iPhone ALoD: MAJOR design flaw!!

[askripko]

As many of you know, I've been suffering with ALoD (Apple Logo of Death) issues since July 11th. I've finally discovered the root cause of this problem, as well as a solution. I'm pasting a quote below from "Mandrake" on another forum which explains in some detail why this problem occurs, how it actually can affect ANYONE running 2.0 software, and how jailbreaking is the only known way to recover.



After suffering through 40 restores (due to ALoDs) between July 11th and August 15-ish, I haven't had to do a single one since - the reason? I finally got up the nerve to PWN my new iPhone 3G. With OpenSSH installed, recovering from an ALoD event takes just a few minutes, with no data loss or settings lost, nothing - it's VERY easy.

Ironic, isn't it? The only way to avoid having to spend 3-4 hours restoring your phone every time an ALoD occurs is to jailbreak. Put another way: in this situation, the only way to have a functional phone is to void the warranty.

Good job, Apple.

Same problems, same thoughts...

 

[mavis]

Wirelessly posted (iPhone 3G (16GB, 2.0.2 JB'd): Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 2_0_2 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/525.18.1 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.1.1 Mobile/5C1 Safari/525.20)

Wirelessly posted (iPhone 3G (16GB, 2.0.2 JB'd): Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 2_0_2 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/525.18.1 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.1.1 Mobile/5C1 Safari/525.20)



Actually, no - I haven't noticed any unusual drain since installing OpenSSH, although I wish I could disable wifi during the day when I'm out, since I never use it. But I know that as soon as I turn wifi off, I'll get an ALoD and then my OpenSSH safety net will be worthless.

Not true. Download a program called iphone_tunnel.exe. It will allow you to SSH into the iPhone without WiFi using the iTunes mobile device support.

It creates a USB/IP tunnel. It's very neat software.

This sounds interesting! Is there anything similar for Mac?

 

[Lightbrazer]

Sigh, while this does fix the ALOD it doesn't fix what causes it for me. My ALOD always occur right after every app starts spontaneously quitting itself thinking I don't own them anymore. So even if I bypass the ALOD I still need to do a complete restore anyway to get the apps running.

I think this is also the reason apple hasn't fixed this yet. They probably want to tackle BOTH of these issues at once. However great find. How stupid not to extend the timers when they went from built in apps to third party apps, unless they really thought springboard could remap 144 of them in under 120 seconds?

 

[mavis]

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Sigh, while this does fix the ALOD it doesn't fix what causes it for me. My ALOD always occur right after every app starts spontaneously quitting itself thinking I don't own them anymore. So even if I bypass the ALOD I still need to do a complete restore anyway to get the apps running.

I think this is also the reason apple hasn't fixed this yet. They probably want to tackle BOTH of these issues at once. However great find. How stupid not to extend the timers when they went from built in apps to third party apps, unless they really thought springboard could remap 144 of them in under 120 seconds?

True, but taking it a step further, I don't understand why springboard has to remap all 144 apps when only one has changed. Seems like a complete waste of time and processing cycles.

 

[mavis]

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Actually, no - I haven't noticed any unusual drain since installing OpenSSH, although I wish I could disable wifi during the day when I'm out, since I never use it. But I know that as soon as I turn wifi off, I'll get an ALoD and then my OpenSSH safety net will be worthless.

Not true. Download a program called iphone_tunnel.exe. It will allow you to SSH into the iPhone without WiFi using the iTunes mobile device support.

It creates a USB/IP tunnel. It's very neat software.

I'm still curious about this. Does anyone know of a way to use SSH (from a Mac) on an iPhone if wifi is disabled?

 

[QuarterSwede]

I don't know if this would stop the problem but since I started only installing/updating apps from iTunes I've completely stopped having any sort of issues (besides Safari being buggy) including long backups.

 

[mappyman]

I think the iphone's lack of memory doesn't help matters.

I tend to find the lags and slow downs are caused by the system using flash memory rather than its 128MB DRAM.

Hence why killing things like Safari and contacts will get rid of the typing lag since it frees RAM and doesnt need to page memory as much. Killing them speeds up the system.

Update it Apple with 1GB of DRAM

 

[mavis]

I don't know if this would stop the problem but since I started only installing/updating apps from iTunes I've completely stopped having any sort of issues (besides Safari being buggy) including long backups.

I don't know, I've always used iTunes exclusively (well, since July 13-ish, or so) but I continued to have problems. Although lately, TBH, I haven't had any ALoDs - I've been rebooting immediately prior to syncing, and I disabled push/fetch for mail (which frees up about 14MB of RAM) and that seems to be doing the trick. I even updated about ten apps at once last night (on my un-jailbroken iPod touch) without a problem.

