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I know this is all purely opinion, but I'm just going to throw out there that I think the iPad is the least exciting Apple product around right now. It's nowhere near as productive as a MacBook (I'd much rather have a new MacBook than an iPad of any kind for Christmas), and even if you're going to argue in favor of having a touch screen for drawing, I feel like a Surface is a more robust device. I suppose you could argue it's a decent entertainment device, but you can watch videos on any of these three devices, and a gaming console or computer is going to blow the iPad away in terms of games. Want to read? Get a Kindle with an e-ink screen. It's easier on the eyes and a fifth of the price.
Frankly I expect a lot of it comes down to that many people have simply never owned one.

A laptop - you probably have one for work/school/whatever already.
A smartphone - you'll have one from the regular replace cycle that started in the late 90s. Also the US system is very hostile to gifted phones.

A tablet however was never 'mandatory' in any way, so a lot of people haven't 'invested' in one. They may still be interested in one as a gift however purely because its a thing thats 'maybe nice since others have them'. Hell even if it wasn't an iPad they wanted, but just any tablet - they'd likely end up saying iPad purely because its the easiest name to remember and the name thats most marketed. (A bit like 'Jeep' or 'Thermos')
 
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People compare cats and dogs and they are still not the same family of animals. Mac Pro, iMac and MacBook Air are the same category just like House Cat, Lion and Saber-Tooth Tiger are the same no matter their size, weight and strength differences. A feline is a feline and a PC is a PC. PCs exist in different form factors: Desktop-PC, Laptop-PC and Tablet-PC. A Tablet-PC is not a tablet, it's a PC that looks like a tablet. Pinguins can't fly and can swim, but they are still birds not fish.

Now give the man his $50, because he is right.

• MacBook & Surface Pro, same category of device.
• iPad Pro & Surface Pro, different category of device.

Clearly can't read. Just because YOU think that's right, doesn't mean you are right. Hence why my bet was let's see what the iPad pro reviews stack it against. A surface pro or a MacBook.
 
No they both run desktop operating systems, so they are in the same class.

They are NOT in the same class. Full gaming purpose built desktop runs a full OS, just like Macbook. Are they in the same class? NO.

Surface is in the iPad PRO class. Do you see an iPad Pro on the list? No.
 
Must be xmas time again...

Apple keeps saying that iPads are not gaining in popularity anymore after so many years.... (or i heard that saying somewhere)

yet it still finds it way on the number #1 stocking stuffer, or the like.

this list looks good because there is 4K in there :D, Surface, Bose... all the favorites.
 
The awkward moment when people would rather have a Dyson or a FitBit than an Apple Watch....
Ever think of price and a need? A dyson is more of a NEED than a watch, no?

I think most people see smart watches as completely pointless. Why have a watch that tells me I have a text message when I can just look at my phone.
So you don't have to keep getting your phone out all the time after a text or notification? certainly when you have the plus
 
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Ever think of price and a need? A dyson is more of a NEED than a watch, no?

It was a joke obviously more people have use of a Dyson over an Apple Watch it's just humorous when it's on a list of things people want this holiday season as you expect the latest gadgets, nota vacuum cleaner.

So you don't have to keep getting your phone out all the time after a text or notification? certainly when you have the plus

Text comes through -> read it on Apple Watch -> pull out iPhone -> reply.
Text comes through -> pull out phone -> read and reply.
 
It was a joke obviously more people have use of a Dyson over an Apple Watch it's just humorous when it's on a list of things people want this holiday season as you expect the latest gadgets, nota vacuum cleaner.



Text comes through -> read it on Apple Watch -> pull out iPhone -> reply.
Text comes through -> pull out phone -> read and reply.
There are many times when without a watch you don't know if you have a text. Certainly at work or at home I wouldn't have it on loud at certain times. So having it on the watch lets you know you have one.

It's more useful for general notifications in fairness as texts yes generally you will need to pull your phone out to text. Many times on the go you don't always have time to get your phone out so the watch is a far more useful option then none at all
 
Just because YOU think that's right, doesn't mean you are right.
That's exactly what it means. Because I put thoughts behind my opinions, I'm always right.

