchange of value between parties.


Damn I need more coffee, I'm grumpier than usual this morning

I think you're confusing our rights to complain on a forum versus our rights to purchase something at a fixed point. do people not have a right to vent?

the right to expect a company to charge what we want them to charge is more akin to us walking into an apple store and demanding a price and getting mad about it versus us complaining on macrumors.

 

[TrueBlou]

I think you're confusing our rights to complain on a forum versus our rights to purchase something at a fixed point. do people not have a right to vent?

the right to expect a company to charge what we want them to charge is more akin to us walking into an apple store and demanding a price and getting mad about it versus us complaining on macrumors.

I'm all for venting, but most people seem to be upset that Apple have changed the price when they've never done so before. Therefore deeming it unfair or a ripoff.

Now if we were to say that the device didn't represent value for money beyond comparisons to what we have become accustomed to as "what an iPad should cost", thats a different matter altogether.

 

[Ghost31]

Damn I need more coffee, I'm grumpier than usual this morning

Should we get off your lawn now?

I think you're confusing our rights to complain on a forum versus our rights to purchase something at a fixed point. do people not have a right to vent?

the right to expect a company to charge what we want them to charge is more akin to us walking into an apple store and demanding a price and getting mad about it versus us complaining on macrumors.

Speaking of confusion, I'm getting more confused the more I read this conversation go on. At some point Apple may need to charge more for the iPad to A) keep their profit margins and B) to not have to cheap out on the tech they put into the iPad Pro. Whenever they were going to have to increase price, you know people are going to be upset about it when you've conditioned them to expect it at a certain price point and then increase it.

But is it totally unjustifiable that they would increase price? Who knows. They didn't tell us why they decided to increase the price. It doesn't seem to make much sense to outsiders, but I think Apple probably has a good reason for it that they didn't jump to overnight. And you never see anybody complaining that the new iPad is a crap product. Or that it's not even worth the price! That's what confuses me. People complain "boo they increased the price" and then...buy it anyway and enjoy it. So technically, the price they're charging can't be THAT unreasonable can it? Or else people wouldn't pay it!

So I'm very meh on this issue. I remember when the first iPad was about to come out and people were speculating it could be more than a thousand bucks. Then it released for the $500-ish price point and blew everyone's minds. I think my iPad Pro is worth it. I think most people just complain because they don't want to part with extra money. Not because of an issue of value

 

[TrueBlou]

Should we get off your lawn now?

I wondered who was standing out there, must remember to fire the ghillie. But nonetheless, the morphine has kicked in, the pain is subsiding a little and I have a nice full mug of coffee. Calmness resumed

 

[HiItsMe]

Was there even a price increase?

On release day:
32gb wifi iPad 4 - $599
32gb wifi iPad Air - $599
32gb wifi iPad Air 2 - $599
32gb wifi iPad Pro 9.7 - $599

64gb wifi iPad 4 - $699
64gb wifi iPad Air - $699
128gb wifi iPad Air 2 - $699
128gb wifi iPad Pro 9.7 - $749

Enough of the complaining already!

 

[rui no onna]

Was there even a price increase?

On release day:
32gb wifi iPad 4 - $599
32gb wifi iPad Air - $599
32gb wifi iPad Air 2 - $599
32gb wifi iPad Pro 9.7 - $599

64gb wifi iPad 4 - $699
64gb wifi iPad Air - $699
128gb wifi iPad Air 2 - $699
128gb wifi iPad Pro 9.7 - $749

Enough of the complaining already!

There was no 32GB wifi iPad Air 2. They nixed the 32GB model last generation and went straight to 64GB wifi iPad Air 2 - $599 so in that context, the Pro 9.7 seems more expensive. Mind, you can add the following data points:

128GB wifi iPad 4 - $799
128GB wifi iPad Air - $799

 

[HiItsMe]

There was no 32GB wifi iPad Air 2. They nixed the 32GB model last generation and went straight to 64GB wifi iPad Air 2 - $599 so in that context, the Pro 9.7 seems more expensive. Mind, you can add the following data points:

128GB wifi iPad 4 - $799
128GB wifi iPad Air - $799

Right. Apple should have never done the price decrease from the 128gb Air 1 to 2. The thanks they got is people complaining about a $50 price 'increase' now. Over the course of four years the 128gb latest and greatest has gotten $50 cheaper (and actually the 32gb model has never seen a price increase since inception!)