I definitely agree, though - the iPhone DESPERATELY needs more RAM.

 

[kdarling]

I was reading some fairy tales to my daughter today, and realized that "Apple Logo of Death" just wasn't poetic enough.

How about...

The Snow White Curse ?

As in the poison apple she ate and fell asleep until a prince kissed her...



And of course, the pictures left on new devices could be "The China Syndrome".

 

[NeoMayhem]

Great explanation. Could this be related to CommCenter reloading randomly, requiring the sim pin to be entered before the phone gains service again?

 

[Trajectory]

How do you recover from the ALoD with OpenSSH?

 

[TheSpaz]

I'd like to add:

I've never seen this problem happen before. It hasn't happened to me or any of my friends and we're running 2.0.2.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but it just doesn't happen to everybody. Why are you restarting during App installs?

 

[pj rage]

I'm glad to hear this issue is fixed for those having issues. It's so weird that some phones seem to CONTINUALLY have this issue, while others (most?) never have it. Very strange.

In the midst of all this app install and springboard loading stuff, am I the only one who wonders why the heck Cydia can install apps in like 30 seconds, but the app store takes SEVERAL minutes to install an app? WTF is up with that?

 

[mavis]

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I'd like to add:

I've never seen this problem happen before. It hasn't happened to me or any of my friends and we're running 2.0.2.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but it just doesn't happen to everybody. Why are you restarting during App installs?

Umm, my phone and iPod spontaneously reboot when installing/updating apps. It's not like I'm doing it by choice.

And I think it's fantastic that you've been lucky enough to have never experienced this issue. I think I've experienced it enough for the both of us.

 

[mavis]

How do you recover from the ALoD with OpenSSH?

From the first post:

As the device is trying to boot up but still at the apple logo, try to log in as root using ssh. You should find you are able to log in soon after the device is pingable on your wifi network, and you have a few minutes to complete the following steps in time.

For example from a mac, log in with:

ssh -l root 192.168.1.103

Where your iphone/ipods own ip address is substituted.

First we will disable the watchdog timer (by temporarily moving its files elsewhere) and then reboot:

mv /System/Library/SystemConfiguration/mobilewatchdog.bundle/ /
reboot

After a few seconds the device will start to reboot, and after approximately 3-6 minutes (depending on how many apps you have installed) you will reach the lock screen as normal, when that happens we now have to re-enable the watchdog timer, and reboot again, so again log in with ssh, and type:

mv /mobilewatchdog.bundle /System/Library/SystemConfiguration/
reboot

You should find your iphone / ipod touch will reboot normally a second time.

 

[juandixon109]

fix this now apple you scrubs

 

[mavis]

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fix this now apple you scrubs

Would be nice, wouldn't it?

 

[TheSpaz]

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Would be nice, wouldn't it?

Mavis: I think you either have too many Apps or there's something wrong with your iPhone. If I were you, I'd delete all the Apps that you don't use. You can't possibly use every app that you have enough to justify having them on your iPhone. The iPhone originally wasn't designed to have 9 screens of Apps on it. I realize that this has changed but, the hardware still hasn't changed since the introduction of the iPhone. I hope I make sense to you.

 

[mavis]

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Would be nice, wouldn't it?

Mavis: I think you either have too many Apps or there's something wrong with your iPhone. If I were you, I'd delete all the Apps that you don't use. You can't possibly use every app that you have enough to justify having them on your iPhone. The iPhone originally wasn't designed to have 9 screens of Apps on it. I realize that this has changed but, the hardware still hasn't changed since the introduction of the iPhone. I hope I make sense to you.

Too many apps? I mean, I know there are plenty of Apple apologists on the boards, but that's just asinine. I have about 75 apps installed - you're saying that's too many?! That's like five pages' worth, out of a possible NINE. You do the math.

It really annoys me that people are so quick to point the finger anywhere but where it really belongs: Apple. How utterly pathetic that you would try to pin this GLARING FLAW on ME, when my only crime has been spending too much money on apps. Please.

 

[TheSpaz]

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Too many apps? I mean, I know there are plenty of Apple apologists on the boards, but that's just asinine. I have about 75 apps installed - you're saying that's too many?! That's like five pages' worth, out of a possible NINE. You do the math.

It really annoys me that people are so quick to point the finger anywhere but where it really belongs: Apple. How utterly pathetic that you would try to pin this GLARING FLAW on ME, when my only crime has been spending too much money on apps. Please.

