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I reckon this 'new fangled device' from Apple could catch on. It's quite portable in a sense at least. It's got a sharp display. And it's quite fast. And can almost be compared to a big computer. Can you imagine say, instead of a stylus you could use a finger. Instead of a whacking great screen, you could hold it in one hand. And by making it pocket size you could carry it ... Well ... Anywhere.

I can't believe Apple didn't bring that concept out first. Oh no wait.

They did. Because ... stylii, bulky devices and impracticality was what the original iPad was trying to eliminate.

And now they've just gone and .... Oh no. What have I just gone out and bought? Wait til my missus finds out about this. She's gonna kill me! o_O
 
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There is nothing "pro" about an OS dumbed down so that grandma doesn't get confused when showing off her grandkids pictures.
 
This iPad pro will be a failure in the market.

Failure, no. Niche product, yes.I've bought one. So have 3-4 artist friends.

There is nothing "pro" about an OS dumbed down so that grandma doesn't get confused when showing off her grandkids pictures.

Says someone who clearly doesn't understand anything about what pro means.
 
I got to try it in store today. It's an awesome device. Amazing screen but it feels surprisingly light for its size. The Pencil is incredible - easily the best stylus I've used since my Cintiq, and probably bests it. The video barely conveys how much better it is than Surface Pro, bu that fact was immediately apparent to me. The Pro stylus isn't even close as far as responsiveness and accuracy. No wavy lines either. It doesn't even feel like a stylus, honestly. The performance was so good and so consistent it just felt like a regular pencil. The pressure response curve was flawless, unlike the Surface which registers all kinds of different line weights. Hard to describe in writing or if you don't have a lot of experience with various styluses, but the feel is just perfect. Latency seemed app dependent. It was imperceptible in the Notes app, but in Paper 53 it was definitely noticeable, but still not bad. I can't wait to get one of my own.

I'm sure this thread will get the usual dismissive comments from the peanut gallery, but it's a very impressive device. So much so I kind of wonder where the Air even fits in anymore, as if you want the larger format iPad the Pro is definitely the way to go. Just excellent stuff all around.
That is consistent with my tests.
 
What an enlighten opinion. Where is the rabbit coming from? From the top of my hat.

Well technically it's the bottom of your hat.

So much lag on both devices.

I thought the Pencil would have no lag.

It doesn't at 30 fps which is closer to human perception maximum human perception. At 120 it's artificial you couldn't notice that unless you were an eagle.

The surface lag is a bit worse but the amount of samples it takes is way worse.
 
Failure, no. Niche product, yes.I've bought one. So have 3-4 artist friends.



Says someone who clearly doesn't understand anything about what pro means.

What does Pro mean to you?
For clarity.

Also a fair test of the pen would have been on the same software.
I have no doubt the Pencil has less lag and I know Apple would have produced a fantastic - if over priced - addition to the iPad Product. Lets just wait till iOS can run Pro software then run a comparison.
 
When I calculate that correctly, the Apple Pencil has a latency of approximately

40 to 60 Milliseconds <---------------- SPECS! Finally!

when using that application. Takes the screen around 5 to 7 frames out of 120 till it catches up with the pen. Other applications may vary.

The curvature is a software feature. You can turn line smoothing on and off in professional programs. The comparison of the two applications is not sound.
 
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so pro software needs to be hard to use?

Well no he's talking about the OS and complaining its amateur. When he clearly doesn't understand what an OS is. There is no reason that Adobe or Autodesk couldn't port photoshop or autocad to this. It has the power. Hell its as fast as a supercomputer from about 2000. People forget how crazy fast computers are now. But the issue would be how long it might take to develop and would it have a market etc. Also the whole UI would need to be redone for touch. The surface is a lovely machine but you have to buy s a very expensive one really.
 
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We must be reading different stories on the front page of MR each week.

Times have changed very much , cause before apple was very popular, it was not weekly news, but annual.

Simple fact is, you are not safe on any platform, if you think you are, you are diluted ;)

That Chinese mishap was hardly a very small incident. Talk about head in sand ;)

Everything you read on MR each week is only getting bigger by certain paranoid commentators ;) Talking about a a magnified molehill as big as Mount Everest. And of course, the Chinese mishap is a molehill. ;) What important is how quick Apple took action before it becomes a real problem.
 
Another fool talking for all (pro) users. I say fool because only a fool would think that every single (pro) user has the same use case as they do....

As a serious question, what workflow will you be using to accomplish "pro" tasks on the iPad?

I'm a professional food photographer, cookbook designer, and cookbook co-author. All told, my books have sold over 2 million copies.

I am also an indie filmmaker with a movie released in 18 countries that was even for sale at Wal-Mart.

In my cookbook business, I require the full version of MS Word with full use of paragraph styles and formatting. I also often use collaboration features and more often I use revision tracking as I work with my co-authors.