 

[rui no onna]

Right. Apple should have never done the price decrease from the 128gb Air 1 to 2. The thanks they got is people complaining about a $50 price 'increase' now. Over the course of four years the 128gb latest and greatest has gotten $50 cheaper (and actually the 32gb model has never seen a price increase since inception!)

Personally, I think there's a chance we might see an actual Air 3 later this year with A9X but no True Tone, Smart Connector and Pencil support. The $499 price point is pretty important in terms of behavioral economics and removing those features might be sufficient to get the Air 3 down to $499 while maintaining profit margins.

 

[HiItsMe]

Personally, I think there's a chance we might see an actual Air 3 later this year with A9X but no True Tone, Smart Connector and Pencil support. The $499 price point is pretty important in terms of behavioral economics and removing those features might be sufficient to get the Air 3 down to $499 while maintaining profit margins.

They'd be shooting themselves in the foot in my opinion. There are other options at $499, the latest and greatest doesn't need to join them.

 

[masotime]

Personally, I think there's a chance we might see an actual Air 3 later this year with A9X but no True Tone, Smart Connector and Pencil support. The $499 price point is pretty important in terms of behavioral economics and removing those features might be sufficient to get the Air 3 down to $499 while maintaining profit margins.

Interesting possibility, but I can't help feel that Apple is confusing consumers with their lineup these days. When you mention the iPP now, no one can tell whether it's a 9.7" or 12.9". On these forums and elsewhere I've seen posts having to clarify this repeatedly. It's very.... Un Apple-like IMO.

 

[supervelous]

Having a different problem than Buyer's Remorse. I have an Air 2 and was sure I was going to upgrade to the Pro 9.7 due to going to school and previously thinking the IPP 12.9 was way too big, and especially since I already own and love a Surface Pro 4. BUT while I overall love SP4 for school and as a laptop it has disappointing battery life and isn't great as a tablet so still used my iPad quite a lot to read textbooks on the go/couch and other leisure times.

Since I'm in school thought just the pen for notes would be awesome to have, it's better than the SP4 pen. BUT then Staples had to go and discount the 12.9 128GB to $799 and I bought. Then got the 9.7 from my preorder. I go back and forth daily on which one to keep.

Love big screen for textbook reading and split view to read and take notes, and taking notes on bigger screen is nice. But it's awkward to have the 12.9 out in class same time as the SP4. Then again some classes I can just get away with using the 12.9 iPad Pro, as long as there is no advanced excel (ran into that in a class last week where we had to add data analytics add-in and run regression analysis).

The 9.7 is so much more portable though! If I paid MSRP for both I'd definitely keep the 9.7. Damn you Staples!

 

[Leo90]

The only remorse I had was to buy the Apple Smart Keyboard. The device itself is amazing! I got a logitech words to go keyboard and besides being so much cheaper it is so more versatile.

 

[spiderman0616]

Interesting that people who were wanting an update on the iPad Air think that the 9.7" Pro is the update. I don't think that's the case at all. There is no reason to differentiate a Pro line if you're not going to have a non-Pro line. The iPad is eventually going to mirror the Mac product line.

12.9" Pro
9.7" Pro
9.7" Air
7.9" Mini

I'm even willing to bet they get rid of the numbering sometime in the next year or two. You buy a standard, a Pro, or a mini. When there's a huge feature upgrade to talk about or a huge leap forward, there's a keynote. Otherwise, follow the strategy used with the Mac.

 

[Ghost31]

I'm even willing to bet they get rid of the numbering sometime in the next year or two. You buy a standard, a Pro, or a mini. When there's a huge feature upgrade to talk about or a huge leap forward, there's a keynote. Otherwise, follow the strategy used with the Mac.

