It's already been answered as I mentioned and even linked earlier. Seems like that part is getting ignored for some reason as perhaps something else that is different is being sought, but going in same circles certainly doesn't seem to be productive.
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iPhone 12 Models Ship in Thinner Box Without EarPods or Charger
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It's true that it will affect a very small percentage of customers, but for them it's really annoying. Yes it's true Apple is playing the environment card very well. As they stated during the keynote they will produce less adapters, less headphones and as a result the packaging will be much smaller allowing them to ship more phones on one crate. So lower manufacturing costs for accessories, cheaper phone boxes and much much much cheaper shipping costs. By doing all this they will save a ton load of money which IMHO is why they're doing it. A nice side-effect is that it's a greener solution. They probably did the math and figured they'll save more money doing this than they'll lose because of disgruntled customers.
That would be idiotic, even for Apple. But look at the times we live in, so no harm in asking.
I just don’t think you’re understanding my question. But you’re right we’re going in circles because I feel like I’m asking one thing and you’re telling me about something different. Either way there’s a lot of good discussion in the forms about this and maybe someone to figure out a better way to do it. That’s what it’s all about is the community coming together to solve problems
Shipping and packaging costs are part of the reason the iMac has been made as thin and light as it is.
I wonder if Apple will start leaving out keyboard, mouse, and power cable with future iMacs? After all, everybody has tons of them already, right?
I wonder if Apple will start leaving out keyboard, mouse, and power cable with future iMacs? After all, everybody has tons of them already, right?
I agree that it’s annoying for some customers but I disagree with the motive. I think Apple’s motives are genuine to help the environment. Of course only Tim Cook and Apple really know what their motive was. It’s always bad PR when making the right and environmentally sound choice also means the company could make more money. Should companies not do the right thing environmentally if it means that’s also the more economical choice for them? I feel that most people actually appreciate when a company makes environmentally conscious decisions. Of course it’s easy to be cynical when those decisions also might increase profit. I personally will be buying one of the iPhone 12 models. Has this decision of not including a charger effected my purchase decision? No because I would’ve bought an iPhone anyway but I do appreciate their choice.
I suspect iMac sales are a tiny fraction of iPhone sales but yes that should be a consideration. Many people do have keyboards so why include that when in some cases it may not be used or needed
I have a bridge I'd like to show you . . .
The techie world is a fascinating place. Over 200 replies about the size of the iPhone 12 box. Unbelievable. Who GAF?? I mean seriously.
Again it's easy to be cynical when a big corporation does anything good but Apple has a long track record of environmentally friendly decisions like this one. When they make environmental choices that cost them money no one questions their motives. Not everything environmentally friendly a corporation or even us as individuals do costs more money. In fact much of it is about less waste and consumption so it often saves money.
Now if this was another corporation without such a track record and they did something like this that cut costs but claimed it was for the environment I would be just as cynical.
More about people not getting what they perceive is a free item when they buy a phone. Anyone with business knowledge knows it's not free but added to the total price but that's not how the average consumer thinks.
Conversation overheard at an iPhone12 internal launch discussion -
Apple: Hmmm. You know a good percent of our marginal costs of an iPhone goes to the adapter, ear buds, and cable. By eliminating those we can (a) sell these separately as profit items, (b) keep the phone costs the same as previous models, and (c) reduce shipping expenses with less packaging volume. How can we sell this strategy, anyone?
Marketing intern in the back of the room: Wait, I know, I know, pick me, pick me! How about touting the reduced iPhone carbon footprint for Apple by doing all of this? We don't have to mention the actual increase in carbon due to the manufacturing, storage, shipping, and sales of those other items, because, well, we're only discussing the iPhone here! We can even tell folks to use their old items!
Apple: Absolutely! Hire and promote that person immediately, she will go far with us.