Those documents are then imported into Adobe InDesign to go into format. This cannot be done with Google Docs, etc. Once the book is designed it goes through rounds of edits with comment tracking in the full version of Adobe Acrobat.

Photography for the books is taken in RAW format, tethered directly into my Surface to allow for live feedback as styling and lighting is adjusted. Photos are edited in Lightroom then sent to Photoshop for final touch ups and to convert to CMYK.

Photos are imported into the InDesign book file, which is soft proofed using the printer's CMYK profile.

The final book is then uploaded as an InDesign package via FTP to the printing company's servers.

On the filmmaking side, I am admittedly more indie. All footage is shot in ProRes HQ at only 1080p. My second movie that I am finishing now had 800gb of footage. All work is done on the main drive with the footage on an external drive. Both the work and footage are backed up on 2 additional drives, one that is kept in a fireproof safe. Editing is done in Adobe Premiere. Sound design is done in a combination of Reaper, Adobe Audition, and izotope RX2. Scoring is recorded using a USB interface and mixing is done using a USB sound card into studio monitors. Color grading is done through Davinci Resolve and rendered out as lossless files that can easily approach 1tb for a full movie.

The finished movie is rendered out to a file that is about 170gb, more than the max storage of the iPad Pro. Again, only 1080p. It is then turned into a DCP for festival playback using OpenDCP and an external hard drive. Other festivals require a Blu-ray Disc that is burned with my external blu burner.

As far as I can tell, there isn't a single aspect of my writing, photography, design, editing, sound mixing, or content delivery that can be accomplished on the iPad Pro. I can and have performed them on a Surface Pro. We're talking about a ton of professional disciplines here and the true workflow required to deliver that work to printers, film festivals, distributors, or even Apple's own iTunes platform (which actually requires that movies be delivered on an HDCAM videotape).

The iPad Pro will find a home in more specialized locations, such as hospitals, once sophisticated and custom software is developed.

The onus is now on the app developers to make the iPad Pro into a truly professional device. I think it can happen, but it is going to take years before these kinds of workflows can happen on iOS. It's a catch 22 where you can't entice the professional without the software and no one will make the software without the customers.

The lack of USB devices is what is most problematic. It is disingenuous to promote 4K video editing when your max storage taps out at 128GB. But it isn't just storage, it is color calibrators, sound cards, editing shuttles, tactile mixing surfaces, disc burners, etc.

I don't think an iPad needs to be this professional, but I also don't think so many people should defend Apple's reluctance to include a touchscreen on an OSX device. OSX may not be optimized for touch, but the Apple Pencil could still have tremendous uses on OSX. If there wasn't a use for a stylus on their full OS, then Wacom wouldn't even exist as a company. A stylus is fantastic for touching up Photos, for drawing in professional apps that have no iOS equal, and even for drawing envelopes in music mixing software. Apple doesn't have to make OSX into a touch OS to put Wacom out of business.
 
As far as I can tell, there isn't a single aspect of my writing, photography, design, editing, sound mixing, or content delivery that can be accomplished on the iPad Pro. I can and have performed them on a Surface Pro. We're talking about a ton of professional disciplines here and the true workflow required to deliver that work to printers, film festivals, distributors, or even Apple's own iTunes platform (which actually requires that movies be delivered on an HDCAM videotape).

that's a lack of perspective on your part. i'm a graphic designer and illustrator. the bulk of my work is done in adobe illustrator because i work in an office and that's the office's work flow and i can't change it. my illustration work is done in whatever i desire. my partner on the other hand is a landscape architect. 2 years ago he decided he didn't want to do the architecture office thing any more and started doing design/build management and he is doing it all on an ipad. he goes to his client's house, measures their yard, sits in his car with his ipad, draws a plan, makes a quote and sells the job all on one day.

at first i looked at his choice of tools - i have an architectural degree and i've worked in several architectural offices and i thought it was very unprofessional. but he proved me wrong. he made it work. just because you are completely tied to certain tools doesn't mean the rest of us are.

i've completed construction ready architectural drawings in illustrator, most architects would laugh at me, but the ones i've worked with didn't even realize it. as far as i'm concerned, if i can make an image with it, i can use it professionally.
 
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Apple clearly wants developers to keep taking the potential of iOS to the next level, they've provided the canvas, and pro apps will come and they will do that, calm your tits everyone it has been 2 days.
 

In the full Pencil video the author clearly states that the curve performance in OneNote is not the best (nothing to do with the pen), and that to make this a true test the same app would have to be used, and he mentions that both pens are really good. Instead, this video just show the last part, and BOOM - we have the Pencil is better than Surface Pen. And everyone jumps on the bandwagon, proclaiming Apple is the best. :rolleyes:
 
As it stands, it seems like the iPad Pro is like a Ferrari running on diesel: super powerful but, ultimately, limited by running the same iOS and app ecosystem and the standard iPad Air/Mini. Plus, who on Earth can hold a 13" device comfortably?