Apple is hard to predict lately. Maybe? But doubtful. They tried this already with "the new iPad" awhile back. Remember that? Then people hated the number schedule and Apple abandoned that style of naming it and came out with the iPad Air. So I really doubt they're gonna go back to that same naming schedule all over again.

Even MORE unbelievable is that they would release another non pro iPad. What would it even have? People were complaining about the 9.7 iPad Pro and how unimpressed they were. But what would they update the new iPad Air to have? It wouldn't have pencil or smart connector or as nice of a camera or the new speaker system. Because that's in the pro version. So what would they do?

Yeah I don't see that happening. They have the mini, the old iPad Air 2 as the "regular iPad" and the two sizes in iPad Pro. That's their line. Next year they'll have an iPad Pro 2 and the iPad Pro 1 will slip into a lower priced slot and so on

 

[supervelous]

Interesting possibility, but I can't help feel that Apple is confusing consumers with their lineup these days. When you mention the iPP now, no one can tell whether it's a 9.7" or 12.9". On these forums and elsewhere I've seen posts having to clarify this repeatedly. It's very.... Un Apple-like IMO.

Agreed, they are slowly moving away from what Steve Jobs did to make this company so successful. He never would have had 4 iPad models in 3 different sizes and 3 iPhones in 3 sizes sold at the same time in my opinion. IIRC Steve Jobs, when he came back to Apple, focused on simplifying the product line and the products they did, they did very well and were "magical". It's hard to sell magical and amazing when there are 3 or 4 versions of the same core product.

They're trying to appease Wall Street in my opinion, chasing new segments such as PC users with the IPP. Stock price is something I don't think was forefront in Steve's mind. He figured just make magical products and the rest would take care of itself.

I think us hardcore users like the choice, but it's confusing to the average consumer.

 

[AlexJoda]

Apple is hard to predict lately. Maybe? But doubtful. They tried this already with "the new iPad" awhile back. Remember that? Then people hated the number schedule and Apple abandoned that style of naming it and came out with the iPad Air. So I really doubt they're gonna go back to that same naming schedule all over again.

Even MORE unbelievable is that they would release another non pro iPad. What would it even have? People were complaining about the 9.7 iPad Pro and how unimpressed they were. But what would they update the new iPad Air to have? It wouldn't have pencil or smart connector or as nice of a camera or the new speaker system. Because that's in the pro version. So what would they do?

Yeah I don't see that happening. They have the mini, the old iPad Air 2 as the "regular iPad" and the two sizes in iPad Pro. That's their line. Next year they'll have an iPad Pro 2 and the iPad Pro 1 will slip into a lower priced slot and so on

Maybe they stay with the Mini. It sounds ridiculous to name that iPad Pro 7.9"....

 

[RedOrchestra]

I just don't see this naming convention to be all that big a deal.

The iPad Pro will be bought on size first, then other specs second - what's so hard about that. Then if you don't like those sizes, you'll look at the Mini.

Everything else, like the Air 2, is old technology and should be stayed away from ... period.

 

[turbineseaplane]

The "air" moniker's of all kinds are going away.

Remember, anything "air" was about how light and thin the product was originally....and now everything is like that, so it's just a matter of phasing it out.

 

[urkel]

I guess I'm having some Pre-Buyers Remorse because I can't figure out something.

Is the iPad Pro 9.7 a "Tick" or a "Tock" release?

With iPhones it's easy. New design is a full step while S is a half-step. But with this iPad its confusing. New accessory support, improved camera and A9X indicate a big step. But old design, 2GB, USB2 and TouchID1 seem to indicate a small step with a much larger release coming up.

I sold my Pro12.9 with full intent on getting a Pro9.7. But in the transition I "borrowed" my wife's Air2 and I'm finding its so similar to the Pro9.7 that I don't know if it's big enough of an upgrade to invest $1000 into.

 

[AlexJoda]

I sold my Pro12.9 with full intent on getting a Pro9.7. But in the transition I "borrowed" my wife's Air2 and I'm finding its so similar to the Pro9.7 that I don't know if it's big enough of an upgrade to invest $1000 into.