Apple: Hmmm. You know a good percent of our marginal costs of an iPhone goes to the adapter, ear buds, and cable. By eliminating those we can (a) sell these separately as profit items, (b) keep the phone costs the same as previous models, and (c) reduce shipping expenses with less packaging volume. How can we sell this strategy, anyone?
Marketing intern in the back of the room: Wait, I know, I know, pick me, pick me! How about touting the reduced iPhone carbon footprint for Apple by doing all of this? We don't have to mention the actual increase in carbon due to the manufacturing, storage, shipping, and sales of those other items, because, well, we're only discussing the iPhone here! We can even tell folks to use their old items!
Apple: Absolutely! Hire and promote that person immediately, she will go far with us.
I'll take "Stuff That Never Happened" for $500, Alex.
Not saying they're not spinning things with the eco angle, but those items are highly unlikely to be a "good % of marginal costs". In terms of COGS, I'd expect they're a very minor portion.
Still - it's all a calculus of lost revenue from the handful of customers who don't buy vs small reduced cost across millions of units. I'd expect they focus grouped this pretty thoroughly before choosing to go down this path.
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I sort of agree. My original post was more tongue-in-cheek, and I have to admit I really got a good laugh from the Jeopardy reference. I don't fully agree though because we all know how "courageous" Apple can be.I'll take "Stuff That Never Happened" for $500, Alex.
Not saying they're not spinning things with the eco angle, but those items are highly unlikely to be a "good % of marginal costs". In terms of COGS, I'd expect they're a very minor portion.
Still - it's all a calculus of lost revenue from the handful of customers who don't buy vs small reduced cost across millions of units. I'd expect they focus grouped this pretty thoroughly before choosing to go down this path.
Well, there's a difference when it comes to deciding to do something and carrying the burden of it and deciding to do something and having someone else essentially take on the costs for it (while you even end up profiting from it on top of that too) -- the latter being a fairly easy thing to do and carries a different connotation.
I've been looking for an opportunity to use that, so thank you for taking it in the humorous spirit intended.
This all reminds me of the chicken little hullabaloo when Apple began dropping optical drives from their computers. And now today one is hard pressed to find a mainstream production laptop computer with a built in optical drive.
Then again when Apple dropped the headphone port... and today relatively few high end phones include them...
With the move of including a USBC to Lightning cord and no brick, Apple is perhaps slightly ahead of the curve.
USBA power sources are already approaching ubiquity - and among existing Apple device owners Lightning power cables are common after eight years availability. So thus many (most?) buyers are already set - they can use the stuff they already have. For those who for some reason don't already have myriad Lightning power cables & USBA sources, it is extremely easy and inexpensive to remedy that situation. ... and the inclusion of a USBC to Lightning cord may even incent some to start migrating to USBC.
End of the day, Apple's going to sell tons of iphone12's, some disgruntled folks aren't going to buy them, the majority either won't care or will get over it, and the world will move on -- with far fewer new 5W or 12W single-port Drawer Denizens collecting dust.
So I get a lightning to USB-C cable in the box but what the heck am I supposed to do with that since all my Apple supplied chargers are standard USB socket? Apple didn't think this one through - ROFL.
The Apple engineering department is brilliant the marketing department not so much.
The Apple engineering department is brilliant the marketing department not so much.
Save it for when you upgrade a multi port charger, and meanwhile use one of your existing Lightning to USBA cables.
To all of you complaining, Apple knows each and every one of you will still buy the iPhone 12. That environmentalist theme is just patronizing its customers. They’ll create the problem and sell you the solution, and you’ll buy it. Because Tim Cook knows you will. They know not including the little brick increases the chances that you’ll buy the MagSafe charger. And turning the screw by raising the price $200 is just Apple wanting more money from you. No environmental excuses there. You’ll all fall into line soon enough and begin defending Apple.
Completely agree. Except that I'm not upgrading to the 12...maybe next year.
Apple will generously "recycle" your old charger at no charge to you, as a trade-in gesture when you purchase your new charger at full cost at any Apple store. All for the environment.