But don't take my word for it. Take his!​

tablet-pc.png


Bill Gates in 2002 categorizing an early hybrid.​
Hence why my bet was let's see what the iPad Pro reviews stack it against. A Surface Pro or a MacBook.
That's a straw man argument and you know it. The dispute was about how to categorize devices not how to compare them. A penguin stays a bird even if most people compare it against other swimming animals. The thing about truth is, it doesn't care about majorities. I bet $100 that making up a $50 bet doesn't prove anything.
 
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people often forget that unlike any other thing on that list, the apple watch is dependent on the user having a newer iphone in the first place. So you are already looking at a far smaller subset of the population to begin with (iphones have 20% of the smart phon market so new iphones must be even less). So to be in at no.12 is actually pretty good.
 
To me the Surface Pro is what tablets should have been all along as true Laptop replacements. I just don't see the point in an iPad, it's a mobile OS that's no good for anything, not even good at playing media because your codecs are locked and it only streams to Apple TV and browsing the net sucks cause there are no extensions or anything.
 
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That's exactly what it means. Because I put thoughts behind my opinions, I'm always right.

But don't take my word for it. Take his!​

tablet-pc.png


Bill Gates in 2002 categorizing an early hybrid.​
That's a straw man argument and you know it. The dispute was about how to categorize devices not how to compare them. A penguin stays a bird even if most people compare it against other swimming animals. The thing about truth is, it doesn't care about majorities. I bet $100 that making up a $50 bet doesn't prove anything.

You clearly haven't realised that you're in the vast minority if you actually believe the iPad Pro and Surface are not direct competitors. My bet wasn't a look at me I'm right, it was a wait and see what the vast majority of reviewers, who know a lot more about it than you do, say. I'm still waiting for the "I have a degree in..." argument.

And honestly a picture from 2002 of Bill Gates? They made a touchscreen tablet device 8 years before Apple did. Great work genius. Microsoft won that race. Whatever childish point you were trying to make with that is completely moot. But I see again you resort to the childish "your argument is rubbish" with no fact to back it up. Are you 12? As I have repeatedly said, wait and see what reviewers actually compare the iPad Pro with. That's called fact. You saying a MacBook and a surface are competitors is opinion. Not fact. Just because you spout the same nonsense as a 12 year old, doesn't make it fact. Just makes you look like a 12 year old.

Further proof you're in the minority is there has been nobody on here agree with you. Go back through the thread and see how many agree with me. Get over yourself.
 
The problem with the Apple watch is Apple. They priced themselves out of the smart watch market. The sport is about the max people really want to pay for a piece of technology that will be obsolete next year. For the price of a stainless steel model, you can get a decent normal watch. Most Seikos are less than that, you can even get Tag Heuer's for less. As for the Edition. $15k? I'd rather the Rolex/Omega/Patek Phillipe etc.
I'd love to see your data behind this. You say Apple priced themselves out of the market. I'm assuming you have data that backs up that statement.
 
Given the continual decreasing sales of the iPad, this is surprising, especially since Apple didn't fully refresh the iPad line. Still that might bode well for them
 
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You clearly haven't realised that you're in the vast minority if you actually believe the iPad Pro and Surface are not direct competitors.
Humans eat fish, penguins eat fish. Humans and Penguins compete for the fish in the ocean. That doesn't make humans neither birds nor fish. Get real, competition has nothing to do with what you are. You are making one straw man after the other. Surface Pros are PCs, end of discussion.
My bet wasn't a look at me I'm right, it was a wait and see what the vast majority of reviewers, who know a lot more about it than you do, say.
I've read all those reviews myself and they don't know more than I do. The better reviewers specifically state that the Surface Pro is a notebook in the form of a tablet. Unlike the iPad Pro which is a tablet in the form of a notebook when you add the Smart Keyboard.
I'm still waiting for the "I have a degree in..." argument.
That's not an argument on whether two computers belong in the same category, but if it's that what you need. I have a degree in Computer Science at Technische Universität Berlin.
And honestly a picture from 2002 of Bill Gates? They made a touchscreen tablet device 8 years before Apple did.
And they named it a Tablet PC, because that's what it was and what the Surface Pro still is, an Intel-based PC, just like the newest Retina MacBook. You can install Windows 10 on the MacBook via Bootcamp and it will run all the same Windows apps and you can install OS X on the Surface and make it a Hackintosh. These are closely related devices using the same hardware and software technologies.
Great work genius. Microsoft won that race.
It's not a race if one competitor doesn't take part. The Americans weren't the first on the moon, they were the only ones at the moon. Russians didn't even try, instead they pioneered the first space station, a technology still useful today. The iPad of 2010 (which made people start caring about this form factor) was no Tablet PC, but just a big iPod Touch. And the iPad Pro directed at graphic designer still is no Tablet PC, but an even bigger iPod Touch.