I don't know, I don't see the point in this device...
 
Had a little play with one today. Strangely i didn't think it seemed that big at all. I think the iPhone 6s + looks ridiculous when you look at that, but for some reason the iPad Pro seemed a normal size...I guess I just looked at it like it was a small laptop screen. It's not the great to hold.

Few thoughts though. I find people yearning for OS X on it bizarre. For a start of it would require a full re-write of OS X as its for Intel not Arm at the minute and thats no simple tasks (neither was going from PPC), secondly there is not a single element suitable for touch.

iOS does now need to step its game up from a purely mobile operating system though people saying "I want to be able to do proper work on it" I wonder what "proper work" is to them. Doing a spreedsheet and emailing? Video editing?

I think people are stuck in conventional thoughts with this though - that it has to be a tablet or a computer and it has to work the way they've always work. For me the greatest use of the iPad Pro is not as a laptop replacement, nor as a tablet but as the world best touch input device, which can be used as a large remote control for Logic Pro or media editing programs. For some records producers being able to touch 10 track volume levels at once on the iPad Pro is revolutionary for the price, previous choices were just the Slate touch screen which is many thousands more and only does one single job, the iPad is multi talented.

But I think thats where you've got the clash of the average user that expects a single device to do everything they can think of and be everything they've ever experienced in a laptop and tablet and something they can't even think of and a professional who pays twice as much as an iPad Pro for an item which does ONE specalised job only. The iPad Pro is capable of replacing some of these (Wacam Cintiq for instance in terms of illustration, graphic designers don't buy that then complain they can't video edit and multi task their e-mail and spreedsheets at the same time on it)
By proper work I'm guessing peopel (including myself) Feel apple need to open up IOS and bring features than the normal desktop computing experience brings.

Sometimes apple makes things far too simple, which actually complicates things far more in the long run.

For instance: Attaching multiple files to an email.
Getting Data from another computer.
Unzipping a file.

Just these 3 things along is hard/impossible because of the way IOS restricts you.

IOS would be perfect as a stand along device for me if they expand on it, loosen the grips a little bit and give us a file management system similar to OSX.
 
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given how much they were promoting the pencil, thought it would do much better vs. surface than it seems to do.

The iPad Pro is years ahead of the Surface which has an annoying fan to keep it cool.
The Apple Pencil is also much smarter and versatile than the Surface Stylus.
 
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I just did the same test with a pencil and paper and I had no perceptible lag! plus the resolution is amazing!

I have a surface and I tried the iPad pro, it is great but my trusty iPad air 2 is so perfect for most of what I need a tablet for. Will be interesting to see how the iPad pro develops.
 
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The iPad Pro is years ahead of the Surface which has an annoying fan to keep it cool.
The Apple Pencil is also much smarter and versatile than the Surface Stylus.

The fan on my Surface pro 4 has not once been activated since I picked up the device on release day. Its a non issue for most users. The surface pen has been great for me.
 
The iPad Pro is years ahead of the Surface which has an annoying fan to keep it cool.

Here's a photo I took on my iPhone of my Surface Pro 4 hooked up to a second monitor, external hard drive, keyboard, mouse, midi controller, mini mixing console, and my Apple Watch charging on the extra USB charger included on the plug. Oh, and also the pen is safely docked on the side of the device... Because Microsoft thought it would be wise to give you multiple solutions for storing the pen. Also not shown, the 128GB microSD card inside the device to supplement the 256GB model I own.

If, by years ahead, you mean that the iPad does not yet have the software or expensive accessories to support these types of setups, yes, you are right.

As I've said before, I am also an Apple fan and do believe that we will one day see lightning accessories of all kinds, but the markup will be insane (as manufacturers know that we will pay it) and they will roll out right as Apple switches to USB-C.
 

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There is nothing "pro" about an OS dumbed down so that grandma doesn't get confused when showing off her grandkids pictures.

I find this is so true. I remember back around 2009 when I heard rumors about a tablet from apple and I really did dream about a tablet running mac os x despite it never being designed in any way for a touch screen. Now I have a macbook retina, surface pro 4 and an iPad air 2 and each is perfect in its own way for me. I mainly use the apple products for personal stuff and the surface for some personal stuff and work.

The big downside of the iPad pro for me is the limited storage space (plus that it cannot be expanded) and the fact it runs frigging iOS with no added features over the over iOS devices to warrant a Pro designation. It really should be an iPad plus, like the iPhone plus is to the smaller iPhone. Thats all it really is, a plus version of the iPad air 2 with updated logic board and better speakers.
 
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