Well, if you want a smooth experience RIGHT NOW, stop clogging your iPhone up with crap. I'm sorry... but 5 pages of apps seems absurd to me. In my opinion, there isn't 5 pages of GOOD apps on the entire App Store. Everyone wanted the iPhone opened up to applications... well your wish has been granted and now you'll suffer if you want that much stuff on your iPhone. Like I said, Apple didn't intend to make the iPhone able to handle all this stuff. Plus you're running 3rd party apps by OTHER DEVELOPERS and a lot of the Apps are still pretty green... only on 1.0 or 1.1 and it should be expected to have problems... especially with all of the thousands of Apps currently available.

I'm not trying to be an apologist.. I understand that you want your iPhone to work but, when you're running over 5 pages of apps (mostly which have only been available for a couple of months) you can't expect a flawless experience. Apple's checking process doesn't mean they check for bugs... they check for malicious code. It's the developers that have to check for bugs and the beta testers, not Apple.

If you want to test this theory, restore your iPhone and do not load any 3rd party (non Apple apps) on your iPhone. Then see if it is as stable as 1.1.4.

 

[sushi]

True, but taking it a step further, I don't understand why springboard has to remap all 144 apps when only one has changed. Seems like a complete waste of time and processing cycles.

This is Apple's approach to setting up environments.

Just like rebuilding the desktop files back in the pre-Max OS X days.

This approach gives a clean slate so everything should work...in concept. Obviously, there needs to be some tweaking of some sort.

Nice to see you posting around these parts.

 

[Bernie-Mac]

Umm my iPhone 2.0.2 is fine i have not had a single problem and probably wont contrary to what you claim

 

[aristotle]

That's nice. Your problems are probably associated with you having jail broken the device.

 

[mavis]

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That's nice. Your problems are probably associated with you having jail broken the device.

Actually, my problems stopped once I finally jailbroke. Ironic, isn't it?

 

[mavis]

Well, if you want a smooth experience RIGHT NOW, stop clogging your iPhone up with crap.

WRONG. I'm having a perfectly smooth experience these past few weeks. The solution? Jailbreaking my iPhone. I now have a stable (albeit slow as molasses) iPhone with tons of apps, too.

I'm sorry... but 5 pages of apps seems absurd to me. In my opinion, there isn't 5 pages of GOOD apps on the entire App Store.

Thank God the world doesn't revolve around your opinion then. I'm guessing you don't spend three hours a day on the train, commuting to/from work? Yeah, that's what I thought.

Everyone wanted the iPhone opened up to applications... well your wish has been granted and now you'll suffer if you want that much stuff on your iPhone.

Funny, my iPod has been 'opened up to applications' since 1.1.1 but I've only just started having problem with it. I guess what you're really trying to say is that the hacking community is far more competent than Apple, since they've had working installers available since last year.

Like I said, Apple didn't intend to make the iPhone able to handle all this stuff.

What?? So you're saying that the iPhone was designed to handle just the original apps and nothing else?

Again, tell that to the people who have been running Installer and Cydia without problems since 1.1.1 ...

Plus you're running 3rd party apps by OTHER DEVELOPERS and a lot of the Apps are still pretty green... only on 1.0 or 1.1 and it should be expected to have problems... especially with all of the thousands of Apps currently available.

Huh? If you had actually bothered reading the posts in this thread, you would realize that the problem is not with applications, but rather, with a watchdog process running on the iPhone/iPod - there's only ONE company responsible for that. I'll let you guess who.

I'm not trying to be an apologist..

And yet, looking back at your post, excuses are all I see. Not one valid point anywhere to be found. Sounds an awful lot like an Apple apologist to me.

I understand that you want your iPhone to work but, when you're running over 5 pages of apps (mostly which have only been available for a couple of months) you can't expect a flawless experience. Apple's checking process doesn't mean they check for bugs... they check for malicious code. It's the developers that have to check for bugs and the beta testers, not Apple.

And since the problem lies SOLELY with the iPhone's OS, tell me again how this argument is even remotely applicable?

If you want to test this theory, restore your iPhone and do not load any 3rd party (non Apple apps) on your iPhone. Then see if it is as stable as 1.1.4.

So now you want me to not use any of the $250 worth of apps I've purchased? THAT'S the answer to this problem? So basically you're saying that we've all been lied to by Apple (touting the App Store in their ads) and that the product does not function as advertised? This is the first thing you've said that actually makes sense. Cheers.