Apple comes from small and power-efficient and goes to bigger and more powerful. Microsoft comes from hot and heavy energy wasters and goes to smaller and slower, less capable. They met in two devices you like to see as competitors. But because where they come from they are and act vastly different. A swimming bird doesn't start tasting like fish, no matter how good it swims.
Whatever childish point you were trying to make with that is completely moot. But I see again you resort to the childish "your argument is rubbish" with no fact to back it up. Are you 12?
Yes, I'm a twelve year old with a computer science degree. And I'm the one who resorts to childish arguments.
As I have repeatedly said, wait and see what reviewers actually compare the iPad Pro with. That's called fact.
No it isn't. Your displayed lack of reading comprehension makes waiting for additional literature pointless. Everything has been said. It's over now.
You saying a MacBook and a Surface are competitors is opinion. Not fact.
That's not what I've said. In fact I believe Macs are sufficiently superior to other PCs that they don't have real competition. What I've actually said is that MacBook and Surface both fall into the same category of portable PCs and therefor it's meaningful that one is higher on the holiday wish list than the other. Because they use so many equal parts they are also similar priced. Shoppers will likely only buy one or the other. And that's the competition for the same amount of money, not similar functionalities. The iPad Pro however, while being the most expensive tablet on earth is still quite cheap compared to a Surface Pro. If you think those two are in competition, it looks bad for Microsoft.
Just because you spout the same nonsense as a 12 year old, doesn't make it fact. Just makes you look like a 12 year old.
I understand you are quite proud of your old age.
Further proof you're in the minority is there has been nobody on here agree with you. Go back through the thread and see how many agree with me. Get over yourself.
Your reality distortion field is not working. Nobody agreed with you and if somebody did he would be equally wrong as you are.
 
apple watch is 11th cause it's a useless product for anyone but apple tech enthusiasts.

The Apple Watch beat every single Samsung phone, every other smartwatch, as well as Sony's, Microsoft's and Nintendo's game consoles. Oh yeah, and it also beat iPhone. And came in 12th out of every single technology gift the store offers. Twelfth out of everything in the store is nothing to be ashamed of. Stop trying to pretend that you not liking it constitutes it being a failure in terms of desirability.
 
The problem with the Apple watch is Apple. They priced themselves out of the smart watch market. The sport is about the max people really want to pay for a piece of technology that will be obsolete next year. For the price of a stainless steel model, you can get a decent normal watch. Most Seikos are less than that, you can even get Tag Heuer's for less. As for the Edition. $15k? I'd rather the Rolex/Omega/Patek Phillipe etc.

I have to agree with you. The times when a phone is intrusive, and what I'm using the phone for would be better on a wristwatch are currently very few. If the Watch Sport was £200 (£249 for the bigger version) I'd have bought one by now, and I'd *still* buy Gen 2 when that came out.

Hopefully pricing is one of the things they will "fix" with the second version.
 
Text comes through -> read it on Apple Watch -> pull out iPhone -> reply.
Text comes through -> pull out phone -> read and reply.

I must be doing something wrong. I reply to all of my texts on the watch itself. The dictation is flawless if I need more than a canned response or emoji. Plus, i don't have to have my phone on my body at all times and yet get all notifications (or filtered ones).
 
I must be doing something wrong. I reply to all of my texts on the watch itself. The dictation is flawless if I need more than a canned response or emoji. Plus, i don't have to have my phone on my body at all times and yet get all notifications (or filtered ones).

Never realised you could respond to texts via dictation on the watch. How well does it work because if it's anything like Siri, it often picks up words incorrectly when I speak (fairly strong Scottish accent however I speak clearly to Siri).

How does the watch work if your phone is not on you?
 
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