You should have stayed with the 12.9" iPP. That was "big enough of an upgrade to invest $1000 into".

 

[bevsb2]

So we should expect everything any company releases to remain at a fixed price point ad infinitum?

Why? Because it suits us? Because we deserve it? Because they have no right to charge whatever they want? Because it's not 1000X more powerful than the last one? Because we spent billions of dollars developing it and spend billions more providing year-round support for it?

Really, I'm genuinely curious, what right do we have to expect any company to charge what we want them to charge for any product, rather than what they deem to be the appropriate price point? I'd sure love for my energy bills to have not increased by over 100% in the past three years, but I don't exactly get a choice.

At the end of the day, if we deem a product to be beyond that which we consider value for money. The singular thing we can do is not buy it. Kind of how consumerism has worked since the days when people exchanged bits of wood with notches carved into them to represent the exchange of value between parties.


Damn I need more coffee, I'm grumpier than usual this morning

Maybe grumpy, but right on.
[doublepost=1459968200][/doublepost]

You should have stayed with the 12.9" iPP. That was "big enough of an upgrade to invest $1000 into".

Or buy an Air 2 on sale.

 

[masotime]

There is no reason to differentiate a Pro line if you're not going to have a non-Pro line. The iPad is eventually going to mirror the Mac product line.

9.7" Pro
9.7" Air

The problem with this reasoning is that you need something more than "pro" features to tag on the "pro" moniker. The 9.7" pro has essentially identical weight and ergonomics with the iPad Air 2. What does that make the iPad Air 3? An even thinner and lighter iPad Air 2 with essentially identical features to its predecessor? Why would anyone buy that? A higher resolution display? Then what exactly makes the Pro a Pro?

If that isn't confusing, I don't know what is.

 

[Ghost31]

Agreed, they are slowly moving away from what Steve Jobs did to make this company so successful. He never would have had 4 iPad models in 3 different sizes and 3 iPhones in 3 sizes sold at the same time in my opinion. IIRC Steve Jobs, when he came back to Apple, focused on simplifying the product line and the products they did, they did very well and were "magical". It's hard to sell magical and amazing when there are 3 or 4 versions of the same core product.

They're trying to appease Wall Street in my opinion, chasing new segments such as PC users with the IPP. Stock price is something I don't think was forefront in Steve's mind. He figured just make magical products and the rest would take care of itself.

I think us hardcore users like the choice, but it's confusing to the average consumer.

Didn't they have lower priced iPhones during Steve jobs' time as CEO?
[doublepost=1459970603][/doublepost]

The problem with this reasoning is that you need something more than "pro" features to tag on the "pro" moniker. The 9.7" pro has essentially identical weight and ergonomics with the iPad Air 2. What does that make the iPad Air 3? An even thinner and lighter iPad Air 2 with essentially identical features to its predecessor? Why would anyone buy that? A higher resolution display? Then what exactly makes the Pro a Pro?

If that isn't confusing, I don't know what is.

Meh. You have a pretty good point, but it doesn't seem confusing in the least to me. There's a current line up and then the cheaper ones. They're like...two separate categories of products. If people wanna buy flagship and current, they had the mini or either iPad Pro. That's only 3 to choose from.

Or if they want a cheaper one then they can choose from last year's models.

Apple is getting desperate to sell at lower price points. So yeah....there will be this 2nd category of products that sell for cheaper

 

[rui no onna]

Didn't they have lower priced iPhones during Steve jobs' time as CEO?

Initial release pre-subsidy ($499/4GB, $599/8GB -> $299/4GB, $399/8GB, $499/16GB). For several years after, the true cost of an iPhone in the USA has been obfuscated by carrier subsidies. It was only with the iPhone 4S that we saw retail prices again ($649/16GB).

 

[Ghost31]

Initial release pre-subsidy ($499/4GB, $599/8GB -> $299/4GB, $399/8GB, $499/16GB). For several years after, the true cost of an iPhone in the USA has been obfuscated by carrier subsidies. It was only with the iPhone 4S that we saw retail prices again ($649/16GB).

No no I mean like where they keep the old model around at a lower price point